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I'm talking a about the instantaneous use not the power per hour. It also displays gas engine instantaneous use in kilowatts. Enough of the derail though, free charging at the office owns, even when people look at me like an alien when I plug it in.
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Dec 1, 2016 19:05
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Very few (non-hybrid) ICE cars show engine output in any unit of power. They Bugatti Veyron is the only I can think of. I suppose it's a bit difficult to figure out without a torque sensor in the drive train, but all the sensors needed are there. With an electric motor it's a lot simpler.
Ola fucked around with this message at 20:19 on Dec 1, 2016 |
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Dec 1, 2016 19:25
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Ola posted:Very few (non-hybrid) ICE cars show engine output in any unit of power. They Bugatti Veyron is the only I can think of. I suppose it's a bit difficult to figure out without a torque sensor in the drive train, but all the sensors needed are there. With an electric motor it's a lot simpler. A few Rolls Royces (I think, or maybe I'm thinking of Bentleys, either way expensive-rear end cars) have a "Power Reserve" gauge instead of a tach. I'm pretty sure both those and the Veyron's display are based on the ECU's calculated load which is generally available on OBD2, so while most cars don't offer a factory gauge for it you can easily see the information with an aftermarket gauge or smartphone app.
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Dec 1, 2016 20:53
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Subjunctive posted:What units does the US use for electricity in general, if not kW? I thought my bill was in kWh, but not I'm doubting myself.
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Dec 1, 2016 21:29
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Ripoff posted:Someone a ton smarter than me will correct me on this, but I'll give it a shot: Horsepower as car guys commonly know it is calculated as a derivative of torque. kW is the voltage and current the car is feeding the motor which is pretty trivial for the motor controller to calculate, but the motor's generated torque is something else. So it'd be weird to see the torque calculated HP while your motor is sucking down 750 amps at 300 volts as it would always look like you're not using a ton of power at low RPMs. Measuring the motor's power by output shaft speed and torque gives you the horsepower/wattage being sent to the drivetrain. The gas engine equivalent would be measuring the horsepower "at the crank." It's useful for figuring out how the car will perform. Measuring the motor's power by multiplying the voltage and current draw gives you the horsepower/wattage demanded from the battery. In an electric car, this is the more useful figure because it's related to how long the battery will last. The gas engine equivalent would be measuring fuel flow (and if you wanted an "input power" value, you'd multiply the fuel flow by the energy density of gasoline to get energy per second). The difference between the two figures is the energy lost to motor inefficiency. An internal combustion engine converts something like 20% of the chemical energy to movement, iirc, while an electric motor can hit 80% or more from battery to wheels.
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Dec 1, 2016 21:44
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My local Chevy dealership has no idea when they're getting Bolts, apparently. I would have thought dealerships would be told roughly when they're getting shipments this close to launch, even if they're not among the first states to get them.
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Dec 2, 2016 19:59
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Ciaphas posted:My local Chevy dealership has no idea when they're getting Bolts, apparently. I would have thought dealerships would be told roughly when they're getting shipments this close to launch, even if they're not among the first states to get them. It's not that unusual in this day and age that the dealership is the least informed party of not only the car's supply chain but its entire lifetime.
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Dec 2, 2016 20:05
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Dealers always have known jack poo poo, it's their natural state.
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Dec 2, 2016 20:09
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Dealers always have known jack poo poo, it's their natural state. This is true, but there was a time when the buyers didn't have access to any information and had to take the dealership's words for truth. I suppose there was also a time when some pretty good people used to work at dealerships.
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Dec 2, 2016 20:22
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It'd be nice if I could lease a new car (besides a Tesla) without having to do the whole dealership thing.
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Dec 2, 2016 22:32
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A good dealership makes it pretty easy, just don't go anywhere near the building until you have a price you're happy with in an email. The last car we leased involved about 3 one line emails back/forth with the dealer around money down (none) and qualifying for any loyalty incentives before they came back with a quote which didn't change. I was in and out to pick the car up in about 90 minutes. If they won't give you pricing up front with no bullshit via email go somewhere else.
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Dec 2, 2016 23:00
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A little off-topic but it's batteries and I can never get anything coherent out of the climate change thread. This is one guy's summary of the recent grid energy storage trial report from California: http://www.tdworld.com/blog/caiso-battery-storage-trial He discusses lithium-ion alternatives near the end, and mentions the Panasonic lithium nickel cobalt aluminum oxide (NCA) batteries Tesla uses are 'good for around 500 charges'. Is this accurate? Doesn't seem like a whole lot, especially for something like Powerwall, although obviously these things don't run anything like a cycle per day or whatever. Presumably this type is what the gigafactory is being built to produce? And what about these alternative lithiums he mentions with thousands of cycles in their lifetimes?
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Dec 3, 2016 11:12
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angryrobots posted:KWh for billing purposes only, kW/MW for engineering and design on power distribution and transmission. Can we make an arbitrary unit called the Edison and use that for billing or power generation? "My Tesla gets 50 miles to the Edison" would be blasphemous enough to work.
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Dec 3, 2016 16:54
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El Grillo posted:A little off-topic but it's batteries and I can never get anything coherent out of the climate change thread. This is one guy's summary of the recent grid energy storage trial report from California: http://www.tdworld.com/blog/caiso-battery-storage-trial Off the top of my head, you can greatly increase battery cycle lifetime by not actually fully charging or discharging the pack. If your BMS keeps the cells between, say, 20% and 95% charge at all times, you can see vastly reduced wear at only a 25% penalty to range. I'm pretty sure that most hybrids do this (which is why you get those Prius taxis with 300,000 miles and no signs of battery damage) and I would assume that most electric cars do too.
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Dec 3, 2016 19:23
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Teslas default to a max charge of 80% in "daily" mode, and get quite cross if you dip below 10%.
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Dec 3, 2016 19:31
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You can also lengthen battery life by configuring what voltage level equates to 100% in the software. The current gen Tesla S60 is a good example of that, it's a 75 kWh battery pack limited to 60 kWh charge, so you get higher charging speeds near 100% and lower cell voltage at 100%. So buying a 60 and not worrying about charging to 100% is a bit like buying a 75 and never going above 80%.
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Dec 3, 2016 20:03
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AFAIK the S60 charges to the "full" capacity by default, while you're right about the rest defaulting to 80%. That "full" buffer remains intact.
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Dec 3, 2016 23:54
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CannonFodder posted:Can we make an arbitrary unit called the Edison and use that for billing or power generation? Watt‐hours are heresy and we should all use joules.
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Dec 4, 2016 00:06
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Platystemon posted:Watt‐hours are heresy and we should all use joules. Yeah but a Joule is a watt * second so you've gotta divide by 3600...
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Dec 4, 2016 00:34
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Three-Phase posted:Yeah but a Joule is a watt * second so you've gotta divide by 3600... Suffer not sexageismal units.
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Dec 4, 2016 00:37
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Horsepower hours  USA #1 TRUMP
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Dec 4, 2016 00:39
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Three-Phase posted:Yeah but a Joule is a watt * second so you've gotta divide by 3600... So use megajoules. 1 kwh = 3.6MJ. It sounds cooler to say My Car Has A 300 Megajoule Battery anyway.
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Dec 4, 2016 00:52
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Sagebrush posted:okay Do all you guys defending the Bolt live in WA or CA? Because those are the only states where it will be sold as of now. EDIT: hence my "compliance car" statement.
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Dec 4, 2016 00:58
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The Sicilian posted:Do all you guys defending the Bolt live in WA or CA? Because those are the only states where it will be sold as of now. How many states is the Tesla Model 3 available in right now, again? (Dealers in Portland and Los Angeles are reporting that they're receiving the first shipments of Bolts right now)
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Dec 4, 2016 00:59
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Sagebrush posted:How many states is the Tesla Model 3 available in right now, again? The state of denial?
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Dec 4, 2016 01:00
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Sagebrush posted:How many states is the Tesla Model 3 available in right now, again? Zero! I guess a few thousand is better than nothing. Praise be to (post bankruptcy) GM! And I guess because the S and X don't count, Tesla is complete Vaporware am I right guys?
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Dec 4, 2016 01:01
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The Sicilian posted:Do all you guys defending the Bolt live in WA or CA? Because those are the only states where it will be sold as of now. I'll test drive a bolt in oil country Texas before the model 3 is delivered. The Sicilian posted:Zero! I guess a few thousand is better than nothing. Praise be to GM (post bankruptcy GM)! Hell yeah
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Dec 4, 2016 01:00
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The Sicilian posted:Zero! I guess a few thousand is better than nothing. Praise be to GM (post bankruptcy GM)! That doesn't work with GM, it's not a cult.
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Dec 4, 2016 01:02
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Sagebrush posted:So use megajoules. 1 kwh = 3.6MJ. My car has a one Salmanazar‐e battery.
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Dec 4, 2016 01:04
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The Sicilian posted:Do all you guys defending the Bolt live in WA or CA? Because those are the only states where it will be sold as of now.
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Dec 4, 2016 01:11
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ilkhan posted:I thought it was OR and CA? You may be right. I'll pipe down now. I wouldn't say I've achieved full cult status yet though. That will probably come with the solar roof and battery installation.
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Dec 4, 2016 01:16
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GM in Canada advertising Tesla and CHAdeMO chargers as available to the Bolt, which they obviously aren't. https://electrek.co/2016/12/06/tesla-supercharger-chevy-bolt-ev-chargingpoint/ I bet this is due to someone in marketing filtering the map for "level 3". It's not a very helpful abstraction and it's going to cause more problems down the road.
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Dec 6, 2016 17:01
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I realize this thread isn't post the mattest wraps u got, but  
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Dec 7, 2016 13:38
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Ciaphas posted:My local Chevy dealership has no idea when they're getting Bolts, apparently. I would have thought dealerships would be told roughly when they're getting shipments this close to launch, even if they're not among the first states to get them. GM has been moving closer to just in time delivery.
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Dec 7, 2016 19:05
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Ola posted:I realize this thread isn't post the mattest wraps u got, but That red T is so bad.
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Dec 7, 2016 19:15
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Ola posted:GM in Canada advertising Tesla and CHAdeMO chargers as available to the Bolt, which they obviously aren't. I wouldn't have expected them to be compatible with Tesla Superchargers, but no CHAdeMO? Isn't CHAdeMO the only one that's supposed to be introducing anything with power comparable to Tesla's chargers? Either way, that's going to kind of limit the Bolt's suitability for long-range travel.
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Dec 7, 2016 23:22
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CHAdeMO is way past introduced. It's been everywhere around here for a while. Looks like Bolt is using the SAE Combo DC Fast Charge. Guess it's the same plug for either DC or AC? https://electrek.co/2016/01/11/gm-bolt-ev-battery-pack-fast-charging-full-specs/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_J1772 LRADIKAL fucked around with this message at 02:44 on Dec 8, 2016 |
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Dec 8, 2016 02:39
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Yeah, from my understanding, CCS is basically DC charging with the normal L1/2 J1772 control circuit, albeit with a couple extra non-interfering connectors. Advantage being that this lets the car have one port that can either work with an AC J1772 L1/L2 EVSE, or the CCS DC quick charger, rather then two separate charging ports. I could be completely off base though so let me know. Edit: I'm a couple weeks in on the volt, and other then my 300+ mile trips across Texas, I've used .3 gallons of gas and that was only because I got cold and wanted waste heat /*RIGHT NOW*/ really liking the peace, quiet, and full tank every morning. blugu64 fucked around with this message at 04:19 on Dec 8, 2016 |
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Dec 8, 2016 04:15
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You're exactly right blugu64. If you charge on AC you plug in the smaller J1772, if you charge DC the plug fits on the same connector and talks on the same dataport but the current flows on the two big wires below. This is one advantage CCS has on CHAdeMO, if they're first with 350 kW, they might just win this VHS/beta kerfuffle. There are 150 kW CCS chargers in the wild already. And it has just come out that the Bolt will support 80 kW charging, it's in the recently released manual, on page 232: https://my.chevrolet.com/content/dam/gmownercenter/gmna/dynamic/manuals/2017/Chevrolet/BOLT%20EV/Owner's%20Manual.pdf
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Dec 8, 2016 07:08
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uggg. That plug is so fugly.
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Dec 8, 2016 07:31
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