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Error 404 posted:Join the Seers. I think at this point that's a given. Also thanks for making the mage we met last game into a Seer, Tolth. How many points in Contacts would you say I need to be his pal?
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Sep 25, 2012 20:14
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Reene posted:
Been in one of those before - 10 players, 2 STs, Weekly live sessions with blocks of downtime email'd-in actions between them. Lasted four months and played out pretty well, though it unravelled due to malignant problems left by character creation. Players came up with a mortal character, then everyone was assigned a path and grouped such that both teams had one of each. Everyone was freshly awakened, meeting each other and their factions for the first time. We had sources of plot hooks, but Team Throne didn't get a very strong incentive to get in with the establishment and ended up as an arcane party train plowing through other people's best laid plans in search of treasure and good times.
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Sep 25, 2012 21:48
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A_Raving_Loon posted:We had sources of plot hooks, but Team Throne didn't get a very strong incentive to get in with the establishment and ended up as an arcane party train plowing through other people's best laid plans in search of treasure and good times. Join The Seers. On the real, though, that basically owns and sounds exactly like the kind of poo poo the Seers would do. Now I have this mental image of a giant armored limo crashing through walls and running over robed Pentacle wizards while the actual Seers are in the back drinking champagne and doing lines of coke. Before departing, the driver's side window rolls down. "Join The Seers," the driver suggests, cheerfully, to the surviving sorcerers, and the car takes off again, leaving spilled wizard and broken candles behind.
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Sep 25, 2012 22:04
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I used some of my cut of a museum heist whose main purpose was to give us an excuse to do business with the seer-controlled Russian mafia to buy a tour bus so I could trash it and sculpt Ghost of Tour Bus into my phantasmal chariot for use when across the gauntlet. Got my dead friend a job as my chauffeur.
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Sep 25, 2012 22:14
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Was there something specific about the tour bus, or were you just too lazy to craft the thing wholesale out of shadow stuff from the ground up? Or was this just an excuse to crash a tour bus?
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Sep 25, 2012 22:45
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For maximum confederacy, some of the Promethean chapter fiction is set right in front of that sculpture in Stone Mountain and explicitly name-drops it:
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Sep 25, 2012 23:58
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Cabbit posted:Was there something specific about the tour bus, or were you just too lazy to craft the thing wholesale out of shadow stuff from the ground up? I had an afternoon and a few briefcase of freshly laundered cash. Nature took its course.
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Sep 26, 2012 00:09
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Loomer posted:Book does not include Gaki, 0/5. I looked for the Bushi/Gaki entry online, but I couldn't find anything. Still, you'd have to get hella racist to outdo the entirety of Kindred of the East. And I mean you'd have to get "Mickey Rooney in Breakfast at Tiffany's"-level racist.
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Sep 26, 2012 01:37
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Simian_Prime posted:
 Challenge Accepted.
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Sep 26, 2012 02:00
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Punting posted:
Had.
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Sep 26, 2012 02:31
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"Gypsy" is such a generic game persona archetype at this point that I am not surprised that there are people who are not aware "gypsy" refers to an actual ethnic group.
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Sep 26, 2012 05:06
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Reene posted:"Gypsy" is such a generic game persona archetype at this point that I am not surprised that there are people who are not aware "gypsy" refers to an actual ethnic group. The people that wrote Gypsy knew, and they put all the incredibly racist poo poo in there anyway. The Roma Anti-Defamation League was out for blood.
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Sep 26, 2012 06:24
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I've been explaining early WoD to a couple of friends as part of the project, since they've seen the maps a few times and asked (they both happen to be nerds and tabletop gamers, but they're DnD more than WoD). For some reason they think I'm kidding when I introduce it as a game that says gypsies have magic blood and Asian people go to a special hell.
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Sep 26, 2012 10:54
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They're probably just pulling your leg, didn't Ravenloft have both those things?
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Sep 26, 2012 11:26
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I think it did, but they're also more Forgotten Realms than Ravenloft. They're basically bog standard 3.5 DMs Guide/PHB/MM guys.
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Sep 26, 2012 12:06
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moths posted:They're probably just pulling your leg, didn't Ravenloft have both those things?
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Sep 26, 2012 14:32
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I thought there was some special Oriental Adventures dread realm, but I am probably wrong. Then again, Oriental Adventures.
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Sep 26, 2012 15:15
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Hi, I have a rules question re: the Summoning power from V:tR's Majesty discipline. A player in my Vampire game used it against another vampire of equal BP last session and failed to beat the target's resistance roll. The rules are sort of ambiguous about the effects of that failure. Does the target's successful resistance mean he can't be targeted by the same vampire's Summoning again for the rest of the night, or just that that particular Summoning failed?
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Sep 26, 2012 16:03
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Pathfinder is pretty bad about the racial caricatures too. Tabletop games in general tend to attract the kind of writers that both can't think of a better way to distinguish different in-setting ethnic groups and so instead rely heavily on real-life stereotypes, and are white/middle-class/etc enough to not know what is wrong with doing that. I'd read Gypsy to see how bad it gets but I'm watching my blood pressure.
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Sep 26, 2012 20:23
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Reene posted:Pathfinder is pretty bad about the racial caricatures too. Tabletop games in general tend to attract the kind of writers that both can't think of a better way to distinguish different in-setting ethnic groups and so instead rely heavily on real-life stereotypes, and are white/middle-class/etc enough to not know what is wrong with doing that. Me and some friends are doing the Serpent Skull AP and hooooly poo poo is it racist.
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Sep 27, 2012 00:08
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Reene posted:I'd read Gypsy to see how bad it gets but I'm watching my blood pressure. Literally stealing babies, hexing people who cut you off in traffic, rampant theft, and magical ethnicity powers await.
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Sep 27, 2012 02:19
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I saw a copy at a used bookstore but couldn't bring myself to buy it.
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Sep 27, 2012 02:47
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It wasn't all Gypsies - WoD: Mafia and Clanbook: Giovanni biased meta-gamers against every Italian-American NPC for a decade.
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Sep 27, 2012 02:55
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Reene posted:I'd read Gypsy to see how bad it gets but I'm watching my blood pressure. Check out the FATAL thread, I've already done it for you.
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Sep 27, 2012 03:38
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moths posted:They're probably just pulling your leg, didn't Ravenloft have both those things? The Vistani were basically the elf replacement for Ravenloft (until Soth's domain got added there were no native elves). There were three tribes that were all tied into special plotlines and domains: the one in Barovia was tied to Strahd and they had limited ability to see the future, the one in Azalin's province was connected to Van Richten and wandered through time and the one in crazy not India was tied to the fey and eventually helped cause the sundering. Ravenloft Vistani were stereotyped against and hated, but they were actually careful in the books to say that most Vistani weren't thieves and the Vistani weren't evil, they were just a nomadic culture in a world where travel was extremely dangerous so everyone feared and hated them.
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Sep 27, 2012 03:53
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TheAnomaly posted:The Vistani were basically the elf replacement for Ravenloft (until Soth's domain got added there were no native elves). There were three tribes that were all tied into special plotlines and domains: the one in Barovia was tied to Strahd and they had limited ability to see the future, the one in Azalin's province was connected to Van Richten and wandered through time and the one in crazy not India was tied to the fey and eventually helped cause the sundering. Ravenloft Vistani were stereotyped against and hated, but they were actually careful in the books to say that most Vistani weren't thieves and the Vistani weren't evil, they were just a nomadic culture in a world where travel was extremely dangerous so everyone feared and hated them.
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Sep 27, 2012 04:28
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...Hopefully, I won't kill the thread again. There's an adventure in this just waiting to break out: http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/133318 I'm trying to decide whether it's a Mage or Hunter adventure, though. (Werewolf is also a possibility, but 'wolves don't often do a whole lot of research, in my experience.) The bigger issue is, of course, how I want to run with it. The bird itself is obviously a spirit. But what kind? A juvenile Thunderbird? The actual Spirit of America? (The bald eagle, of course, was only our limited understanding of the essence of America itself.) What might happen if you captured and controlled it? Could Changelings make a pact with it? If I don't play up the spirit angle, then there's a conspiracy of some sort to hide the existence of the bird from the world at large. Why? And who's behind it? Perhaps the bird doesn't exist at all, but Audobon's painting is some kind of clue pointing at a greater mystery altogether. Thoughts?
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Sep 28, 2012 15:33
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JohnnyCanuck posted:...Hopefully, I won't kill the thread again. The answer to all of these is Yes.
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Sep 28, 2012 17:38
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Yawgmoth posted:They also had the ability to navigate the Mists, which were notoriously dangerous since they were how you got into (and out of, if extremely lucky) Ravenloft itself. The Mists also separated several domains from each other so they were a great way to traverse long distances, if they didn't completely and utterly gently caress your poo poo first. And of course, they were impossible to navigate by any means, save for being Vistani. This is another big part of why they were hated. Because they were pretty much the only people who could leave a realm even if the Lord of it closed the borders. Everyone else was stuck there at the whim of an evil vampire or whatever, but the Vistani could just leave if they wanted to. Everyone figured that clearly they were in league with the "dark powers", since they could just break the rules of the setting in ways nobody else could.
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Sep 28, 2012 18:17
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One of the girls in my gaming group (there are 3 girls and 3 guys) has convinced the guy that normally DMs D&D for us to run Vampire. The girl that wants to play has played the Vampire: The Masquerade computer game, but never the RPG. The GM and I have played Vampire: The Masquerade maybe two or three sessions when it first came out twenty years ago, the other three have not played anything other than D&D and Shadowrun. A lot of things I have read on various forums seem to mention that Vampire: The Masquerade has a better setting, but that Requiem has a cleaner ruleset. The GM will be using my books to run the game, and I have Requiem, but would buy the Print on Demand 20th anniversary of Vampire: The Masquerade if that ended up being a better option. All of that considered, the GM usually asks me to come up with a general plotline and some character hooks for the players, and then he runs with that to create a campaign. Problem is, without knowing which game to play, and without a lot of experience with VtM, and no experience with VtR, I have no idea where to start, or what kind of plotline I could use to get us started. That being the case, any suggestions on which game to use and a few good plot ideas or plot points that might get us started? Thanks.
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Sep 28, 2012 18:58
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Anything that can be done in Masquerade can be done in Requiem. Requiem has better rules, and honestly the setting is better because it has a lot more flexibility in terms of what you want to put together: there's less "Oh, and about that," baggage hanging over it. As for plot points, a good one is "You're all fledging vampires, but one of you was embraced and dumped without knowing who his or her Sire was. The Prince is very annoyed by this, and so has convened you together with the twin tasks of finding the anonymous Sire and helping this new member of the kindred find a place for him or her self. Why you guys? Well, to an ancient vampire, you're all young, so maybe you can all relate." Edit: As for why this would work, well... Mystery, something to be getting on with, a reason for the party to get together, the potential for bonding (and plenty of reason to be annoyed with each other), an excuse to tour kindred society and no immediate antagonism breathing down your neck. Great for starting players looking to get comfortable with the game. Etherwind fucked around with this message at 19:47 on Sep 28, 2012 |
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Sep 28, 2012 19:43
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I think the Requiem setting is way cooler than the Masquerade setting. There's more overall diversity among vampires and way more interesting stuff for vampires to be doing. I'd just port any specific things you like from Masquerade into Requiem by using the conversion guide and calling them new bloodlines/new covenants/new whatevers. Hell, nothing stops you from making the Caine thing publically or secretly true; just keep Requiem's clans and covenants around, because they own.
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Sep 28, 2012 19:47
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Stupid question but do vampires in either VTR or VTM actually get along? Become friends? Something about the whole predator of the night thing makes me think that all kindred are lone wolves who only pretend or dimly feel camaraderie in any sense, and everyone they do "befriend" is just a means to an end. Then again I'm going to play a Mekhet so maybe that's just their view of things.
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Sep 28, 2012 19:52
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They can. There are many reasons why they shouldn't, or why it would be a challenge, but to be honest I've always felt the "With enough time every vampire will totally gently caress every other vampire," card has been completely overplayed. That's actually dumb because a big focus of Vampire has always been politics, and a major element of Realpolitik (even going back to the Prince) is friends and how they should be treated, and it's much, much less about loving them for personal benefit as it is recognising their complementary strengths and the value in loyalty. The sort of person who never has friends, only temporary allies of conveniance, is not the sort of person who ultimately does well in politics (every major politician ultimately has a few friends they will not betray). There's a lot to be said for a group of people casting their lot in together, especially since not everyone wants to be the top dog.
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Sep 28, 2012 20:03
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It was more prevalent in oWod, or at least seemed to be. The Anarch movement had a strong solidarity "us v them", as did clan Tremere. Sabbat packs had vauldere communal blood bonding, and then Blood Brothers comedy option. I'd say that the lone predator archetype was a VtR implementation. You had back stabbing in M, but it was generally the higher ups and power elites, not street level PCs.
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Sep 28, 2012 20:06
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crime fighting hog posted:Stupid question but do vampires in either VTR or VTM actually get along? Become friends? Something about the whole predator of the night thing makes me think that all kindred are lone wolves who only pretend or dimly feel camaraderie in any sense, and everyone they do "befriend" is just a means to an end. In Tolth's game, our coterie was pretty much falling apart so we gave each other a one drink vinculum. This isn't enough for mind control, or even enough to bias someone towards someone else. It's just enough to make it so that you aren't instinctively hostile to one another. This is also a really dangerous situation because if one of us manages to feed our blood to another, that other probably wont get too mad about it. and it's potentially only two drinks away from total enslavement. I've already got a vampire manservant that I vinculumed
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Sep 28, 2012 21:25
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crime fighting hog posted:Stupid question but do vampires in either VTR or VTM actually get along? Become friends? Something about the whole predator of the night thing makes me think that all kindred are lone wolves who only pretend or dimly feel camaraderie in any sense, and everyone they do "befriend" is just a means to an end. Sure vampires can be friends, in the way Mafia members might be friends. Why, one of my Vampire characters once forcibly befriended an NPC! Without using the Vinculum or mind control, even!
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Sep 29, 2012 03:31
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It's possible to be a legitimately friendly vampire. Doing it takes a lot of self control, the willingness to lose gracefully - and to back out of a situation if the other guy clearly cares too much.
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Sep 29, 2012 03:58
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Genuine vampire 'friends' are fairly rare, was my reading of it all. There were plenty of cases in the books and novels of vampires who appeared to be friends, but such relationships lasted for all of a few years in general - or were on-again, off-again alliances based on respect and loyalty rather than what we'd necessarily consider genuine friendship. Sabbat didn't really have friendships arise just because of the Vinculum. I can think of, off the top of my head, two genuine Sabbat friendships (but half the oWoD still needs reading, so there are more later, I'd bet): Some packmaster or other in the Clan Novels who felt legitimate affection towards his toughest member, and so broke his neck so he wouldn't be there when the pack was destroyed in a trap. And two old vampires who'd met in something like the 15th century. That turned poisonous. In fact, that poisonous nature was a big element in most of the 'friendships'. poo poo got poisonous, because familiarity breeds contempt. Vannevar Thomas had a good three friends over the course of Prince of the City, all of which wound up as enemies in the very end. Now, genuine love seems to be one of the exceptions, but it is exceedingly rare among humans and vampires alike in the WoD, and even it has a tendency to end up warped and twisted over the long decades and the endless centuries. Basically, VtM 'friendship' was more 'I'll think more than twice before I stab you in the back, and maybe even feel bad about it' than 'We're brothers, man, brothers!'. Mostly.
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Sep 29, 2012 04:25
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My Ventrue in our current Requiem game has made "make friends" his current priority. Having been on the giving and receiving ends of Dominate and Blood Bonds most of his Requiem, he's decided that friends are valuable because they're such a rare commodity amongst the Kindred. His first act in the game was to take a group of low-status but friendly vampires (i.e. the PCs) and take them out to dinner. His proposal was, "How many elders have genuine friends? None. They have ghouls, minions, and toadies. They have allies and superiors. But when the chips are down, what happens? The allies smell blood in the water and frenzy over who can get the first pound of flesh. The ghouls make a run for freedom, or at least find another Daddy who they can bend over for. That's why they all eventually fall" "But a coterie? A group of Kindred who hang out because they like each other? That's something they don't understand. And that's why we'll succeed while they fail. So who's with me?"
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Sep 29, 2012 04:45
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