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Gay Retard posted:Are the new Mac Pros supposed to be out by the end of 2018? They were always out of my budget, but a maxed out 2008 Mac Pro for under $600 sounds really tempting - their multi-core geekbench scores rival most modern CPUs. I thought they had been pushed back to 2019?
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Aug 15, 2018 18:46
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badjohny posted:I thought they had been pushed back to 2019? You're right, they said it wouldn't be released until 2019 back in April.
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Aug 15, 2018 18:57
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They haven't given a timeline except "not 2018" So expect your cool new Mac Pros in 2024
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Aug 15, 2018 19:37
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FCKGW posted:They haven't given a timeline except "not 2018" They'll be thinner than an iPad Air. :jony:
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Aug 15, 2018 19:46
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Mark Larson posted:They'll be thinner than an iPad Air. :jony: They're for professional supermodels.
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Aug 15, 2018 20:16
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There is no aluminum Mac Pro with any kind of Thunderbolt, is there? The 2012 has FireWire 800 and USB 2, yes? I long to put my own GPUs & storage in an officially-supported Mac but getting it up to speed in other ways seems like a laundry list. Edit: not to mention no 6Gb/s SATA out of the box. kuskus fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Aug 15, 2018 |
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Aug 15, 2018 20:48
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Electric Bugaloo posted:If you pick up a 4,1 you can upgrade the CPUs yourself (TOTL and near-TOTL are readily available used for relatively little money as they were used in a lot of servers) reflash it and turn it into the 12 core 5,1 model of your dreams for usually less than a 5,1. There are a lot of guides and kits available online. Question! What is a decent price for one of these? Trying to figure out where to start.
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Aug 15, 2018 20:56
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kuskus posted:There is no aluminum Mac Pro with any kind of Thunderbolt, is there? The 2012 has FireWire 800 and USB 2, yes? I long to put my own GPUs & storage in an officially-supported Mac but getting it up to speed in other ways seems like a laundry list. Thunderbolt only on the trashcans, yes. You can add a USB 3.0 card to a cheesegrater mac however. There's a MacRumors master thread on what can and cannot be upgrades on these machines: https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/cmp-classicmacpro-4-1-5-1-upgrade-guide-sticky-discussion.2099092/ MarcusSA posted:Question! What is a decent price for one of these? Trying to figure out where to start. I bought mine with a 6 core and upgraded ram and video card for $600 on craigslist a year or two ago, you can probably find them cheaper by now. Mac of all trades still sells them and warranties them for 90 days, but you'll pay more that way. https://www.macofalltrades.com/shop/apple-desktops/refurbished-mac-pro/?_bc_fsnf=1&Year=2009&Year=2010
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Aug 15, 2018 21:04
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FCKGW posted:Thunderbolt only on the trashcans, yes. Thanks this is very helpful.
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Aug 15, 2018 21:08
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Has anyone tried to unfold a trashcan MP guts and put it into a rectangular enclosure?
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Aug 15, 2018 21:53
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Krispy Wafer posted:How do those old Xeon chips compare to modern stuff? Like if I was stupid enough to try and rehabbing an old Mac Pro what kind of performance would I get out of it? My work desktop has a Supermicro board with an X5670, which appears to have been the top of the line 6-core chip for the 2010 release of the 5,1 - later replaced with the slightly faster X5675. It's running Windows 10, but I think the comparison is still valid. Performance is pretty good in my opinion, for office work - the only time I get any kind of slowdown is when I switch between local access and Remote Desktop and it chugs for a moment to redraw every application I have open for a different monitor configuration. My main home desktop has an X5660 at 4.56 and from what I recall in benchmarks generally the per-clock performance is lower than the 2500K that I used before, but having two more cores and being a little higher clocked makes up for it. Power consumption at stock is not bad at all - idling under 10W for the CPU alone and ~80W at load - but the load number doubles with my overclock, and at 4.80 (not entirely stable) I get to around 200W even without HT. The 95W TDP models used in the Mac Pros are probably the sweet spot on the power/performance curve, since X5680 and X5690 have a 130W TDP. Eletriarnation fucked around with this message at 21:59 on Aug 15, 2018 |
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Aug 15, 2018 21:54
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Shaocaholica posted:Has anyone tried to unfold a trashcan MP guts and put it into a rectangular enclosure? Yeah there's companies that do this, the last post house I worked in used one but I can't remember the name
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Aug 15, 2018 21:58
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Quantum of Phallus posted:Yeah there's companies that do this, the last post house I worked in used one but I can't remember the name I'm not talking about the rack enclosures with 2 holes cut out for 2 trashcans. I mean take the guts out entirely and unfold them into a more traditional box.
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Aug 15, 2018 22:05
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That’s kinda funny that my 2011 air has TB and so does my 2012 minI, but not on a 2012 pro.
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Aug 15, 2018 22:42
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Go 10 or 12-core or go home IMO. You’ll pay more for a dual-CPU Mac Pro than a single-CPU model but it’s worth it to get more power than a modern TOTL quad core iMac that way. Make sure you look at the internals for the twin heatsinks vs the single big-block on 4-6 core single socketed models. Mac resellers will also sell you the dual-CPU tray with or without CPUs installed, as they are interchangeable in the same chassis but you’ll pay way more that way (although you can resell/trade in the single socket tray to recoup some of that, though I think it’s worth just getting a 8-12 core dual-CPU model to begin with). You can upgrade an 8-core model to various tiers of 12-core but the most you can put in a 4-core is 6. trilobite terror fucked around with this message at 23:53 on Aug 15, 2018 |
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Aug 15, 2018 23:50
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Are the MP 4.1/5.1 prices dropping/rising or pretty steady for a while now?
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Aug 16, 2018 00:11
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At what kind of workload is a maxed out old Pro going to be actually faster than a new iMac or 15” MBP, and worth the headache of a desktop and finding/flashing a modern video card? How much are the cpu/Ram upgrades on eBay?
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Aug 16, 2018 00:26
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Bob Morales posted:At what kind of workload is a maxed out old Pro going to be actually faster than a new iMac or 15” MBP, and worth the headache of a desktop and finding/flashing a modern video card? You'll have good perf/$ but less good perf/watt. Ram will be cheaper I'm guessing but ram prices are crazy. Internal SSD/HDD upgrades cheaper/easier but won't have crazy PCIe speeds. Maybe there's some PCIe SSD bootable(?) solution. And hipster points for having a older form factor. Its totally not a decision made purely on 'logical' reasons. You wouldn't do it for production (I would think).
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Aug 16, 2018 00:32
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Shaocaholica posted:Internal SSD/HDD upgrades cheaper/easier but won't have crazy PCIe speeds. Maybe there's some PCIe SSD bootable(?) solution. Best you can do with a SATA based SSD is maybe 530-550 MB/sec; if you wanted you could put it on a PCIe card if you wanted to save the bays for platter HDs. If you're willing to go the hacker route, there's already a tested procedure on MacRumors forums that works on 5,1s up to the last version of High Sierra; basically you inject the NVMe driver extracted from the Late 2013 Mac Pros into a copy of your most current 5,1 BootROM, then reflash this to your cMP. It's similar to the process for flashing a 4,1 to a 5,1. Once you successfully complete the flash you can buy a $20 PCIe M.2 carrier and your favorite PCIe M.2 card (970 Evo/Pros are the most popular and compatible.). Format it with Disk Utility, HFS or APFS, then clone over from your boot drive, set Startup Disk to the PCIe drive, reboot, boom you're in business. It's suggested you already be at 10.13.6 before attempting this. I do this with a Samsung 970 pro and I get 1300 MB/sec reads and writes. Stuff that has to do a lot of disk loads (Outlook, FileMaker Pro, Fortnite) runs like a dream on this setup. Work is in progress to support this for Mojave, but Mojave has to be finalized before anything solid can materialize. Binary Badger fucked around with this message at 01:02 on Aug 16, 2018 |
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Aug 16, 2018 00:57
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I keep losing the charger for my 13 inch 2017 MBP so I broke down and purchased one or those MagSafe adapters so I could use my plethora of older chargers. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B075RZJS2Z/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1 So far it works alright. I think there's a power flow hit when using this, so charging + using at the same time doesn't work so well. But it holds up in a pinch until I find my USB-C charger again.
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Aug 16, 2018 01:23
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Binary Badger posted:Best you can do with a SATA based SSD is maybe 530-550 MB/sec; if you wanted you could put it on a PCIe card if you wanted to save the bays for platter HDs. Stop giving me ideas! Unrelated: I have 2 Airport Extreme Base Stations I need to sell. I'll put them up in SAMart but feel free to PM me.
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Aug 16, 2018 02:17
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Shaocaholica posted:Stop giving me ideas! Are they the 802.11ac towers or the 5th Gen flat slabs?
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Aug 16, 2018 02:21
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Binary Badger posted:Are they the 802.11ac towers or the 5th Gen flat slabs? Tower tower! Observation deck! e: I also have an additional 5th gen 'flat slab' Extreme(?) Time capsule. Not sure what the capacity is. Not sure if there are fun hacks to do with it. Shaocaholica fucked around with this message at 02:41 on Aug 16, 2018 |
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Aug 16, 2018 02:33
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Bob Morales posted:How much are the cpu/Ram upgrades on eBay? Not bad; X5670s are $30 apiece and assuming you can use standard DDR3 RDIMMs, I just got 48GB for $114 (8GBx6, $19 each) about a month ago.
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Aug 16, 2018 03:23
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Bob Morales posted:At what kind of workload is a maxed out old Pro going to be actually faster than a new iMac or 15” MBP, and worth the headache of a desktop and finding/flashing a modern video card? RAM and CPUs are (well, were, idk now) cheap. I got 32GB unbuffered ECC RAM at 1333Mhz for £60 an the top tier chip (W3690) for £100 and then another £100 for a regular old GTX 680 which is dirt simple to flash for Mac EFI BIOS. As for handling a workload, it totally depends on what yours is. Given you can put any modern video card up to a 1080Ti in there, I'd argue the CPU will always be the limiting factor all other things being equal. If you get a W3690 or X5690 Xeon or an i7 990X (lol) you're as fast as it can go. It's still a pretty competent chip and if you're dealing with a heavily multi-threaded workload then you'd definitely benefit from a dual CPU setup. I bought my base unit for ~£600 18 months ago, factor in the upgrades to date (512GB SSD, GTX 980Ti and USB 3.0) less the crap I eBay'd because I didn't need (GTX 680, HD 7570, old RAM, old CPU) and I'm in for roughly £1,000.* That isn't cheap for a near 10-year old machine, but this is bizarro world where you have to spend 5x that to get close to the performance if you bought new. *this is before claiming back as an expense on my tax return. ymmv.
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Aug 16, 2018 07:58
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I inherited mine from someone at work who upgraded to a trash pro, although mines a 12 core model. I've got an ssd running off a sata3 card, 32gb of ecc and I did have an RX480 in it but when I upgraded to HS it hosed up sleep. The fix is to flash the rx480's bios so it thinks it's the one specific model of rx580 that HS supports, but I haven't got around to doing it yet. I was eyeing the compatible higher clocked xeons on e-bay, which weren't too badly priced either.
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Aug 16, 2018 08:19
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It really annoys me that there aren't any USB C multi-port adapters that support both 4k/60hz and USB 3.
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Aug 16, 2018 14:49
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I guess the last gen 4.1/5.1 fleet of MPs will live on life support by 'fans' for a long time because reasons. Even if someone gets tired of it there will always but someone else to pick up the torch.
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Aug 16, 2018 15:15
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Krispy Wafer posted:I keep losing the charger for my 13 inch 2017 MBP so I broke down and purchased one or those MagSafe adapters so I could use my plethora of older chargers. This is cool as poo poo and I just ordered one.
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Aug 16, 2018 16:16
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I would totally watch a Linus style video of someone upgrading an old Mac Pro on the cheap to see how much power can be gotten out of it compared to current machines.
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Aug 16, 2018 18:19
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EL BROMANCE posted:I would totally watch a Linus style video of someone upgrading an old Mac Pro on the cheap to see how much power can be gotten out of it compared to current machines. Ton of videos already tho. Linus would just gently caress it up somehow. I still love his channel tho.
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Aug 16, 2018 19:46
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Shaocaholica posted:I guess the last gen 4.1/5.1 fleet of MPs will live on life support by 'fans' for a long time because reasons. Even if someone gets tired of it there will always but someone else to pick up the torch. Of course it has fans. It’s a wonderful design object and showcases Apple’s signature “it just works” ethos and focus on industrial design applied in a direction that isn’t really commonly seen in post-1997 Macs (although ironically the G3 iMacs had all of their guts on a tray that could be pulled out of the rear of the machine for servicing/upgrading). The interior of the Mac Pro is just as finished and polished as the exterior and everything was made to be as easy and painless to access as possible at a time when many high-end hobbyist PC builder cases were still really annoying to set up and work in. At the time that it came out as an evolution of the G5 it was light years ahead of what you could get on the Windows/Linux side. It pioneered lots of ease-of-use considerations that are more commonplace in builder cases today such as hot-swappable drive bays, a pull-out CPU/RAM tray, a latching side access panel and finished interior edges that wouldn’t slice your finger open. Even the Trashcan is very accessible. The shroud comes off with a thumb switch, the base swivels for accessibility, and everything can be stripped out with a screwdriver. I’ve said it before that the Trashcan’s biggest failures were thermals, a failed bet on dual-GPU vs single-GPU, and a failure on Apple’s part to create an ecosystem around the weird form-factor components, but creating a “closed box that can’t be upgraded” wasn’t one of them (at least in theory, too bad there was nothing on the market to upgrade it with).
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Aug 16, 2018 20:20
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Last Chance posted:Untreated mental illness is really sad yeah... I feel like this guy used to work in a studio with an old PowerMac G3 or something where some of this stuff may have actually mattered (especially if the machine didn't have a lot of memory and he was running a bunch of audio plugins). Now there's no way that any of this stuff could possibly make the slighest bit of difference. Probably just some old GreyBeard audio engineer that doesn't really understand computers after 2004.
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Aug 16, 2018 20:24
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Shaocaholica posted:Ton of videos already tho. Linus would just gently caress it up somehow. I still love his channel tho. I’ll have to search it out. I’m a fan of channels with decent production values and who are willing to throw big money at pointless questions, so I watch a fair few of Linus’s things.
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Aug 16, 2018 20:27
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64bit_Dophins posted:yeah... I feel like this guy used to work in a studio with an old PowerMac G3 or something where some of this stuff may have actually mattered (especially if the machine didn't have a lot of memory and he was running a bunch of audio plugins). Or you could just call a scam a scam. Like, a lot of the same criticisms that are applied to snake oil audiophile crap are also applicable to snake oil health supplements, sexual performance aids, naturo/homeopathy, magic, astrology, etc. Purveyors can believe in their own bullshit to various degrees, or not, but the only people I really feel sympathy for are those who get taken advantage of.
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Aug 16, 2018 20:52
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Electric Bugaloo posted:At the time that it came out as an evolution of the G5 it was light years ahead of what you could get on the Windows/Linux side. It’d have been fairer to say that some of what we saw then, came from the PowerPC G3 and G4 towers in terms of upgrade friendliness which then the G5 PM/cMP cases as well as cases PC-side incorporated. But some of it was just straight up common sense too, such as rounded edges and such, and I wouldn’t rush to attribute to Apple. And hot swap bays predate the cheese grater chases by many, many years. I will say that I still love my G4 Quicksilver’s chassis and have thought at times of rebuilding a system within it.
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Aug 16, 2018 21:18
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Lol imagine how many HP Z8XX would sell if some magic friendship would allow non hacked native macOS support.
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Aug 16, 2018 21:49
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SourKraut posted:While I don’t disagree with a lot of what you wrote, this is some RDF revisionist Apple worship. You started to see toolless drive cages, rubber grommet mounts for fans/drives, rounded corners on cable routing holes, zip tie points for cable management, etc. in the DIY case market in the mid-2000s from the likes of Cooler Master, Antec, etc. The internal cleanliness and items like the hinges door certainly weren’t really available, but the cleanliness is in part due to internal component provisions more so than the case, which case manufacturers don’t have control over.  my bad.
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Aug 16, 2018 22:17
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EL BROMANCE posted:I would totally watch a Linus style video of someone upgrading an old Mac Pro on the cheap to see how much power can be gotten out of it compared to current machines. Here’s an article where someone shows some upgrades https://m.imore.com/retro-review-2009-mac-pro-2018
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Aug 16, 2018 22:38
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Bob Morales posted:Here’s an article where someone shows some upgrades Eh, no PCIe M.2 boot disk upgrade and he hardly even touched his RAM. I'd hate to have all that and still only have High Sierra running at SATA 2 speeds.
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Aug 16, 2018 23:04
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