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muggins posted:I am painting bicycle troops for my Slovak Rapid Division and they're amazing Pics or it didn't happen, or whatever kids say these days.
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Dec 28, 2015 13:40
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Are there any decent Flames lists with IS-2s or am I basically going to have to look for some other game to get my stalin-barrelled fury fix?
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Dec 28, 2015 21:32
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JcDent posted:Pics or it didn't happen, or whatever kids say these days. When I said I am painting I meant I put them together and primed them =/
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Dec 29, 2015 02:28
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spectralent posted:Are there any decent Flames lists with IS-2s or am I basically going to have to look for some other game to get my stalin-barrelled fury fix? I'm gonna be honest, your options aren't great. IS-2s aren't that great in Flames for a variety of reasons, and it's difficult to use them effectively. They CAN be successful, but it requires a lot of skill and a decent amount of luck. With that being said, your options for an IS based list are either a standard Guards Heavy Tank Regiment from Red Bear (Revised) or a Hero Guards Heavy Tank Regiment from Berlin. Red Bear (Revised) (AKA The Big Book of Late-War Soviets) has its main advantage in the sheer number of support options. Compared to Berlin, where your support is comparatively anemic, a list from RBR can take a fairly wide variety of tanks, infantry, and artillery. You also get more tanks in general-you can get more than double the number of IS-2s in a list as you can in Berlin, and you can choose to take IS-85s instead of IS-2s for the better RoF-though you lose the ability to take tank escorts (For... some reason). Berlin focuses on quality over quantity, though the quality increase isn't particularly great. 3 tanks per platoon instead of 5, 3 platoons instead of 4, and a vastly reduced number of support options have a large impact on the numbers you can put on the table. In return, all units in the army get the "Heroes of the Soviet Union" special rules, though only one (Pass skill tests on a 3+) actually matters for IS-2s. You can also choose to take later-model IS-2s with improved front armor (11 vs. 10), but the biggest advantage the list has is access to 160mm mortars. They're big, they're powerful (AT4 FP 2+) and they're cheap-you can take 8 of them for only 220 points. But, like I said, IS-2s really aren't that great. Unlike most other tanks they don't really have any rules to help them out, and both the gun and the armor are in the awkward position of being good enough to be expensive, but aren't good enough to really justify the cost of taking them. It doesn't help that Battlefront has tried to shoehorn them (And Soviets in general) into an assault role, which is both ahistorical and greatly reduces their effectiveness in-game. So by all means, feel free to take them, but if you want to field IS-2s you'd probably be better served by another, less dumb game.
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Dec 29, 2015 03:05
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To be fair it should be noted that all heavy tanks, Allied or not, suck in FoW.
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Dec 29, 2015 03:22
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Well, mine is going to be for Bolt Action and/or Chain of Command and/or Forever Alone dioramas.  Arquinsiel posted:Funnily enough, if it was against Panthers my money would be on the Churchill for simple visibility benefits. See the milhist thread for why or wait until EE posts here again. link? http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3585027 this thread?
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Dec 29, 2015 04:12
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So, my Grendel 6mm arrived. A small test batch of vaguelly Team Yankee (God that's an ugly name) related stuff: BMP-2. OK, I guess, the only other BMP I have is from GHQ and GHQ is both master race and 1/285 (while others are usually 1/300 if I'm not mistaken)  The T-55 is OK, I guess, but I feel like Heroic and Ros has better detail (newer molds?) and more pronounced road wheel gap.  Heroic and Ross' T-72 has a lovely hull and an OK turret. But this Grendel T-72 is the opposite - the hull is of adequate quality and detail, but the turret is some sort of a cow-pie, I think It's way smaller than it should be.  The Abrams isn't that detailed on the hull (maybe it's actually realistic) and kind of OK on the turret, so pass? Should have ordered a HnR Abrams, but lol planning ahead.  The Hind is featureless lump of poo poo that looks like it had been whittled out of a piece of wood. You can almost make out the places where the side were/are supposed to be.     I also got 50ish soviet infantry dudes. 2 broke off their legs during transport, one remained on single leg, and there are about five prone MG teams. I guess they're more solid, but less detailed than God's own GHQ offering, However, they much, much cheaper. I guess that goes for every 6mm manufacturer save for CinC and I'm probably not gonna order them ever. Next month, I might try for 3mm, because I'm shitlord who can't concentrate long enough to build one functional army.
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Dec 29, 2015 13:03
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Acebuckeye13 posted:I'm gonna be honest, your options aren't great. IS-2s aren't that great in Flames for a variety of reasons, and it's difficult to use them effectively. They CAN be successful, but it requires a lot of skill and a decent amount of luck. With that being said, your options for an IS based list are either a standard Guards Heavy Tank Regiment from Red Bear (Revised) or a Hero Guards Heavy Tank Regiment from Berlin. Yeah, figured, thanks. Numlock posted:To be fair it should be noted that all heavy tanks, Allied or not, suck in FoW. Heavy tanks as support are viable IME and you can get decent results with the RT all-KT-all-times type lists with a little support via the expedient of being totally immune to everything's guns to the front and having 40" of straight-through RoF 2 guns. Those lists are insanely unfun to play, though. Honestly, the IS-2 is probably the worst heavy tank in the game by some measure; no super special rules, front armour is insufficient for immunity to common AT guns*, RoF 1, and it's still expensive as tanks that can boast frontal immunity or have a gun that can plug stuff from miles away. It probably needs to be a bunch cheaper to actually be viable in any list; they could probably be 25-50 points cheaper without anything breaking. *Early-churchills and Tiger I have the same flaw here, but by late war the churchill is getting a "nice medium tanks" level points cost and the Tiger gets special rules which make it a semi-heavy that can flank or rapid-fire death or whatever the gently caress you roll.
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Dec 29, 2015 13:49
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osirisisdead posted:Well, mine is going to be for Bolt Action and/or Chain of Command and/or Forever Alone dioramas.
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Dec 29, 2015 14:22
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spectralent posted:Are there any decent Flames lists with IS-2s or am I basically going to have to look for some other game to get my stalin-barrelled fury fix? As others have indicated the IS-2 falls into a weird a weird no-man's land with tanks. It has heavy enough armor to make it expensive but not so heavy that it can ignore a lot of incoming fire. The gun is good enough to be expensive but suffers badly from being on the RoF 1/2 line. It ends up having a good enough stat line to be expensive but not good enough to actually be great. Other examples include the Tiger I, but for some reason no one cries about that guy. In my experience all of the best Soviet lists use some kind of infiltration. Here's a list I quickly came up with that I think might be fun in a casual environment. 
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Dec 29, 2015 21:20
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The Scouts can't infiltrate the IS-2s, unfortunately. They can only infiltrate the Hero Rifle Battalion and the Hero Storm Group. Berlin is kinda poo poo for Soviets.
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Dec 29, 2015 21:40
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Berlin is kinda poo poo for Soviets. Which is... weird.
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Dec 29, 2015 21:43
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Colonial Air Force posted:Which is... weird. My belief is that Battlefront wanted to be done with Late War as quickly as physically possible so they could focus on Team Yankee, which is why they started shoving so much content onto digital instead of putting it into their books. Compound that with the fact that nobody at Battlefront actually cares about researching or writing for Soviets, and you get the exceedingly low-effort dreck they shoved into Berlin.
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Dec 29, 2015 21:56
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It's Battlefront. While other companies' German Berlin figures are desperate old men and child soldiers, Flames of War's Germans got IR Vampir Sturmgewehr and yet more SS.
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Dec 29, 2015 21:57
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Really, all you need to know about Battlefront's treatment of the Eastern Front is that the Germans in Berlin get stupid prototypes that saw service for maybe five minutes before getting blown up, and Soviets can't even take SU-85s.
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Dec 29, 2015 21:59
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I'm glad I didn't get involved with FoW, then... I also just like 28mm. Arquinsiel posted:Yup, that's the one. Some great posts in there about what makes a tank good or bad and operational contexts etc. Great thread, thx.
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Dec 29, 2015 22:12
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Acebuckeye13 posted:Really, all you need to know about Battlefront's treatment of the Eastern Front is that the Germans in Berlin get stupid prototypes that saw service for maybe five minutes before getting blown up, and Soviets can't even take SU-85s.
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Dec 29, 2015 22:16
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moths posted:It's Battlefront.  Flipswitch posted:This doesn't bode well for Team Yankee. My buddy was saying that Battlefront seem to have some sort of narrative they want to spin and adhere to for their games rather than actual game balance. Hordes of lovely, yet motivated Soviets against the Few, the Better Geared Yankees. The name is God-awful, too.
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Dec 29, 2015 22:23
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JcDent posted:
I agree that the game will probably be awful, but the name is from a book
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Dec 29, 2015 22:56
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Yeah I can forgive them the name because of the book, but even then the name of Team Yankee is poo poo anyway even with what it's linked to.
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Dec 29, 2015 23:03
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If it wasn't specifically yanks in the story then it'd almost, maybe, be a not terrible name for an ad-hoc battlegroup formation of indeterminate size, assuming there were teams Alpha to Xray floating around somewhere, with Zulu faffing around behind...
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Dec 29, 2015 23:09
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Team Yankee is at least coming close to doing soviets some justice for the first time ever in a battlefront game so that might change; they're not bogged down with terrible special rules and have a broad array of support options. BMP squads put M113 platoons to shame, likewise with soviet AA options. The T-72 is a little worse than the Abrams but it's at least not hen and chicks and it is also way cheaper. I am cautiously optimistic I'm not playing the Official Chump Team this time.
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Dec 30, 2015 00:58
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I'm gonna stall out for newer stuff before I leap in, at least until the Shilkas are out, but it does seem cool so far. Curious how much stuff they'll add from the era, more choppers, tanks that sort of thing.
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Dec 30, 2015 01:06
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Flipswitch posted:I'm gonna stall out for newer stuff before I leap in, at least until the Shilkas are out, but it does seem cool so far. Curious how much stuff they'll add from the era, more choppers, tanks that sort of thing. Zvezda do shilkas Also the "Carnation" (gvozdika). Sadly BTRs rather than BMPs, but those are out already anyway. It's only 1/100 hinds that are hard to get from other places.
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Dec 30, 2015 01:53
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Anyone knows how long it could take for Battlefront to send items that got out of stock? We ordered a lot of stuff beyond the starter kit (friend of mine went and ordered a soviet army with a batallion of riflemen, some t34s and other stuff) and when the order was sent it said those items (amongst others) were out of stock. My brother have tried to get in contact with them but they've sent some pretty vague emails, so I figured you guys probably know the answer to the question
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Dec 30, 2015 02:14
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Acebuckeye13 posted:The Scouts can't infiltrate the IS-2s, unfortunately. They can only infiltrate the Hero Rifle Battalion and the Hero Storm Group. I didn't say they could, they're there to lift GtG for the IS-2s and mortars. If you don't have them then dug in Veteran infantry become a huge obstacle. moths posted:It's Battlefront. No, they did the old men and boys thing too. They included full Volkssturm support weapons as well. The German IR units are part of a different book.
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Dec 30, 2015 02:56
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Oh, I know the name is from a book, I still hate it, Daddy Yankee connections and all that.
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Dec 30, 2015 07:03
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I don't know if you guys have looked beyond the cover of the Team Yankee rule book but most of the people who have, have come to the conclusion that the Soviets in TY are better than the Americans.
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Dec 30, 2015 09:09
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Numlock posted:I don't know if you guys have looked beyond the cover of the Team Yankee rule book but most of the people who have, have come to the conclusion that the Soviets in TY are better than the Americans. I'm not much for mathhammering, so I really can't say. I'm the guy who's buying a box of BA Early War Germans with full intent of fielding LMGs.
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Dec 30, 2015 09:39
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JcDent posted:I'm not much for mathhammering, so I really can't say. I'm the guy who's buying a box of BA Early War Germans with full intent of fielding LMGs. One thing I like about CoC is that the big nasty machine gun that fires at 900 rounds per minute is the foundation of your platoon's firepower, not a handicap.
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Dec 30, 2015 10:13
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lilljonas posted:One thing I like about CoC is that the big nasty machine gun that fires at 900 rounds per minute is the foundation of your platoon's firepower, not a handicap. That's the beauty of Warlord/BA, innit? Not like you're gonna run out of WWII skirmish rulesets. Lardies gonna make sure of that.
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Dec 30, 2015 10:58
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Greggster posted:Anyone knows how long it could take for Battlefront to send items that got out of stock? I order some FoW Soviet stuff from the Warstore on November 4th and they still haven't sent me the stuff that was special order from Battlefront. At this point I'm kind of pissed.
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Dec 30, 2015 11:38
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spectralent posted:Zvezda do shilkas I forget that historical have that buy from other companies thing. What companies are good to look at?
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Dec 30, 2015 12:49
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Zvezda's T-72s are of the wrong model and Abramses are just crap. My humble suggestion would be to seek out /hwg/ thread on 4chan's /tg/ board; either the OP or one of he other top posts always have a list of manufacturers. It miggt be a little old, tho. Moderns are somewhat hard to find, usually.
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Dec 30, 2015 13:05
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I'll do some scouting, thanks mate. Greggster posted:Anyone knows how long it could take for Battlefront to send items that got out of stock?
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Dec 30, 2015 13:43
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JcDent posted:Zvezda's T-72s are of the wrong model and Abramses are just crap. The T-72s are the wrong model but they're also snap fit and lovingly detailed. I would heartily recommend them anyway because they're just so nice to put together. The same is true of the shilkas and gvozdikas though. The abrams is pretty lovely and underdetailed though. Their WW2 stuff is awesome, dirt cheap, and also snap fit, though, though some assembly steps seem to be designed for superior russian fingers or something on some of the vehicles like a lot of their trucks. If you're doing anything barbarossa-y, they have a pretty great range. Basically zvezda are probably my favourite miniatures maker just because I can assemble them over a quiet lunch or whatever when I've got some spare time and don't need to cart around hobby kit or set aside a specific modelling time block to make them.
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Dec 30, 2015 13:57
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Numlock posted:I don't know if you guys have looked beyond the cover of the Team Yankee rule book but most of the people who have, have come to the conclusion that the Soviets in TY are better than the Americans. Yeah, i've looked at it and it's actually a lot better designed than their other post-WW2 attempts. What I mean to say is, i'd give it a go.
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Dec 30, 2015 14:22
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pz your old av was way better  Zvezda seem to have a really lovely rep over here as being a bit cheap, I have zero experience with them but it has put me off just a little it. Just started playing Dropzone Commander so it'll be a little bit before I get into TY anyway. Might snag the rulebook today and keep reading it.
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Dec 30, 2015 15:01
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They are a bit cheap. That is exactly the whole point of them. Cheap, but "good enough". Some of their kits are even "nice".
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Dec 30, 2015 15:16
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Yeah they're not "looks like a mould-line riddled lump of plastic" cheap. Some of the detail is a bit soft, but that's about it. Actually, they're usually largely free of mould lines, though there's been a little flash on them. And again, no glue. You can clip them off and just put them together wherever, it's wonderful.
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Dec 30, 2015 15:33
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