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El Mido
Feb 22, 2011
Advance 3 is kind of bad but it also kind of knows it since the Knuckles + Tails combo exists. Even the Dimpsiest levels cannot withstand the ability to super jump and glide.

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Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

This does not make sense when, again, aggregate indicia also indicate improvements. The belief that things are worse is false. It remains false.
Aw yeah, sonic music party!

J-Spot
May 7, 2002

El Mido posted:

Advance 3 is kind of bad but it also kind of knows it since the Knuckles + Tails combo exists. Even the Dimpsiest levels cannot withstand the ability to super jump and glide.
I thought the team mechanic was going to be so cool before the game launched, but there really was no reason to use anyone other than Knuckles+Tails. Since you could glide, fly, and break barriers you could get anywhere with this team. Then you had the absolutely worthless combos that would actually break the primary characters skill like Tails+Knuckles (replaces Tails' flying ability with Knuckles gliding but no wall climb), Tails+Cream (replaces Tails' flying ability with some bizarre move where he forgets how to fly and falls), Cream+Tails (replaces Cream's flight with a slow fall) or Knuckles+Sonic (replaces Knuckles' glide and wall climb with a mid-air head-butt).

beep by grandpa
May 5, 2004

Guys I'm working on ripping the Sonic Mania debut trailer music and I'm gonna jam to it, loudly, the entire time I go for my morning run tomorrow and I'm probably gonna blast off into the sky with sonic speed.

Ventana
Mar 28, 2010

*Yosh intensifies*

sharrrk posted:

i love the tag team mechanics from advance 3 but the level design is pretty bad

The only levels imo that are actually bad are Sunset Hill Act 3 (which is a pointless maze at the beginning for some odd reason) and Chaos Angel Act 2 (which has nothing bad/wrong with it but for some reason is super long and just repeats gimmicks/parts of the level design for sheer length). Cyber Track is fun, Toy Kingdom is fun when you get a handle of the jack-in-the-box springs, Ocean Base is a bit long but has a lot of neat moments in it which makes it worth it.


El Mido posted:

Advance 3 is kind of bad but it also kind of knows it since the Knuckles + Tails combo exists. Even the Dimpsiest levels cannot withstand the ability to super jump and glide.

There's a lot of team combinations that also basically destroy levels. It's a "choose your own way to break the game" kind of design which is usually fun to play with.

YoshiOfYellow
Aug 21, 2015

Voted #1 Babysitter in Mushroom Kingdom


Why would you link Sonic Chronicles? :gonk:

That game still has the most atrocious soundtrack of anything I've ever heard. It makes me so drat sad.

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

the greatest flaw of all the advance games is they had bad special stages

Groovelord Neato
Dec 6, 2014


Bass Bottles posted:

I can't remember the station square music right now but the ooOoooooOooooo from Mystic Ruins immediately jumped into my head

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oa0giRkQdQM

Motto
Aug 3, 2013

Stairmaster posted:

the greatest flaw of all the advance games is they had bad special stages

I've never gotten into any of Advance 2's.

PaletteSwappedNinja
Jun 3, 2008

One Nation, Under God.
Advance 2s special stages were neat, I thought. The others would be fine if not for awful hitboxes and tons of sprite scaling that make it difficult to hit anything.

Sonic 1 is the only game with a special stage I really liked. Holy poo poo am I ever sick of the "running down a tunnel" stages.

Stairmaster
Jun 8, 2012

in sonic advance 2 you visit the afterlife to battle zero for the chaos emeralds.

Kulkasha
Jan 15, 2010

But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Likchenpa.

PaletteSwappedNinja posted:

Advance 2s special stages were neat, I thought. The others would be fine if not for awful hitboxes and tons of sprite scaling that make it difficult to hit anything.

Sonic 1 is the only game with a special stage I really liked. Holy poo poo am I ever sick of the "running down a tunnel" stages.

Sonic 3's actual special stages were the slots and the lightning pinball, and the emerald stages were 3D turn on a dime nightmares

Chieves
Sep 20, 2010

Once I got the sprite scaling down, I REALLY liked the ones from CD.

Ms. Unsmiley
Feb 13, 2012

the only good special stages are the blue spheres. the rush games had decent special stages too iirc. i think the saturn version of sonic 3d blast had good special stages too? i've only seen those ones in video though, i never played that game.

MorningMoon
Dec 29, 2013

He's been tapping into Aunt May's bank account!
Didn't I kill him with a HELICOPTER?
https://twitter.com/boxerhockey/status/757402049776541696

The set up for the stream was such a mess

El Mido
Feb 22, 2011

Ventana posted:

There's a lot of team combinations that also basically destroy levels. It's a "choose your own way to break the game" kind of design which is usually fun to play with.

You're right that flying, gliding, and super jumping over Dimps level design makes it bearable but I don't know if I'd call that fun.

Pureauthor
Jul 8, 2010

ASK ME ABOUT KISSING A GHOST

Is there a fan who would attend a live Sonic event and not sing along to Live and Learn?

Amppelix
Aug 6, 2010

Did someone say, "Sonic Advance 3's level design"?

Warning: Huge level map

Look at this mess. You can tell where the level ends, but where does it even begin? What the heck is the progression? If you fall and/or somehow reach higher ground at any point in the level, you will have no idea if you're even supposed to be going left or right (incidentally, the level begins in the lower left corner where a tiny Sonic sprite is.)

Maybe y'all are way better at videogame spatial awareness than I am or something, but this has always been my experience with SA3. I never have any idea where the "ground level" actually is, if I'm on the low or high path, if alternate paths even exist right now, if this drop is to a pit or to another route, etc. I can get to the end of the level with some flailing, sure, but it never feels good. More like I just chose some directions randomly and the game eventually deposited me at the exit.

Great Beer
Jul 5, 2004

beep by grandpa posted:

Guys I'm working on ripping the Sonic Mania debut trailer music and I'm gonna jam to it, loudly, the entire time I go for my morning run tomorrow and I'm probably gonna blast off into the sky with sonic speed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cB3HXVvm0g

There ya go. Video description has a bunch of links for spotify, bandcamp, itunes, whatever.

Super Jay Mann
Nov 6, 2008

Amppelix posted:

Did someone say, "Sonic Advance 3's level design"?

Warning: Huge level map

Look at this mess. You can tell where the level ends, but where does it even begin? What the heck is the progression? If you fall and/or somehow reach higher ground at any point in the level, you will have no idea if you're even supposed to be going left or right (incidentally, the level begins in the lower left corner where a tiny Sonic sprite is.)

Maybe y'all are way better at videogame spatial awareness than I am or something, but this has always been my experience with SA3. I never have any idea where the "ground level" actually is, if I'm on the low or high path, if alternate paths even exist right now, if this drop is to a pit or to another route, etc. I can get to the end of the level with some flailing, sure, but it never feels good. More like I just chose some directions randomly and the game eventually deposited me at the exit.

I don't know, the progression seems pretty obvious to me. You start at the bottom and take a fairly linear path that leads into a slightly higher path that doubles back the way you came until it reaches the leftmost area which leads into a major set of branching paths in the upper half of the level. Some of them criss-cross one another but all use the terrain and various level gimmicks to propel you rightwards until all the paths coalesce after the large set of multiple waterfalls and waterslides. From there it's a straight shot to the end of the level. There are even several potential shortcuts to expedite the level if you bring the right character combo with you, most notably the large pit at the very right of the initial lower pathway that leads straight to the very end of the stage if you climb/fly up there. Of course you may end up falling at some points and end up having to repeat some sections if you aren't careful but that's the nature of the beast.

I love Sonic Advance 3 just to be clear.

Kulkasha
Jan 15, 2010

But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Likchenpa.
Everyone should read Sonic Megadrive, it gud

Jarogue
Nov 3, 2012


Amppelix posted:

Did someone say, "Sonic Advance 3's level design"?

Warning: Huge level map

Look at this mess. You can tell where the level ends, but where does it even begin? What the heck is the progression? If you fall and/or somehow reach higher ground at any point in the level, you will have no idea if you're even supposed to be going left or right (incidentally, the level begins in the lower left corner where a tiny Sonic sprite is.)

Maybe y'all are way better at videogame spatial awareness than I am or something, but this has always been my experience with SA3. I never have any idea where the "ground level" actually is, if I'm on the low or high path, if alternate paths even exist right now, if this drop is to a pit or to another route, etc. I can get to the end of the level with some flailing, sure, but it never feels good. More like I just chose some directions randomly and the game eventually deposited me at the exit.

I always just run forward and worked for me.

also

Super Jay Mann posted:

I love Sonic Advance 3.

MikeJF
Dec 20, 2003




I remember Sonic Advance 3 being okay until I hit Chaos Angel and then that was enough of that bullshit.

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

https://soundcloud.com/hyperpotions/checkpoint
drat that Sonic Maina trailer music is good. I assume they're not at all handling the music for Sonic Mania and we'll get gunk.

PaletteSwappedNinja
Jun 3, 2008

One Nation, Under God.
They're not handling the music for the full game (which is fine by me, the trailer music sucks).

The composer is a guy named Tee Lopes - he's done a lot of Sonic fan remixes (including the music for the aborted Sonic 2 HD) as well as a few original games like Major Magnet. Here's his soundcloud, if you want more just type his name into youtube, he's seriously done shitloads of Sonic tunes: https://soundcloud.com/teelopesmusic

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

His other stuff sounds good but the Sonic remixes he has are kinda meh.

E: No wait found one I like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRjHM8wiTbg

Golden Goat fucked around with this message at 10:03 on Jul 25, 2016

Bloody Pom
Jun 5, 2011



The one stage track shown so far is Sonic CD as gently caress, so I'm hopeful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGR5fTO2oio

Ventana
Mar 28, 2010

*Yosh intensifies*

Amppelix posted:

Did someone say, "Sonic Advance 3's level design"?

Warning: Huge level map




The problem here is that you're trying to look at the map where the game makes it unclear where the starting point is, but that doesn't really apply when you actually play the level. For pretty much any level if you were to actually just start to drop in, you'd be able to just go right a little and immediately figure out the proper path. The sole exception would be Sunset Hill Act 3 (which that isn't even, thankfully), cause usually even in the most labyrinthine of stages you'd usually be able to tell soon if going right or left is the proper direction, but Sunset Hill Act 3 doesn't even give you that.

If we're judging purely on some theory "what stages have the prettiest/easiest to follow map designs when looked at overall"? Yeah Sonic Advance 3's are messy since it's hard to gauge their starting point references normally. But in practice in gameplay? The levels are fine.


MikeJF posted:

I remember Sonic Advance 3 being okay until I hit Chaos Angel and then that was enough of that bullshit.

Chaos Angel 1 is okay and pretty cool. Chaos Angel 2 is where it starts to really long drag and doesn't offer anything new. Chaos Angel 3 is the platform autoscroll-y level, which I guess a lot of people would dislike in their Sonic game but I actually liked the level for feeling like a tight challenge without actually being too hard and the unique gimmick was new to the franchise. That Level would be hell if Sonic Advance 3 didn't have the "enemies drop rings when they are destroyed" mechanic, though but otherwise works fine within the gameplay mechanics of the game.

A Great Big Bee!
Mar 8, 2007

Grimey Drawer
#2 Forgotten Skies - Sir Spacebar
Sonic Rush Adventure - Sky Babylon

beep by grandpa
May 5, 2004

Great Beer posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cB3HXVvm0g

There ya go. Video description has a bunch of links for spotify, bandcamp, itunes, whatever.

Oh yeah I did rip the music but it was only available in pedestrian 128kbps so I ended up buying the mp3 from the Google store in wondrous 320!

GUI
Nov 5, 2005

I fukken love the kid who lost his mind singing the Sonic Heroes song when the singer pointed the microphone at him.

Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NL50_W_mgU&t=452s

GUI fucked around with this message at 14:24 on Jul 25, 2016

Golden Goat
Aug 2, 2012

GUI posted:

I fukken love the kid who lost his mind singing the Sonic Heroes song when the singer pointed the microphone at him.

Edit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NL50_W_mgU&t=452s

"SING IT!"
"EARRUGHHHGGSS"

Scaly Haylie
Dec 25, 2004

smell this posted:

meh not as great as station square

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejcdZ2i965o

Amppelix
Aug 6, 2010

Ventana posted:

The problem here is that you're trying to look at the map where the game makes it unclear where the starting point is, but that doesn't really apply when you actually play the level. For pretty much any level if you were to actually just start to drop in, you'd be able to just go right a little and immediately figure out the proper path. The sole exception would be Sunset Hill Act 3 (which that isn't even, thankfully), cause usually even in the most labyrinthine of stages you'd usually be able to tell soon if going right or left is the proper direction, but Sunset Hill Act 3 doesn't even give you that.

If we're judging purely on some theory "what stages have the prettiest/easiest to follow map designs when looked at overall"? Yeah Sonic Advance 3's are messy since it's hard to gauge their starting point references normally. But in practice in gameplay? The levels are fine.

A) That is Sunset Hill 3. At least if we trust http://www.soniccenter.org/maps/sonic_advance_3 and why wouldn't we

B) Did you like skip over the rest of the post where I complain about how I always got lost in the stages

To be honest I haven't made an actual effort to play SA3 in at least five years, so maybe I'd like it more now. But I really don't want to even try.

Dabir
Nov 10, 2012

I went and watched a playthrough of Sunset Hill and even having seen the entire map I had no idea what the gently caress just happened.

Ventana
Mar 28, 2010

*Yosh intensifies*

Amppelix posted:

A) That is Sunset Hill 3. At least if we trust http://www.soniccenter.org/maps/sonic_advance_3 and why wouldn't we


Oh, uh, what? Weird, I looked up the same map earlier this morning and I swear it didn't give me that map. Not that it changes any of the points made.

If you got stuck on other levels, I dunno what to tell you. Look at any of those other maps and you'll see they're mostly linear. Ocean Base seems like the exception since most of those levels involve going down (which is actually pretty cool now that I look at it), but aside from like 1 section it isn't too confusing to play really.

If you didn't like the game 5 years ago, I don't know if your perspective in games has changed enough to where you'd like it, so I wouldn't say it'd really be worth it to you to play again. If you did though, I'd recommend trying out the different team combinations and actually try applying them, cause a lot of the odd things actually end up having cool uses (that the poster above kind of missed, even if some of those are pretty silly as pointed out).

Also for a laugh, just look at how big Chaos Angel Act 2 is, cause drat.

YoshiOfYellow
Aug 21, 2015

Voted #1 Babysitter in Mushroom Kingdom

I'm apparently the odd one out here because Advance 2 is my favorite of the trio, although Advance 1 is also spectacular.

Also I appreciate the games for making Amy legitimately fun to play. Mostly in Advance 2, although unlocking her is rude as hell.

Paused
Oct 24, 2010
Knux and Amy can really break Sunset hill 3 while we're talking about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_uuDwGD_dM

Ventana
Mar 28, 2010

*Yosh intensifies*

YoshiOfYellow posted:

I'm apparently the odd one out here because Advance 2 is my favorite of the trio, although Advance 1 is also spectacular.

Also I appreciate the games for making Amy legitimately fun to play. Mostly in Advance 2, although unlocking her is rude as hell.

No, Advance 2 is also my favorite of the 3 as well. But I usually count it as not a classic Sonic game, and that comes along with me acknowledging its several flaws.

And yeah, I appreciate that Amy is actually fun to play as, as opposed to how gimped she felt in Advance 1. In general though, I always thought Advance 2 was weird cause I never felt like the character differences ever mattered too much in the grand course of the level designs cause of how straight forward they were.

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Robotnik Nudes
Jul 8, 2013


Check this out. I consider this the definitive version


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKDYXjwNpqI

Edit: Since we're talking about Tee Lopes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jixl-ZV8HTg

Robotnik Nudes fucked around with this message at 21:19 on Jul 25, 2016

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