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Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist
One more. Trying chameleon.

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/HappyUnlawfulGreendarnerdragonfly-mobile.mp4

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tweet my meat
Oct 2, 2013

yospos
Gonna drop the forbidden rat technique. Bonfire ascetic the poo poo out of that first circular room in grave of saints until it's at whatever the max ng+ level is then camp out there chameleoned as the small rat statue that looks kinda like an actual enemy rat. You'll be almost fully concealed by a huge swarm of friendly ng+ buffed rats that look just like you and it's basically impossible to lose once they get staggered even once.

Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist
I just watched that happen on NG+0 while waiting in the same spot. Jfc.

Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist
Can't stop won't stop

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlIt-R-rfhE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TnhnQPLKyxY

Zesty fucked around with this message at 21:30 on Jul 25, 2021

Djeser
Mar 22, 2013


it's crow time again

multijoe posted:

If you want to do twee roleplay stuff you can still do that as an dark spirit, you just can't undermine the central premise of the game

Oh no, god forbid online play in Dark Souls is weird, arbitrary and obtuse

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh
it would suck if someone could join my world and 'help' by killing all the enemies.
all that would mean is I would quit out and rest to respawn all the enemies, and it would be really annoying if they killed something that didn't respawn

Djeser
Mar 22, 2013


it's crow time again

let he who has not popped a tree of s seed of giants cast the first stone

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh
im castin it baby

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea
So is there a good new game build guide? Thinking two swords, dexterity kind of thing.

Doing some googling, it looks like to get the same amount of iframes I had in Dark Souls 1 (13) when dodging I'll need 32 adaptability to go with the 6 attunement I started with, with more iframes being gained at 9, 14, 20, 24 and 32 adaptability. After that it gets weird and maybe I'll get another iframe at 48 adaptability, maybe not. Either way, 16 levels for a single iframe seems a bit steep.

What stats should be focused on first? It looks like the early soft caps are vigor and endurance to 20, vitality to 29, adaptability to 24, and dexterity to 18 to power-stance rapiers. Sound reasonable?

Gort fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Jul 26, 2021

Heithinn Grasida
Mar 28, 2005

...must attack and fall upon them with a gallant bearing and a fearless heart, and, if possible, vanquish and destroy them, even though they have for armour the shells of a certain fish, that they say are harder than diamonds, and in place of swords wield trenchant blades of Damascus steel...

Stats seem reasonable. I would recommend using a rapier and a curved sword offhand instead of two rapiers, since the dual wield moveset adds a lot of versatility to just “poke, poke, poke, poke.” Two-hand the rapier for bosses.

Gort
Aug 18, 2003

Good day what ho cup of tea

Heithinn Grasida posted:

Two-hand the rapier for bosses.

Why's that? Power stance animations take too long or something?

NGDBSS
Dec 30, 2009






Gort posted:

Why's that? Power stance animations take too long or something?
Nah, the 2H thrusting sword moveset is tied for fastest in the game alongside 2H daggers.

Also keep in mind that while DS2 has more stats to keep track of than any other Soulsborne title, the XP curve is different enough that you'll get to level 150-200 by the time you finish the base game + DLC. Don't be afraid to throw levels around if if fills out something useful.

Paracelsus
Apr 6, 2009

bless this post ~kya

Gort posted:

Why's that? Power stance animations take too long or something?

They tend to be somewhat stamina-intensive. Dual rapiers is very strong burst damage, but probably overkill for a lot of regular enemies. Also slashing with a rapier is funny.

Heithinn Grasida
Mar 28, 2005

...must attack and fall upon them with a gallant bearing and a fearless heart, and, if possible, vanquish and destroy them, even though they have for armour the shells of a certain fish, that they say are harder than diamonds, and in place of swords wield trenchant blades of Damascus steel...

Gort posted:

Why's that? Power stance animations take too long or something?

Mostly for the stamina efficiency. The two handed thrusts are very quick and cheap and make it easy to get away after a few jabs while also doing massive damage because of the rapier’s high counter multiplier. The dual-wield moveset with a curved sword is great for versatility, but it’s hard to beat the two-handed moveset against bosses. It’s nice to have a shield in the off hand as backup, too, since it makes some tough fights (ruin sentinels, gargoyles) way easier.

I’ll admit that while I’ve done rapier+curved sword or straight sword many times, I haven’t played much with dual rapiers, so it could be much better than I’m describing.

Frida Call Me
Sep 28, 2001

Boy, you gotta carry that weight
Carry that weight a long time
nah two-handed rapier is fine, dual rapiers is a gimmick. different offhand is good advice

Son of Thunderbeast
Sep 21, 2002
Might make a hammer & sickle powerstancer. No idea what that'll be like, haven't used either of those types of weapons before, should be fun

Horace Kinch
Aug 15, 2007

Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Might make a hammer & sickle powerstancer. No idea what that'll be like, haven't used either of those types of weapons before, should be fun

Commie Souls 2

Rubellavator
Aug 16, 2007

Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Might make a hammer & sickle powerstancer. No idea what that'll be like, haven't used either of those types of weapons before, should be fun

pretty freakin' neat from what i remember

Zesty
Jan 17, 2012

The Great Twist

NGDBSS posted:

Also keep in mind that while DS2 has more stats to keep track of than any other Soulsborne title, the XP curve is different enough that you'll get to level 150-200 by the time you finish the base game + DLC. Don't be afraid to throw levels around if if fills out something useful.

To add to this, I like my builds to be in the PVP meta, which is 120 for DS1 and DS3. But in DS2 the meta is 150. But it's also muddied by soul memory. So yeah, you have a lot of points to play with and stopping exactly where you want to is a little grey anyway.

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔
You'll probably want the Full Moon Sickle for looks. I made a character powerstancing those once because they do look awesome, but be warned: they're utter trash. There's not many outright bad weapons in DS2, but I consider this one, I could not make it work no matter how hard I tried.

Downsides:
- sweet spot needed
- where it is makes no sense considering the model
- in fact, the range is extremely low and you need to go to an extremely weird medium distance to hit the sweet spot
- high reqs, especially for powerstance
- heavy
- slow attacks, making the bleed part worthless
- moveset sucks

Maybe with the hammer as your main weapon, you can make this work for shielding enemies. Overall though you will use the hammer 99% of the time.

Son of Thunderbeast
Sep 21, 2002

Simply Simon posted:

You'll probably want the Full Moon Sickle for looks.

jfc the artificial undead absolutely refuse to drop this. I despawned all of them in the copse and harvest valley wearing my gear and using all my coins and nada. I've resorted to covenant of champions to try and farm this drat sickle :argh:

here's hoping the "complain on the internet" method helps

e: for now at least i've got a very nice +2 craftsman's hammer and 40 str

Son of Thunderbeast fucked around with this message at 17:06 on Jul 28, 2021

Simply Simon
Nov 6, 2010

📡scanning🛰️ for good game 🎮design🦔🦔🦔
Yeah farming two of them for my powerstance build was a nightmare, and then it turned out to be a turd. And I only knew at like SL80 because of the high reqs! Biggest DS2 disappointment, probably.

Son of Thunderbeast
Sep 21, 2002
Good news is I got the sickle! Bad news is the hammer and sickle aren't powerstance compatible lol oh well

Looks cool though!

Guillermus
Dec 28, 2009



Son of Thunderbeast posted:

Good news is I got the sickle! Bad news is the hammer and sickle aren't powerstance compatible lol oh well

Looks cool though!



Yeah, hammer and sickle always end being more of a trouble and you end swapping for anything else. It looks cool in theory but it always end being a bad idea in practice.

Shoehead
Sep 28, 2005

Wassup, Choom?
Ya need sumthin'?
I'm trying to play through all 3 DS games before Elden Ring comes out, just finished DS1 and man this seems so big in comparison. I'm trying to reassess my DS2 reflexes, which are a lot like mine for the first game but slightly different, it's weird!
Never done any of the dlcs in the trilogy, usually because I'd have finished a vanilla playthrough by the time they're out and I'd never get far enough with a new character to enter so I'm looking forward to seeing these 3.

I'm also relistening to Bonfireside chat and watching some old Vaati videos, he seems to have been so up on the game for his early mechanics videos and is kind of sour later on, which is sad. I love this game, lovely cycle and all

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

Shoehead posted:

I'm trying to play through all 3 DS games before Elden Ring comes out, just finished DS1 and man this seems so big in comparison. I'm trying to reassess my DS2 reflexes, which are a lot like mine for the first game but slightly different, it's weird!

DS2's controls were revised in a weird way, but you might also be feeling the low i-frames from starting Agility levels. Just make sure to level Adaptabilty/Attunement and that will smooth out some of the awkwardness.

Shoehead
Sep 28, 2005

Wassup, Choom?
Ya need sumthin'?
Oh yeah I'm a good ways in from my session today and my character is finally starting to feel like a real Dark Souls character thanks to a bucket load of agility. My last ds1 run was a melee/pyro character with a dark wood ring and enough dex to fast cast. I hadn't considered how that would make this game feel by comparison.

Also this is sotfs so I'm still having to deal with the Pursuer fights while I also want to hit last second dodges and poo poo

Son of Thunderbeast
Sep 21, 2002
The Pursuer is DS2's friendly twinkling titanite courier

Djeser
Mar 22, 2013


it's crow time again

love that guy

the purse user

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.
I'l see you.... later

Guillermus
Dec 28, 2009



Nuns with Guns posted:

I'l see you.... later

Happy Souls :3:

raditts
Feb 21, 2001

The Kwanzaa Bot is here to protect me.


Nuns with Guns posted:

DS2's controls were revised in a weird way, but you might also be feeling the low i-frames from starting Agility levels. Just make sure to level Adaptabilty/Attunement and that will smooth out some of the awkwardness.

Just give this to all new DS2 players

Akuma
Sep 11, 2001


My first time through DS2 on 360 id just moved so had no internet at all to look anything up, didn't know about adaptability, never put any points in it, decided to play a caster with a dagger in my off hand and roll through everything.

But by god I did it.

Shoehead
Sep 28, 2005

Wassup, Choom?
Ya need sumthin'?
I'm pretty sure I can take him on any time now and now he's nowhere to be found. I want that twinkling titanite though cos I've got the craftsmans hammer and it kinda rules.

Oh also I've realised I almost always dodge left and apparently that were his curse attack's hotbox is super wide?

Nuns with Guns
Jul 23, 2010

It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

raditts posted:

Just give this to all new DS2 players


I love it

Raylax
Jul 21, 2021

Tshshshshshshshsh
This forum has taught me so many cool little Dark Souls 1-3 things that I was completely unaware of before I joined (like DS2 adaptability), that I'm absolutely gonna end up blowing another hundred plus hours replaying them all this year, so THANKS. I GUESS.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

Shoehead posted:

Oh also I've realised I almost always dodge left and apparently that were his curse attack's hotbox is super wide?

No poo poo? That would explain why that attack was always the bane of my existence.

Now solve the riddle of Sir Alonne's grab attack. :unsmigghh:

Shoehead
Sep 28, 2005

Wassup, Choom?
Ya need sumthin'?

John Murdoch posted:

No poo poo? That would explain why that attack was always the bane of my existence.

Now solve the riddle of Sir Alonne's grab attack. :unsmigghh:

According to the fextralife wiki in any case. Grabs in general seem to have some sort of hitbox to animation mismatch anyway those hippos keep trying to eat my head and I'll be so far back. It could also be that I'm expecting iframes I no longer have.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

VideoGames posted:

Been thinking about DS2 a lot. I have the taks this year of figuring out a top ten list of games played that includes DS1, DS2, DS3, DeS and Sekiro.

DS2 I think is the best of the Dark Souls trilogy. I keep thinking about all three and when I think about my high points, the high points I obtained in DS2 were the highest of the three. I have all these wonderful happy moments that I can recall instantly, fewer with DS3 and very few with DS1. This is not to say I dislike the other two because I love them all so much. It is just so tough to organise 5 of the greatest games ever. Any one of them could have been the game of the year without question. :)

Some of my most favourite things about this one:

- Great club powerstancing.
- Pate.
- Burnt Ivory King, Pursuer, Sinh
- Being invaded for an entire Sunday by the same person and the resulting back and forths we had that included, being taught how to change into items and staging an impromptu prop hunt, battling each other with only shields, being gifted something every time I died and eventually discovering I was being watched on stream and my invader cheering me on as I beat the game.
- The areas of the DLC.
- Esmerelda's bear, seek seek lest.
- Pharros Lockstone mechanics
- Iron Keep and the elevator
- Lucatiel and her whole storyline.
- The overarching idea behind the game and the fear of memory
- Beating the Darklurker.

There is so much about this game I properly adore and the more I think about it, the more I have to place it at the top of the Dark Souls trilogy. :)

I agree with this post from a few pages ago. DS2 is peak Soulsborne to me. I liked it so much that I bought it 3 times - I had it on PS3, then later on PC, then on PC again when SotFS came out. I played all the way through probably a dozen times on PS3 :shrug: It's full of memorable, fantastical moments and the world and environments vibrantly stand out to me. A lot of the criticism I remember was that it was too "high fantasy" or too "bright" but those are two of the things I loved about it, it just felt like much more of a storied and fabled world than anything in any other Soulsborne game. Shrine of Amana, the Dragon Aerie, the Belfry - even these areas that people often refer to as "bad" are memorable to me because they visually told a story better than environments in any other game in the series. They felt grand and overwhelming in a way nothing in DS3 does. Hell, even Things Betwixt is my favorite starting zone from any Souls game - it sets the tone of being in a fairy tale fable version of Dark Souls right away what with being surrounded by giant tree roots and guided by mysterious forest witches. It's also the only Soulsborne game (at least as far as I know) to show the ruin of the world beyond the scope of Humans and humanoid gods - you have other cultures and species on display like the beastmen, the weird belfry dudes, the Giants - the whole thing was much better at portraying the sense of loss and despair that had befallen the world because it showed us that the world was a lot bigger and less human-centric than shown in other games in the series.

Those grand fantasy moments were also my favorite part of DS1 - the Duke's Archives and the crystal caves, the gigantic tree-roots in The Great Hollow and the ruins of a demon civilization. The Souls series shifting away from that into a bunch of mundane grey-and-brown werewolf stuff is one of gaming's biggest disappointments to me :(

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John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.
I like what 2 does with the undead curse. It feels like a really thinly sketched plotpoint in the first game (so much so that 3's DLC then expends a bunch of effort backfilling all the details) but 2 puts it at the front and center for much of its runtime. The Undead Asylum isn't a cheery place by any stretch, but it feels friendly and inviting when you compare it to the Lost Bastille.

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