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https://twitter.com/sup_im_sammy/status/1374919613801242627
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Mar 25, 2021 20:09
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are the mods still cranky that nobody is using their preferred nomenclature for the american concentraiton camps?
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Mar 25, 2021 20:30
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reading about the Great Leap Forward this evening. what a screw-up!
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Mar 26, 2021 00:34
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dead gay comedy forums posted:alright, gonna brush up some stuff tomorrow and scribble a Thing Appreciate your effort, I've been trying to suss this out as someone who never took economics. I've read Smith, some Ricardo and traced stuff like the LTV to Marx and then the utility theory of value in response to Marx(?) but things kinda get muddy for me after that.
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Mar 26, 2021 00:37
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indigi posted:reading about the Great Leap Forward this evening. what a screw-up! It's honestly surprising that the government was able to maintain control before and after it
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Mar 26, 2021 00:39
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indigi posted:reading about the Great Leap Forward this evening. what a screw-up! It would be interesting to have a discussion about what exactly was happening. If anything, it seems a mirror of what was occurring at the end of the first five year plan in the Soviet Union. I don’t know if back yard furnaces or shooting sparrows was actually much of a factor compared to issues like a lack of raw investment into machinery.
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Mar 26, 2021 01:05
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Flavius Aetass posted:It's honestly surprising that the government was able to maintain control before and after it Many of the people living still remembered the Civil War lol
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Mar 26, 2021 02:57
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k, let's talk about the neoclassical school of economics. Now, the truly ideological project in Western econ being carried at the time, to provide moral justification for capitalist thought in opposition to Marxism, was and still is the Austrian school. Neoclassical economics is where the actual technicality of capitalist ideology happens, and this distinction is crucial to establish at first, because there is a veritable gallery row of incredible loving bastards use that as an excuse to say that they are ideologically exempt (Milton Friedman comes to mind). What this means is that neoclassical dolts want the economy to behave in a similar manner that the Austrians idealize (hence why it is easy to conflate the two), so they have to structure everything they work with in a way that makes these very social things become some sort of abstracted yet still natural phenomena. "Natural rate of unemployment", "natural rate of inflation", "general equilibrium" and other sorts of bullshit that implies that this economy thing a process that happens regardless of human function, and there's a joke by a critic of the neoclassical school that is basically "if only we could get rid of those pesky humans, then everything would work as God intended!" That's pretty much what the neoclassical line of thought implies, which is obviously quite loving barbaric and incredibly idiotic. So they run to the Austrian school. Austrians say that only "natural markets", formed by the appraisal of the countless individuals on society, are the only actual democratic avenue of action (or input) that these individuals truly have, and I believe you can see where this is going, right? That's right, a loving unholy pudding of an argument where the only way that a society can be truly democratic is through free enterprise and a market economy without interference. Now, if they only phrased as liberal and democratic, that would be actually very much coherent, rather funny as that might sound. There's nothing in liberalism that actually requires democracy; what liberalism requires is capitalism. The neoclassical school works by providing complex theoretical talking points to explain why states should stay hands-off from any economic activity, because anything it does will generate undue stresses that will move them away from Holy Equilibrium, making it ever more difficult to get any closer to the Holy Pareto Optimal Point (which conveniently nobody has any loving idea where it might be because turns out economies are extremely loving complex). Every single action has million unintended consequences and all of them gently caress with the natural balance of things, and to the observant, the implication that falls like a lightning bolt is, holy loving poo poo then why even bother? The consequence of that line of thinking is incredibly well represented by this other joke, perhaps the most famous savage take against mainstream econ:  Microeconomics deal with "utility calculus" and incredibly dumbass anti-sociological points to create a human being that can have mathematized decisions, in these vacuums of reality where perfect choices and conditions are available. Neoclassical economics spring from there, from the application of these emerging microeconomic ideas into the classical principles argued by a bunch of French and British dudes during the 18th century. "Supply and demand", etc. Macroeconomics comes from attempting to aggregate these into a much larger scale, of a whole society. Big loving deal, it sucks to describe a lot of things, models go loving bad and come to conclusions like "providing social assistance in the middle of a loving pandemic is a very bad idea don't do it!" that's a general outlook, if you guys want specifics, please do ask
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Mar 26, 2021 04:05
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SSJ_naruto_2003 posted:Many of the people living still remembered the Civil War lol *Dude looks up from his backyard furnace and shrugs* "It's a living!"
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Mar 26, 2021 19:21
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Doctor Nick posted:One thing that I've been interested in but have never been able to find is an account of the development of neoclassical economics as an ideological project to provide cover for capitalism. Does anyone here have something like that that they can share? For a bit of reading on "Neoliberalism as project" chapter 3 of the book ""Inventing the Future - Postcapitalism and a World Without Work" is titled "Why Are They Winning? The Making of Neoliberal Hegemony" and talks about the effort to push it as mainstream , and how the creation of the Chicago School came about and the use of Friedman and Hayek as promotors. It is somewhat short, but interesting.
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Mar 26, 2021 19:21
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this thread's qcs whine thread closed before i could really sink my teeth into it its actually good for my mental health but still gently caress you mods that poo poo was funny
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Mar 27, 2021 08:06
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Strongly urge folks to come out tomorrow: https://www.answercoalition.org/stop_anti_asian_racism_now_end_white_supremacy_misogyny_and_militarism
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Mar 27, 2021 08:08
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Ardennes posted:It would be interesting to have a discussion about what exactly was happening. If anything, it seems a mirror of what was occurring at the end of the first five year plan in the Soviet Union. It was a desperation play. A mistake, certainly, but US imperialism was an existential danger, and Khrushchev had first made clear that the USSR could not be relied to come to the rescue, and then subsequently pulled the rug out from under the economic development plans that they saw as necessary to defend themselves independently. Under the circumstances, it's very hard to see what alternative course of action could have been suggested.
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Mar 27, 2021 08:14
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Pomeroy posted:It was a desperation play. A mistake, certainly, but US imperialism was an existential danger, and Khrushchev had first made clear that the USSR could not be relied to come to the rescue, and then subsequently pulled the rug out from under the economic development plans that they saw as necessary to defend themselves independently. Under the circumstances, it's very hard to see what alternative course of action could have been suggested. It is interesting through the primary discussion still seems (like I suggested) about back yard iron forges and hunting sparrows but not the broader political economy at play. This includes among many leftists.
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Mar 27, 2021 08:17
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I think it's truly insane that they continued grain exports during the famine
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Mar 27, 2021 08:28
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indigi posted:I think it's truly insane that they continued grain exports during the famine what do you mean?
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Mar 27, 2021 08:32
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my political journey 2014-2019 illustrated 
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Mar 27, 2021 20:37
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Stone toss is a nazi
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Mar 27, 2021 21:08
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idk what stone toss is :|
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Mar 27, 2021 21:10
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he's a nazi who makes comics and that's an edited one of his. I like the edit tho, nothing too wrong with repurposing that poo poo, it's like all the Marx Ben Garrison edits. Made me chuckle. 
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Mar 27, 2021 21:13
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someone post the "stonetoss is shmorky" edits tia
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Mar 27, 2021 21:17
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dead gay comedy forums posted:Microeconomics deal with "utility calculus" and incredibly dumbass anti-sociological points to create a human being that can have mathematized decisions, in these vacuums of reality where perfect choices and conditions are available. Neoclassical economics spring from there, from the application of these emerging microeconomic ideas into the classical principles argued by a bunch of French and British dudes during the 18th century. "Supply and demand", etc. Macroeconomics comes from attempting to aggregate these into a much larger scale, of a whole society. Big loving deal, it sucks to describe a lot of things, models go loving bad and come to conclusions like "providing social assistance in the middle of a loving pandemic is a very bad idea don't do it!" I take it that these models can go exponentially bad when you get, say, a completely disinterested and brainless algorithm involved that will always incentivize making paper clips above all else?
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Mar 27, 2021 21:37
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Saw a woman with a Montclair State hoodie on today...couldn't help but wonder if she ever had occasion to study under Comrade Furr
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Mar 28, 2021 03:05
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Mr. Lobe posted:Stone toss is shmorky
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Mar 28, 2021 05:21
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but what is Marx’s opinion on big boats jamming up the canal
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Mar 28, 2021 07:26
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made with mematic
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Mar 28, 2021 07:33
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Mr. Lobe posted:made with mematic das kapital memes for marxist teens
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Mar 28, 2021 08:11
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now tell us what Marx would think of the big titty boat drawings, Harvey
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Mar 28, 2021 08:49
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yr new gurlfrand! posted:but what is Marx’s opinion on big boats jamming up the canal This is a David Harvey companion - but still funny.
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Mar 28, 2021 17:47
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Victory Position posted:I take it that these models can go exponentially bad when you get, say, a completely disinterested and brainless algorithm involved that will always incentivize making paper clips above all else? haha, yeah utilitarianism was bad, but it became really bad because of neoclassical thinking imo, since economics provided a material mean of quantification of those decisions - "how much are you willing to spend" - then it is amazing how fast it goes downhill
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Mar 28, 2021 19:16
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Goast posted:this thread's qcs whine thread closed before i could really sink my teeth into it speaking of https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?noseen=1&threadid=3963294&pagenumber=1&perpage=40#post513500583 i dont know where getting banned for genocide denial in a meta complaining thread about another thread to determine the correct democratic centralist forums line on whether a genocide is actually occurring ranks in the silly poo poo that goes on here
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Mar 29, 2021 07:14
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mila kunis posted:speaking of https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?noseen=1&threadid=3963294&pagenumber=1&perpage=40#post513500583 jesus fuckin christ hmbol
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Mar 29, 2021 18:16
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im sure glad rime has rehabilitated themselves from extremely racist to extremely concerned about having the right opinions
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Mar 29, 2021 21:00
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https://twitter.com/vijayprashad/status/1376676596426366981
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Mar 30, 2021 04:19
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https://twitter.com/MikeStillAwake/status/1376719386606772227
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Mar 30, 2021 06:39
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good to learn that western activists are the largest and most exploited working class
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Mar 30, 2021 11:28
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we're the Woking Class, we toil in the Woke mines
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Mar 30, 2021 11:28
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Read this and let your heart swell with pride and inspiration Viva Cuba https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/against-the-odds-cuba-could-become-a-coronavirus-vaccine-powerhouse/
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Mar 30, 2021 15:47
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quote:beats by callfire | Socialist Alternative / DSA joiner | Tech worker | he/him pronouns Lmao
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Mar 30, 2021 15:50
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socialists in general are really loving stupid it seems. I’m reading more about the run up to WWI and every country’s socialists were like “hell yeah let’s get this war in” for the most part
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Mar 30, 2021 16:26
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