Early FPS Megathread: the kids need to learn about TekWar sooner or later

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Retro Games > Early FPS Megathread: the kids need to learn about TekWar sooner or later

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Lurdiak: Feb 26, 2006; I believe in a universe that doesn't care, and people that do.

NoneMoreNegative posted:

Doomguy? Feh. Duke Nukem? Move Over, honey!

Ch-Chk BOOM

I'm surprised no one ever made a Doom wad based on Narc.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIzOBXJFTuU

# ? Jul 4, 2017 19:59

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# ? May 30, 2024 23:57

Heavy Metal: Sep 1, 2014; America's $1 Funnyman

Social Animal posted:

Reminds me of the Firearms mod for HL1 for some reason. Anyone play that game? It had some cool stuff for the time like artillery and parachuting.

Yep yep, was good stuff. HL was the height of multiplayer mods in my book.

^ a Narc TC would be rad for sure, drat that game is badass.

# ? Jul 4, 2017 20:32

Social Animal: Nov 1, 2005

Heavy Metal posted:

Yep yep, was good stuff. HL was the height of multiplayer mods in my book.

^ a Narc TC would be rad for sure, drat that game is badass.

Yeah I feel like there was always something new to play on HL1. Other ones I remember were science & industry, frontline assault and even a revolutionary war mod.

# ? Jul 4, 2017 21:48

Grimthwacker: Aug 7, 2014

I still have quite a backlog and I probably shouldn't have but I just brought the Turok remasters because of the Summer Sale. I've always wanted to play a version of Turok 2 where it wasn't a good-looking but foggy slideshow.

# ? Jul 4, 2017 22:11

juggalo baby coffin: Dec 2, 2007; How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?

i spent way too much of my youth playing sven coop

i remember there was that arena map for it with the buttons you could push to summon stuff and make it fight. that was amazing to me back in the day.

# ? Jul 4, 2017 22:22

Guillermus: Dec 28, 2009

Social Animal posted:

Yeah I feel like there was always something new to play on HL1. Other ones I remember were science & industry, frontline assault and even a revolutionary war mod.

My top mods (excluding wich became official Valve games like Day of Defeat, TFC or CS) were Firearms, ActionHL and Sven Co-op. Firearms was loving amazing and had tons of weapons and poo poo also had awesome animations like removing your mp5's handguard and barrel to install an integrated SD and change the gun completely.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPebRgR7di4&t=270s

Edit: How the hell I forgot Vampire Slayer, Frontline Force and The Specialists (in some ways better than AHL).

Guillermus fucked around with this message at 22:48 on Jul 4, 2017

# ? Jul 4, 2017 22:31

Lemon-Lime: Aug 6, 2009

I will always be sad that Frontline Force: Source never happened (the original FLF did chokepoint map design really well), and fondly remember Desert Crisis, the GoldSrc mod that apparently no one else ever played.

# ? Jul 4, 2017 22:38

c0burn: Sep 2, 2003; The KKKing

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/155523518

This guy is playing Quake for the first ever time and it's quite funny watching him be cheerfully clueless

# ? Jul 4, 2017 22:45

Guillermus: Dec 28, 2009

I wonder how hard would be to play old HL mods with the WON HL client (disabling the cdkey auth request) nowadays with Win7/8/10. I really want to gently caress around with goons playing Vampire Slayer or Firearms.

# ? Jul 4, 2017 22:51

Windmill Hut: Jul 21, 2008

Guillermus posted:

Sven Co-op.

This mod was SO much fun. Some of the levels really relied on having a bigger group but it was awesome when you could jump on a server with just one friend and play through a bunch of levels - but even better when the surveys filled up.

Most other mods, if you played for hours you'd get to the end of a map rotation then likely stop. With Sven Coop you could literally spend most of the day playing and never see the same map again.

Oh to be 16 again

# ? Jul 4, 2017 23:26

juggalo baby coffin: Dec 2, 2007; How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?

I think one thing that sucks these days is that the increased levels of graphical fidelity make it harder for people to make mods and maps. Like in a lot of the mods i used to love the new assets were pretty lovely looking, but the games weren't that far off them so even like, a beginner modeller could turn out a gun that wouldn't immediately turn people off. People could get good at that stuff through modding, starting off making assets just a little bit worse than the game, then on par with the game, then even better than the game.

Now like, even a game with d-tier graphics like stalker requires a really high level of skill to turn out guns and textures that look like they fit. In pretty much every mod i've made I've just wound up repurposing existing game assets with minor amounts of original contribution by me. It seems to be the same for a lot of other, better modders too though. If you go and look at any of the bethesda games most of the mods are using existing game textures over new meshes, and a lot of the ones that aren't are using professionally made textures yanked from somewhere else.

Maps too have a huge level of detail now, you can't get away with a box that plays well now. It might play great, but people will just move past it if it doesn't look fantastic. I know in TF2 they had those orange maps that were more classic style, but that's a rarity.

I think its why so many indie games have such healthy modding scenes. Minecraft looks like poo poo, but has a ton of huge and elaborate mods for it.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 00:04

Mordja: Apr 26, 2014; Hell Gem

Lemon-Lime posted:

and fondly remember Desert Crisis, the GoldSrc mod that apparently no one else ever played.

What up buddy! I especially liked it because despite its generic, modern warfare type name, it was actually all about shootdodging off of rooftops blasting laser guns and M79 grenade launchers at people. I think I even joined a Steam group for it, though I assume it's totally dead by now.

juggalo baby coffin posted:

I think one thing that sucks these days is that the increased levels of graphical fidelity make it harder for people to make mods and maps. Like in a lot of the mods i used to love the new assets were pretty lovely looking, but the games weren't that far off them so even like, a beginner modeller could turn out a gun that wouldn't immediately turn people off. People could get good at that stuff through modding, starting off making assets just a little bit worse than the game, then on par with the game, then even better than the game.

Now like, even a game with d-tier graphics like stalker requires a really high level of skill to turn out guns and textures that look like they fit. In pretty much every mod i've made I've just wound up repurposing existing game assets with minor amounts of original contribution by me. It seems to be the same for a lot of other, better modders too though. If you go and look at any of the bethesda games most of the mods are using existing game textures over new meshes, and a lot of the ones that aren't are using professionally made textures yanked from somewhere else.

Maps too have a huge level of detail now, you can't get away with a box that plays well now. It might play great, but people will just move past it if it doesn't look fantastic. I know in TF2 they had those orange maps that were more classic style, but that's a rarity.

I think its why so many indie games have such healthy modding scenes. Minecraft looks like poo poo, but has a ton of huge and elaborate mods for it.

I mean, it's that, but it's also the fact that game developers have gone out of their way to make their games hard to mod. I mean, look at Bethesda's games, they're (animations aside) as high fidelity as their contemporaries but they still engender massive projects.

Mordja fucked around with this message at 00:21 on Jul 5, 2017

# ? Jul 5, 2017 00:18

Lemon-Lime: Aug 6, 2009

Mordja posted:

What up buddy! I especially liked it because despite its generic, modern warfare type name, it was actually all about shootdodging off of rooftops blasting laser guns and M79 grenade launchers at people. I think I even joined a Steam group for it, though I assume it's totally dead by now.

Running around buck-naked and doing wallflips with the plasma cannon was the best.

Also yeah, I checked like 8 years ago and it'd already sunk without a trace, there's no way it's gotten a revival. At least people still pug S&I on a weekly basis (or did a couple years ago, anyway).

# ? Jul 5, 2017 00:21

Windmill Hut: Jul 21, 2008

juggalo baby coffin posted:

I think one thing that sucks these days is that the increased levels of graphical fidelity make it harder for people to make mods and maps. Like in a lot of the mods i used to love the new assets were pretty lovely looking, but the games weren't that far off them so even like, a beginner modeller could turn out a gun that wouldn't immediately turn people off. People could get good at that stuff through modding, starting off making assets just a little bit worse than the game, then on par with the game, then even better than the game.

I totally agree. Another factor is that people seem to need something to strive for long-term in games now - i.e. 'levelling up' / earning items / etc. All the games i spent significant time playing when i was younger were purely for the fun of each match and getting better at the game.

My first love was Quake 3 Fortress. By the end of it's development it was a very high quality mod (and the guys who made it are now the game company Splash Damage) but it started from a pretty simple place... just QWTF for Quake 3.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 00:34

Nition: Feb 25, 2006; You really want to know?

I agree as well. I used to be able to make a whole Unreal Tournament level in a few hours that was playable and looked relatively decent. These days it'd take weeks. And modern levels are generally made with full 3D mesh modelling tools instead of the old boolean subtractive editor in UnrealEd.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 00:39

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

Is a game still indie when it's sold 122 million copies and been on 2 generations of consoles?

# ? Jul 5, 2017 00:48

Bongo Bill: Jan 17, 2012

fishmech posted:

Is a game still indie when it's sold 122 million copies and been on 2 generations of consoles?

I don't think there's much value in debating the definition of "indie," especially when it's used as a way to insinuate that commercial success implies a loss of authenticity.

"Independent" means that the developers were not answerable to the publisher during development, which is vague enough to start with.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 01:04

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

Bongo Bill posted:

I don't think there's much value in debating the definition of "indie," especially when it's used as a way to insinuate that commercial success implies a loss of authenticity.

"Independent" means that the developers were not answerable to the publisher during development, which is vague enough to start with.

I mean the thing with Minecraft is that over 6 months before the game had it's official release full price version, Mojang was already signing multi-million dollar deals with Microsoft and 4J to port the game to the 360 and so on, or things like how the Pocket Edition that released initially only on Sony phones was out months before official release too, and was obviously answerable to Sony for the initial exclusivity and devlopment. And that was over 6 years ago.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 01:26

juggalo baby coffin: Dec 2, 2007; How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?

did you know: i dont think theres any value in debating the definition of indie

i used it to mean: low budget, non-AAA game

# ? Jul 5, 2017 02:43

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

juggalo baby coffin posted:

i used it to mean: low budget, non-AAA game

Soooooo.. not Minecraft for the past like 6+ years.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 02:56

Meat Beat Agent: Aug 5, 2007; felonious assault with a sproinging boner

Doom is an indie game.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 06:53

Shadow Hog: Feb 23, 2014; Avatar by Jon Davies

Really, many of DOS's heavy hitters were, if you think about it.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 07:08

juggalo baby coffin: Dec 2, 2007; How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?

fishmech posted:

Soooooo.. not Minecraft for the past like 6+ years.

it was made by one guy stop being a loving pedant

# ? Jul 5, 2017 07:09

Social Animal: Nov 1, 2005

Lemon-Lime posted:

I will always be sad that Frontline Force: Source never happened (the original FLF did chokepoint map design really well), and fondly remember Desert Crisis, the GoldSrc mod that apparently no one else ever played.

I remember being in the irc launch event they had for it. I also remember Safety Dance playing in the character customization menu. I think I was bored of it in about a week though.

poo poo even Natural Selection got its start on HL1 right? Man I miss mods.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 08:26

WeedlordGoku69: Feb 12, 2015; by Cyrano4747

fishmech posted:

Soooooo.. not Minecraft for the past like 6+ years.

Minecraft blew the gently caress up but that doesn't make it, like, not an indie game. Microsoft and Sony signed deals for ports but it was still a bedroom project by one dude that simply made a unbelievable fuckload of money.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 08:59

Diabetes Forecast: Aug 13, 2008; Droopy Only

I've been making a map for Doom and making a couple of my own textures for it here and there and honestly yeah it takes zero effort to make things that look better than the base game. Making it play well is another story.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 10:01

Guillermus: Dec 28, 2009

Diabetes Forecast posted:

I've been making a map for Doom and making a couple of my own textures for it here and there and honestly yeah it takes zero effort to make things that look better than the base game. Making it play well is another story.

I love that skybox texture. That level looks fantastic.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 11:21

Negostrike: Aug 15, 2015

Those textures have a PS1 vibe on them, which I like a big deal. Keep it up!

# ? Jul 5, 2017 13:32

ookiimarukochan: Apr 4, 2011

juggalo baby coffin posted:

it was made by one guy stop being a loving pedant

One guy got all the money but there was more or less no point where Minecraft was only made by one guy - that's why everyone who knows Notch hates him.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 14:39

fishmech: Jul 16, 2006; by VideoGames; Salad Prong

juggalo baby coffin posted:

it was made by one guy stop being a loving pedant

It was made by a whole studio of people already by the time of release. gently caress, Notch had already gotten to barely doing any coding by the time of the official retail release in 2011, it was mostly Jens leading the project and already 10 other people working at the offices full time. Jens would officially be the guy in charge of development like two weeks after launch.

ookiimarukochan posted:

One guy got all the money but there was more or less no point where Minecraft was only made by one guy - that's why everyone who knows Notch hates him.

Yeah he grabbed himself like a billion dollars, he allotted everyone else about $300,000 from the sale.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 16:34

Convex: Aug 19, 2010

fishmech posted:

It was made by a whole studio of people already by the time of release. gently caress, Notch had already gotten to barely doing any coding by the time of the official retail release in 2011, it was mostly Jens leading the project and already 10 other people working at the offices full time. Jens would officially be the guy in charge of development like two weeks after launch.

Yeah he grabbed himself like a billion dollars, he allotted everyone else about $300,000 from the sale.

And then complained that he didn't understand why they all hated him before moving to the Hollywood Hills and tweeting MRA talking points

# ? Jul 5, 2017 17:46

Sir Lemming: Jan 27, 2009; It's a piece of JUNK!

Was it (originally) published by EA, Ubisoft, Nintendo, or a similar-sized company? No? Then it's indie.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 18:33

Yodzilla: Apr 29, 2005; Now who looks even dumber?

Beef Witch

If you make enough money selling games that you can afford real ramen and not just the kind that comes with flavor packets you're not indie.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 19:37

Lurdiak: Feb 26, 2006; I believe in a universe that doesn't care, and people that do.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=617lGZjYyNo

# ? Jul 5, 2017 19:38

Gobblecoque: Sep 6, 2011

Usually I kinda like the dorky derails that pop up here from time to time (like the one about framerate in movies) but yeah this one kinda sucks.

# ? Jul 5, 2017 19:38

juggalo baby coffin: Dec 2, 2007; How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?

Instead of discussing if increased asset quality has made it harder for modders and mappers, and thus harder for the games industry to recruit new talent, let's argue over if minecraft is indie enough

# ? Jul 5, 2017 20:10

Shadow Hog: Feb 23, 2014; Avatar by Jon Davies

I definitely think there's something to be said for your actual point (and not the dumb tangent the conversation wound up going off on); technical limitations made the bar for meeting standards much lower and thus easier to jump over (and some of the games in question never really were lookers, in retrospect; that game magazine touting extremely blocky screenshots of Unreal and proudly touting it as "YES THESE ARE REAL SCREENSHOTS" seems really laughable today, doesn't it?).

But hey, at least Dusk is looking to bring that lo-fi feel back? Of course, being a Unity game, good luck modding it, but nevertheless...

# ? Jul 5, 2017 20:21