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Karchev or Darius being unable to being large numbers of jacks outside of theme lists is a terrible idea.
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Nov 8, 2016 23:57
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All they have to do is take away boosted attack rolls from his feat and I think it'll put the mad dog spam away. Removes a poo poo ton of focus efficiency and makes it really hard for them to deal with high def models with their mat5. You'll at least see fewer dogs in exchange for some higher mat jacks or mat fixing tech (greylords, etc)
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Nov 9, 2016 00:17
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So your solution is to take away half of his feat? I know it happened to Haley2 in Mk2, but I don't think Karchev is at that level. Not to mention the problem isn't his feat, it's his feat in concert with 15 Mad Dogs.
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Nov 9, 2016 00:23
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Friendly Fire posted:An interesting write up on why Mad Dogs with Karchev are broken written by Chris Davies. This is really tough to read with this guy spewing memes and other reddit spergin poo poo. Calling them mad doges isn't funny or clever hnnnnghghth fuuuuckckck pissssss
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Nov 9, 2016 00:26
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Floppychop posted:So your solution is to take away half of his feat? Eh magical weapons and boosted damage rolls is still really good on a dude who speeds up khador jacks by 3" and has 30 warjack points.
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Nov 9, 2016 00:29
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Jimmy Hats posted:Eh magical weapons and boosted damage rolls is still really good on a dude who speeds up khador jacks by 3" and has 30 warjack points. *speeds up one jack by 3 inches every time another model kills an enemy Also boosted damage rolls means that if you charge you've basically wasted that part of the feat. Road to War is generally not very good with a mad dog spam list. I like it if running a normal karchev list where there's ranged attacks to trigger it for the jacks. But in mad dog spam, most of the jacks aren't going to get to use it unless there's a ton of convenient small infantry to trample, and if you have road to war on then you're not using counter charge. chutche2 fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Nov 9, 2016 |
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Nov 9, 2016 00:35
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Khisanth Magus posted:I'm not sure why you'd reach for MHSF instead of Invictors in MK3. Similar damage output against warjacks, higher damage output against non-warjacks, but invictors have a much longer threat range and a good accuracy fixer in rerolling misses on CRAs(who hasn't rolled snakeyes on a huge CRA against a critical model). If you go second put deadeye and/or shatterstorm on the Invictors, mini feat, assault and shred any non-stealth single wound infantry the enemy has. Stealth infantry is very hard to deal with, currently. Most of the other premier shooting units will just fold to MHSF (like WGRC or Invictors, for example) but will fight Invictors pretty well.
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Nov 9, 2016 00:45
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chutche2 posted:*speeds up one jack by 3 inches every time another model kills an enemy Killing an enemy is really easy in a faction that gets 4 rat 7 auto damagers for 8 points. Also that part of the feat IS wasted, if you ignore the other 1-4 attacks that warjack is making.
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Nov 9, 2016 00:47
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Karchevs feat is fine in conjunction with the usual mix of khador jacks with 2-3 initials, and you're usually looking at 8-10 there unless you're forgoing support. 14 jacks makes it a bunch much, especially if you factoring trampling over an expensive small base unit. The article is good, you should read it.
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Nov 9, 2016 00:49
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497 hit boxes, at a minimum ARM 18 is the problem. Or, at least, the biggest problem. That's an absurd number, with an absurd damage threshold. Weaponmaster spam can't counter that, other heavy hitters can't counter that, it's a ridiculous figure that needs to be altered. And it's not just Karchev. Perhaps he's the worst offender, but is it much better with Butcher and Full Throttle for free boosted charges and better damage options? Or how about B3 Energizer to make it faster? Harkevich to get them +3 ARM for the turn it counts? Sorscha2 for double damage feat and Boundless Charge? poo poo is bonkers. Bargain price Heavies should not exist at that price.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:05
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Jimmy Hats posted:Killing an enemy is really easy in a faction that gets 4 rat 7 auto damagers for 8 points. I'm talking about a mad dogs list. Is karchev somehow allocating 3 to every one of his mad dogs? And what khador jack has 3 initials so it can get 5 attacks on a charge with karchev?
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Nov 9, 2016 01:05
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chutche2 posted:I'm talking about a mad dogs list. Is karchev somehow allocating 3 to every one of his mad dogs? And what khador jack has 3 initials so it can get 5 attacks on a charge with karchev? Ragers
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Nov 9, 2016 01:06
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susan posted:497 hit boxes, at a minimum ARM 18 is the problem. Or, at least, the biggest problem. That's an absurd number, with an absurd damage threshold. Weaponmaster spam can't counter that, other heavy hitters can't counter that, it's a ridiculous figure that needs to be altered. And it's not just Karchev. Perhaps he's the worst offender, but is it much better with Butcher and Full Throttle for free boosted charges and better damage options? Or how about B3 Energizer to make it faster? Harkevich to get them +3 ARM for the turn it counts? Sorscha2 for double damage feat and Boundless Charge? poo poo is bonkers. Bargain price Heavies should not exist at that price. You're right. Khador players should bring their light jacks instead. Oh wait.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:14
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susan posted:497 hit boxes, at a minimum ARM 18 is the problem. Or, at least, the biggest problem. That's an absurd number, with an absurd damage threshold. Weaponmaster spam can't counter that, other heavy hitters can't counter that, it's a ridiculous figure that needs to be altered. And it's not just Karchev. Perhaps he's the worst offender, but is it much better with Butcher and Full Throttle for free boosted charges and better damage options? Or how about B3 Energizer to make it faster? Harkevich to get them +3 ARM for the turn it counts? Sorscha2 for double damage feat and Boundless Charge? poo poo is bonkers. Bargain price Heavies should not exist at that price. So, what light jacks should Khador use then? The mad dog is a little bonkers yes, but at the same time its a turd on its own. Khador has always been the turd polishing faction. Karchev just manages to polish 14 turds at once. Want a limiter on Karchev? Give his feat a target number, d3+3 just like eVlad
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Nov 9, 2016 01:19
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Jimmy Hats posted:This is really tough to read with this guy spewing memes and other reddit spergin poo poo. Calling them mad doges isn't funny or clever hnnnnghghth fuuuuckckck pissssss It's worth fighting through all that though as he makes some solid points.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:19
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what the hell is with all this khador light jack 
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Nov 9, 2016 01:20
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comrade corcus posted:So, what light jacks should Khador use then? The mad dog is a little bonkers yes, but at the same time its a turd on its own. Khador has always been the turd polishing faction. Karchev just manages to polish 14 turds at once. Want a limiter on Karchev? Give his feat a target number, d3+3 just like eVlad I like this idea but I dunno how much it matters compared to the number of jacks actually getting stuck in on his feat turn anyway
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Nov 9, 2016 01:22
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All of the suggestions so far either make Karchev a terrible caster outside of a mad dog list, or make the mad dog a terrible jack that no caster will ever take. The karchev changes suggested so far would make him significantly worse than mk2 karchev, who was already considered a gimmick caster taken for non-competitive games.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:24
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Losing boosted hit rolls would literally only affect mad dog spam. Real khador jacks have mat7, and pay points for it. Mad dogs don't pay points for mat which is why they are cheap.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:50
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Jimmy Hats posted:Losing boosted hit rolls would literally only affect mad dog spam. Real khador jacks have mat7, and pay points for it. Mad dogs don't pay points for mat which is why they are cheap. Or berserkers, or spriggans, or devastators, or demolishers. And mat 7 isn't auto hit. You're still boosting to hit warpwolves and stuff.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:58
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chutche2 posted:Or berserkers, or spriggans, or devastators, or demolishers. Nobody uses spriggans, they use berserkers on jack marshalls which can fix mat, and devastators and demolishers are used for power attacks which you spend the focus to boost to hit on always anyways. The difference is that mat 7 hits def 14 on 2 dice something like 56% of the time, whereas mat 5 doing the same is something like 28%. Karchev would be a perfectly servicable caster with a slight change to him to take the steam out of cheap jack spam. It would just mean that he couldn't drop his mad dog list into literally everything, there would be occasional bad match ups against high defense armies.
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Nov 9, 2016 02:06
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Jimmy Hats posted:Nobody uses spriggans, they use berserkers on jack marshalls which can fix mat, and devastators and demolishers are used for power attacks which you spend the focus to boost to hit on always anyways. jack marshals aren't that prevalent
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Nov 9, 2016 02:29
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Jimmy Hats posted:Nobody uses spriggans, they use berserkers on jack marshalls which can fix mat, and devastators and demolishers are used for power attacks which you spend the focus to boost to hit on always anyways. Can you cite your source on berserkers only being used on jack marshalls? Khador has one jack marshal, and he's very rarely taken with a jack. Also I hope you have a way to give the berserker free charges, because if you're using the +2 mat ability you're not using crush or the charge ability.
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Nov 9, 2016 02:30
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(Berserkers don't get used)
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Nov 9, 2016 02:31
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Jimmy Hats posted:(Berserkers don't get used) Berserkers were in two lists at WTC. One a Karchev list, and one a Sorscha1 list.
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Nov 9, 2016 02:36
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Oh you're right a guy on the 28th place team used 2 of them in his second list and another guy on the 50th place team used 1 of them in his second list
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Nov 9, 2016 03:09
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Jimmy Hats posted:Oh you're right a guy on the 28th place team used 2 of them in his second list and another guy on the 50th place team used 1 of them in his second list Yeah, so they didn't win. So what? The players at the WTC represent some of the top players in the world. Some of them are going to end up losing. That doesn't make them poo poo players.
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Nov 9, 2016 03:25
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Guess I won't be going to WMW ever. I wonder if we will still get models here in Canada....
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Nov 9, 2016 05:30
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Gee, wonder why this thread is so dead today.  PP released the ADR casters for 2017 today. http://privateerpress.com/community/privateer-insider/insider-11-9-2016
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Nov 9, 2016 21:52
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What does Garryth like to be run with?
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Nov 9, 2016 21:57
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Looking to trade. Have: Minions and Convergence Want: A loaded gun so I can kill myself and leave this world. Serious inquiries only.
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Nov 9, 2016 22:05
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My mohsar/tanith pairing lookin p swag right now
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Nov 9, 2016 22:11
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rydiafan posted:Looking to trade. As long as your are a middle class+ healthy straight white male you will probably be fine for the next 4 years if you just turn off your ability to care about your fellow man.
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Nov 9, 2016 22:18
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waah posted:Gee, wonder why this thread is so dead today. WIthout some Errata changes the cryx ADR is awfullllll.
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Nov 9, 2016 22:37
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For anyone who knew who she was, apparently Kim Wilborn passed away yesterday. I'm not sure what the cause was.
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Nov 9, 2016 22:57
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S.J. posted:For anyone who knew who she was, apparently Kim Wilborn passed away yesterday. I'm not sure what the cause was. I'm not trying to be dumb, but was this person important in the WMH community? Google search showed up with nothing.
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Nov 9, 2016 23:01
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rydiafan posted:Looking to trade. Dude, you need to keep making the best podcast ever. It might be one of the few things for people to really enjoy in a four year pile of poo poo.
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Nov 9, 2016 23:03
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rkajdi posted:I'm not trying to be dumb, but was this person important in the WMH community? Google search showed up with nothing. She was a PG in Kansas City. Organized events, went to others like WMW. I just saw her last Friday when she was overseeing the line. She mentioned she recognized me, and looked so psyched about her bag of swag 
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Nov 9, 2016 23:02
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For anyone interested in donating to her memorial http://www.t-shirtexplosion.com/apps/donations/ She was a PG that helped out with a ton of stuff all over the place. I always loved talking to her when I saw her. This sucks.
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Nov 9, 2016 23:04
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S.J. posted:For anyone who knew who she was, apparently Kim Wilborn passed away yesterday. I'm not sure what the cause was. Aw gently caress
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Nov 9, 2016 23:39
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