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Bombadil sucks and is also the best.
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May 22, 2018 01:02
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VanSandman posted:Bombadil sucks and you know it.  , old wight. Tom kicks dick and his exclusion from every adaptation is as inexcusable as any number of skateboarding elves, if not more so.
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May 22, 2018 01:03
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Maybe if you all listened to 40 hours of tedious podcasts on bombadil you’d understand.
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May 22, 2018 01:03
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skasion posted:
the barrow wights would have been cool too
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May 22, 2018 01:10
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Yeah the wights are cool and I love that they are barely explained as old kings that can’t stop haunting poo poo.
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May 22, 2018 01:27
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VanSandman posted:Yeah the wights are cool and I love that they are barely explained as old kings that can’t stop haunting poo poo. Actually there's an easily missable line saying the wights were sent to the barrows by the witch king in ages past. They aren't the spirits of the dead buried there. Which makes them even scarier imo
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May 22, 2018 01:33
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the implication with the wights is that Men tried to establish a colony there and the Witch King sent the wights to kill and torment the colony until they all died, the wights then infested the burial grounds and stole all the loot. At least that's what I remember from the Unfinished Tales
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May 22, 2018 02:43
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Data Graham posted:Yeah well I have one friend who refuses to even watch Fellowship because he considers the whole thing to have been ruined by Dalek Galadriel, so what you gonna do. To be fair that is the single worst, most embarrassing thing in all 6 PJ Middle-earth films.
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May 22, 2018 03:22
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I've never seen it but I've heard that there is a clip of that scene with out any of the effects and her performance is supposedly amazing without all the CGI and auto tunning.
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May 22, 2018 03:47
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:To be fair that is the single worst, most embarrassing thing in all 6 PJ Middle-earth films. Legolas defying gravity takes this cake for me
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May 22, 2018 04:13
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sunday at work posted:I've never seen it but I've heard that there is a clip of that scene with out any of the effects and her performance is supposedly amazing without all the CGI and auto tunning. I feel like I've seen it and yeah from the clip as I remember it, she gives a great performance.
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May 22, 2018 04:17
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sunday at work posted:I've never seen it but I've heard that there is a clip of that scene with out any of the effects and her performance is supposedly amazing without all the CGI and auto tunning. I would pay  to see that. I could see the excellent acting underneath it all. I never fully grasped Galadriel until I saw Cate's performance.
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May 22, 2018 04:17
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:To be fair that is the single worst, most embarrassing thing in all 6 PJ Middle-earth films. That's a high bar to clear.
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May 23, 2018 10:06
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sassassin posted:That's a high bar to clear. I'm painfully aware. I like the films a lot - even, on balance, the Hobbit trilogy - but I'm under no illusions of their perfection.
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May 23, 2018 13:16
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:To be fair that is the single worst, most embarrassing thing in all 6 PJ Middle-earth films. Aragorn french kissing a horse is worse
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May 23, 2018 13:27
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The Galadriel ring test ? Interestingly that’s an almost literal word for word translation from the book. Adaptation is hard. What do you reimagine and what do you leave alone?
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May 23, 2018 13:32
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euphronius posted:The Galadriel ring test ? Interestingly that’s an almost literal word for word translation from the book. Adaptation is hard. What do you reimagine and what do you leave alone? You delete all the CGI overlays and just let Blanchett's performance handle it.
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May 23, 2018 13:33
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euphronius posted:The Galadriel ring test ? Interestingly that’s an almost literal word for word translation from the book. Adaptation is hard. What do you reimagine and what do you leave alone? You don't slather Cat Blanchett in CGI and alter her voice.
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May 23, 2018 13:34
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Yeah I mean there are thousands of ways it could be better. That wasn’t my point at all!!
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May 23, 2018 13:35
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Another example . The bridge of khazad dum scene is almost also a one to one beat for beat translation of what happens in the book (besides the ridiculous wings on the Balrog. Wtf). That works very well. But then “translations” of other scenes don’t really. Like there is no way the ent moot scene would have worked without major changes or the phantom dog attack in Hollin or Frodo just hanging out for 17 years or the bath scene in Buckland or Bombadils hallucination inducing story. adaptation is hard.
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May 23, 2018 13:41
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Even if you ignore the insanely goofy presentation, that scene is still bad because the movie doesn’t do the groundwork for it to make sense. In the book the reason why Galadriel’s situation is poignant is because she really does want the ring. If she lets Frodo go on, whether he succeeds in destroying the ring or Sauron gets it back, her life’s work in Lorien will be ruined because it was created through the rings’ power. Her choice is to either lose everything she still has and flee the world, or become a semi-divine tyrant ruling it. One could go so far as to say that this dilemma — that by destroying the ring Frodo will also be putting an end to those parts of the ancient world which were good and beautiful — is the whole point of the Lothlorien sequence. In the movie, the essential linkage between Nenya’s power, the power of the One, and the existence of Lorien is never made. Galadriel’s monologue is deprived of the context that gives it meaning and becomes just Cate Blanchett in a temper.
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May 23, 2018 13:47
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Yeah. There needed to maybe one 30 second scene of Sam hugging a Mallorn tree and it being made clear her ring keeps it all working.
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May 23, 2018 13:49
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euphronius posted:Another example . The bridge of khazad dum scene is almost also a one to one beat for beat translation of what happens in the book (besides the ridiculous wings on the Balrog. Wtf). Also aside from Gandalf whispering "fly you fools" as he clings to the edge, and then letting go Makes it look like he's acting out a preordained scene of some kind, "Hey you idiots, can't you take a hint? I'm busy trying to hit my cues here"
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May 23, 2018 15:33
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euphronius posted:Another example . The bridge of khazad dum scene is almost also a one to one beat for beat translation of what happens in the book (besides the ridiculous wings on the Balrog. Wtf). That works very well. But then “translations” of other scenes don’t really. Like there is no way the ent moot scene would have worked without major changes or the phantom dog attack in Hollin or Frodo just hanging out for 17 years or the bath scene in Buckland or Bombadils hallucination inducing story. adaptation is hard. It's fine to change things, but when you change them for the worse, then you done hosed up. An example of a good change is the whole Theoden arc which the movies did pretty well but wasn't quite the same as the book. Giving Arwen something to do instead of letting it be Glorfindel was a good change. A bad change was...well there's a lot. Faramir, the Ents, Denethor, etc. The whole tone Jackson went for was a more action-packed cinematic type Lord of the Rings. That's fine, and he mostly pulled it off, but I think Ebert said it best when he said that the way Jackson directed/filmed the movies was basically taking LOTR and aiming it at a teenage audience. The movies rarely pause to breathe. And god, I just remembered since I haven't seen them in a while, but does the music ever loving end? I think almost 100% of the scenes are musically scored which gets pretty irritating after a while. Still, my complaints aside, LOTR is a pretty solid trilogy of movies. They aren't the books, but they capture at least some of the feel of them. The Hobbit was loving terrible though. I didn't even see the other two so I have no idea how bad those are, but the first Hobbit was trash. Martin Freeman was an abominable Bilbo.
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May 23, 2018 16:17
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poo poo like this is why Thranduil gets a bad rap. Sure he was a dick to the Company and sure he doesn’t wanna help his neighbors even when their houses are literally on fire, but does HE get a big scene where he realizes that everything he’s built depends on the continued well-being of evil in the world? No, because he doesn’t even have a ring. And Sauron lives in his frickin back yard. And he’s STILL a powerful elvenking. Anyway it’s possible they discuss this in the second or third Hobbit movies, but the first one was so horrible I couldn’t watch the other two. Physically could not. And I unironically enjoyed the LotR movies front to back.
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May 23, 2018 16:35
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The movies are scored all the way through because Jackson was smart enough to realize that Shore was probably the greatest film composer in the world at the time and the more dramatic heavy lifting they could get him to do, the better.
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May 23, 2018 16:40
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elise the great posted:poo poo like this is why Thranduil gets a bad rap. Sure he was a dick to the Company and sure he doesn’t wanna help his neighbors even when their houses are literally on fire, but does HE get a big scene where he realizes that everything he’s built depends on the continued well-being of evil in the world? No, because he doesn’t even have a ring. And Sauron lives in his frickin back yard. And he’s STILL a powerful elvenking. The first hobbit movie was by far the best so good call
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May 23, 2018 16:53
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elise the great posted:Anyway it’s possible they discuss this in the second or third Hobbit movies Would you be astonished to learn that they didn’t? Of course they didn’t. They were wall-to-wall hot brooding Thorin and hot smouldering Kili and videogame gameplay and hey this worked in LotR let’s do it again. Thranduil’s great fun but completely wasted.
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May 23, 2018 17:32
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Thranduil is a broke chump willing to imprison passers-by and besiege his neighbors for money. His son is an ineffectual twerp, his servants are drunkards, he lives in a hole in the ground like a hobbit and he can’t keep a guy in jail to save his life. Royalty? Don’t make me laugh, he’s a glorified booze baron. Lee Pace’s version is semi-intentional parody of Jackson’s elves and pretty funny one at that, he’s a good actor.
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May 23, 2018 17:39
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In my head the whole Hobbit trilogy is an intentional parody taking the piss out of a classic kid's book. Can't bear to think of it as anything else. Except maybe that it's intended to be the Hobbit as envisioned by a 10 year old boy who just read the book for the first time, that could explain it too.
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May 23, 2018 18:02
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I like it as a cynical parody of its predecessor. But then, I've enjoyed worse movies.
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May 23, 2018 18:21
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I like Lee Pace a lot and I still couldn’t watch the latter two movies. Describing the first as “the best one” fills me with certainty that I made the right choice. I did watch some clips on YouTube to see if it got better. Am I just imagining poo poo or did they introduce Thranduil with a sexy saxophone slow-pan up his legs like a noir femme fatale getting out of a taxi? Did Smaug literally bathe in melted gold and fly around yelling to nobody about how cool he is? Does Bombur catch sick air on a waterslide? Does Kili make out with an elf???? Anyway I feel like next time I sit down to watch PJLotR, which will probably be when I introduce it to my own child, I’m gonna feel a lot better about it by sheer virtue of it not being the Hobbit.
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May 23, 2018 19:02
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elise the great posted:Did Smaug literally bathe in melted gold and fly around yelling to nobody about how cool he is? I mean That's Smaug
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May 23, 2018 19:06
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elise the great posted:I like Lee Pace a lot and I still couldn’t watch the latter two movies. Describing the first as “the best one” fills me with certainty that I made the right choice. It's warhammer-novel bad, yes. Just have your kid watch the rankin-bass animated hobbit, it's genuinely better in every way.
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May 23, 2018 19:10
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There is a long sequence in the third movie I think where the dwarves fire up a bunch of furnaces and melt a huge pile of gold to try and kill Smaug by pouring the gold on him. The gold doesn't kill Smaug, he just flys away. The whole thing is just more brooding Thorin and wanking over CGI. Just a completly pointless addition that amounts to nothing.
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May 23, 2018 19:12
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sunday at work posted:There is a long sequence in the third movie I think where the dwarves fire up a bunch of furnaces and melt a huge pile of gold to try and kill Smaug by pouring the gold on him. That’s the second film. The third film stretches out three chapters to 90 minutes and suuuuucks.
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May 23, 2018 19:16
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Also the gold looks like shampoo. I don't know how Weta managed to take the concept of white-hot glowing molten metal, which they had handled with complete and groundbreaking convincingness for five whole movies up to that point, and reinterpret it as "gold-colored CGI liquid from a Mind's Eye video in 1995".
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May 23, 2018 19:18
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:It's warhammer-novel bad, yes. Although you could probably finish a warhammer novel in less time than it takes to watch those movies.
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May 23, 2018 19:19
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Data Graham posted:Also the gold looks like shampoo. Lack of time and the studio being a nuisance mostly
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May 23, 2018 19:19
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:It's warhammer-novel bad, yes. Read the book to your kids rather than using either movie version imo.
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May 23, 2018 19:36
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