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Free Market Gravy posted:His entire draw in ECW was that he was the little, goofy scrawny guy who could slay the giants. What goofy, scrawny guy in the WWE has ever been successful or gotten a lot of screen time, even as a comedy character? Vince loves his giants and would never let them be slayed, so that left Spike to get over as a serious wrestler. I like to image Vince having some sort of seizure upon being shown tapes of Spike winning in squash matches over all the giants in ECW. Like Vince's mind just could not comprehend what he was watching.
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# ? Aug 3, 2009 19:32 |
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# ? May 28, 2024 15:26 |
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I liked Spike & Big Show's tag team reign. I thought he got a fair shot in the WWE, given that he was always a bit of a niche character.
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# ? Aug 3, 2009 22:07 |
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Jagtpanther posted:Did anything come of WWE's alleged interest in bringing back Sycho Sid for one more run? Another broken piece of Sid's body (this time, it was his heart).
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# ? Aug 3, 2009 23:18 |
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KungFu Grip posted:That Tai Pei Death Match Ian and Axel had was pretty terrible and hard to watch on multiple levels. Yes the only garbage wrestling ECW produced that was as bad as CZW or IWA included the owner of IWA and his brother. Also, New Jack was CZW before CZW was cool. But he was charismatic and crazy enough to be talentless. The Sabu vs Terry Funk match was epic in its gut churning violence... But it was a decent match, seeing as it was Terry loving Funk and Sabu, not Sexxy Eddy vs Deranged. The same goes for the Cactus Jack vs Terry Funk flaming branding iron incident. Even though the spectacle pushed the limits of acceptability, there was a bit more going on than just "Watch fat guy get set on fire... huh huh huh cool." GOP fucked around with this message at 02:32 on Aug 4, 2009 |
# ? Aug 4, 2009 02:26 |
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Pie The Grand posted:Another broken piece of Sid's body (this time, it was his heart).
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 03:21 |
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GOP posted:Also, New Jack was CZW before CZW was cool. But he was charismatic and crazy enough to be talentless. More to the point, he had a BADASS entrance, an actual character (crazy militant black thug), and wasn't put in a position to carry the company at any point. He was generally used as an attraction, which is a good way to book guys like him instead of the way Ian or Zandig run things.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 04:45 |
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Captain Strange posted:I liked Spike & Big Show's tag team reign. I thought he got a fair shot in the WWE, given that he was always a bit of a niche character. People forget that the Romeo and Juliet angle with the Dudleys and Hollys was both entertaining and over. GOP posted:The same goes for the Cactus Jack vs Terry Funk flaming branding iron incident. Even though the spectacle pushed the limits of acceptability, there was a bit more going on than just "Watch fat guy get set on fire... huh huh huh cool." It's worth adressing the question of "Why is hardcore okay for Cactus Jack and Terry Funk, but when it's CZW or IWA it's garbage wrestling?" The difference is promos and psychology. Funk was arguably one of the top 10 wrestlers of the past thirty years. He didn't have to do hardcore to have an entertaining match, but he knew how to use it in a way that made sense. Cactus was a big fat guy with average athletic ability. Yet, his promo ability and charisma made him one of the biggest stars of the Attitude era. In the ring, he made up for his althletic flaws with great psychology. Some could argue he used big bumps and hardcore as a crutch, and there's some truth to that. However, his had great psychology and knew how to use those spots for maximum effect and could sell well.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 04:45 |
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WeaselWeaz posted:It's worth adressing the question of "Why is hardcore okay for Cactus Jack and Terry Funk, but when it's CZW or IWA it's garbage wrestling?" The difference is promos and psychology. Funk was arguably one of the top 10 wrestlers of the past thirty years. He didn't have to do hardcore to have an entertaining match, but he knew how to use it in a way that made sense. Cactus was a big fat guy with average athletic ability. Yet, his promo ability and charisma made him one of the biggest stars of the Attitude era. In the ring, he made up for his althletic flaws with great psychology. Some could argue he used big bumps and hardcore as a crutch, and there's some truth to that. However, his had great psychology and knew how to use those spots for maximum effect and could sell well. Exactly, it's like those people who think that the Hell in a Cell match between Foley/Taker was great because of the spots off the roof, and can't understand why people don't consider it a classic when they leap into a dumper full of weedwhackers off of a roof swarming with crocodiles. The spots mean something because of our familiarity with the characters, the build to the match, and the fact that Foley got BACK UP afterwards with a crazy smile on his face because his character was loving insane and wanted to keep fighting.... and Taker's reaction was,"gently caress it okay let's fight some more!"
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 05:32 |
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Jerusalem posted:the fact that Foley got BACK UP afterwards with a crazy smile on his face because his character was loving insane and wanted to keep fighting.... and Taker's reaction was,"gently caress it okay let's fight some more!" But this also happens in CZW matches
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 05:49 |
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Chilly McFreeze posted:But this also happens in CZW matches I know, but yeah, nobody knows anything about the character of CZW wrestlers, who they are, or why they should care* - it's the equivalent of the villainous henchmen in disney live action kids films who slip and land on their backs and then bowling balls land on their heads. It's not funny and nobody cares because no reason has been provided to. * The answer is we shouldn't. Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 05:54 on Aug 4, 2009 |
# ? Aug 4, 2009 05:51 |
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Jerusalem posted:Exactly, it's like those people who think that the Hell in a Cell match between Foley/Taker was great because of the spots off the roof, and can't understand why people don't consider it a classic when they leap into a dumper full of weedwhackers off of a roof swarming with crocodiles. The spots mean something because of our familiarity with the characters, the build to the match, and the fact that Foley got BACK UP afterwards with a crazy smile on his face because his character was loving insane and wanted to keep fighting.... and Taker's reaction was,"gently caress it okay let's fight some more!" CZW matches are like Tom & Jerry cartoons. If you watch a whole morning of cartoons and you see one Tom & Jerry, it is definitely different and crazy. If you watch a Tom & Jerry marathon, the violence loses all meaning and impact. Plus, like Tom & Jerry, the wrestlers just do crazy spot after crazy spot without any transitions or story.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 05:55 |
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I would actually spend money to get hold of some Tom and Jerry cartoons, however, so there's a large difference.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 05:56 |
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Jerusalem posted:I would actually spend money to get hold of some Tom and Jerry cartoons, however, so there's a large difference. Are we comparing my childhood to a trashy wrestling promotion that has people doing horrible things to themselves for ~100 an appearance? Really? I was actually browsing through FYE's wrestling selection, came across some CZW dvds, and thought to myself who would actually buy one of these. As I went to put it back down, there was a ROH DVD behind it. I pulled that one to the front and shoved the CZW one as far back as I could. No one should ever see CZW. I feel horrible that Mickey Rourke or whichever stuntman they used for him had to go through that shoot with Necro for the movie.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 06:32 |
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It's also worth mentioning that a deathmatch can actually be wrestled with psychology and in a really smart way. Japan's had this covered for years, and in fact the first match that opened my eyes to this was a women's exploding barbed wire match where they *GASP* actually TEASED the big spots for 15 minutes!
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 06:36 |
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Xenoletum posted:Are we comparing my childhood to a trashy wrestling promotion that has people doing horrible things to themselves for ~100 an appearance? Really? However, CZW was allegedly decent-good in 2005, due to a different (competent) booker, a WAAAY better talent pool (first outside exposure of IWS, PWG guys) and probably less deathmatches.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 07:10 |
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Jerusalem posted:Exactly, it's like those people who think that the Hell in a Cell match between Foley/Taker was great because of the spots off the roof, and can't understand why people don't consider it a classic when they leap into a dumper full of weedwhackers off of a roof swarming with crocodiles. The spots mean something because of our familiarity with the characters, the build to the match, and the fact that Foley got BACK UP afterwards with a crazy smile on his face because his character was loving insane and wanted to keep fighting.... and Taker's reaction was,"gently caress it okay let's fight some more!" It's also telling that if you walk up to anybody involved in the Mankind/Undertaker Hell in a Cell, Mick and 'Taker included, and start raving about the match being great, they'll look at you like you're a mental patient and maybe even start backing away slowly. The spectacle was incredible, sure, but the match, such as it was, sucked a dick. And the spectacle, as you point out, is not reproducible; it was a result of one planned spot, then a whole lot of unplanned poo poo and Mick Foley being, frankly, too loving stupid and concussed to know when he needed to stop.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 08:37 |
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tzirean posted:It's also telling that if you walk up to anybody involved in the Mankind/Undertaker Hell in a Cell, Mick and 'Taker included, and start raving about the match being great, they'll look at you like you're a mental patient and maybe even start backing away slowly. The spectacle was incredible, sure, but the match, such as it was, sucked a dick. And the spectacle, as you point out, is not reproducible; it was a result of one planned spot, then a whole lot of unplanned poo poo and Mick Foley being, frankly, too loving stupid and concussed to know when he needed to stop. I imagine if you went up to Undertaker and said that he would say "Of course, I won" then vanish in a cloud of smoke.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 08:47 |
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Wazzu posted:However, CZW was allegedly decent-good in 2005, due to a different (competent) booker, a WAAAY better talent pool (first outside exposure of IWS, PWG guys) and probably less deathmatches. Kingston vs Hero was a awesome. Team Masturbation, Kings of Wrestling, BlKOUT, Super Dragon... Decent stuff. GOP fucked around with this message at 09:20 on Aug 4, 2009 |
# ? Aug 4, 2009 09:18 |
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I loved CZW in 2005 when they feuded with ROH leading up to Death Before Dishonor 4. Of course, the only exposure I had of CZW was through ROH. Nowadays, I get all my CZW poo poo from Botchamania videos.
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# ? Aug 4, 2009 12:22 |
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Batmanuel posted:I loved CZW in 2005 when they feuded with ROH leading up to Death Before Dishonor 4. John Danzig didn't, he through the booker down the stairs and fired him. tzirean posted:The spectacle was incredible, sure, but the match, such as it was, sucked a dick. And the spectacle, as you point out, is not reproducible; it was a result of one planned spot, then a whole lot of unplanned poo poo and Mick Foley being, frankly, too loving stupid and concussed to know when he needed to stop. Actually, Jim Ross deserves a lot of credit too. In the hands of any other announcer it would have come off as a trainwreck from the big spot on. A spot which was only happened because Foley was deathly afraid of a bad match figured if he was thrown off the cage that anything after would probably be fine. Nobody, including Vince and Taker, was happy it was done. Jerusalem posted:the fact that Foley got BACK UP afterwards with a crazy smile on his face because his character was loving insane and wanted to keep fighting.... and Taker's reaction was,"gently caress it okay let's fight some more!" JR got that over. Foley wasn't smiling, he was trying to show off a missing tooth and a hole in his lip. JR made it look less stupid, and more bad-rear end.
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# ? Aug 5, 2009 13:10 |
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What if Michael Cole and Tazz called the Hell in the Cell match? Answer:
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# ? Aug 5, 2009 14:26 |
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Batmanuel posted:What if Michael Cole and Tazz called the Hell in the Cell match? Honestly, I sometimes wonder what the Attitude Era would have sounded like if Gorilla and Jesse were still calling it. When Jesse came out to do PBP for that Raw before Summerslam 99 I got goosebumps from being so excited to hear him behind the mic.
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# ? Aug 5, 2009 19:33 |
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TL posted:Honestly, I sometimes wonder what the Attitude Era would have sounded like if Gorilla and Jesse were still calling it. When Jesse came out to do PBP for that Raw before Summerslam 99 I got goosebumps from being so excited to hear him behind the mic. Gorilla was/is really underrated as a play-by-play guy. I mean yes Gordon Solie was awesome, but Gorilla was one of the voices of my youth and he had chemistry with a lot of people; Jesse, Heenan, Mean Gene, even dipshits like Lord Alfred sounded good next to him.
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# ? Aug 5, 2009 20:25 |
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WeaselWeaz posted:Actually, Jim Ross deserves a lot of credit too. In the hands of any other announcer it would have come off as a trainwreck from the big spot on. A spot which was only happened because Foley was deathly afraid of a bad match figured if he was thrown off the cage that anything after would probably be fine. Nobody, including Vince and Taker, was happy it was done. I count Ross' reactions in the "whole lot of unplanned poo poo" collection, though I did him a disservice by not mentioning him.
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# ? Aug 5, 2009 20:40 |
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Gorilla was great for reacting to people and having his color guys bounce lines off of him. He tended to repeat the "spontaneous" lines over and over again over the years, but he had a great voice and his,"Oh will you stop!" was always fun to hear.
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# ? Aug 5, 2009 23:42 |
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Jerusalem posted:Gorilla was great for reacting to people and having his color guys bounce lines off of him. He tended to repeat the "spontaneous" lines over and over again over the years, but he had a great voice and his,"Oh will you stop!" was always fun to hear. loved his constant misuse of the word literally.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:03 |
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grody but still def posted:loved his constant misuse of the word literally. It wouldn't drive me so nuts if it wasn't the EXACT OPPOSITE of what they meant.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:23 |
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WeaselWeaz posted:JR got that over. Foley wasn't smiling, he was trying to show off a missing tooth and a hole in his lip. JR made it look less stupid, and more bad-rear end. He really did look like he was smiling though, so it's not like JR was thinking fast on his feet and making these calculated statements- he was just freaking out and happened to have a microphone near his mouth. It was undeniably awesome though
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:24 |
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Jerusalem posted:Gorilla was great for reacting to people and having his color guys bounce lines off of him. He tended to repeat the "spontaneous" lines over and over again over the years, but he had a great voice and his,"Oh will you stop!" was always fun to hear. I enjoyed how no one could execute an abdominal stretch to his liking. Any reason why he gets ignored by management these days?
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:24 |
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LividLiquid posted:Every wrestling announcer in history does this and it drives me nuts. No, Mr. Schiavone. No. Nobody is actually hanging from the loving rafters. Sting was hanging from the rafters every week on Nitro.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:25 |
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CombineThresher posted:I enjoyed how no one could execute an abdominal stretch to his liking. Because he's been dead for 10 years?
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:26 |
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Rusty Shackelford posted:Because he's been dead for 10 years? So? Gordon Solie never worked for Vince at all, and he gets mentioned all the time.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 00:30 |
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I've been watching the clips that Ken Anderson (Kennedy) has been posting onto youtube, and been wondering if they would have been suitable to a degree for when he was injured and still working for WWE. I've been getting a good chuckle out of them, but wonder if they would have been received as well if they were broadcast during a raw or something. Even if he was doing it when he wasn't injured. It doesn't seem to far out of character for him when he was with the WWE. I realize that the WWE would most likely not air them at all, but if they were do you think they would have helped his character more than his terrible promo's he was doing to promote his movie Behind Enemy Lines 3 or whatever it was? It should be noted that I was/am a Kennedy fan so perhaps I have a somewhat biased view of it. For reference, here is his most recent one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xfBvLaSvhFw
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 01:31 |
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LividLiquid posted:Every wrestling announcer in history does this and it drives me nuts. No, Mr. Schiavone. No. Nobody is actually hanging from the loving rafters. Its not like this is limited to wrestling announcers, pretty much 80% of the population does this.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 01:43 |
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grody but still def posted:loved his constant misuse of the word literally. There's an awesome scene from How I Met Your Mother involving this same misusage by Robin, unfortunately it's not on Youtube or Hulu though.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 03:09 |
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grody but still def posted:loved his constant misuse of the word literally. I still think his best thing was his explainations of holds on the human anatomy, with medical terminology. Especially when Heenan would have no clue what he was talking about.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 03:24 |
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JR taught me what a sternum was, so he is the greatest.
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 03:29 |
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WeaselWeaz posted:I still think his best thing was his explainations of holds on the human anatomy, with medical terminology. Especially when Heenan would have no clue what he was talking about. LACTIC ACID BUILDUP
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 03:37 |
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WeaselWeaz posted:I still think his best thing was his explainations of holds on the human anatomy, with medical terminology. Especially when Heenan would have no clue what he was talking about. External occipital protuberance!
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 07:04 |
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# ? May 28, 2024 15:26 |
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TL posted:External occipital protuberance! Gorilla Monsoon: He hit him in the external protuberance area! Bobby Heenan: Why do you always use words no one understands? Gorilla Monsoon: It's fun. You should try it. *jobber gets kicked in the stomach* Bobby Heenan: He kicked him in the uterus! Gorilla Monsoon: Would you stop it!
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# ? Aug 6, 2009 07:24 |