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Mister Bates posted:Fantastic post Really insightful. I read the group navigator, Crosby’s, book, and he was far more jaded and obviously traumatized than I think they would ever show on screen. Even the part where he cheats on his wife with the SOE girl, in his memoirs, is clearly because his brain is broken with PTSD, something we see with veterans all the time now. Because he went on to be a literature professor, he does a great job explaining how he was in an emotional fugue state chasing dopamine. Instead they made it into… kind of a love story? The other thing is, the squadrons had an atrocious casualty rate, with people who survived going home or to staff positions (like he does), and for a TV show not committed to actually introducing characters and killing them off, when they’re all wearing masks and flight helmets in the combat scenes, I think requires more skill than they had. They could either introduce characters that are barely memorable, only to have them die, which Crosby says was his experience and why he didn’t bother getting to know new crews, or follow aircrews into their desk jobs, or teaching rotations in the US. That’s hard though, and makes demands on the audience. The aircrew instruction system where combat veterans tried to prepare these kids for what awaited them in Europe is interesting, and the stories of the instructors being back in the states while the war was still on, nobody even knew what PTSD was etc. is really understudied in military history, and has made no progress at all in pop history, other than The Pacific, I suppose - where the machine gun team leader returns to training duties only to be killed at Iwo Jima.
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Apr 7, 2024 17:57
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DJJIB-DJDCT posted:Really insightful. The part in the Pacific where the boot camp Marine says he wants to slap a jap and basilone flips out at him is a pretty cool inversion of the first episode hype speech by chesty puller You'd never see writing like that now
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Apr 7, 2024 18:05
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I knew the depiction of the Red Army was going to be what it was but I was still speechless seeing a literal horde in rags shooting Germans attempting to surrender.
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Apr 7, 2024 18:06
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DJJIB-DJDCT posted:I knew the depiction of the Red Army was going to be what it was but I was still speechless seeing a literal horde in rags shooting Germans attempting to surrender. Yeah that's stealing Canadian valor
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Apr 7, 2024 18:12
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Exactly, minus the rags thing because our battledress was very well made.
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Apr 7, 2024 18:19
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Ardennes posted:Maybe the US was just a lot more confident in itself in the 2000s when you can have some complexity, and the US isn't necessarily the good guys (look at The Pacific). Now the wagons are circled, and it is pure hearted America versus the baddies (the Russkies may be the worst of them all!). cgi improved, then plateaued and then got worse as Hollywood and capitalism destroyed all the cgi studios and scattered the artists to the wind. It's not just that the actual graphics themselves have gone backwards, there seems to have been a loss of technique. Take the original Jurassic park, the T-rex sequence still holds up because its dark and rainy and that natural loss of fidelity hides all the things that make your brain go 'hey that's not right'. Now the arrogant, or dumb, bastards don't bother and they just throw some poo poo up that looks terrible and in full lighting. I have no problem believing a 2001 show could have better everything than something made in in the last decade.
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Apr 7, 2024 18:25
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Regarde Aduck posted:cgi improved, then plateaued and then got worse as Hollywood and capitalism destroyed all the cgi studios and scattered the artists to the wind. It's not just that the actual graphics themselves have gone backwards, there seems to have been a loss of technique. Take the original Jurassic park, the T-rex sequence still holds up because its dark and rainy and that natural loss of fidelity hides all the things that make your brain go 'hey that's not right'. Now the arrogant, or dumb, bastards don't bother and they just throw some poo poo up that looks terrible and in full lighting. Yeah the Godzilla vs Kong or whatever new movie trailer looks like an Xbox cutscenes, pure dogshit
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Apr 7, 2024 18:26
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With Marvel I am a bit shocked how bad things look tbh. CGI looks more “fake” than I can remember in a long time.
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Apr 7, 2024 18:27
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I once read something wise written on the bumper of a car. "kill your television" the sticker read
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Apr 7, 2024 18:31
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KomradeX posted:It was okay It was pretty loving far from okay.
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Apr 7, 2024 18:47
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DJJIB-DJDCT posted:I knew the depiction of the Red Army was going to be what it was but I was still speechless seeing a literal horde in rags shooting Germans attempting to surrender. Ridley Scott did the same thing in Napoleon, we are suppose to look at a Russians as destitute asiatics dressed in primitive attire.
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Apr 7, 2024 19:31
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It's not fair to blame CGI for Marvel movies. At least the 2nd Avatar movie is still bright and colorful.
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Apr 7, 2024 20:10
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DJJIB-DJDCT posted:With Marvel I am a bit shocked how bad things look tbh. CGI looks more “fake” than I can remember in a long time. starship troopers spent half its budget on special effects (combo of 90s CGI and practical effects) and that still looks better than most of the poo poo coming out now
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Apr 7, 2024 20:41
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Just thinking about the movies I can think of with was-great-then-still-great-now special effects, it's all mid 90s - mid 2000s stuff Apollo 13 - 1995 Jurassic Park - 1993 The Matrix - 1999 The Lord of the Rings - 2001-2003 The OG Pirates of the Caribbean - 2003 Saving Private Ryan - 1999 even lower budget effects movies from back then like Event Horizon still looks miles better than the same grade of shlock now because back then the guys doing the effects had some craft and hadnt been punched into the ground by the studio cost cutting and refusal to do anything practical to anchor the cg
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Apr 7, 2024 21:48
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The Oldest Man posted:Just thinking about the movies I can think of with was-great-then-still-great-now special effects, it's all mid 90s - mid 2000s stuff I think you might be a little biased toward movies that came out in your formatinr years... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Incredible_Shrinking_Man (1957) looks great today. e: lot of effort quote:Some special effects shots were the earliest taken for the picture. For example, shots with Randy Stuart were taken against a black velvet backdrop and then composited with shots of Williams on an enlarged living room set. Their movements were synchronized using negatives from the first exposed scene in the camera gate, with the opposite done for the other scene.[13] Sound production began on May 31.[14] An oversized dollhouse was built for Williams on Stage 28. It had previously been used for The Phantom of the Opera and Dracula.[15] Arnold said he filmed scenes with the cat in a normal studio with an animal trainer who had about 40 identical cats.[16] To coax the cat to approach the dollhouse, Arnold hid food in it so the cat would find a way into the house.[17] Later he timed the cat's reactions and directed Williams accordingly to react to the cat.[17] Arnold first attempted to follow the novel and use a black widow spider. After preliminary tests, he found black widows were too small to use properly in the film.[18] In an interview with Tom Weaver, Randy Stuart said the spiders presented problems. The overhead lamps on the set had to be turned up high, leading to the deaths of 24 tarantulas.[19] They were directed with little puffs of air, a technique which had been used previously in Arnold's film Tarantula.[19] Despite sources suggesting otherwise, the films did not use the same tarantulas.[19][1] mawarannahr has issued a correction as of 21:54 on Apr 7, 2024 |
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Apr 7, 2024 21:51
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Like, just watch old movies and shows. Once in a while, there comes a new show like Shogun that looks good, but the percentage of terrible looking new shows are too high.
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Apr 7, 2024 21:56
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mawarannahr posted:I think you might be a little biased toward movies that came out in your formatinr years... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Incredible_Shrinking_Man (1957) looks great today. oh yeah, for sure. there's tons of earlier stuff that still looks good. Aliens, 2001 a space Odyssey, the Incredible Shrinking Man, the Fly, the Blob, all kinds of cool stuff. I'd just peg ~2005ish as when stuff actively started to look worse with "better" sfx technology instead of better and the era immediately preceeding that is Peak Special Effects.
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Apr 7, 2024 21:58
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Isn't that because they shot on videotape?
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Apr 7, 2024 21:58
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There is plenty of good CGI out there that goes unnoticed because it just blends into an existing set. Zodiac for example heavily uses CGI and seems like almost entirely a practical movie with little action. It is the giant complex shots that can look absolutely ridiculous, especially if they get rushed, which is becoming more and more common. Honestly, Marvel and all the franchise films of the late 2000s until today happened in the first place because Hollywood categorically refuses to take risky or political scripts, and something needed to be fed into the pipeline. Everyone was expecting to eventually get a "good film" on Afghanistan or Iraq and the closest you got was Generation Kill. Three Kings is not as good as people remember it was (even if it was Iraq 1). ----------- Supposedly, Shogun is good and from what I have seen it has held up even if it is a remake, Dune 2 sounded solid as well. There isn't 100% nothing in terms of output but it is getting much more threadbare. Ardennes has issued a correction as of 22:06 on Apr 7, 2024 |
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Apr 7, 2024 22:02
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Ardennes posted:Supposedly, Shogun is good and from what I have seen it has held up even if it is a remake, Dune 2 sounded solid as well. There isn't 100% nothing in terms of output but it is getting much more threadbare. shogun had an enormous costume budget and consulted actual historical experts on how to make it all period-accurate https://variety.com/2024/artisans/n...oks-1235922133/ it's also really good and far less racist than the book
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Apr 7, 2024 22:15
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Shogun is very well-made and entertaining. I don't know enough about the history to comment on the accuracy.
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Apr 7, 2024 22:16
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Also, Hollywood wanted to replace practical stunts/special effects with CGI because they wanted to remove the union workers and hand the works to oversea cgi slaves. Why else would you replace realistic and fun blood squirts with fake rear end cgi blood?
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Apr 7, 2024 22:17
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Cleanup between takes
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Apr 7, 2024 22:19
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Ardennes posted:It is the giant complex shots that can look absolutely ridiculous, especially if they get rushed, which is becoming more and more common. I do feel pretty bummed out about that, though. It feels like every big effects movie has adopted the George Lucas prequel directing school of producing mashed turds with a marketing department.
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Apr 7, 2024 22:23
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stephenthinkpad posted:Also, Hollywood wanted to replace practical stunts/special effects with CGI because they wanted to remove the union workers and hand the works to oversea cgi slaves. this has been a general thing, ruthlessly eliminate direct staff - outsource the art department to ex-warsaw europe / the phillipines (just as good, but financial capitalism hasn't murdered their cost of living)
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Apr 7, 2024 22:27
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Just sit in this green colored prop rocking back and fore like you are riding a motorcycle and talk to this tennis ball like you are looking at the love of your life and we will let the cgi slaves take care of everything. And we will tell them to make last min rendering change to make the shot extra fake.
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Apr 7, 2024 22:31
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stephenthinkpad posted:Also, Hollywood wanted to replace practical stunts/special effects with CGI because they wanted to remove the union workers and hand the works to oversea cgi slaves. Imagine how stupid Total Recall or any Paul Verhoeven movie would look with that lovely cgi blood. Squibs - never accept anything less.
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Apr 7, 2024 22:35
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Ardennes posted:Three Kings is not as good as people remember it was (even if it was Iraq 1). 
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Apr 7, 2024 22:41
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I liked watching Archer.
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Apr 7, 2024 22:49
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BadOptics posted:Imagine how stupid Total Recall or any Paul Verhoeven movie would look with that lovely cgi blood. Squibs - never accept anything less. pretty sure the outcome of the Rust shooting is that we're never getting a non-cgi gun in a movie ever again
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Apr 7, 2024 22:55
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The Oldest Man posted:pretty sure the outcome of the Rust shooting is that we're never getting a non-cgi gun in a movie ever again Wasn't that also the result of the studio or someone wanting to cut corners because they hate dealing with unionized employees? Strange how everything that was torn apart to fight unionized workers (cgi, firearm safety, etc.) went to poo poo and/or directly harmed other workers on set....
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Apr 7, 2024 23:00
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Z the IVth posted:In Stross's similarly themed Laundry series the UK's survival strategy for the apocalypse involves appointimg Nyarlahotep as Prime Minister. lmao that owns
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Apr 7, 2024 23:09
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BadOptics posted:Wasn't that also the result of the studio or someone wanting to cut corners because they hate dealing with unionized employees? Strange how everything that was torn apart to fight unionized workers (cgi, firearm safety, etc.) went to poo poo and/or directly harmed other workers on set.... The entire movie was a poo poo-show from top to bottom yeah https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rust_shooting_incident#Union_disputes_and_safety_complaints
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Apr 7, 2024 23:09
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The Oldest Man posted:pretty sure the outcome of the Rust shooting is that we're never getting a non-cgi gun in a movie ever again all the john wick movies used prop guns with vfx and that was perfectly fine
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Apr 7, 2024 23:10
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Griz posted:all the john wick movies used prop guns with vfx and that was perfectly fine still bummed that a movie like Ronin will never be shot again because all of the techniques used to make it are basically lostech and it's cheaper to just have some dirt-quality vfx shop churn out something Good Enough for the marketing department to make hay with
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Apr 7, 2024 23:19
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BadOptics posted:Wasn't that also the result of the studio or someone wanting to cut corners because they hate dealing with unionized employees? Strange how everything that was torn apart to fight unionized workers (cgi, firearm safety, etc.) went to poo poo and/or directly harmed other workers on set.... The non- union armorer was also a nepo baby!It hits every beat!
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Apr 7, 2024 23:25
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https://vm.tiktok.com/ZSFgrJE9p/
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Apr 7, 2024 23:28
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Regarde Aduck posted:cgi improved, then plateaued and then got worse as Hollywood and capitalism destroyed all the cgi studios and scattered the artists to the wind. It's not just that the actual graphics themselves have gone backwards, there seems to have been a loss of technique. Take the original Jurassic park, the T-rex sequence still holds up because its dark and rainy and that natural loss of fidelity hides all the things that make your brain go 'hey that's not right'. Now the arrogant, or dumb, bastards don't bother and they just throw some poo poo up that looks terrible and in full lighting. Don't forget that for all the money they spend on CGI they want it fast so they don't give these studios enough time to render things out cause we've got a schedule of Marvel movies to put out
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Apr 7, 2024 23:31
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The Oldest Man posted:Just thinking about the movies I can think of with was-great-then-still-great-now special effects, it's all mid 90s - mid 2000s stuff dont forget about the phantom menace 💅
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Apr 7, 2024 23:48
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Mandel Brotset posted:dont forget about the phantom menace 💅 It is really funny how it looks better than the later entries in the series
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Apr 7, 2024 23:52
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