|
Alongside cursive being outdated, we teach penmanship / handwriting at the wrong ages anyways. Technically you should teach boys and girls at different ages, because they hit puberty at different ages, and hormones actually mess up our handwriting. Generally when girls learn, it's after the influx of hormones from puberty, whereas boys learn beforehand and don't cope to it.
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 19:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 00:40 |
|
|
Popular Thug Drink posted:So then all I have to do is count up a penny, four dimes, a five and a twenty. $25.41 easy peasy. That's what people are complaining about as the newfangled complicated way to do things. If you aren't giving $0.41 as a penny, nickel, dime, and quarter, then you should feel bad about missing one of the best moments of running a register. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 19:59
|
|
|
seiferguy posted:Alongside cursive being outdated, we teach penmanship / handwriting at the wrong ages anyways. Technically you should teach boys and girls at different ages, because they hit puberty at different ages, and hormones actually mess up our handwriting. Generally when girls learn, it's after the influx of hormones from puberty, whereas boys learn beforehand and don't cope to it. Now I'm picturing a 10 or 11 year old having massive headaches and shooting laser from his eyes because a teacher decided to teach him cursive at too early an age.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:03
|
|
|
PupsOfWar posted:in post-elementary school math education, a lot of kids are held back by the fact that they don't really understand how the operations work, which makes it hard to teach them order of operations, algebra, etc. they don't know that subtracting is finding the difference between two numbers, or that multiplication is the same as repeated adding, or don't get how multiplication and division are opposites. Common Core is targetting this problem. This was definitely me, and I struggled in math when I was in school because of it. Thankfully I figured out a lot of the stuff they seem to be teaching with common core on my own, so I actually do okay with every-day mental math. A few of the people in my office have young kids though and it's really bizarre to hear them do the whole WHAT IS THIS poo poo thing about Timmy's math homework to me, and when I look at it I think "oh yeah, this is how I do it in my head."
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:07
|
|
|
Nth Doctor posted:If you aren't giving $0.41 as a penny, nickel, dime, and quarter, then you should feel bad about missing one of the best moments of running a register. I was just about to post this when I saw your reply. .41 was the best change ever, unless it came out to an even dollar amount, but that was rare. I honestly wonder if working a register didn't make it easier for me to understand my son's math homework, as I've been doing math in my head that way for years and I think it mostly goes back to figuring out what to give someone for change.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:31
|
|
|
The best part of common core is Reagan's former head of education is running ads on conservative media about how common core was a good idea ruined by BIG GOVERNMENT and conservatives need to take it back.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 20:57
|
|
|
Hulk Krogan posted:This was definitely me, and I struggled in math when I was in school because of it. Thankfully I figured out a lot of the stuff they seem to be teaching with common core on my own, so I actually do okay with every-day mental math. This is my experience as well. I see so many folks from my old podunk town, who started having kids out of highschool, who complain about 'common core' and how bizarre the new math is. Meanwhile as a dude with multiple degrees and a focus in statistics, I look at it and go, 'Yeah that's pretty much how I've always done math'.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 21:54
|
|
|
The ur  COMMON CORE image is this classic (as far as I know): Which I love because the super genius with the electrical engineering BS couldn't figure out that Jack forgot to subtract 10, which the writer of the document (presumably "frustrated parent" but really, who knows) obscured by incorrectly identifying numbers on a child's math problem. TheLoquid fucked around with this message at 22:10 on Mar 30, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:07
|
|
|
Poizen Jam posted:This is my experience as well. I see so many folks from my old podunk town, who started having kids out of highschool, who complain about 'common core' and how bizarre the new math is. Meanwhile as a dude with multiple degrees and a focus in statistics, I look at it and go, 'Yeah that's pretty much how I've always done math'. Everyone I know personally who has complained about common core is... not that bright. Theres a very strong undercurrent of "I don't understand this because it's incomprehensible, not because of any personal difficulty I'm having" related to parents complaining about homework.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:11
|
|
|
Venom Snake posted:A lot of conservatives hold the self contradicting belief that abortion should be illegal but we shouldn't allow poor people and minorities to have children. Shouldn't allow them to CHOOSE to have them. Babies are supposed to be a punishment for poor people, them enjoying that ruins it. When a poor person has a baby, they're suppoosed to go even further into bankruptcy and desair, and have to give up even more basic comforts.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:12
|
|
|
TheLoquid posted:The ur My son is near 3, so I haven't come across whatever the UK version of this is just yet. But I think that image is confusing things by having too many jumps on the left of the number line. 427 - 316 works well using the approach listed. quote:1. 427 - 100 = 327 I've never looked at a common core maths question in my life and it took all of 2 mins to work out how it should be approached, and I'm a university comp sci drop out.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:19
|
|
|
seiferguy posted:Alongside cursive being outdated, we teach penmanship / handwriting at the wrong ages anyways. Technically you should teach boys and girls at different ages, because they hit puberty at different ages, and hormones actually mess up our handwriting. Generally when girls learn, it's after the influx of hormones from puberty, whereas boys learn beforehand and don't cope to it. Huh? I learned printing somewhere in the 5-8 range. Even if we lived in some bizarre world where kids don't learn to print until they're tweens, I have a hard time believing  would have any role whatsoever.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:27
|
|
|
I'm a student elementary school teacher in France and we teach math in a way that's fairly similar to Common Core, from what I've seen of it. As someone who was terrible at math and studied languages at university I find it way easier and most of the kids pick up on it right away. I suppose it helps that our math books are in a language most of the parents don't speak so they can't stick their noses in and get mad about how bullshit this new math is.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:27
|
|
|
Mr Darcy posted:My son is near 3, so I haven't come across whatever the UK version of this is just yet. But I think that image is confusing things by having too many jumps on the left of the number line. That is the point, Jack "forgot" to subtract the 10. The question isn't how to do it, it is to find the mistake.
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:34
|
|
|
First comment on some "look at this image!" garbage article on some garbage site:quote:This is ridiculous! I am 71 yrs old and solved this in my head in a few seconds. We were taught to use our brain in school. We weren't allowed to count on our fingers to do math. Also didn't have a calculator, computer or ipad. We had an old fashioned math book and blackboard. Our teacher kept a ruler and a paddle that gave us a little boost just in case we needed encouragement. Our schools need to go back to the old way of teaching our children. 99% of complaints about common core are
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 22:35
|
|
|
Xarthor posted:Wait, am I reading that wrong, or is he saying that we shouldn't allow low(er) income people to "breed"? No, that would be old-hat boring conservatism. That doesn't even shock me anymore. This was hilarious because the guy was extending that up to the middle class: anyone who got hosed over by losing the children and dependents deduction. Only the richest!
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 23:11
|
|
|
Time to replay a semi-annual favorite whenever awful Common Core complaints come up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIKGV2cTgqA 
|
|
#
?
Mar 30, 2015 23:17
|
|
|
Well, of the people I know who are against common core, one is/was a school administrator for charter schools. This person's opinion is that their kids used to love math until common core was introduced. It is also their opinion that common core is government over reach because we shouldn't hold smarter kids back by making these kids do problems like everyone else if they can already do it in their heads. So this person does the argument from authority thing a lot. Huh, kind of funny about that electrical engineer! Just so happens that another person who argues against it knows an EE (with a minor in math) who is frustrated about it too! Anyway, the argument from authority left it at pretty much "I don't know why they can't do it they way I did". Doctor Butts fucked around with this message at 00:33 on Mar 31, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:30
|
|
|
Doctor Butts posted:Well, of the people I know who are against common core, one is/was a school administrator for charter schools. Schools and school districts have always been fiercely independent entities in this country so it doesn't come as a surprise to me that no matter how much things like this will help, schools don't want to give up their ability to choose their own curriculum.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 00:56
|
|
|
Rick_Hunter posted:Schools and school districts have always been fiercely independent entities in this country so it doesn't come as a surprise to me that no matter how much things like this will help, schools don't want to give up their ability to choose their own curriculum. Which they can still do under Common Core, since Common Core isn't a curriculum, it is a set of standards for curricula to meet. Kind of like the ACA and insurance plans.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 01:10
|
|
|
Doctor Butts posted:Well, of the people I know who are against common core, one is/was a school administrator for charter schools.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 01:25
|
|
|
Guaranteed, with a BS in EE, he (and most other people with a BS in anyE) couldn't do a dif e.q. problem to save his life.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 01:39
|
|
|
Ghost of Reagan Past posted:My favorite retort, other than explaining how it works, is to point out that teaching is different from electrical engineering (or whatever). Yeah, you find the method maddening and far too complicated. You've taken differential equations and do tons of complicated math every day. That doesn't mean you know how to teach it, or even basic arithmetic. It means you're an expert in differential equations and complex math. Maybe let the experts in teaching do the teaching, while you go do electrical things? I'll go one further: It doesn't mean he actually understands what it is he is doing when he does arithmetic.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 01:39
|
|
|
Mo_Steel posted:Time to replay a semi-annual favorite whenever awful Common Core complaints come up: I posted that as a comment to an "I Hate CC" post and everyone said "see, it was stupid then so why do we need to learn this stupid way. They are just going to come up with something dumber so CC is a waste of time."
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 02:02
|
|
|
totalnewbie posted:Guaranteed, with a BS in EE, he (and most other people with a BS in anyE) couldn't do a dif e.q. problem to save his life. Hey, I used to be able to do differential equation problems, and I know enough that if I needed to do one now I'd be able to relearn it. Granted, for an engineer, most of the time solving a differential equation is as simple as discretizing it and passing it off to a program, hence why we have finite element analysis for solving most of our problems.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 02:46
|
|
|
Popular Thug Drink posted:First comment on some "look at this image!" garbage article on some garbage site: * It's a takeover of education by the feds. * It came directly from Obama. * It contains history lessons that teach kids to hate America.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 02:50
|
|
|
Guilty Spork posted:* It contains history lessons that teach kids to hate America. Yeah anything that is not "America is the best nation ever and has never made a single mistake ever and oh by the way Communism is incapable of working, ever, and liberals suck" is teaching people to hate America to the right. My assumption is that at least one lesson said "America made a mistake this time" or "here is a situation where America was not the good guy." That or covering the Civil War properly. The right seriously wants to rewrite American history to make them and their states look good.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 03:06
|
|
|
Reminds me of a moral panic in the 80s surrounding a textbook series...I forget the title..."Reflections," maybe? Anyway, the religious right at the time was up in arms that it was "teaching witchcraft." They had tables set up at the local malls where they bugged passersby about it. It was my first moral panic. Ah, memories.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 04:54
|
|
|
ToxicSlurpee posted:Yeah anything that is not "America is the best nation ever and has never made a single mistake ever and oh by the way Communism is incapable of working, ever, and liberals suck" is teaching people to hate America to the right. My assumption is that at least one lesson said "America made a mistake this time" or "here is a situation where America was not the good guy." That or covering the Civil War properly. The right seriously wants to rewrite American history to make them and their states look good. Let's not forget former Governor (and current President of Purdue University) Mitch Daniels tried to remove any mention of Howard Zinn from Indiana state curriculum.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 04:56
|
|
|
totalnewbie posted:Guaranteed, with a BS in EE, he (and most other people with a BS in anyE) couldn't do a dif e.q. problem to save his life. Both ECEs and MEs at my school are required to take Diff e.q. for undergrad  . My favorite argument against CC is that you can do it in your head. No poo poo, maybe the kid learning from CC will learn it easier that way, you already know how to do it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 06:03
|
|
|
Mr E posted:you already know how to do it. This is the single worst problem in math education; too much poo poo written by and taught by people who already know how to do it, but don't understand how they learned it. Anyone who can't figure out what those math worksheets are for should STFU up about it, because if they aren't already part of the problem they are trying to make themselves part of the problem.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 06:14
|
|
|
LOL just because you take the course, that doesn't mean you actually understand it or did anything more in depth that 2nd order ODEs that you were basically given the answer to and had to find out what makes it the answer. Maybe the worst you had to do was solve them using power series or something, & I'm sure for almost everyone it is a sophomore level course. Laplace and fourier transforms are not that difficult, but again you don't actually need to understand what is going on to algorithmically solve them. I'm sure the most that the majority of EE graduates have done is solving a wave equation.
|
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 06:16
|
|
|
Watermelon Daiquiri posted:LOL just because you take the course, that doesn't mean you actually understand it or did anything more in depth that 2nd order ODEs that you were basically given the answer to and had to find out what makes it the answer. Maybe the worst you had to do was solve them using power series or something, & I'm sure for almost everyone it is a sophomore level course. Laplace and fourier transforms are not that difficult, but again you don't actually need to understand what is going on to algorithmically solve them. I'm sure the most that the majority of EE graduates have done is solving a wave equation. I'm sensing some massive buttfrustration here.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 09:35
|
|
|
Watermelon Daiquiri posted:LOL just because you take the course, that doesn't mean you actually understand it or did anything more in depth that 2nd order ODEs that you were basically given the answer to and had to find out what makes it the answer. Maybe the worst you had to do was solve them using power series or something, & I'm sure for almost everyone it is a sophomore level course. Laplace and fourier transforms are not that difficult, but again you don't actually need to understand what is going on to algorithmically solve them. I'm sure the most that the majority of EE graduates have done is solving a wave equation. What's your point? Most differential equation work is useless in the real world (where engineers need to actually build stuff) and what isn't useless in the real world is discretized, solved with finite element analysis or similar tools, and then tested experimentally to see if the model holds up. Knowing and understanding the theory is the important part of an engineer's education as he or she then knows which models to apply or when analyzing frequency is helpful.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 11:36
|
|
|
The point is that "I know how to do differential equations" is practically worthless in the realm of pedagogy. Good job, you're more qualified to explain subtraction to children than a homeless illiterate man would be, because at least you know how to do it. That doesn't mean you know anything about how children learn or are qualified to contradict experts in the field of education. E: Also if that EE can't figure out a number line, he might be a loving idiot. That homework question is obvious to me after looking at if for 5 minutes, and I'm also a EE who knows nothing about pedagogy. And it would have taken less time than that if the idiot parent hadn't written the wrong numbers under the number line. E2: Also  at the idea that classroom exercises to teach schools to children should be the same level of work expected in an office. I bet if a newspaper editor sat there diagramming every sentence in an article to figure out which one is the subject he'd get fired too. God why is it so complicated, first-graders, can't you just look at the sentence and tell?
VitalSigns fucked around with this message at 12:11 on Mar 31, 2015 |
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 11:54
|
|
|
Mr E posted:Both ECEs and MEs at my school are required to take Diff e.q. for undergrad Yeah, I wasn't clear, I just meant that his "I'm a EE who's studied advanced math like diff e.q." is pretty dumb because no one really remembers that poo poo after a while, not if they've just got a BS, because it probably means they're not going to be using it for their work. There are obviously exceptions, but it's just a dumb thing that's supposed to sound impressive to impressionable people.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 13:34
|
|
StealthArcher posted:I'm sensing some massive buttfrustration here. Ha, no, just some mania and text's inability to show nuance. 
|
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 13:40
|
|
|
VideoTapir posted:Reminds me of a moral panic in the 80s surrounding a textbook series...I forget the title..."Reflections," maybe? Anyway, the religious right at the time was up in arms that it was "teaching witchcraft." They had tables set up at the local malls where they bugged passersby about it. It was my first moral panic. Ah, memories. Wasn't that around the time parents were worried their kids were being sacrificed to satan in day cares? Edit: I wonder how this will be affected by Indiana's religious freedom law. Hmm.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 13:42
|
|
|
Gravel Gravy posted:Wasn't that around the time parents were worried their kids were being sacrificed to satan in day cares? The 80s were also a time that people genuinely believed that Dungeons and Dragons was a pagan front used to corrupt children and lure people into witchcraft and satanism. Yup, a game where you pretend to be an elf that beats up dragons and takes their stuff will totally teach you real, actual magic. Yup. Totally. Throwing those little plastic things around is literally how you cast spells.
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 13:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 00:40 |
|
|
Gravel Gravy posted:Wasn't that around the time parents were worried their kids were being sacrificed to satan in day cares?
|
|
#
?
Mar 31, 2015 13:53
|
|
