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currently i've decided to just learn smiths songs and butt my head up against those, because johnny marr is one of the few guitar heroes who i actually totally love and think is also a great melodist... if i had a little more of that in my style i wouldn't complain. so it seems like that's a good place to focus to pick up some technique at the moment
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Jun 1, 2022 23:43
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i almost poo poo my rear end out when i found out Johnny Marr was in Modest Mouse for a while
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Jun 2, 2022 00:26
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Got the Helix and it's cool but the presets and the one I made with the 5150/tube screamer honestly didn't sound super great. In fact almost all the high gain presets sounded pretty similar. Need to learn about it, play with it, however it could be how I connected it through my interface with direct monitoring. I reckon I'll just try using the Helix as it's own interface with my monitors plugged into the Helix to avoid any issues with that for now while I learn how to make good presets. However I'd need to leave it on a lot, since that's how I would be getting sound on my PC. Do you guys think this would be a problem? eventually I'll get the Helix it's own powercab or something and go back to my interface as my PC's soundcard but that would be a month or two. e: One big pro, is playing through the Helix doesn't seem to pick up near as much interference as playing through my plug ins so I'm happy about that. Drunk Driver Dad fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 00:35
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landgrabber posted:currently i've decided to just learn smiths songs and butt my head up against those, because johnny marr is one of the few guitar heroes who i actually totally love and think is also a great melodist... if i had a little more of that in my style i wouldn't complain. I had to write five guitarists who inspire me for some list for my guitar teacher the other day and it was like four metal guys and Johnny Marr.
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Jun 2, 2022 00:45
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the number one suggestion i've heard about the modeler sim fancysetups like the Helix is: turn the loving gain down. Like you can pull the knob back on the COWBOYS FROM HELL patch from 9 to like 5.5 and it's still god drat metal, but you are actually getting some tone and dynamics through. My mindset shifted when i was getting into Gojira's tone and was all "do i need a baritone custom and a 90000 db high gain amp for this" and somebody advised "uh he just plays a tele in d standard with .010's and its through like a jcm800 or something"
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Jun 2, 2022 00:54
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Jun 2, 2022 00:59
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Jonny 290 posted:the number one suggestion i've heard about the modeler sim fancysetups like the Helix is: turn the loving gain down. Like you can pull the knob back on the COWBOYS FROM HELL patch from 9 to like 5.5 and it's still god drat metal, but you are actually getting some tone and dynamics through. My mindset shifted when i was getting into Gojira's tone and was all "do i need a baritone custom and a 90000 db high gain amp for this" and somebody advised "uh he just plays a tele in d standard with .010's and its through like a jcm800 or something" Helix is plugged up as it's own interface now. I'm aware of the gain, I used plug ins exclusively until the Helix. As of right now, if I had to explain it, the helix sounds like it's lacking "balls" for lack of a better term, with the highs being weird and scratchy. I'm going to watch some videos and fiddle a while before I get more in depth posting about it. There's a lot of stuff to adjust. Taking the high cut on the cab section all the way down to like 7k helped a lot, but that's a bit extreme compared to what I'd mess with in the plug ins. I'm mostly wondering right now if there is anything in the global/hardware settings that needs to be adjusted, stuff like the gain and instrument/line levels you'd adjust on an interface before I start messing with the actual modeling.
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Jun 2, 2022 01:35
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most of metal is chord voicings/technique
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Jun 2, 2022 02:08
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landgrabber posted:most of metal is chord voicings/technique hmmmmmm you may wanna like not talk unless you can back it up dudearino
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Jun 2, 2022 02:15
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Jonny 290 posted:the number one suggestion i've heard about the modeler sim fancysetups like the Helix is: turn the loving gain down. Like you can pull the knob back on the COWBOYS FROM HELL patch from 9 to like 5.5 and it's still god drat metal, but you are actually getting some tone and dynamics through. My mindset shifted when i was getting into Gojira's tone and was all "do i need a baritone custom and a 90000 db high gain amp for this" and somebody advised "uh he just plays a tele in d standard with .010's and its through like a jcm800 or something" I'm reminded again of the story Billy Corgan told about being in the studio with Tony Iommi recording Black Oblivion. Iommi had long been a guitar idol of Corgan's, and he spent years and probably thousands and thousands of dollars chasing that tone, trying to get more gain. Here was his chance, while Tony was tracking guitar. Billy went into the live room to scope out his rig, and he was just plugging straight into the amp and the gain was at like 6. It's all in the fingers (or lack thereof).
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Jun 2, 2022 02:27
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Baron von Eevl posted:I'm reminded again of the story Billy Corgan told about being in the studio with Tony Iommi recording Black Oblivion. Iommi had long been a guitar idol of Corgan's, and he spent years and probably thousands and thousands of dollars chasing that tone, trying to get more gain. Here was his chance, while Tony was tracking guitar. Billy went into the live room to scope out his rig, and he was just plugging straight into the amp and the gain was at like 6. Theres a gear rundown video with Pallbearer and they keep saying "yeah man, we use a lot less gain than you would think, like, a lot less" and both guitar players have dual amp setups each, running one with distortion and the other running nearly clean. I think Brett was using a JC-120 for one of them iirc.
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Jun 2, 2022 02:52
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That's a thing. I know Josh Homme has said the one thing that people trying to copy his tone consistently get wrong is too much gain. He usually just uses a little crunch but runs through a ton of different amps so it's a big full sound.
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Jun 2, 2022 03:28
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Doesn't dual/quad tracking also make it sound more "gainier" without having to crank it up so much as well?
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Jun 2, 2022 03:29
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muike posted:i almost poo poo my rear end out when i found out Johnny Marr was in Modest Mouse for a while saw that version of the band play live with REM + the National in 2008 at Madison Square Garden Johnny came out during the end of REM’s set and played a bunch of fan-favorite songs with them 
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Jun 2, 2022 03:32
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Drunk Driver Dad posted:Doesn't dual/quad tracking also make it sound more "gainier" without having to crank it up so much as well? omg yes it does the whole reason that Heartwork sounds the way it does is because of quad tracking
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Jun 2, 2022 03:39
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Baron von Eevl posted:That's a thing. I know Josh Homme has said the one thing that people trying to copy his tone consistently get wrong is too much gain. He usually just uses a little crunch but runs through a ton of different amps so it's a big full sound. I've found if you wanna get the higher gain (but not actually that high gain) QOTSA sound run a fuzz into a really mids-y pedal like a tube screamer or marshall-ish distortion both at like half heat then turn the volume on your guitar way down to like 2ish until it barely has enough hair on it to have good sustain. The scragglier tones on like no one knows are super low gain but like 5 different mics recording 2-3 amps all at once. I put a stupid amount of time into getting some of those to sound right but so has a lot of people
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Jun 2, 2022 03:57
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I feel like chasing that sort of thing - mimicking several different mics on several different amps in different spatial arrangements - is kind of a lost cause. It's good to experiment with that to see how it affects the finished recording and how you can manipulate things, but doing it in the service of duplicating someone else'svery specific sound brings up way too many variables that it becomes hopeless, and all so you can get maybe the second-best version of a sound against the original.
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Jun 2, 2022 04:34
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Drunk Driver Dad posted:Helix is plugged up as it's own interface now. I'm aware of the gain, I used plug ins exclusively until the Helix. As of right now, if I had to explain it, the helix sounds like it's lacking "balls" for lack of a better term, with the highs being weird and scratchy.
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Jun 2, 2022 04:40
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landgrabber posted:most of metal is chord voicings/technique heeeeeere we go
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Jun 2, 2022 05:49
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Spanish Manlove posted:omg yes it does I watched a cool video about that album and I think they also used a little practice amp for some of the tone
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Jun 2, 2022 05:51
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one of my favourite metal artists is devin townsend, a real humble dude who fully admits he's not a technical guitar wizard and just likes neat prog chords and stuff so he plays primarily in open C through a cranked recto while switching between operatic vocals and screaming, both to whatever weird lyrics pop into his head and he remembers to write dwon
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Jun 2, 2022 07:25
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More tracks with less gain. Gain increases crunch, but you also lose definition, and therefore impact. It's a fun balancing act.
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Jun 2, 2022 07:47
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Open C tuning is really fun but I can't use it without sounding like Devin after a few minutes
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Jun 2, 2022 08:51
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Siivola posted:Did it fix the booming bass you were having previously? Interestingly yes, it was way less boomy compared to plug-ins. Although it still seemed a little muddy at the time. When I went to bed I had a preset going with a Revv amp that was getting much more in the ball park of sounding pretty decent though. I found a few videos on youtube I bookmarked with some stuff to try out later today when I get home.
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Jun 2, 2022 10:29
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That's fascinating, I wonder what caused it.
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Jun 2, 2022 10:51
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With metal guitar the cab sound matters a lot and the helix stock cabs are not all that great - although that appears like its being overhauled in the next update. The XXL cab I like because it sounds like an Orange oversized. Also the horizon drive is real good for that sound. Also do not be afraid to mess with the hi pass/lo pass on the cab or IR block to quite extreme settings because its a quite gentle rolloff youre not actually losing everything beyond it entirely. (-6bd or -12db I think) massive spider fucked around with this message at 11:58 on Jun 2, 2022 |
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Jun 2, 2022 11:56
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I've been very piano-y lately, but I'm aiming to get back into open mics at my local cafe and their piano sucks balls so I'm back into the guitar practice. So, hey everyone, and please hold me parasocially accountable for learning songs
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Jun 2, 2022 14:17
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Accidental NGD. Dad got it in a trade and asked me to try and sell it but I think I'm just going to buy it instead, if he'll let me (rather than just tell me to keep it). An Epiphone "Plus Top" lemon burst from, I THINK 2008. The production code on it is from October 2007, but they didn't do Lemon Burst in 2007. I can't find a 2008 Epi catalog, so just going on assumption. A few dents and dings and a little fret wear. The guy got it a couple of years ago, put Seymour Duncan '59s and a 50s wiring setup in it, then said he just never found the mojo. Well, turns out someone had put a new Tusq nut on it and never adjusted it. The action on the first fret and the action at the 15th were BOTH about 3/64. Wildly high. After cutting it down properly ... plenty of mojo. I've never considered myself a Les Paul guy but I can't put this one down for some reason. Just REALLY clicks with me. It's got me looking at my other 2 in the rack and wondering like, "what do you even do for me now?"
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Jun 2, 2022 16:18
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Nice, always liked the Lemon Burst. Also not a Les Paul guy, but I keep buying them. 2 Firefly, 2 Harmony, 2 Lotus, a Chibson, and now a Hondo I actually plan on keeping.  Ash body & top, set neck, factory USA DiMarzios, set neck, exactly 8 pounds, and about 42 years old. Made around the time Samick/Hondo was working with Japanese manufacturers to improve their quality. It shows,
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Jun 2, 2022 17:47
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Holy gently caress that's pretty. According to my sweetwater rep, if we channel enough NGE in one place we can rip open a vortex to the netherrealm 
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Jun 2, 2022 18:07
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finished up my first song for this 2 week songwriting workshop: https://vocaroo.com/1gCkog5Cqf2D i don't know where this style comes from, i don't listen to music like this really. just happens!
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Jun 2, 2022 18:27
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This is very impressive. Beautiful resolutions in your guitar harmony. Love your vibrato and voice control, too. I will go out on a limb and say I am confident in your talent specifically because you selectively apply vibrato at the ends of your vocal phrases in a way that requires a performer to be very actively listening to themselves singing. To some people it comes naturally and in my experience the folks who can do that can do it because they are apt. Others just never get it. You have it. I know how stupid that sounds but I promise I mean it in the best way. You demonstrate a very deep appreciation for music with a complex piece like this. This song is begging for vocal harmonies. 
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Jun 2, 2022 19:10
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a.p. dent posted:finished up my first song for this 2 week songwriting workshop: https://vocaroo.com/1gCkog5Cqf2D sounds good, very pretty singing voice and i like the guitar playing (except for the percussive part at 10s, which (to my ears) had too much high frequency content. Maybe from your nails? Maybe striking without your nails would make it sound better to me?) Can we talk about the Ab at 1m45s (and again shortly after)? Were you thinking about giving an augmented 5th chord tone for the C dominant chord, or were you thinking about a minor 3rd for the key of F major? It feels like you were looking to make some dissonance there, and i wonder what other options you might have considered.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:17
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Dr. Faustus posted:This is very impressive. Beautiful resolutions in your guitar harmony. Love your vibrato and voice control, too. I will go out on a limb and say I am confident in your talent specifically because you selectively apply vibrato at the ends of your vocal phrases in a way that requires a performer to be very actively listening to themselves singing. To some people it comes naturally and in my experience the folks who can do that can do it because they are apt. Others just never get it. You have it. thank you for the very kind words! i'm not really using vibrato intentionally - i think this is just at the edge of my vocal range and i need to push to get up there (i'm always writing songs in stupid keys for my voice). and yeah, i would love to play this with a full band and see what we could do with different arrangements. Helianthus Annuus posted:sounds good, very pretty singing voice and i like the guitar playing (except for the percussive part at 10s, which (to my ears) had too much high frequency content. Maybe from your nails? Maybe striking without your nails would make it sound better to me?) good point about the percussion, it was my nail. i don't even know if it's necessary but i left it in for the class assignment i was thinking of that note as a G#, creating a dominant Caug. didn't really consider anything else, but i'm sure any number of others would work - b5, #11, b9. might play around with it. forgot to note that i didn't do it on purpose but this is the landgrabber special: uses the iii chord in the verse, and the melody climaxes with a major 7th!
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Jun 2, 2022 19:29
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a.p. dent posted:finished up my first song for this 2 week songwriting workshop: https://vocaroo.com/1gCkog5Cqf2D Nice work, I got postal service vibes from your voice. I really liked the guitar playing and chord choice as well. Its funny how we might like certain types of music but when tasked with writing a song, its tricky to know where its going to end up for a multitude of reasons.
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Jun 2, 2022 19:34
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a.p. dent posted:good point about the percussion, it was my nail. i don't even know if it's necessary but i left it in for the class assignment i agree with doctor faustus's assessment -- this is better than the stuff i come up with. inspiring! i hope you don't mind me picking at that G# -- i think you like this kind of posting from me, but maybe not all the time. lmk... You didn't play the G# at 1m36s, so it sounds like a mistake the first time I hear it at 1m45s! And when you repeated the G# again, the vibe i got was "i meant to do that (or did i?)". In hindsight, i think you were trying to convey a growing dissonance, but that's not quite how it hit my ears in the moment. I wonder if including the G# at 1m36s would set it up for that, since I would hear it all 3 times, instead of just twice?
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Jun 2, 2022 19:45
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Helianthus Annuus posted:i agree with doctor faustus's assessment -- this is better than the stuff i come up with. inspiring! interesting, yeah. i could go either way, playing it all 3 times or waiting until the final crescendo. i'm leaning toward the latter. it has a nice effect coming in after the vocals and leading back into the verse
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Jun 2, 2022 20:13
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massive spider posted:With metal guitar the cab sound matters a lot and the helix stock cabs are not all that great - although that appears like its being overhauled in the next update. Yeah I was watching some videos and every tone I heard that I liked, they were using their own IRs. I was going to go with ML Soundlabs Oversized since it's what the guy used in one video, but are there any other IR packs I should look at? Is Jen Boogers stuff particularly good or just marketed well?
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Jun 2, 2022 22:18
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landgrabber posted:most of metal is chord voicings/technique to be fair i think this applies to like every genre the point i was trying to make is that you could probably get a metal sound out of like, a les paul and a JCM800 if you played with the right technique/inversions/tuning to get everything below and aggressive sounding. likewise, even if you had a really pointy guitar and a triple rec with the scoopiest tone, it will still probably sound like blink-182 if you just play power chords. i thought i was actually being very fair because i was thinking that voicings and technique are the main way rock genres are differentiated from each other — there’s a lot of crunchy guitar music out there using all roughly the same gear, and arrangement/textural decisions/playing style is what makes them different from each other.
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Jun 2, 2022 22:33
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That's true but there are exceptions, some sounds will kind of by necessity push you in a direction. If you tune down to drop-A and run through an FZ2 or SF300 you're gonna sound like Electric Wizard on Dopethrone, there's no way around that.
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Jun 2, 2022 22:41
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