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Crazy how a Japanese movie would want to focus on a Japanese cast without having 50 Americans in the background of each shot
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May 5, 2024 19:15
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Big Mean Jerk posted:Crazy how a Japanese movie would want to focus on a Japanese cast without having 50 Americans in the background of each shot Absolutely insane. Especially because America is so well known for including other nationalities in their story! Real talk: Minus One focuses on Japanese WWII vets, because it's story about war made in Japan. And while that context definitely adds weight to what the film is saying, I see the message itself as pretty universal: War is hell and people will order you to fight and die for their own selfish causes. In the end everyone has to live with the consequences. The only way to deal with the radical nationalism and warmongering that enables these disasters is to realize that the heart of a community lies in the people themselves. If you remember that, you can break free from the oppressive lies that cause hate and become stronger through love, cooperation, and vulnerability. It's the exact opposite of fascism.
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May 5, 2024 19:31
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Arc Hammer posted:Godzilla ripped the poo poo out of the US Military during and following their nuclear tests so they abandoned Japan. No he's completely correct- there should be SCADS of GIs in the movie. I understand they wanted to focus on the characters who are Japanese, but not even including GIs and MPs in the backgrounds of every scene where there were more than a few people is honestly baffling. The Japanese economy was destroyed, and America occupied and created a new government for Japan. There were Jeeps on all the roads (the first post-war toy made in Japan was a tin Jeep that was made from scrap cans by Marusan Toy, and it was incredibly successful because little boys wanted the cool vehicle that they Americans who gave them chocolate drove around). There is one scene with a black market, but the black market was also everywhere and pretty much the only way to get tons of necessary items. The Yakuza became a real powerhouse during this time. The US Military could not be avoided in Japan at all for a long, long time after the war ended and it sticks out like a sore thumb that the movie doesn't have even a single MP around. Edit: I am not saying "THIS SUCKS WHERE ALL THE WHITE MEN AT", I feel that there should have been MPs in the background even if they were far away enough to identify their uniforms but not so close that you would notice they are all Japanese extras in said uniforms. GATOS Y VATOS fucked around with this message at 20:35 on May 5, 2024 |
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May 5, 2024 20:33
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GATOS Y VATOS posted:No he's completely correct- there should be SCADS of GIs in the movie. I understand they wanted to focus on the characters who are Japanese, but not even including GIs and MPs in the backgrounds of every scene where there were more than a few people is honestly baffling. The Japanese economy was destroyed, and America occupied and created a new government for Japan. There were Jeeps on all the roads (the first post-war toy made in Japan was a tin Jeep that was made from scrap cans by Marusan Toy, and it was incredibly successful because little boys wanted the cool vehicle that they Americans who gave them chocolate drove around). There is one scene with a black market, but the black market was also everywhere and pretty much the only way to get tons of necessary items. The Yakuza became a real powerhouse during this time. No one is arguing that this wasn't the case in reality. However, in the fictional movie with a giant lizard, the US military wasn't present because of said giant lizard wrecking their poo poo, causing them to withdraw.
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May 5, 2024 20:45
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Douche4Sale posted:No one is arguing that this wasn't the case in reality. However, in the fictional movie with a giant lizard, the US military wasn't present because of said giant lizard wrecking their poo poo, causing them to withdraw. I understand that point but there was literally years worth of things happening in Tokyo before G started eating ships. edit: I talked to a couple of friends in Japan and they mentioned it as well without me bringing it up. They said they found it weird, but at the same time 
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May 5, 2024 20:46
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I shrug and put it on the same level as Dunkirk having 200 dudes on a beach rather than 200,000.
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May 5, 2024 20:50
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A Worrying Warlock posted:Absolutely insane. Especially because America is so well known for including other nationalities in their story! This movie was so good not just for this, but for how it sort of tricks you early on into thinking it's going to be this more typical "do we get to win this time" redemption for Shikishima where he's going to man up and personally save Japan from Godzilla to redeem himself for failing to die for nothing. But instead while he's certainly the character we spend the most time with, the movie's almost more about everyone around him coming to realize your post as the story goes on. The way the movie worked out having so many people and so much effort from everyone into working together to not just stop Godzilla but also save each other was loving awesome. But also when watching the movie I saw the lack of US presence as more of a pure budgetary limitation kind of thing.
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May 5, 2024 21:08
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Whose the modern version of '50s Raymond Burr? Bob Odenkirk? Should have had him in the movie to give some American representation. gently caress it, they already put a different Breaking Bad guy in a different Godzilla movie.
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May 5, 2024 21:30
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Asterite34 posted:Whose the modern version of '50s Raymond Burr? Bob Odenkirk? Should have had him in the movie to give some American representation. gently caress it, they already put a different Breaking Bad guy in a different Godzilla movie. 50’s Raymond Burr? Who knows. 80’s Raymond Burr? Get Steve Martin.
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May 5, 2024 21:37
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Whenever an American GI is not on screen, all the other characters should be asking "外国人はどこですか".
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May 5, 2024 22:13
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The USA died on their way back to their home country.
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May 5, 2024 22:27
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Mantis42 posted:No I think you're reading it wrong. To the conservative nationalist Japanese the occupation was the most humiliating aspect. This film depicts Japan as defeated but still fundamentally sovereign, it's military still intact and autonomous. There should be American GIs on every corner in 1946. Their absence is weird and it says something. You know it's not a documentary right? This isn't our version of post war Japan. They made it abundantly clear when they set up why the US wasn't there.
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May 6, 2024 01:11
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Asterite34 posted:Whose the modern version of '50s Raymond Burr? Bob Odenkirk? Should have had him in the movie to give some American representation. gently caress it, they already put a different Breaking Bad guy in a different Godzilla movie. "My Godzilla, Minus One!"
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May 6, 2024 01:24
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checkplease posted:Whenever an American GI is not on screen, all the other characters should be asking "外国人はどこですか". lmbo
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May 6, 2024 02:02
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The presence or absence of American forces isn’t actually relevant to this discussion. As we’ve seen, people can easily say “it’s an alternate universe”, and the lack of GIs is lampshaded with a quick “they don’t care about Japan because they’re distracted by the Cold War” or whatever. The film’s conservatism is much more straightforward than that: it’s in the therapeutic narrative where the protagonist overcomes his trauma to become a productive member of society - a good husband and father, ready for a successful career, etc. The aberrant monster is killed so we can return to a more-or-less ‘normal life’ - a normalcy that is not really outlined in any detail.
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May 6, 2024 02:17
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Asterite34 posted:Whose the modern version of '50s Raymond Burr? Bob Odenkirk? Should have had him in the movie to give some American representation. gently caress it, they already put a different Breaking Bad guy in a different Godzilla movie. Get David Strathairn on it
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May 6, 2024 02:26
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Muscle Tracer posted:I'm begging you to watch the movie again if you think this has any relation to what actually happens in the film. The biggest criticism of the Japanese military is "they sent us all to certain deaths for no reason, and then vilified us if we didn't actually die." If you think that the main theme of the film is anything other than "living for a reason is better than dying for no reason", idk what to tell you other than to give it another go. Yeah, the whole Japanese experience is key there given the whole deal is more or less they went all-in on militarism and failed miserably, committed tons of atrocities for no real gain and ended up humiliated and destroyed. It's a huge theme in a lot of things from Grave of the Fireflies to Gundam, that fascism was not only unconscionable and insane but idiotic and led to nothing but miserable failure.
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May 6, 2024 07:34
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I loved both Shin Godzilla and Godzilla Minus One, but they're both politically conservative movies for different reasons. Mantis and SMG have already touched on G-1's historical revisionism and heteronormativity/conformity angles, and a big theme of Shin Godzilla is Japan pulling itself up by its bootstraps to become a co-hegemon with the US rather than the US's yappy little lapdog. Fortunately, I don't think this stuff harmed the presentation of Godzilla any, and since both movies only depict Godzilla as at best temporarily repressed, they at least each acknowledge the possibility of their own negation.
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May 6, 2024 22:58
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How on earth is it politically conservative to express a desire to not be an American colony.
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May 6, 2024 23:15
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Why aren't more Kaiju films documentaries
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May 6, 2024 23:17
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Gripweed posted:How on earth is it politically conservative to express a desire to not be an American colony. Because they're aiming to be an American partner in crime instead. They're going to sweep away the old bureaucracy and move fast and break things or whatever - but isn't Godzilla straight up America's fault? Wasn't it the American response that provoked Godzilla into unleashing the height of its destructive power? I dunno about this one, guys! That the movie raises questions like these is to its credit but Elysium it ain't.
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May 6, 2024 23:30
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Ferrinus posted:Because they're aiming to be an American partner in crime instead. They're going to sweep away the old bureaucracy and move fast and break things or whatever - but isn't Godzilla straight up America's fault? Wasn't it the American response that provoked Godzilla into unleashing the height of its destructive power? I dunno about this one, guys! How are they aiming to be America’s “partner in crime”? What does that even mean? And they don’t want to sweep away the old bureaucracy, the movie is a celebration of bureaucracy! It’s the bureaucracy that saves the day and defeats Godzilla!
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May 6, 2024 23:51
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Gripweed posted:How are they aiming to be America’s “partner in crime”? What does that even mean? Well, the movie starts out with the Japanese frustrated by their available range of military responses being stymied by their relationship with America. They just straight up aren't allowed to defend themselves except in extremely limited ways unless they get permission. There's a scene (I'm told) in the Watchmen TV show in which a heroic cop is faced with some bad guys but is literally not allowed to unholster her gun until she phones home to get permission; that's the Japanese state for like the first half of Shin Godzilla. Shin's relationship to bureaucracy is nuanced. It really does love showing us bureaucracy, and many of the heroes are bureaucrats, but through the beginning of the movie the state bureaucracy is obviously too complex, hidebound, and politically paralyzed to do anything right or help anyone. Meeting after meeting is played for laughs, experts are brought in but say absolutely nothing of substance because they're too concerned for their careers, there's basically a "...he's right behind me, isn't he" joke in that one press conference, etc. The bureaucrat who actually saves us does so by reaching out to a bunch of weirdos and malcontents who didn't fit into the old structure at all but are now being turned to out of desperation. Only they're able to work quickly and dynamically, drawing outrageous conclusions and putting forward bold plans that would be impossible under the old system, cutting through red tape to get help directly from the private sector (and G-1 echoes this with its private-public partnership of retired soldiers and businessmen who can finally collaborate without stifling government oversight). Fortunately, like everyone in the old bureaucracy fails their save against Godzilla's breath weapon, and with the chaff cleared away our main character is poised to become the new head of the country at the same time as the female lead is poised to become the US President, and Japan is going to scrap-and-build its way back to global relevance even as its political marriage to the US is effectively renewed under much more equal terms. But will this be enough to stop a Godzilla who further evolves and returns as a swarm of identical humanoids...? Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 00:14 on May 7, 2024 |
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May 7, 2024 00:11
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None of that says why in Minus One the Japanese people want to become Americans partner in crime. Self defense isnt about working with America in the end. Or was that in reference to Shin?
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May 7, 2024 00:16
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checkplease posted:None of that says why in Minus One the Japanese people want to become Americans partner in crime. Or was that in reference to Shin? Sorry, I should be clear that the "partner in crime" thing was about Shin Godzilla, not Minus One. If Gripweed was talking about Minus One there then I was confused and, in turn, confused everyone else.
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May 7, 2024 00:18
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Ah ok oops. Yeah I need to watch Shin again, been a while and forgot some of the details there.
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May 7, 2024 00:20
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Ferrinus posted:Well, the movie starts out with the Japanese frustrated by their available range of military responses being stymied by their relationship with America. They just straight up aren't allowed to defend themselves except in extremely limited ways unless they get permission. There's a scene (I'm told) in the Watchmen TV show in which a heroic cop is faced with some bad guys but is literally not allowed to unholster her gun until she phones home to get permission; that's the Japanese state for like the first half of Shin Godzilla. A colonized nation wanting to be able to manage it's own internal security issues is not actually comparable to a cop wanting to be allowed to kill people. So when you said Japan wanted to be America's "partner in crime" the crime you were talking about was being a sovereign country? But way more importantly, why are you trying to make this point by comparing the movie to a show you haven't seen? What are you doing, man?
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May 7, 2024 00:47
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The watchmen tv show is a bit strange on reflection. I liked it, but it did have the scene in question where liberal gun policies are keeping the police from being able to defend themselves from the white supremacists, but also the white supremacists are controlling the government. So costumed vigilantes are needed to go outside the law. Could've used some more Kaiju.
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May 7, 2024 01:03
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the kaiju is why tim nelson was so hosed up from trauma
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May 7, 2024 01:11
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Ferrinus posted:Well, the movie starts out with the Japanese frustrated by their available range of military responses being stymied by their relationship with America. They just straight up aren't allowed to defend themselves except in extremely limited ways unless they get permission. There's a scene (I'm told) in the Watchmen TV show in which a heroic cop is faced with some bad guys but is literally not allowed to unholster her gun until she phones home to get permission; that's the Japanese state for like the first half of Shin Godzilla. One of the more interesting things about the film (Shin) is how Godzilla seems to react to the Japanese bureaucracy. The men-with-guns at the scene are ultimately told to stand down rather than possibly endanger a couple of civilians crossing the road and in response Godzilla (temporarily) halts his march into the city. It's when the military is finally let loose on Godzilla that it in turn destroys the heads of government with its fire breath. Not necessarily disagreeing with your analysis, to be clear, just pointing out a moment that caught my eye. Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 04:54 on May 7, 2024 |
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May 7, 2024 01:34
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Gripweed posted:A colonized nation wanting to be able to manage it's own internal security issues is not actually comparable to a cop wanting to be allowed to kill people. So when you said Japan wanted to be America's "partner in crime" the crime you were talking about was being a sovereign country? Japan becomes, or gets on the way to becoming, America's partner in crime towards the end of the movie, when it proves itself against Godzilla and Kayoko makes ready to become US president. So ten years down the line she'll be funding some genocide somewhere and when I criticize it you'll pop up like "god forbid women do anything  "
Ferrinus fucked around with this message at 03:19 on May 7, 2024 |
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May 7, 2024 03:15
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That Watchmen scene is weird because the other thing about cops is that they're masked vigilantes that are able to do a lot of extrajudicial violence most of the time except in literally that one and only moment because Lindelof wanted to comment on something going on in the discourse at the time. That whole show was like a collection of neat ideas and scenes that fell apart when you examined them as a whole.
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May 7, 2024 03:54
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Minus One didn't have Americans because Shin Godzilla hit audiences with that one-two haymaker of the senator's daughter and the US fighter pilot dialogue scene; a poor-performance combo that nearly ruined an otherwise excellent movie.
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May 8, 2024 21:59
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I really liked that the American president talked like a Metal Gear Solid character, actually.
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May 9, 2024 02:55
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As good as Godzilla Minus Color looks, the ORTHOchromatic Shin Godzilla is way, way too dark and honestly it adds nothing to the experience in my opinion other than "Why is everybody's faces look so grimy" and "What the gently caress is Godzilla doing (during the barfing out smoke before the igniting)?" Not recommended, and I wouldn't spend money on the blu-ray if you were considering getting it. 1.5 out of 5 stars.
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May 9, 2024 03:20
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I'd watch President Solidus Snake controlling Kaiju with nanobots.
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May 9, 2024 03:48
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"Making the Mothra of all omelettes here Rodan, Can't fret over every egg!"
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May 9, 2024 04:12
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The Peace Walker/Monster Hunter crossover was pretty much made of Godzilla jokes.
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May 9, 2024 09:57
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All of the American dialogue is hilarious and one of the reasons I love Shin Godzilla
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May 9, 2024 17:02
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| # ? May 27, 2024 12:48 |
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So although the studio apparently wants him back to direct, Wingard has no deal in place and he wants to do another project before any new Monsterverse movie. Regardless, he's not going to write it. https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/godzilla-x-kong-follow-dave-callaham-1235895879/ They signed Dave Callaham, who wrote Shang-Chi in the MCU and has co-written the Spiderverse movies as well. He also did early drafts and got a story credit for Godzilla 2014. He also worked on Wonder Woman 1984, but let's not talk about that.
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May 11, 2024 16:30
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