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They do look awful but then again the new Austin looked like hot trash until they announced its Main Battery Reload Booster would have infinite charges, at which point it became interesting at least. Trip report on British DDs - I disliked the line completely until Jervis when it started getting good. This was followed by Lightning which I thought was fantastic and up there with the best tech-tree Tier 8 ships of any class. Unfortunately haven't enjoyed the Jutland as much. The extra firepower and heal IMO do not make up for the slight increase in concealment. With the Lightning you knew that probably the only DD that could outspot you at all yet still give you a knife-fight was Cossack but there are a high variety of nasty poo poo that are very close to Jutland's 5.7km. Still not a bad boat but in a sea of many great T9 DDs it doesn't stand out nearly so much. kaesarsosei fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Jan 16, 2021 |
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Jan 16, 2021 17:26
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For the new premium DD it even says:quote:Like new researchable German destroyers, the ship has good armor and is quite mobile.  I'm left wondering if: This is a terrible translation The writer just has no clue WG are purposefully lying WG think these DDs do have good armour and are mobile??? Velius posted:They’re supposed to have improved pen angles. I don’t think as it stands they’ll be usable, but if they do have improved angles then the AP might be able to do AP things to enemy dds in a viable way. Otherwise it’ll be overpen city and no way are these competitive. They will need short fuses too if they want to not overpen most DDs. Unless you mean better AP angles lets them pen DDs longways? AP but not for broadsides would certainly be something.
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Jan 16, 2021 17:40
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They did state they will have short fuse improved pen angle AP I believe, and also the 19mm thing is for the superstructure, they said on stream I think it will have armored sections of 38mm, so they will bounce a lot of HE from other DDs. If you've ever engaged someone in Khaba who doesn't know about its armor plate, this can be hilarious.
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Jan 16, 2021 17:43
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They're not exactly small so 38mm armour might get them penned a lot more from cruisers at least.
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Jan 16, 2021 18:25
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I mean, none of that actually matters because it's going to get torn apart by CVs in its current form. Even ignoring how nearly irrelevant AA is in general, the DFAA here feels like an elaborate joke - like, what's it even supposed do? The T8 doesn't even HAVE flak bursts to take advantage of it, and its continuous damage is garbage. Even the T10 only has 2 mediocre flak bursts (lowest number in tier, barring the 0 flak French), and while its short-range continuous is okay that doesn't actually stop strikes. Fun times for something with middling detection, no heal, no smoke, and mediocre speed.
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Jan 16, 2021 19:10
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Darkrenown posted:For the new premium DD it even says: I was meaning getting pen when the enemy dd is angles enough to fuse. Unless it’s short fuse AP those 150s are going to be worthless if the enemy dd turns fully broadside, yeah.
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Jan 16, 2021 19:39
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It looks like the intent is for you to get on the side of a cruiser and citadel it with AP, but unless they do something weird with the guns there will be very few situations where it's actually better at that than other destroyers. Because of the terrible damage output (a Gearing has more HE dpm than the German tier 10 has AP dpm) they won't outdamage other DDs unless they're getting reliable citadels and the other DD isn't. The French and Russian DDs are already pretty good at citadeling broadside cruisers at close range, and they can still contribute something if they don't have a broadside cruiser 6 km away. Also the French have reload booster to kill broadside things quickly, and the Russians can smoke if someone turns away instead of sitting there looking like an idiot until you die. I think the developers thought that putting 6" guns on a destroyer is an improvement somehow, when none of the attributes are any better than on the normal destroyers. All it even does is make your gun damage 10% lower because you can't use BFT. edit: also the tier 10 has Yamato turning radius  The ZF-2 is even more confusing. It's supposed to be a tier 8 ship but there are tier 5s that outgun it. It has reload booster but with reload booster active it still only has tier 7 dpm. It's supposed to use torpedoes but the torpedoes are the same as the tier 6 Gaede. It doesn't even have speed boost. If you compare it to the Maass a tier lower, the only advantages it has are one kilometer of range and the concealment module. It's worse in every other way. At least there's precedent since the Z-23 is already worse than the Maass, but yikes. James Garfield fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Jan 16, 2021 |
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Jan 16, 2021 22:50
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kaesarsosei posted:They do look awful but then again the new Austin looked like hot trash until they announced its Main Battery Reload Booster would have infinite charges, at which point it became interesting at least. Jutland used to have something like 30% more gun DPM than it currently does (3.5s reload instead of 4.5s) and was rather overpowered. Then they nerfed it in several stages until it became one of the lowest DPM DD's at T9. It really not very enjoyable at all anymore. At least they nerfed the Kitakaze so it has more than the 200 meter stealth disadvantage it used to have.
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Jan 17, 2021 01:46
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The guns on these new destroyers are in stupid positions as well. They want you to play as an aggressive gunboat but you can only reliably get one of your 3 guns on target unless you're broadside on. Its just weird. They look awful. The Torps at tier 8 are only 8km range. No smoke, guns you cant fire at all times and slow turret traverse. Slow, awful turning radius and detection ranges. Planes spot you from 4km but your AA is atrocious. How are these going into test like this? serious gaylord fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Jan 17, 2021 |
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Jan 17, 2021 15:16
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Yes, here is a great example of when you might NOT want your DD to have armor https://imgur.com/xmz5wp0
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Jan 17, 2021 19:42
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There's a very 'British Light Tanks' smell about this new German DD line. Much like these ships, everyone knew the light tanks would be awful just looking at them. They didn't get changed and went into the game to be one of the least played tech tree lines. I imagine these will go the same way.
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Jan 18, 2021 08:31
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Oh, they get battleship guns?
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Jan 18, 2021 11:44
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Darkrenown posted:Oh, they get battleship guns? 6 inchers but the firing angles are absolutely godawful. Among many other problems.
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Jan 18, 2021 13:49
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 This is the tier 10. Its described to be an aggressive destroyer hunting gunboat. It has rubbish concealment for both surface and air and its guns are on its rear end. Its suggested gameplay doesn't match its ship model at all.
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Jan 18, 2021 23:35
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serious gaylord posted:
??? The dev blog about them describes them as supposed to hunt light cruisers, not destroyers. I mean, they're no better at that then they are at hunting DDs in their current form for a variety of reasons, but you can at least see the elements that are supposed to let them do so - 6" guns with high AP damage and improved penetration angles, plus 38" hull armor to shatter light cruiser HE. None of this actually matters though, since the big thing coming down the pipe is the commander skill rework they're pushing through despite feedback saying it's absolute garbage at the moment.
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Jan 18, 2021 23:57
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The idea of making a destroyer that hunts light cruisers seems absurd on its face. I don't particularly want to gunfight a minotaur or smolensk in any destroyer you could name, and I'm not even sure what you could give a DD that would make me want to. Even giving it the Stalingrad's ballistics on 6" guns might not be enough.
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Jan 19, 2021 00:21
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wdarkk posted:The idea of making a destroyer that hunts light cruisers seems absurd on its face. I don't particularly want to gunfight a minotaur or smolensk in any destroyer you could name, and I'm not even sure what you could give a DD that would make me want to. Even giving it the Stalingrad's ballistics on 6" guns might not be enough. Kleber is a loving fantastic light cruiser annihilator. You citadel light cruisers out to like 12-14km depending on which one. The problem is these German DDs have absolutely none of Klebers traits
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Jan 19, 2021 00:31
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Shaman Tank Spec posted:6 inchers but the firing angles are absolutely godawful. Among many other problems. I know. It was because the poster above compared them to UK light tanks in WoT which were advertised as having "battleship guns" (they didn't of course, only the T10 had a somewhat large gun while the rest of the line was average sized or, mostly, below). But thankyou for answering! So in other news, today I earned 2 containers. I picked More resources for both. First one? Supercontainer: 15k coal. Second one: 3 * 400 coal 
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Jan 19, 2021 04:11
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Lord Koth posted:
Tbh I am looking forward to it. My biggest gripe is the new Deadeye skill because the last thing the game needs is encouraging BBs to sit back and snipe from 20km. But aside from that I have no complaints (yet).
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Jan 19, 2021 09:58
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 This TX DD sure looks good. Halborn fucked around with this message at 12:46 on Jan 19, 2021 |
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Jan 19, 2021 10:21
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Halborn posted:
Yikes.
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Jan 19, 2021 11:32
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Halborn posted:
Hahaha
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Jan 19, 2021 12:04
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Just for fun's sake, what hidden feature or 1 addition could they make to these new German DDs to make them playable? eg if the torps had a 0.5km spotting distance, would they (the ships) still be useless?
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Jan 19, 2021 16:01
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kaesarsosei posted:Just for fun's sake, what hidden feature or 1 addition could they make to these new German DDs to make them playable? eg if the torps had a 0.5km spotting distance, would they (the ships) still be useless? Torps are basically bad as something to build around/rely on. Like sometimes they work well, sometimes they work amazingly well, but there's always a healthy dose of luck involved with them, even fast torps with good detection. Consistent damage and consistent impact comes from something that can hit consistently, which is guns. The problem these DDs have right now is that they have no really good way of disengaging or mitigating damage. No smoke, poor speed, poor rudder even, and on top of that they don't do overwhelming damage to really anything (other than probably themselves, with their 38mm hull plate you'll probably sink a lot of fat AP salvos into one) So, really they need more speed, better pen angles, better rate of fire... some combination of those things.
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Jan 19, 2021 16:42
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Instead they're going to get like 500 more HP and 0,1 sec shaved off their reload time and then pushed out to sink.
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Jan 19, 2021 16:45
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kaesarsosei posted:Just for fun's sake, what hidden feature or 1 addition could they make to these new German DDs to make them playable? eg if the torps had a 0.5km spotting distance, would they (the ships) still be useless? Yes, even if you want a torpedo boat their torpedoes are bad. They might be ok if they had battleship penetration on the AP, I guess.
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Jan 19, 2021 17:29
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Shaman Tank Spec posted:Instead they're going to get like 500 more HP and 0,1 sec shaved off their reload time and then pushed out to sink. Not necessarily, even the more underwhelming line theyve released recently (British CAs) are decent at what they're supposed to do and at the high end of the tree have a role and do a lot of damage (Goliath was probably the most impactful cruiser last clan battles season). They don't really tend to release a tech tree line that is just completely horrid/nobody will want to grind at all. If these go into testing and they are top to bottom, at all skill levels of tester atrocious they will make big changes.
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Jan 19, 2021 17:38
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Ooof the patch is hitting. Time to respec my GK captain and see if the ships any good.
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Jan 19, 2021 18:11
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Weegee: “Hey, what if we made a DD that would arm MvR AP rockets?”
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Jan 19, 2021 19:01
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Preechr posted:Weegee: “Hey, what if we made a DD that would arm MvR AP rockets?” I mean, Gearing and Khaba both have armor, but it's very easy in a DD to angle to MVR rockets
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Jan 19, 2021 19:31
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kaesarsosei posted:Just for fun's sake, what hidden feature or 1 addition could they make to these new German DDs to make them playable? eg if the torps had a 0.5km spotting distance, would they (the ships) still be useless? Undetectable by air would be my first thought. they would still suck, but suck less.
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Jan 19, 2021 19:58
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ranbo das posted:Undetectable by air would be my first thought. they would still suck, but suck less. True, I would play a tier 7 ship in tier 10 matches all day if it meant no CVs so I guess a tier 7 DD that gets tier 10 matchmaking in exchange for being immune to CVs would be a good trade.
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Jan 19, 2021 21:07
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toadee posted:I mean, Gearing and Khaba both have armor, but it's very easy in a DD to angle to MVR rockets In a DD that has the turning radius of a battleship?
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Jan 19, 2021 22:28
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Dammit, I cannot figure out how to play RN CLs correctly. I feel like the instant I get spotted I get focused and died, but if I hide or don't shot to avoid getting spotted I'm not actually doing anything. I feel better off playing a DD. Maybe the problem is I'm only in the Leander (getting close to Fiji), but it feels like I'm wasting my time playing that line vs. either a DD line or almost any other cruiser line.
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Jan 20, 2021 01:09
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Mr.Unique-Name posted:Dammit, I cannot figure out how to play RN CLs correctly. I feel like the instant I get spotted I get focused and died, but if I hide or don't shot to avoid getting spotted I'm not actually doing anything. I feel better off playing a DD. Maybe the problem is I'm only in the Leander (getting close to Fiji), but it feels like I'm wasting my time playing that line vs. either a DD line or almost any other cruiser line. Fiji is widely considered the best ship at tier 7. That said I'm still just as terrible as you. My favorite move is to start deploying smoke while turning broadside but still going too fast so I eat a dev strike. It's a big  moment!
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Jan 20, 2021 01:31
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Getting spotted while slowing down but before disappearing is a death sentence at higher tiers. You need to be able to predict when you need to smoke and do it completely undetected. And obviously from T8 upwards radar will be prevelant in nearly every match.
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Jan 20, 2021 08:50
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RN CL have very slow deceleration so you need to get used to smoking up later as to not risk sailing out of your smoke. It might be worth investing in larger smoke puffs aswell. You also eat citadels from most angles. I can pretty much only play them by camping islands and sitting in smoke. I pretty much only sail in the open when I see an exposed DD I might be able to rush down.
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Jan 20, 2021 13:13
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Its irrelevant from today/tomorrow but I had a Dunkirk captain on my Fiji (witj Improved Smokescreen) and this let me put the engine to full stop and hit smoke right away and still just about stop in time. Otherwise I think you needed to be at less than 3/4 speed. It's kinda weird they are removing that skill - yes it was nearly useless (although in the above specific case decent especially on RN CLs which have a lot of spare skill points) but why not keep it in? And as I understand it, the Dunkirks get no replacement skill bonus.
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Jan 20, 2021 14:19
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So are there recommended builds up for things yet?
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Jan 21, 2021 01:28
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Dunno but the random loving skills they give you are insane. My Stealth/RPF Neptune captain had RPF removed and the four point secondary battery skill added. Edit, also the bullshit of having the captain be specced for four different ship types but only being specialized in one is loving stupid. There isn't a way to be specced for one tech tree dd, one tech tree CA, BB, etc, is there? Blindeye fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Jan 21, 2021 |
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Jan 21, 2021 02:31
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