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Putting the P in PM.
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Aug 18, 2023 17:13
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 06:31 |
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When I was job hunting a couple years ago I got deep into the interview process with AWS and a bank here in LA. AWS was something like 2-4 calls with screener, recruiter, a couple other people, an interview day prep call and then a full day remote interview which consisted of 5-6 separate interviews, a portfolio review with a panel, and then a design exercise. The design exercise was at the end of the day and I think that sunk me because I was fried after interviewing all loving day. Total calls must have been approaching 10? This was for a Senior UX Designer position. The bank was a call with the recruiter, two calls with the manager, one call with the team, another call with the manager, a group interview with bank leadership. Total calls was 6. They never bothered to tell me I didn't get the job. This was for a UX manager position.
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Aug 18, 2023 17:14
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Trabant posted:"I'm very interested in this position. Also, I'm extremely interested in seeing your office bathrooms within the next 30 seconds." You're going to poo poo there a lot, it's a good thing to check. Do they cheap out on the TP? Do they have infuriating motion sensors for the lights and faucets?
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Aug 18, 2023 17:19
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covering my camera during a teams interview so i can bring my laptop to the bathroom and take a poo poo while they ask me about my synergies
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Aug 18, 2023 17:22
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Awkward Davies posted:When I was job hunting a couple years ago I got deep into the interview process with AWS and a bank here in LA. Amazon put the technical one at the end of the day for me too! Same deal with being completely wiped at that point after 6 hours of bullshitting through all their "talk us through an example of how you demonstrated one of our 30+ core principles". Couldn't talk straight let along think anymore. Apparently not being a "bar raiser" (gotta demonstrate above the team average skills) was what did me in. Never mind my long track record of coming up to speed quickly on whatever the hell I need to learn. Too old, too slow, whatever, gently caress off.
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Aug 18, 2023 17:43
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Baddog posted:Amazon put the technical one at the end of the day for me too! Same deal with being completely wiped at that point after 6 hours of bullshitting through all their "talk us through an example of how you demonstrated one of our 30+ core principles". Couldn't talk straight let along think anymore. Apparently not being a "bar raiser" (gotta demonstrate above the team average skills) was what did me in. Never mind my long track record of coming up to speed quickly on whatever the hell I need to learn. Too old, too slow, whatever, gently caress off. From what I hear we both dodged a bullet, but drat the comp was good with those sweet sweet RSUs.
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Aug 18, 2023 17:46
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Cacafuego posted:I’ve been in pharma for >10 years and between 5-7 jobs I have never done more than 2 interviews. Seriously? Only 2? I don't think I've ever had that few. Lemme think... NSLIJ - 4 (for an internship at that) Covance - 3 rounds of phone screenings, then 8 hours of interviews in-person. Not sure how many were involved because they also had more people connecting to listen in over telecon. I think most were 1-hr slots, though, so at least 8 interviews. (I rejected offer) US Genomics - Interviews ran from 8AM-3PM plus a lunch interview. I forget how many, but there were a lot. (They rejected me) Harvard - 5 rounds of phone screenings, then in-person for 3 more rounds. (I rejected offer) Pfizer - 2 rounds of phone screenings, then a half day of probably 6 people. No lunch provided. Gilead - 2 phone screenings, nothing beyond that. (Rejected me) Novartis - 3 rounds of phone screenings, then a full day of 6-8 interviews. Most were hour-long. (I rejected with extreme prejudice) Lilly - 2 rounds of phone screenings, then a full day of probably 10-12 interviews. J&J - 4 rounds of phone screenings, then a half-day of interviews. I think it was 4 on-site interviews, including the HR person. GNE - 2 rounds of phone screenings, then a full day of interviews + presentation + lunch + dinner. Total day ran about 12 hours start-to-finish, easily 15-20 people interviewed me once meal interviews were involved, plus there were ~30 people at my presentation.
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Aug 18, 2023 17:48
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That much interviewing is pure 
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Aug 18, 2023 17:55
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Eric the Mauve posted:That much interviewing is pure reading this as "pure emotional intelligence"
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Aug 18, 2023 17:58
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teemolover42069 posted:covering my camera during a teams interview so i can bring my laptop to the bathroom and take a poo poo while they ask me about my synergies "Can you give me an example of multitasking?"
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Aug 18, 2023 18:32
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Speaking for my current company's approach, the number of interviews is because they sort of take this semi-democratic approach to hiring and want everyone to have input. The candidate's schedule was basically this... First: Phone screening with me, decided to bring him in for half-day. Interview Day: 1) My manager, 30 min 2) My boss's boss, 30 min 3) A formulator/Researcher they'd have to work with regularly: 30 min 4) Lead floor engineer who would interact with him regularly: 30 min 5) Two other floor operators he'd be on the team with: 30 min together 6) Project engineer who he would have to support during production or qualification work: 30 min. 7) Lunch with three other floor operators, 30-40 min. 8) Closeout 15-30 min with me again over telecon (because I have COVID), mainly for him to ask any questions he has after the interviews. (No new questions from me at this point.) Then I get feedback and a HIRE/NO HIRE vote from everyone in the group who interviewed him. I technically have the authority to overrule them, but given the people who had issues were the people who'd have to work with him on a day-to-day basis (even the lead floor engineer, for whom this candidate isn't competition), I'm not going to overrule them. It's an inefficient and overbearing way of doing interviews, but that's the interview culture here. 
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Aug 18, 2023 18:38
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Put in short notice PTO after a 12 day grind and some doozy emails received before 8am this morning. Too bad the system won’t accept “gently caress It Friday” as a PTO code, but my team was cool with it.
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Aug 18, 2023 19:05
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Sundae posted:Seriously? Only 2? I don't think I've ever had that few. Lemme think... lmao Powerful Two-Hander posted:"Can you give me an example of multitasking?" This seems more like "multi asking"
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Aug 18, 2023 19:18
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My Amazon interviewing was also very long, an evening call plus a full day of technical interviews. In the end I didn’t get an offer from that group but another group just sent me an offer instead. I guess if you are at a certain level of doing ok at an interview this is a thing so they don’t need to redo much other than a quick chat with a different manager. Anyway that kind of fell through because the hiring manager didn’t seem aware it was a cross border thing etcetc so there was some miscommunication. Overall not regretting missing out amazon from what I’ve heard about it. Being a close #2 to getting a dream job at microsoft was more of a bummer  The hiring manager at MS was really excellent though and seemed sincere about that I did really well, and encouraging for my future career growth. Really great experience interviewing there overall.
priznat fucked around with this message at 19:55 on Aug 18, 2023 |
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Aug 18, 2023 19:52
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priznat posted:.... but another group just sent me an offer instead. I guess if you are at a certain level of doing ok at an interview this is a thing so they don’t need to redo much other than a quick chat with a different manager. That was nice in principle, but I got bounced around *several* of their recruiters afterwards who didn't seem to know wtf. Including a cross border thing like you mentioned. "This seems like a good fit and Vancouver actually sounds pretty cool, I'd be open to a move. What do I need to get going to work there as an American?". "oh poo poo uhh yah my bad this was supposed to be Canadians only".
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Aug 18, 2023 20:08
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Baddog posted:That was nice in principle, but I got bounced around *several* of their recruiters afterwards who didn't seem to know wtf. Including a cross border thing like you mentioned. Lol mine was the opposite. I was under the impression that I would be in vancouver working remotely and occasionally come down to seattle but the new job was like no it’s gotta be on the US side. So welp. Worked out for the best anyway because it was around this time that the big incumbent in town was shedding people like crazy so a lot of companies started satellite offices to scoop em up.
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Aug 18, 2023 20:25
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drat yall should have swapped or something
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Aug 18, 2023 20:38
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Sham green card weddings for all!!
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Aug 18, 2023 20:46
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 priznat posted:Sham green card weddings for all!! Being already married, I'm basically trying to figure out which ex-  republic's citizenship I can qualify for and get the fastest path to being able to work in the EU if/when the US turns into Republic of Gilead.
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Aug 18, 2023 20:52
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I applied for a job that I think wanted a top secret clearance and one of the questions was if I had dual citizenship and if I was willing to give it up. There probably exists a job where I would give it up, but that one wasn’t it
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Aug 18, 2023 21:02
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If I show up to the first interview and the interviewer hasn’t researched my background and career, they’re obviously not interested enough in hiring me.
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Aug 18, 2023 23:57
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Sounds like Meta is joining Amazon in being extreme hardasses about RTO, yeesh. https://ca.news.yahoo.com/metas-updated-rto-mandate-strict-210349371.html I don’t get it, but then I’m not a megalomaniac weirdo.
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Aug 19, 2023 01:55
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It's all about empires.
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Aug 19, 2023 02:21
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Corporate goals: "You need to make twice the drugs at half the cost, and also with half the carbon footprint, and also hiring is frozen."
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Aug 19, 2023 04:52
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Having joined this company during COVID and had my first year+ full remote . . . I feel like this isn't all that hard. Does the company have a culture where people answer their loving IMs/calls in a timely fashion, and are people willing to hop on a screenshare and share what they know? If yes: remote will work just fine. Potentially even better than in-person because screenshare is loving busted good if you do it right. If no: sorry your culture sucks, I hope all your employees find better jobs soon! I have a hard time parsing "remote work doesn't work!" as anything other than "our culture demonstrates that teamwork is a waste of time" at this point. I mean, yeah, some jobs DO need to be in person, but I don't trust Jamie Dimon to be the arbiter of that.
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Aug 19, 2023 05:10
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Zarin posted:Having joined this company during COVID and had my first year+ full remote . . . I feel like this isn't all that hard. I'm in the same boat, down to the hire on timeline and everything. This company had the best on boarding experience, by far, and I've learned more here than probably all of my previous jobs combined. I agree with everything you said.
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Aug 19, 2023 05:21
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Eric the Mauve posted:That much interviewing is pure Maybe, but it also gives you more data points. It's easier to bamboozle one person than six people, and you can actually get into their direct skills. It's also very useful to discover things like "huh, all of the women interviewing him found him dismissive and lovely, while he was very eager and charming to all the men, perhaps this person has an issue working with women and we should not hire them despite otherwise acceptable technical performance."
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Aug 19, 2023 12:26
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Zarin posted:Having joined this company during COVID and had my first year+ full remote . . . I feel like this isn't all that hard. The remote work pushback has to be bullshit. I’m required to be in office but nothing has changed in how I work because my team is spread across different states. I have zero face to face interaction with anyone even though I’m in a cubicle three days a week. I asked if I could get an exception to the RTO initiative but was told no, and now they’re even making fully remote employees go into the nearest office. At this point it has to just be a way to cut headcount without layoffs.
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Aug 19, 2023 13:22
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The last two days I was in the office - a satellite regional location used by a completely different branch of the org - I was alone. As in, I turned off the alarm, turned on the coffee maker, and reverted everything when I left. But yeah we totally need that office space. For collaboration.
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Aug 19, 2023 13:29
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Just quoting myself on this since the epiphany I had a couple months ago:Eric the Mauve posted:That's exactly what executives everywhere are thinking and doing, though. A person in Indonesia can work remotely for $3/hr so why would I pay a person in the U.S. to work remotely for $30/hr? That's what it's all about. Money is not actually the #1 most important thing to these sociopaths. Status is. (Money is a huge determiner of status of course, but it's more about how much you spend than how much you have.)
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Aug 19, 2023 14:44
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priznat posted:Sounds like Meta is joining Amazon in being extreme hardasses about RTO, yeesh. I'd guess neither have hit their attrition targets yet. And what Eric said.
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Aug 19, 2023 15:24
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Motronic posted:I'd guess neither have hit their attrition targets yet. And what Eric said. Yeah most likely, and yet ironically meta has been trying to rehire people it laid off in the previous round. I wonder if it is to get more of a 6mo-1yr knowledge dump then lay off again after finding it was too hasty and too many groups dead in the water.
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Aug 19, 2023 17:07
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It's always been about sending the message because they were all getting too comfortable and it's not good for business for Labor to start to get Ideas.
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Aug 19, 2023 17:15
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priznat posted:Yeah most likely, and yet ironically meta has been trying to rehire people it laid off in the previous round. I wonder if it is to get more of a 6mo-1yr knowledge dump then lay off again after finding it was too hasty and too many groups dead in the water. A lot of layoffs are chaotic and done on spreadsheets by people who are so far removed from front line engineers that they don't know what they do how they do it or if they're needed. Then there is a shuffle to get the people back who had the institutional knowledge/tribal knowledge that didn't get written down or the people who actually did the work that got wrongly caught up in the layoff. I really don't understand what kind of person would actually go back. Of go back and put in any sort of effort now that they know exactly how valued they are by most of the company - the part with the actual firing ability.
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Aug 19, 2023 18:26
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Motronic posted:A lot of layoffs are chaotic and done on spreadsheets by people who are so far removed from front line engineers that they don't know what they do how they do it or if they're needed. Then there is a shuffle to get the people back who had the institutional knowledge/tribal knowledge that didn't get written down or the people who actually did the work that got wrongly caught up in the layoff. If you haven’t found anything else yet going back makes sense to me. Job hunt and collect a salary and then move on.
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Aug 19, 2023 18:29
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Motronic posted:A lot of layoffs are chaotic and done on spreadsheets by people who are so far removed from front line engineers that they don't know what they do how they do it or if they're needed. Then there is a shuffle to get the people back who had the institutional knowledge/tribal knowledge that didn't get written down or the people who actually did the work that got wrongly caught up in the layoff. Yeah the only reason I could see to go back would be to just get some pay while job hunting elsewhere, and perhaps paper over the layoff on the resume as something that didn’t happen. Treat it like a contract job, really.
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Aug 19, 2023 18:31
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Oh I could see myself going back in that situation, in the right circumstances. Which are defined by the great philosopher Charles Barkley when he said: "I sat down with the Rockets and I said 'Yeah, I'm gonna retire.' And they said, 'Well, we'll give you $7 million.' And I said, 'You got a pen on you?'"
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Aug 19, 2023 18:41
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lol yeah, I mean.....I'm talking about offers that are a reasonable possibility for people who aren't CEOs and sports stars. Sure, go back if you've got nothing else. But at that point you've got to be looking and/or coasting.
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Aug 19, 2023 18:49
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I wonder what the offers are like.. Do they have suspiciously deferred vesting schedules? Same base pay, or less as a real gently caress you? Fascinating.
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Aug 19, 2023 18:55
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priznat posted:I wonder what the offers are like.. Do they have suspiciously deferred vesting schedules? Same base pay, or less as a real gently caress you? Fascinating. I always figured that for tech companies layoff.xls was sorted by the "unvested equity" column. Wonder what the offers look like on getting that back.
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Aug 19, 2023 19:07
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