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the trick is to give your destroyers repair drones, which they should have for all situations anyway; they warp in targeted on the dreadnought and will keep it repaired forever that and give the interceptors carapace armor; otherwise they'll all get themselves killed by torps trying to strafe the carrier
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Jul 31, 2016 19:44
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the worst is when a carrier decides to target your AI interceptors with its railguns, they don't know how to do anything but beeline straight for the target and take a volley to the face for hot instant death
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Jul 31, 2016 21:11
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I finally got around to eliminating all of the traitor lords. It took me this long because Rainbow Six: Siege has taken over about 75% of my life. Game is fantastic Kairo, bravo. I can't be sincere enough about this, game ticks all the right checkboxes for me, exactly what I wanted when I first seen that trailer 2 years ago. I feel engaged 100% of the time on missions and feel like every second counts, which seems to be the polar opposite of every other space game out there. Ofcourse I have to add that my cheap and old T-flight Hotas X's thrust isn't working ideally, just to add to your annoyance.  But I don't really care about that, what I do care about: Would it be possible to make it so using keyboard and mouse in the planning/strategy mode is more reliable while using a flight stick? Gets kinda annoying having to use the x360 scheme when I don't have an x360 controller plugged in and would much rather just use the intuitive keyboard and mouse scheme. Sometimes when I click on a mouse button it will switch over, but in most cases it doesn't. This is the only friction I came across while playing.
Jehde fucked around with this message at 06:58 on Aug 2, 2016 |
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Aug 2, 2016 00:11
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Switching between controller and KB/M is pretty seamless for me, maybe your stick has some goofy deadzone issue that's causing the game to think it's receiving input when you're not touching it?
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Aug 2, 2016 06:31
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Jehde posted:Ofcourse I have to add that my cheap and old T-flight Hotas X's thrust isn't working ideally, just to add to your annoyance. Glad you dig it. Try "Force Mouse In Menus" in the gameplay settings page. This should also affect the tactical mode. Helter Skelter posted:Switching between controller and KB/M is pretty seamless for me, maybe your stick has some goofy deadzone issue that's causing the game to think it's receiving input when you're not touching it? Yeah, this might be what is happening. The software I use specifically has a FAQ question for doing this. But I think that either that many sticks are sending out noise or the software is only checking whether an input/axis is > 0, not if it is changing. I don't have access to the source so it's hard to tell. But yeah, it works flawlessly with gamepads so who knows? 
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Aug 2, 2016 13:34
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I am glad to see this is EA now! I have run a few missions and I'm having a blast; It's easy to pick up but now I'm looking forward to learning how to effectively issue commands and take things a bit more tactically. Is there a write-up or video of how to use the command interface stuff more effectively?
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Aug 2, 2016 16:19
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Gooch181 posted:Is there a write-up or video of how to use the command interface stuff more effectively?
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Aug 2, 2016 16:47
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Helter Skelter posted:Just do what I do and ignore it during every mission except Tannhauser. Now that I have both destroyers and interceptors in my fleet I'm just pausing at the start of a mission and giving them each a target, then picking one for myself. It is effective thus far! I am really liking the style here but I still feel like a scrub; I went ahead and bought the AP upgrade to increase my mobility and increase my dependence upon mobility, that should make things more interesting! (I have essentially zero space sim experience) I am still running as soon as capital ships show up after being decimated by missiles once; I thought it would be cool to try and send my heavy missile at one but got creamed before it could make contact. Looking forward to seeing just how tough these things are eventually.
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Aug 2, 2016 16:51
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Bought the game, is fantastic, plays amazing along with the Command and Conquer OST playing. I have one single little problem though, my fighters and destroyers and such now refuse to equip shields, as in I have level 2 shields bought but they refuse to go up during the mission, thus leaving me shieldless.
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Aug 2, 2016 17:42
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You also have to have regular shields equipped.
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Aug 2, 2016 18:02
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they're not really worth it
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Aug 2, 2016 18:06
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What are the upgrades that you all find most helpful? I can already tell the AP one is a good buy.
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Aug 2, 2016 20:02
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Gap Drive is the only (worthwhile (go away kamikaze chassis)) upgrade that fundamentally changes how you play in the campaign, but it's really expensive. Repair drones make your capships functionally immortal in the campaign and are mandatory for challenge mode. Other decent buys: - AP ammunition makes an Artillery frigate kind of monstrous, and has some niche applications for your fighters (shotgunning destroyers, picking turrets off a carrier or battlecruiser with the longrifle). - Flak Drones or Carapace Armor aren't bad if you expect to take a lot of torpedo volleys in a mission, but this is quite rare in the campaign. - Engine Intakes or whatever the +30% speed upgrade is secretly quite good; it's just probably not worth the slot over Gap Drive as a mobility option. e: if you want to go hunting traitor lords early, take AP ammunition and the longrifle and blow off all the turrets from long range, then keep shooting up the bridge. it's a lot easier once you have a frigate though ee: everyone has a different preferred playstyle in campaign though and it's honestly easy enough that you can do whatever and have fun. there's One True Loadout* for challenge mode but you'll be swimming in renown by the time you get there anyway *or so i claim, anyway Reiterpallasch fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Aug 2, 2016 |
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Aug 2, 2016 20:59
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Thanks for the advice! I need to try the long-rifle out still and I ditched the shotgun as soon as I got the shield-killer missiles. I'm not even going to touch the challenge mode yet. I have a frigate/3 fighters/3 destroyers following my lead now, which is nice. I'm going back to the earlier missions and checking them out at higher difficulties. I am generally prioritizing traitor fighters before focusing on the objective but it feels like there are more strategic considerations I should have in mind. Obviously this depends on the mission, but is there a general plan of attack you prefer to follow?
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Aug 2, 2016 23:48
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To be honest, I've been playing only wave clear mode for the past couple of weeks. I use Longrifle + ECM Pulse with Gap Drive, Energy Shields, and Purifier Bombs, and rely heavily on the ability to warp straight to an enemy capital ship and shove 6 bombs into it. There's probably more elegant ways to handle most of the campaign missions--the only advice I can give you is that you'll often get better results by sending your wingmen after individual targets, and switching between them as they reach their targets. The shotgun definitely has its place, especially on defense missions, where the most threatening enemies in a stage are destroyers--you can shred even shielded destroyers in a single drive-by with the shotgun, and your own destroyers will be at hand to strip shields off enemy strikecraft. Also, it's just plain fun. Missiles perform best against shielded fighters, while the ECM pulse is your best option against shielded corvettes.
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Aug 3, 2016 01:26
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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaa report: wave 25 is definitely clearable--i came into it with only one dead destroyer, and came within one stupidly missed longrifle shot of doing it, i think. there's not even an achievement for it anymore but it's the wall i've been going for lately e: actually helpful comment: on today's wave 12 for me, two of the enemy traitor lord corvettes crashed into each other warping in, which was hilarious but probably not intended behavior Reiterpallasch fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Aug 3, 2016 |
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Aug 3, 2016 03:42
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yeah I have to say the Gap Drive is pretty amazing, glad I went back to churn up points to buy it
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Aug 3, 2016 06:46
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Reiterpallasch posted:Missiles perform best against shielded fighters, while the ECM pulse is your best option against shielded corvettes. Shielded corvettes are literally my worst fear at the moment, fitting gap drive basically feels like I'm forced to take shields just to ward off the flak and carapace armor feels too situational to take it for just those circumstances. ECM pulse doesn't feel like it does damage to shields fast enough and I get ripped up by the flak from the corvettes before I can strip them fast enough and blow the crap out of them. taking the shotfun just dooms me to running through several reloads getting through the shields with the AC and meanwhile the flak rips me up even worse. Not really sure how to handle them best right now, to be honest.
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Aug 3, 2016 13:29
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I tried the EMP gun a few times, but its slow projectile speed means the effective range isn't really greater than the missiles, which have the added bonus of doing hull damage. Requesting a mod to add the word SICK in front of DRIFT MODE
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Aug 3, 2016 14:14
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Sometimes I wanted to have fighters with multiple loadouts (as in, one fighter with the bomber chassis, and the two others with kamikaze chassis or whatever else), but besides that it will probably be jarring to switch between them, I'm not sure that it would be even effective as I am imagining. Also, short of giving an order to the fighter you are piloting, can you switch targets while you are in the tactical map mode? I could have sworn I've done that before.
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Aug 3, 2016 14:15
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HardDisk posted:Also, short of giving an order to the fighter you are piloting, can you switch targets while you are in the tactical map mode? I could have sworn I've done that before. I believe just left-clicking with your current fighter selected switches targets without needing a right-click to send an order.
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Aug 3, 2016 14:52
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Is there a way to completely disable mouse piloting? I couldn't get my CH throttle working (same issues as before) so I decided to HOKAS it (hands on keyboard and stick), but pressing a key makes the game switch to mouse control and my ship yanks toward the cursor until I move my stick again, which disables the mouse until I press a key. Speaking of the mouse, when I'm editing the controls, clicking on a control assignment doesn't actually click on that assignment, instead it clicks on whatever assignment was previously selected. That is to say: Assignment for control X is highlighted. I mouse over assignment for control Y. Controls X and Y are both highlighted. I click on control Y. The game prompts me to reassign control X. To reassign control Y, I have to first move to it with the arrow keys or gamepad. Then clicking on control Y (or on anything else) will select it. I can make a video if needed.
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Aug 3, 2016 17:44
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HiroProtagonist posted:Shielded corvettes are literally my worst fear at the moment, fitting gap drive basically feels like I'm forced to take shields just to ward off the flak and carapace armor feels too situational to take it for just those circumstances. Well, probably the best way to deal with them is simply to drag them over to your own capital ships and watch your destroyers carve them up with a single torpedo volley. Failing that, you can (ab)use DRIFT MODE to engage with the ECM pulse while staying in the 3km-4km range window where the flak can't hit you. Remember that you don't actually need to hit the corvette to drain its shields with the ECM pulse--anywhere on the bubble works fine, even if you're not getting the weapon lock tone. Ideally, it never gets the chance to shoot at you.
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Aug 3, 2016 18:47
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Challenge mode seems to have gone offline?
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Aug 3, 2016 21:26
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Xerxes17 posted:Challenge mode seems to have gone offline? I'm at an airport and can't look at this until late PST. Is it just being slow to grab leaderboard data or does the game crash or something? Shine posted:HOTAS There isn't a way to do this right now. It also doesn't surprise me that the game switches over to KBAM mode when you hit the keyboard. I can probably set it up so it only relies on the mouse movement to switch over to KBAM mode though, just not until the next update.
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Aug 3, 2016 21:38
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Kairo posted:I'm at an airport and can't look at this until late PST. Is it just being slow to grab leaderboard data or does the game crash or something? I didn't wait too long, but the leader board doesn't load and when you start the trial there is just the outpost with sentries and the timer never moves from 2mins.
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Aug 3, 2016 21:48
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Xerxes17 posted:I didn't wait too long, but the leader board doesn't load and when you start the trial there is just the outpost with sentries and the timer never moves from 2mins. OK, I'll take a look but it won't be until late. Edit: Can you send your <install>/dyingsun_Data/output_log.txt to bugs@marauderinteractive.com ? I can at least look at now. Kairo fucked around with this message at 21:52 on Aug 3, 2016 |
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Aug 3, 2016 21:49
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This current challenge mode seemed straightforward until wave 14 when it felt like suddenly all my capitals were dead. It was only a matter of time until my interceptors were taken down too. oops!
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Aug 5, 2016 00:11
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Shine posted:HOTAS Ok, in the beta and challenge mode branches, I changed it so the keyboard won't switch over to KBAM mode, only the mouse does it. This should make it work how you want. I did some testing and I don't think it's gonna screw with anything else, but let me know if it does. I don't know what is up with some throttles, namely the CH ones, but for whatever reason they don't work with the game really well. Xerxes17's problem was that the game didn't detect Steam, but I made it not have a complete meltdown if that happens. It should work OK in offline mode too. Also nerfed the repair drones slightly, but made them respawn a little faster in challenge mode. I'll probably re-price them in campaign since they break a bunch of missions like you guys said.
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Aug 5, 2016 00:12
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Kairo posted:Ok, in the beta and challenge mode branches, I changed it so the keyboard won't switch over to KBAM mode, only the mouse does it. This should make it work how you want. I did some testing and I don't think it's gonna screw with anything else, but let me know if it does. I don't know what is up with some throttles, namely the CH ones, but for whatever reason they don't work with the game really well. Works like a charm, thanks! The lack of analog throttle doesn't bug me, really. The joystick and pedals are more important, and those work fine.
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Aug 5, 2016 15:40
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I suspect that any reasonable repair drone healing rate nerf won't affect the fundamental problem. Repair drones are mandaatory because they remove attrition from the game--it doesn't matter how much damage you take on a wave as long as you don't permanently lose a ship. The repair rate doesn't really matter as long as your ships still heal up to full in between carrier/destroyer waves. Even wave 20+ Frigate/corvette/fighter waves can barely scratch your capships and you can stall against carriers by shooting out the turrets on the last carrier repeatedly (you should have 1+ hour of time banked by then anyway), so the only real case in which this affects the player is if a carrier wave comes immediately after a destroyer wave. Basically, reducing the rate at which repair drones work might make them a little bit less broken, but they don't make them any less mandatory, which I think is the real problem. And the obvious fix--making some % of incoming damage unrepairable--has second-order effects that I don't think people will like. e: it's a tricky problem; i don't even really have any good answers
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Aug 5, 2016 22:22
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Okay, let me expand on those thoughts. First, obvious disclaimer: you may not even want to care about any of this, since I don't know if there are 5 other players who routinely put up wave 20+ scores. I'm not really bragging here--as currently constituted, wave clear mode is basically just an exercise in personal endurance/bloody-mindedness, not really piloting skill. Maybe optimize for keeping wave clear fun for most people who are playing the game instead of catering to my balance nitpicks. The TLDR is that currently, only Carrier waves matter. With one rare exception, only Carrier waves can end a player's run. And with one rare exception, only carrier waves can drain a player's permanant resources. Everything else is a breather. - Fighters: One-shot shooting gallery for a longrifle from ~8km. Shielded waves are more troublesome, but they can't really do much to the player's capital ships other than kill drones. Ever since drone HP/respawn was buffed, that's not really a problem as long as you pick off the unnamed trash. EXCEPTION: if your capital ships are dead, your run would normally end anyway at the next carrier wave, but a ball of shielded fighters can end you a few waves early. It's beatable--one of the most stressful waves I've ever been in was with no capships vs. Shield + Anti-shield ammunition + Juggernaut heavy fighters--but you have to be quite good and lucky. - Covettes: A punchline. - Destroyers: Tend to come in pretty spread out and die pretty easily if unshielded, which means that your frigates will only usually be fighting 2-3 at once. Your repair drones can stay on top of that--this is actually another case in which can see a repair drone nerf being bad for the player. EXCEPTION: If they come in shielded, they can easily overwhelm your capital ships. This scenario still isn't very threatening to a capable pilot, though. You can one-shot a destroyer with purifier bombs or with a ram, so each interceptor is good for 3 instant kills of even a shielded destroyer. Coincidentally, that's exactly as many as you need to kill for a respawn. But if you keep whiffing bombing runs, you could find yourself going into the next wave without 6 Purifiers, which is suicide if that wave is carriers. - Frigates: a lot less dangerous than they look. Purifier bombs oneshot even juggernaut frigates, which means that each interceptor is good for 2 dead frigates. Plus, they come in with a bunch of unshielded chaff you can shoot up for free repawns. Plus, their engagement range is short enough that you tend to have all day to set up your bombing runs before your capships start taking damage. Ironically, frigates would be a lot scarier if they didn't come with escorts. - Carriers: whoooo boy. If you don't have capships left when they jump in you're dead--I suppose it might be possible to dodge 4+ railguns long enough to disable them all, and then farm reinforcements for purifiers, but that's literal negative fun (source: i've been dumb enough to try). If you fail to kill off all the artillery tubes almost instantly (i.e before the third volley, in my experience), you won't have any capital ships left for the next carrier wave. Your luck here is too dependent on the ratio of available purifiers to artillery carriers--a 3 torpedo + 1 artillery wave is a joke; a 1 torpedo + 3 artillery wave is nightmarish. Typing it up like that, I think that there actually is a second core balance problem with wave clear--respawns are too easy to earn, or rather that extra purifier bombs are too easy to earn. Off-the-cuff suggestion: what would happen if you toned down the rate at which waves get nastier, but made it so that losing interceptors increased the number of kills you needed to get for a reinforcement? LIke, make the number of kills required 2 + (number of dead interceptors / 3) or something. e: other possible nerf: increasing the amount of time you get to begin with and reducing the amount of time you get for kills by a _lot_. Many of the strategies I outline are a lot less degenerate if you don't have 1+ hour on the clock by the time you hit wave 20. ee: hahahaha 4x artillery carriers on wave 13 today Reiterpallasch fucked around with this message at 07:52 on Aug 6, 2016 |
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Aug 5, 2016 23:14
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Now that the controls are sorted out, I'm getting into the meat of the game. Am I doing something wrong with my squad? I'm doing Tannhauser Gate, which I understand is the first "test" in this game, and my AI squad is next to worthless. I make an order chain for my other fighter and three destroyers to attack a group of three escorts and then an objective freighter, while I go to the other group of escorts+freighter and solo it. My AI team is getting shot to pieces by their targets, or at best is taking forever to destroy them, while I'm able to handle my targets on my own. I don't know if this is a case where the outfitting meta determines if your AI buddies are useful or not, or if I'm just ordering them around wrong, but it's frustrating that I'm so much more effective in one fighter than an AI squad of a fighter and three destroyers. Also, one time I was taking longer than I should've to finish the escorts, so I made a quick detour and shot out the engine of the objective freighter so it would be a sitting duck for a minute or so, but it warped away a few seconds after I "broke" its engines. Is this intended behavior? I don't think ships should be able to warp to safety when their engines are broken.
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Aug 6, 2016 07:43
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Shine posted:Also, one time I was taking longer than I should've to finish the escorts, so I made a quick detour and shot out the engine of the objective freighter so it would be a sitting duck for a minute or so, but it warped away a few seconds after I "broke" its engines. Is this intended behavior? I don't think ships should be able to warp to safety when their engines are broken. It shouldn't let the freighters warp away if you take out their engines. When you disabled the subsystem, where was it in relation to the gate or the combat space rings? The game is definitely player-focused, meaning you'll always be the most effective unit. I've always had difficulty balancing AI effectiveness compared to you, especially when it comes to hugely-different units like fighters and capitals in the same fight, because it's really easy to just have the AI just kill everything, or on the flipside make it so that fighting capitals in your fighter is ineffective. Edit: I'm still looking at this capital/fighter balancing thing, and there are other problems with it like turn speeds on your destroyers maybe being too slow, which lets enemy destroyers circle behind. It's all a big jenga tower. Kairo fucked around with this message at 16:54 on Aug 6, 2016 |
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Aug 6, 2016 16:37
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Kairo posted:Glad you dig it. Try "Force Mouse In Menus" in the gameplay settings page. This should also affect the tactical mode. Yeah sorry, turns out this was totally the case.  It's because for my HOTAS the zero point for throttle is the middle instead of all the way back, so I basically always have it forward a bit, instead of keeping it at the middle for normal speed.
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Aug 6, 2016 17:07
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The Heavy Auto-cannons on your destroyers are such a trap choice I'm not even sure why they're in the game. At the very least, they need the same range as the interceptor guns. Okay, managed to get up to wave 17 today. Today is lousy with railguns on the carriers so you want to put shields on everything. Interceptors: Autocannon Shotgun Shields AP Ammo You must have shields, otherwise random railgun shots will OHK you. You must have AP ammo so you can double tap carriers with your bombs and finish them off with your autocannon/shotgun if a bomb gets intercepted). Also, this combination lets you kill frigates without bombs in one pass, run in dumping AC until mag empty, then hit them with the shotgun. Destroyers Shields Shield Extenders Frigate Shield Repair Drone With shield extenders your destroyers actually become rather tough and you should be able to get up to wave 13 without any capital losses. If a destroyer takes hull damage, get the frigate to repair it. Don't be afraid to run from a new wave if your stuff needs to recharge/repair. However once you hit wave 13, you must have your fleet approach closely behind the big asteroid in order to get into range. Tell them to focus fire onto one of the carriers bridges to with a fighter bombing it. Go after another carrier with your own bombs. You will lose your fleet at this point as 8 loving railguns is simply too much and all you can hope for is to thin the herd enough that you can struggle onward with your fighters. Hopefully you will have destroyed 2 out of the four carriers in the opening minute. After that it's down to you having "the right stuff" and picking off escorts, dodging railguns and managing bomb runs. Edit: Then you will soldier on until you reach wave 17, where you die to 4 carriers with a large escort. Maybe a long-rifle would let you get past this point, but it'd be a real pain in the rear end. Xerxes17 fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Aug 6, 2016 |
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Aug 6, 2016 17:35
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Xerxes17 posted:The Heavy Auto-cannons on your destroyers are such a trap choice I'm not even sure why they're in the game. At the very least, they need the same range as the interceptor guns. LOL. I'm not sure the range will help much unless I push them way out. I was considering making these all even more lightly armored with sniper rounds instead of the autocannons. The beam frigate kind of handles the up-close DPS role better, so they are a bit redundant anyways. I'd rather have your capital fleet sit back and snipe since it keeps them all together and clears the encounters up a bit.
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Aug 6, 2016 18:27
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Destroyers are already fragile enough. But giving them a long-range gun option would be kinda nice.
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Aug 6, 2016 18:29
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Kairo posted:It shouldn't let the freighters warp away if you take out their engines. When you disabled the subsystem, where was it in relation to the gate or the combat space rings? Glad to hear that's not intended behavior. I don't remember where I was, but I'll Shadowplay it if it happens again.
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Aug 6, 2016 18:44
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Hmm, a LR build lets you actually keep capitals until the 17th wave! You just tell them to go gently caress off into dead space while you whittle down the enemy with your long rifles. Doesn't help you from getting sniped by railguns though  I suppose I should have sent the remaining destroyer and frigate in together so me and a fighter could purifier rush the railguns, but that's a crapshoot for pulling it off. Capital railguns are too effective against fighters. Even when maneuvering hard you'll catch shells and it's infuriating that you can be just one-shot in a 20km bubble around a carrier. It only gets worse once you try to get closer as their high projectile speed gives you absolutely zero chance to dodge unless you were already drifting at the time of firing and can immediately change direction with after-burn. Heaven help you if there is a second carrier shooting at you in the interval between the other, because that's basically a No Escape Zone that you can't win against. Perhaps add a new module to railgun carriers "fire control RADAR" which disables both railguns when destroyed, as short of just killing the bastards there is no way to disable them quickly enough. Hitting the railgun turrets at a distance is also a bit too fiddly considering their tack-driver accuracy against you. Xerxes17 fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Aug 6, 2016 |
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Aug 6, 2016 22:31
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