Wiring Thread: This stupid safety device started alerting that there wasn't safety!

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slap me silly: Nov 1, 2009; Grimey Drawer

kid sinister posted:

the light was on the switch and the fan was always hot

This is exactly how I wired mine. It's far more convenient than having light and fan on the same wall switch. I claim it's more convenient than a double wall switch, even.

# ? May 17, 2010 06:01

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# ? May 23, 2024 19:32

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

I suppose the kitchen should be brought up to code too... Right now I've got 3 circuits in the kitchen:

1. kitchen/breakfast area lights - shared with adjoining rooms
2. kitchen/breakfast area outlets - has 2 GFCIs, one is at the first circuit junction. (apparently the person who installed them didn't know you can daisy chain off them) For some reason, the washer/dryer outlet in the basement is on this circuit too
3. garbage disposal - shared with a random light in the basement

That's it. The oven/range is gas, so no circuit there. The microwave is a countertop model. The dishwasher is one of those portable ones, but I will install a proper one when I redo the kitchen. All existing wiring is 14-2 with ground.

So what do I need to do to bring this kitchen up to code?

Also, one other circuit code question: is it legal for a furnace to share a circuit with an attic fan?

# ? May 17, 2010 18:48

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

Anybody?

# ? May 19, 2010 19:16

Papercut: Aug 24, 2005

I never do residential so take this with a grain of salt, but from my reading:

1. Washer/dryer needs it's own dedicated 20A outlet per 210.11(C)(2).

2. You need all of your kitchen/breakfast area/pantry/dining room outlets (that don't serve fixed equipment like a garbage disposal) to be served by a minimum of two 20A dedicated circuits (can't be shared with any outlets in other parts of the house), per 210.52(B). The refrigerator and gas-fired appliances can be on these circuits.

3. I don't think there's any problem having the disposal and light on the same circuit, but make sure it's properly rated. I think 210.23(A)(2) applies, which would mean the circuit would have to be sized to be minimum double the ampacity of the disposal (because it's fixed equipment shared with a luminaire).

4. No, I think 422.12 requires a dedicated circuit for the furnace.

Edit: That doesn't get into receptacle spacing, which you should also consider if you want to bring it to code.

Papercut fucked around with this message at 22:15 on May 19, 2010

# ? May 19, 2010 21:53

Solaron: Sep 6, 2007; Whatever the reason you're on Mars, I'm glad you're there, and I wish I was with you.

Anyone have any good resources/sites for how to connect a line to a breaker box? I recently had a Mennonite family in the area build a pole barn for me and I wanted to run power to it. We had an additional box installed when we added on a laundry room, so I know we have ample room in the new box.

What wire will I need for running some power tools (mostly table saw, router, etc, but I'd like to be able to plan for welding one day when I learn how).

If I'm missing any info you need let me know! I've called my normal electrician, but I think I'd just rather try it myself (assuming it's not a "never do this without being licensed you idiot" scenario).

# ? Jun 3, 2010 00:05

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

Solaron posted:

Anyone have any good resources/sites for how to connect a line to a breaker box? I recently had a Mennonite family in the area build a pole barn for me and I wanted to run power to it. We had an additional box installed when we added on a laundry room, so I know we have ample room in the new box.

What wire will I need for running some power tools (mostly table saw, router, etc, but I'd like to be able to plan for welding one day when I learn how).

If I'm missing any info you need let me know! I've called my normal electrician, but I think I'd just rather try it myself (assuming it's not a "never do this without being licensed you idiot" scenario).

Easy answer: buy a #10 extension cord and plug it into the closest outlet in your house. Problem solved!

To do this "right" is pretty involved- you'll be adding a new electrical panel in your barn. You'll need to install a double-receptacle in your main house panel; at least a 2-pole 30A breaker (two 30A breakers with a yoke connecting them.) You can go larger if you'd like (60A), but I wouldn't go any smaller than 30A 2-pole if you want lights and a good welder. This would let you put in an electric car charger 5 or 10 years down the road, too.

If you want to go the quick & easy way, you can just run a single 20A circuit and pull all the lights and receptacles off it. This is the easiest method; no new panel required and the cable is a lot smaller and cheaper - but you'll be limited as to what you can run in the barn to one power tool at a time. You'll be limited to very light-duty welders. [I powered up my toolshed/workshop this way]

Questions for you: how far is the barn from your panel panel? Will you be running this underground? And do you want to go cheap and simple, or robust and expandable? If you're handy and willing to research and do it right, you can definitely DIY it. You might want to pay your electrician to inspect your work and make the final connection into your electrical panel, though.

grover fucked around with this message at 01:06 on Jun 3, 2010

# ? Jun 3, 2010 01:04

Solaron: Sep 6, 2007; Whatever the reason you're on Mars, I'm glad you're there, and I wish I was with you.

grover posted:

Questions for you: how far is the barn from your panel panel? Will you be running this underground? And do you want to go cheap and simple, or robust and expandable? If you're handy and willing to research and do it right, you can definitely DIY it. You might want to pay your electrician to inspect your work and make the final connection into your electrical panel, though.

Thanks for the response. My bar is approximately 70' from the back of my house. I will be running this underground. I would prefer to go robust/expandable. I'm willing and somewhat handy, but I'm also not embarrassed to pay a pro when needed; if I need to have my electrician run the line to the barn and add the panel in so I can do the rest, that's fine.

Adding a new panel in the barn is a good idea I hadn't considered. I've got a sub panel coming off my main one already - is it okay to have a 3rd panel coming off my second one?

# ? Jun 3, 2010 02:20

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

Solaron posted:

Thanks for the response. My bar is approximately 70' from the back of my house. I will be running this underground. I would prefer to go robust/expandable. I'm willing and somewhat handy, but I'm also not embarrassed to pay a pro when needed; if I need to have my electrician run the line to the barn and add the panel in so I can do the rest, that's fine.

Adding a new panel in the barn is a good idea I hadn't considered. I've got a sub panel coming off my main one already - is it okay to have a 3rd panel coming off my second one?

You could pull it off your sub-panel, but it would be better to pull it from your main panel. The main concern is voltage drop; when motors start, they're a literal short-circuit for a brief period of time, and draw far more current than during steady-state. This draws down the voltage of everything on the circuit, and makes lights dim momentarily. It would impact everything on your sub-panel. It will impact everything on your main panel, too (as the service entry from the powerlines to your house see voltage drop too), but it's unavoidable. If the main panel is accessible and has room for the new breaker, I'd recommend pulling straight from there.

If your state uses International Building Code (IBC), I'd highly recommend buying International Residential Code (IRC) as it's a concise compilation of all the building codes that will apply to you, including relevant portions of the National Electrical Code (NEC). The electrical portion is thus a whole lot easier to follow than NEC. It goes in detail about how deep your trench needs to be (18" for SCH40 PVC), how big the cable needs to be (#6 for 60A), etc. I recommend going with a larger cable to compensate for voltage drop and keep it below 3% to this panel, and 5% to any receptacle in your barn.

You can buy a 60A panel at any home center. You need to buy one with a main breaker. It's OK to put in an oversized panel- the main breaker is essenteially just a switch, the breaker in your main panel is the actual circuit protection.

You'll need to pull 4-conductor cable; 2 hots, a neutral and a ground. You'll need to put a new ground rod in for your barn and will tie the house ground to the new barn ground. Do not ground the neutral in the new panel- it must be floated.

Research and learn before you start- wiring up a building from scratch is a BIG job, and the last thing you need is to do something wrong and have to tear it all out and start over.

# ? Jun 3, 2010 02:42

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

Hi, remember how I was upgrading my place legally to 3 prong outlets? Well, things have been going OK so far, but I ran across this:

Click here for the full 1600x1200 image.

Back when this place had a fusebox, it looks like this was how these circuits were grounded. When it was upgraded to breakers however, the electrician left the old clamps in place. I assume that I'll need to unfasten the grounds from the clamps, poke them into the breaker box and extend each ground all the way to the ground/neutral bar?

edit: nevermind, I figured out the junction box sizes

kid sinister fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Jun 5, 2010

# ? Jun 5, 2010 01:51

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

kid sinister posted:

Hi, remember how I was upgrading my place legally to 3 prong outlets? Well, things have been going OK so far, but I ran across this:

Click here for the full 1600x1200 image.

Back when this place had a fusebox, it looks like this was how these circuits were grounded. When it was upgraded to breakers however, the electrician left the old clamps in place. I assume that I'll need to unfasten the grounds from the clamps, poke them into the breaker box and extend each ground all the way to the ground/neutral bar?

edit: nevermind, I figured out the junction box sizes

Actually, that's a legal grounding method. I don't particularly like relying on the clamp's bond to the box for the ground, but if those clamps are UL listed for it (they almost certainly are), then it's OK and you can leave it. Make sure the ground bar is solidly grounded to the box and that there's no corrosion or anything else on those clamps that might impact the quality of the ground.

# ? Jun 6, 2010 01:38

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

I got some more questions about code. 210.12(C) 1 and 2 state that bathrooms and laundries both need their own dedicated circuits for receptacles. However, in both my laundry area and my only bathroom there are only 1 receptacle in each. Would I need 20A GFCIs for those 2 areas because of 210.21(B)(1)?

Also, I pretty much got that bathroom lights and receptacles must be on separate circuits. However, are you allowed to put those 2 circuits in the same box?

# ? Jun 8, 2010 19:20

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

kid sinister posted:

I got some more questions about code. 210.12(C) 1 and 2 state that bathrooms and laundries both need their own dedicated circuits for receptacles. However, in both my laundry area and my only bathroom there are only 1 receptacle in each. Would I need 20A GFCIs for those 2 areas because of 210.21(B)(1)?

Also, I pretty much got that bathroom lights and receptacles must be on separate circuits. However, are you allowed to put those 2 circuits in the same box?

The bathroom circuit can serve the bathroom's lights as well, but no other receptacles or lighting.

Yes, even though there is precisely one outlet in your laundry room, it needs its own circuit.

# ? Jun 9, 2010 00:13

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

OK... then do I have run 12-2 for the light too? That existing wiring is 14-2.

If they're the only receptacles on their 20A circuits though, do I need to use 20A receptacles?

edit: and what about that "OK to have 2 circuits in the same box?" question?

kid sinister fucked around with this message at 01:45 on Jun 9, 2010

# ? Jun 9, 2010 01:40

Solaron: Sep 6, 2007; Whatever the reason you're on Mars, I'm glad you're there, and I wish I was with you.

I screwed up. I bought 100' of 4/3 wire when what I really needed is about 150'. I plan on burying this. Are there any ways I can save this or am I screwed? I doubt the local DoItBest store will accept a return on it.

I found a 'waterproof cable splice kit' that says it goes all the way down to 2 AWG, but I don't know if it would work and/or if it is feasible. http://www.acehardwaresuperstore.com/gb-waterproof-cable-splice-kit-p-16183.html

Would this work, or what are my options? Thanks.

I'm pretty dumb.

# ? Jun 9, 2010 01:55

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

kid sinister posted:

OK... then do I have run 12-2 for the light too? That existing wiring is 14-2.

If they're the only receptacles on their 20A circuits though, do I need to use 20A receptacles?

edit: and what about that "OK to have 2 circuits in the same box?" question?

If it's a duplex receptacle (2 plugs), it counts as 2, and you can thus put a single standard 15A duplex outlet on a 20A circuit. If it's a dedicated receptacle (for instance, a non-GFCI outlet for a freezer in a garage where outlets normally must all be GFCI protected), then you have to put a special single-plug receptacle and size the breaker appropriately; 15A if it's the only thing on the circuit, or 20A is OK if that circuit is feeding multiple dedicated receptacles.

The wiring must be sized for the protection, and vice versa. If it's a 20A breaker, you can have no less than #12. Use any #14 wire in there, and you'd have to downgrade it to a 15A circuit.

Code for bathrooms: You can share multiple bathroom receptacle circuits on a single GFCI outlet. If you put the lights on the same circuit as the GFCI receptacles, you need a dedicated 20A circuit for each bathroom.

grover fucked around with this message at 00:39 on Jun 10, 2010

# ? Jun 9, 2010 02:18

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

Welp, looks like I'll need to run all new wiring for that bathroom then. In that case I'll need to keep a junction for the old circuit in the box, since the bathroom isn't at the end of its existing circuit. Is this allowed? Should I bind their neutrals and grounds, or keep them separate?

# ? Jun 9, 2010 16:49

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

kid sinister posted:

Welp, looks like I'll need to run all new wiring for that bathroom then. In that case I'll need to keep a junction for the old circuit in the box, since the bathroom isn't at the end of its existing circuit. Is this allowed? Should I bind their neutrals and grounds, or keep them separate?

Multiple circuits in a box, OK. Tie all grounds together. MULTIPLE CIRCUITS, MULTIPLE NEUTRALS. New code states that if two hots are sharing a neutral, the breaker must disconnect both. Keep neutrals separate!

# ? Jun 9, 2010 19:20

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

That "two hots sharing a neutral" reminded me of something. I was messing around with my AC last week after the condenser outside wouldn't turn on. Long story short, I gassed the ant colony inside and cleared out all the dead ant bodies keeping the relay from making good contacts. Lo and behold, I have AC again!

Anyway, I have a leftover from that fuse/breaker box upgrade from a few years ago: an AC subpanel. All that's in it is a lever switch, 1 neutral and 2 fuses, 1 for either hot line. Since those 2 hots are now on a joined breaker in the new box, is this subpanel even necessary?

# ? Jun 10, 2010 04:47

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

kid sinister posted:

That "two hots sharing a neutral" reminded me of something. I was messing around with my AC last week after the condenser outside wouldn't turn on. Long story short, I gassed the ant colony inside and cleared out all the dead ant bodies keeping the relay from making good contacts. Lo and behold, I have AC again!

Anyway, I have a leftover from that fuse/breaker box upgrade from a few years ago: an AC subpanel. All that's in it is a lever switch, 1 neutral and 2 fuses, 1 for either hot line. Since those 2 hots are now on a joined breaker in the new box, is this subpanel even necessary?

If it's right by your A/C unit, then yes. It's not a "subpanel," but a "fused disconnect." And is there to remove power when servicing the unit. If it's within sight of and readily accessible from the location where the A/C is, then it's a disconnect. If it's on the other side of the house or something, then it's not needid.

# ? Jun 10, 2010 19:26

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

Define "right by". My AC unit, this... fused disconnect and the breaker box are all within 6 feet of each other. The breaker box and fused disconnect are inside, the AC is obviously outside along with a second disconnect on the side of the house (that disconnect looks like a motherboard jumper on steroids).

It just struck me as odd that this disconnect thingy by the breaker box is still there, considering that the newer breakers perform the same function as the old fuses and lever switch. At first glance it appears superfluous and I was wondering if it's even necessary anymore.

# ? Jun 10, 2010 20:32

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

kid sinister posted:

Define "right by". My AC unit, this... fused disconnect and the breaker box are all within 6 feet of each other. The breaker box and fused disconnect are inside, the AC is obviously outside along with a second disconnect on the side of the house (that disconnect looks like a motherboard jumper on steroids).

It just struck me as odd that this disconnect thingy by the breaker box is still there, considering that the newer breakers perform the same function as the old fuses and lever switch. At first glance it appears superfluous and I was wondering if it's even necessary anymore.

It's not the distance, it's the line of sight. If you can't see the breaker from the AC unit, you need a disconnect by the unit. You don't need a 2nd disconnect inside the house beside the panel, though, that's... odd.

# ? Jun 10, 2010 22:31

dwoloz: Oct 20, 2004; Uh uh fool, step back

What are the general codes revolving around wiring in a crawl space? Is conduit required?

# ? Jun 11, 2010 01:06

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

dwoloz posted:

What are the general codes revolving around wiring in a crawl space? Is conduit required?

Nope. Romex is still fine (type NM). Running across joists, must go in holes at least 1 5/8" from the face. Parallel, should not be run on the bottom of the joist.

I think 8/2 NM, 10/3 NM, or larger can be stapled to the bottoms of joists when crossing. It might be 8/3, 6/2 or larger.

I really should pull my codebook out of the car.

# ? Jun 11, 2010 01:16

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

Great, I try to bring my place up to code... I installed 2 combo AFCIs today for my bedrooms, hall and family room. The problem is that on one circuit, that AFCI trips when I turn my PC on. I've unplugged everything else from that circuit including unplugging the PC from its surge protector and plugging it in directly and it still trips. Right now I'm running it off an extension cord to the other GFCI, so I know I don't have a short somewhere in my PC case. Ideas?

# ? Jun 11, 2010 04:41

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

kid sinister posted:

Great, I try to bring my place up to code... I installed 2 combo AFCIs today for my bedrooms, hall and family room. The problem is that on one circuit, that AFCI trips when I turn my PC on. I've unplugged everything else from that circuit including unplugging the PC from its surge protector and plugging it in directly and it still trips. Right now I'm running it off an extension cord to the other GFCI, so I know I don't have a short somewhere in my PC case. Ideas?

Does it trip when you plug anything else in, or just the PC?

If it's just the PC, I strongly suspect weird harmonics from your power supply are draining to ground. That's typically fixed with an isolated circuit with its own neutral and ground all the way back to the panel, but I don't know if that will fix an issue with AFCIs.

# ? Jun 11, 2010 18:41

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

kid sinister posted:

Great, I try to bring my place up to code... I installed 2 combo AFCIs today for my bedrooms, hall and family room. The problem is that on one circuit, that AFCI trips when I turn my PC on. I've unplugged everything else from that circuit including unplugging the PC from its surge protector and plugging it in directly and it still trips. Right now I'm running it off an extension cord to the other GFCI, so I know I don't have a short somewhere in my PC case. Ideas?

Could be a wiring problem in the receptacle; ground-neutral short, most likely.

# ? Jun 11, 2010 18:46

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

grover posted:

Could be a wiring problem in the receptacle; ground-neutral short, most likely.

Doubtful, yesterday I got out my 12' PC power cord and tried it in 2 other outlets in the room, same result. My plug-in outlet tester says that every outlet on that circuit is wired correctly... How do I test for a neutral-ground short? Unscrew them at the breaker box and test for continuity?

babyeatingpsychopath posted:

Does it trip when you plug anything else in, or just the PC?

If it's just the PC, I strongly suspect weird harmonics from your power supply are draining to ground. That's typically fixed with an isolated circuit with its own neutral and ground all the way back to the panel, but I don't know if that will fix an issue with AFCIs.

I just discovered that AFCI will also trip if I turn on the TV in other room on that circuit... The plot thickens.

kid sinister fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Jun 12, 2010

# ? Jun 11, 2010 23:54

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

kid sinister posted:

I just discovered that AFCI will also trip if I turn on the TV in other room on that circuit... The plot thickens.

Shared neutrals. The neutrals from two circuits touching will cause the AFCI to screw up.

# ? Jun 12, 2010 01:09

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

babyeatingpsychopath posted:

Shared neutrals. The neutrals from two circuits touching will cause the AFCI to screw up.

gently caress, I just remembered something I discovered on that circuit... Back when I was working on upgrading that circuit to 3 prong outlets, I remember that some outlets in the family room on that circuit were still testing as grounded when I myself disconnected the ground farther up the circuit. Could that be causing my problem?

# ? Jun 12, 2010 06:07

TouchyMcFeely: Aug 21, 2006; High five! Hell yeah!

I'd like to splice a 6 gauge wire. I know the typical way to do something like this would be to use a split bolt but I was doing some reading and saw that there are new connectors like insulation piercing and set screw insulated multi-tap connectors that can do the job as well. Should I just forget the split bolt and locate one of these new types of connectors or is the split bolt still the way to go?

Also, if using a split bolt connector, what's the proper way to insulate it once the wires are connected? I can't imagine leaving giant metal bolts exposed in a box is a safe way to leave them but I'm not sure what you're supposed to do with them either.

# ? Jun 12, 2010 06:08

Solaron: Sep 6, 2007; Whatever the reason you're on Mars, I'm glad you're there, and I wish I was with you.

TouchyMcFeely posted:

I'd like to splice a 6 gauge wire. I know the typical way to do something like this would be to use a split bolt but I was doing some reading and saw that there are new connectors like insulation piercing and set screw insulated multi-tap connectors that can do the job as well. Should I just forget the split bolt and locate one of these new types of connectors or is the split bolt still the way to go?

Also, if using a split bolt connector, what's the proper way to insulate it once the wires are connected? I can't imagine leaving giant metal bolts exposed in a box is a safe way to leave them but I'm not sure what you're supposed to do with them either.

I had a question on splicing as well (from earlier on this page) that I'd love some help with! I'm trying to get the wire returned but they may not accept it back (grrr).

# ? Jun 12, 2010 13:46

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

I've always just used split bolts and electrical tape. If you can track down something better, go for it. I can virtually guarantee you the split bolt will be way cheaper. And yeah, connect them and then tape before energizing the circuit. On a split-bolt connector, the tape is the only insulation, so you must get it right.

http://ecmweb.com/mag/electric_electrical_taping_skills/

kid sinister posted:

Doubtful, yesterday I got out my 12' PC power cord and tried it in 2 other outlets in the room, same result. My plug-in outlet tester says that every outlet on that circuit is wired correctly... How do I test for a neutral-ground short? Unscrew them at the breaker box and test for continuity?

Ground-neutral faults are extraordinarily difficult to trace, because the ground and the neutral ALWAYS have connectivity due to the neutral-ground bond in your panel. It will not show up as bad in a circuit tester, either, for this reason. If the bare copper ground wire is touching the neutral terminal on any outlet on the load side of the GFCI, anything you plug into any outlet will have a portion of the neutral current returning via the ground, and the GFCI will trip.

If you remove the neutral conductor from the load side of the GFCI outlet (which should completely isolate the neutral system electrically from everything), and your multimeter shows it still has conductivity to ground, you know there's a N-G fault somewhere. If you remove the covers from the other outlets, you should be able to inspect for it.

grover fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Jun 12, 2010

# ? Jun 12, 2010 14:56

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

The last time I was in my local electrical supply store, in the front window they had these insulated splices that looked like 1-connection terminal strips on steroids. You should be able to use one of those indoors...

Could you use something like the phone line repairmen use for outdoor splices? Basically they have these tubes full of silicone-like stuff that you activate and then dunk your splice in.

And I tracked down my ground-neutral short! It's occurring inside a section of old AC cable that goes to the front porch light. Now I get to replace that ~2' of AC... Never a dull moment!

kid sinister fucked around with this message at 21:29 on Jun 12, 2010

# ? Jun 12, 2010 21:26

babyeatingpsychopath: Oct 28, 2000; Forum Veteran

TouchyMcFeely posted:

I'd like to splice a 6 gauge wire. I know the typical way to do something like this would be to use a split bolt but I was doing some reading and saw that there are new connectors like insulation piercing and set screw insulated multi-tap connectors that can do the job as well. Should I just forget the split bolt and locate one of these new types of connectors or is the split bolt still the way to go?

Also, if using a split bolt connector, what's the proper way to insulate it once the wires are connected? I can't imagine leaving giant metal bolts exposed in a box is a safe way to leave them but I'm not sure what you're supposed to do with them either.

The proper way to insulate a split bolt is rubber tape with electrical tape over top. I personally like 3M Scotch 130C with 3M Scotch Super 33+ over top. Read and follow the box directions.

# ? Jun 12, 2010 21:30

Turnquiet: Oct 24, 2002; My friend is an eloquent speaker.

I have done something bad, but want to make it right.

About a year ago I mounted our old flat panel onto the wall in our master bedroom. I routed a UHF antenna through the wall and into the master bath linen closet. Over time, I added a wireless router and other amenities to turn the TV into a full fledged connected media source. But now that I have taken a moment to step back and think about the power scenario, I suspect I did it very poorly.

Here is the front of the wall. The outlet featured is pretty much where all the power comes from.

Here is how it looks in the master bath linen closet behind that wall:

A new metal receptacle box is daisy-chained to the back of the outlet featured in the first paragraph. I have the TV plugged into an extension cord that plugs into that unmounted electrical box. The router plugs in there too, but at least it interfaces directly with the receptacle.

My original plan was to mount the receptacle to the stud above the receptacle that faces out to the master bedroom, and cover it with a double-wide plate to allow the extension cord and network cables to run into the wall and out the hole behind the TV. I would then patch my drywall, and everything would be good.

But then I thought that since I am in a technically in the master bath, I would probably need a GFCI receptacle mounted four feet up. Also, I am unsure on the policy on daisy chaining electrical outlets. My father in law mounted an outlet inside the wall behind his TV, but still accessible via a hole in his drywall. He daisy chained it.

I guess the long, rambling short of it is how do I bounce back from this and make turn this from a project completed in haste to something that would pass muster?

# ? Jun 13, 2010 17:35

kid sinister: Nov 16, 2002

And now for the back porch! I have a covered, screened-in patio there right now. All that's there right now is a wall light fed by 14-2 AC through the brick wall, with a 14-2wG patched into that and screwed flat against the brick by the wall light (I know this isn't to code), and it goes up and over to a ceiling fan out there which is rusting so it's probably not "damp" rated.

I'm going to replace that run from the indoor switch with 12-4 MC (or 12-3 with insulated ground, I don't get the numbering sometimes) so I can also put in a GFCI out there as per code now requires and still have a switched hot for lights.

I figure I'll have to put in a sealed extension box for the wall light, then run conduit from it down to the GFCI box and up to the ceiling fan. What exactly are the requirements for conduit outdoors? Can I just run NM down the conduits, or do I need to go with individual conductors?

Or do I even need conduit in this situation? The wall light is about 6 feet up.

kid sinister fucked around with this message at 22:41 on Jun 14, 2010

# ? Jun 14, 2010 22:36

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

kid sinister posted:

And now for the back porch! I have a covered, screened-in patio there right now. All that's there right now is a wall light fed by 14-2 AC through the brick wall, with a 14-2wG patched into that and screwed flat against the brick by the wall light (I know this isn't to code), and it goes up and over to a ceiling fan out there which is rusting so it's probably not "damp" rated.

I'm going to replace that run from the indoor switch with 12-4 MC (or 12-3 with insulated ground, I don't get the numbering sometimes) so I can also put in a GFCI out there as per code now requires and still have a switched hot for lights.

I figure I'll have to put in a sealed extension box for the wall light, then run conduit from it down to the GFCI box and up to the ceiling fan. What exactly are the requirements for conduit outdoors? Can I just run NM down the conduits, or do I need to go with individual conductors?

Or do I even need conduit in this situation? The wall light is about 6 feet up.

UF cable is watertight, and you can use it in wet/damp areas pretty much anywhere you'd normally be able to use NM. You can pull UF through conduit if you want, or you can transition to THWN in the conduit. THWN is a lot easier to pull than UF.

12-3 sounds like a very good idea, although if there's any #14 in the circuit at all, you're still limited to 15A.

# ? Jun 15, 2010 04:11

FogHelmut: Dec 18, 2003

I have 2 GFCI outlets on the same breaker, but in separate bathrooms. If one is on, the other is off. These were here when I moved in. What could be causing this issue?

# ? Jun 17, 2010 00:37

dietcokefiend: Apr 28, 2004; HEY ILL HAV 2 TXT U L8TR I JUST DROVE IN 2 A DAYCARE AND SCRATCHED MY RAZR

In town right now and staying with my family for the next week, so as usual I am up to little home improvement projects. Two years ago my dad replaced one of those manual intermatic wall timers that blew after 10-15 years of use. Since that time another two have died. This last one actually blew up tonight leaving scorch marks on the wall. When it was working it actually made the wall quite warm.

It is a timer switch controlling three exterior lights. Two are decorative 40-50w incandescent bulbs and one is a 23w CFL bulb. Timer is rated for like 15A.

What the gently caress would be causing this?

# ? Jun 23, 2010 05:06

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# ? May 23, 2024 19:32

grover: Jan 23, 2002; PEW PEW PEW

dietcokefiend posted:

What the gently caress would be causing this?

CFLs, most likely- they really don't play nice with cheap timers, dimmers, motion sensors, etc. Could be simple elderly component failure internally, too.

# ? Jun 23, 2010 10:55

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Hobbies, Crafts, & Houses > Wiring Thread: This stupid safety device started alerting that there wasn't safety!

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