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This totally green to me. I'm all in, that Devil suit had me off my chair... Know nothing about this story.
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Dec 15, 2015 10:24
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I was expecting Tim curry in Legend to come walking out... And I was pretty close
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Dec 15, 2015 13:29
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Sir DonkeyPunch posted:Solid looking devil tho Finally got around to seeing it and I'm just happy that his face retains so much emotion and, for lack of a better word, humanity. He looks kind of nervous but excited and happy and the suit doesn't stick out badly, which is good since they'll be around a bit more in the following episodes. That said, I'm curious to see how the next few episodes go since they've already made some changes from the book. The Indian (I think?) girl having a theological crisis isn't in the book that I recall, and I'm wondering if Milo will go about things in the same way or in a somewhat different manner. I did like that the old guy that he hung around did seem to parallel Milo's own story in a way, with the old guy deciding he doesn't really care about seeing any more just like Milo decides that he's seen enough after he gets back from the Overlord's homeworld and that he wants to die on Earth, with the Overlords taking advantage of his decision to get some more data. The final episode is probably going to be pretty depressing now that I think about it.
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Dec 15, 2015 18:15
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There's an article on Mental Floss about why it took so long to adapt this and apparently for a good chunk of time it boiled down to rights issues. One person or another would have the rights but be unable to actually produce something.
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Dec 16, 2015 02:08
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Episode 2 is having some serious Village Of The Damned stuff going on. Edit:  What the hell just happened Karellen was not shot in the book
MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 03:49 on Dec 16, 2015 |
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Dec 16, 2015 02:51
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Another good episode. I can't believe no one is watching this I guess.
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Dec 16, 2015 04:16
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Yeah I'm surprised this isn't getting more attention. It's really good and encapsulates that Arthur C Clark charm
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Dec 16, 2015 04:35
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This is far exceeding my expectations. Who caught the John Keats reference? I'm calling it now, Hyperion is next! gohmak fucked around with this message at 07:10 on Dec 16, 2015 |
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Dec 16, 2015 06:16
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That seems like it'd be a far more ambitious undertaking than a 3 episode limited series, both in terms of the budget necessary and the amount of episodes it would take to cover the story. I would imagine something like Rendezvous with Rama or Foundation would be far more likely - though as far as I know the rights to Foundation at least are still tied up at the moment.
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Dec 16, 2015 16:54
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I thought it was kind of weird how they just kind of off handedly mentioned that Wainright killed himself after the kidnapping debacle.
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Dec 16, 2015 22:23
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Well, they had to get rid of him somehow, otherwise you'd have people asking where he is the rest of the series. Unrelated, I'm kinda worried about tonight's finale, because there feels like a lot of beats remaining in the story and I'm not sure how they'll fit it all in in 2 hours while still fleshing things out. From memory, you've got the new species being Weird, that dude sneaking onto the whale, exploring the Overlords homeworld / learning about the Overmind, returning to earth and watching the Weird Kids destroying Earth... combined with the existing series-only beats like Ricky being sick, I wonder how they'll cram it all in satisfactorily.
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Dec 16, 2015 22:45
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I'm more curious how they'll do the home world at all since they seem to only have the budget to have Karellan around as an Overlord, at least so far. I hope the finale is as dramatic and emotive as the book.
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Dec 16, 2015 23:17
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Alien saviors are easier to trust if they have the voice of Charles Dance.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:32
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etalian posted:Alien saviors are easier to trust if they have the voice of Charles Dance. Plus, they look like, if someone really forced their hand, they could ruin your day. Screw their technology, getting a wing smacked against you looks like it'd throw you across the room.
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Dec 17, 2015 00:43
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I think the tone is fundamentally completely off. It's reminding me of a Shyamalan movie, and I don't mean that in the "dumb/bad" way, I mean the way suspense/tension is being handled for a story that is actually quite straightforward and engaging because of its narrative forthrightness.
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Dec 17, 2015 01:38
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You know, he sure has been dying for a while.
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Dec 17, 2015 02:07
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I don't like Jennifer's dad. Uproot your whole family from utopia (which your supremely cute wife clearly doesn't want) because you can't be an architect? gently caress you, Jennifer's Dad. Edit: an hour left? Yeah, this is going to end super rushed. We didn't need Rikki Stormgren after the first bit, folks. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 03:07 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 02:37
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They all pulled a Jesus.
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Dec 17, 2015 03:17
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Not sure if I should spoiler-block things since I bet some people will be watching it later... Well, like I predicted, the ending was super rushed and kinda hurt my enjoyment of the whole affair in an admittedly-unfair-but-gently caress-it way. Outside the holy-hell-they-are-devils bit, the most interesting stuff in the book happens at the end: the Overlord's homeworld, the kinda-sorta communication with the Overmind (I actually dug the conversation with the tiny bit of the Overmind more than I figured I would), the discussion of what happens to society after the kids leave, the return to discover that the children we last saw are clearly no longer human children, the reason why humans have seen Overlords as demons, etc. All of that got way too compacted to deal with a storyline with Rikki that was basically done with in the first third of the series.
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Dec 17, 2015 04:16
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I plan to read the book at some point after seeing this but I'm wondering, is it ever explained in the book why The Overlords are not able to become part of the Overmind? I mean it was explained as a connection between all living things, a collection of the universe. The Overlords are living things in that universe, what keeps them from joining it? Were they specifically designed by the Overmind to not join so they can help other species join or were they chosen by the Overmind because they have this trait for some odd reason?
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Dec 17, 2015 06:03
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Gordong Dongbay posted:I plan to read the book at some point after seeing this but I'm wondering, is it ever explained in the book why The Overlords are not able to become part of the Overmind? I mean it was explained as a connection between all living things, a collection of the universe. The Overlords are living things in that universe, what keeps them from joining it? Were they specifically designed by the Overmind to not join so they can help other species join or were they chosen by the Overmind because they have this trait for some odd reason? Just that they're not built able to do so. I tend to think of it as chirality in molecules, their brains are right-handed or something.
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Dec 17, 2015 06:11
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I remember debating that point with my SciFi/Fantasy teacher in high school, actually. He took the position that the Overlords were slaves and could never ascend into the Overmind, but I argued that it didn't have to be chattel slavery, that they could be in something more like indentured servitude where the slaves could either be freed / buy their freedom. There's nothing stopping from another race coming up to take the Overlord's position, and the Overlords children start acting odd. It could be that it's just awfully  that the Overlords have to go on.edit: this is super nitpicky, but I think I preferred the book's concept that the children were dissolving the planet, rather than one kid basically blowing up the planet. Sure, they make sure to say she's drawing energy, but it doesn't really look it. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 07:10 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 06:36
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Wow. Having never managed to get through the book (I find a lot of Clarke's writing to be kind of... sloggy to endure) that ending hit a lot harder than I was expecting.
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Dec 17, 2015 07:01
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Never read the book but I thought that was as about as beautiful an ending as I've seen in a scifi story in forever. It was full of emotion and wonder and tension and just flat out floored me. I'm seeing here it might not have worked for some people that read the the book but I am amazed at how much I was drawn into everything. Ricky's final stretch especially really grabbed me and I think Mike Vogel was a real standout in this series. I seriously think I'll have to go back and redo my Top 10 for this year because this just came out of nowhere and completely knocked me out. Sorry it didn't land the same for some of you but for me it was something special.
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Dec 17, 2015 08:48
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Gordong Dongbay posted:I plan to read the book at some point after seeing this but I'm wondering, is it ever explained in the book why The Overlords are not able to become part of the Overmind? I mean it was explained as a connection between all living things, a collection of the universe. The Overlords are living things in that universe, what keeps them from joining it? Were they specifically designed by the Overmind to not join so they can help other species join or were they chosen by the Overmind because they have this trait for some odd reason? I might need to go back and read it, but there was some possible implication in the book that just as humans weren't special for developing psychic powers, maybe the Overlords weren't special for not developing them and just incredibly useful. Book minor spoiler, but kinda/not show spoiler (in that while it spoils show plot, it does it with something not in the show): Scratch the humans not being special, they were actually a fast track operation. The prediction was once they went interstellar they would develop psychic powers and pollute the species around them that also just happened to be medium/high risk, creating a small nodule of power that would mess up the Overmind in that region.
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Dec 17, 2015 10:24
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Subcomputer posted:I might need to go back and read it, but there was some possible implication in the book that just as humans weren't special for developing psychic powers, maybe the Overlords weren't special for not developing them and just incredibly useful. Book minor spoiler, but kinda/not show spoiler (in that while it spoils show plot, it does it with something not in the show): Scratch the humans not being special, they were actually a fast track operation. The prediction was once they went interstellar they would develop psychic powers and pollute the species around them that also just happened to be medium/high risk, creating a small nodule of power that would mess up the Overmind in that region. They should have elaborated on that more and why we knew what the overlords looked like. The only thing that was disappointing was the rush job on the home world scene. As a father of two young children the scene when the children ascended had tears streaming until the moment was spoiled by the ex military dude with a nuke. What a bad addition.
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Dec 17, 2015 13:04
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The nuke thing is straight out of the book, if I remember correctly.
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Dec 17, 2015 16:26
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I clearly missed something so I have a few questions, DO NOT READ if you're a spoilers guy. - So all the children were taken. - Guy gets on the ship, travels 40 years to Overlord planet. (Also I thought he was on the back of a whale or something, but then next time we see him he is next to a squid?) - Humans died, then the earth died, or earth died, then the humans died. - Overlords find the Guy, take him back to his planet when he asks, it is long dead. - But Jennifer girl is still there? After 80 years? Just hanging out being a Overmind conduit or whatever? For what purpose? Nobody was visiting her like the Overlords did with the conduit on their planet, using it to communicate. - And then she destroys the Earth, or the Overmind destroys it? I assumed there would be a solar flare or something, and thats what they were saving humans from, but it appears like that white beam is what blows up Earth. Once again, why? All the humans were gone and the planet was dead. Why blow it up? - Also why bother with the animals? Was it really just to make a zoo, I thought it was supposed to be some sort of Ark. Were the animals ever explained in the book? Why not just take DNA samples? Also you'd have to be an iiiiiiiidiot to turn down the Overlords offer. Just flying around with Alien Satans visiting crazy squid people and freaking them out. Like the next species they visit their devils look EXACTLY like humans so they trot you out in front of the crowd instead of Karellen. bring back old gbs fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 16:47
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Overall I enjoyed the miniseries, the first part was the best IMO with the Karellen reveal being done very well. The ouija board thing was fairly stupid, whether or not it was from the book, and would have been nice if it was replaced with something better in the show but not a huge deal. I also didn't like how the children acted and seemed so different. What's the point of absorbing our race into the overmind when what they're absorbing is do different from normals humans. I just started reading the book so I'm not sure if the show handles it worse than the book does. I like the overall idea and story arc though. The foreward in the book now about ACC explaining how he wrote this back when he believed in the paranormal (and no longer does) is interesting. I used to believe in that junk too when I was kid. Surprised that someone as intelligent as he was believed that stuff into adulthood, even pre-internet.
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Dec 17, 2015 19:12
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:- So all the children were taken. They weren't taken, they just decided on that moment to start communing with the Overmind. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:- Guy gets on the ship, travels 40 years to Overlord planet. (Also I thought he was on the back of a whale or something, but then next time we see him he is next to a squid?) Nope, squid. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:- Humans died, then the earth died, or earth died, then the humans died. It's discussed more in the book, but basically when humanity finds out that they'll never get their kids back and that they'll never have more kids, the response is equal parts calm resignation and violent destruction. Eventually, though, civilization crumbles in gently caress-it-all violence and savagery. This is the basis for humanity having images of the Overlords as Devils: the mental image of Hell On Earth, with red dudes with wings watching over us, being burned into humanity's collective unconsciousness before it even happened. They just didn't realize the red dudes didn't cause it, and were helpless to stop it. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:- But Jennifer girl is still there? After 80 years? Just hanging out being a Overmind conduit or whatever? For what purpose? Nobody was visiting her like the Overlords did with the conduit on their planet, using it to communicate. I took it to mean that she tried to get onto the orbital like they agreed to, but somewhere down the line it broke. They kept her body because they knew Milo loved her. In the book they explain that the children were tinkering with gravity/etc like kids playing with toys, that might be at play, unspoken. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:- And then she destroys the Earth, or the Overmind destroys it? I assumed there would be a solar flare or something, and thats what they were saving humans from, but it appears like that white beam is what blows up Earth. Once again, why? All the humans were gone and the planet was dead. Why blow it up? In the book they explain that the no-longer-humans need a lot of energy to ascend. Matter is energy. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:- Also why bother with the animals? Was it really just to make a zoo, I thought it was supposed to be some sort of Ark. Were the animals ever explained in the book? Why not just take DNA samples? It's partially to have a memorial of Earth. In the book it shows they have massive zoos/museums. 32MB OF ESRAM posted:Also you'd have to be an iiiiiiiidiot to turn down the Overlords offer. Just flying around with Alien Satans visiting crazy squid people and freaking them out. Like the next species they visit their devils look EXACTLY like humans so they trot you out in front of the crowd instead of Karellen. All races see the Overlords as Devils, because the Overlords will be there when their race dies. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 21:11 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 21:06
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He explained it better/|
gohmak fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Dec 17, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 21:08
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MisterBibs posted:I took it to mean that she tried to get onto the orbital like they agreed to, but somewhere down the line it broke. They kept her body because they knew Milo loved her. In the book they explain that the children were tinkering with gravity/etc like kids playing with toys, that might be at play, unspoken. Jennifer was the main Overmind person, not the frozen one. In the book it just takes a really long time to change completely from human to Overmind, and they've been doing it all that time. Believe it or not, Rodricks is black in the book too, and he's even on the cover of the first edition:  That's him seeing the Overmind, but I don't remember why he's naked. VVVV That's basically how the original short story ended. Action Jacktion fucked around with this message at 02:05 on Dec 18, 2015 |
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Dec 17, 2015 22:27
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I feel like stopping at the end of the first part of this actually makes it a better story.
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Dec 18, 2015 01:42
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32MB OF ESRAM posted:I clearly missed something so I have a few questions, DO NOT READ if you're a spoilers guy. Also worth mentioning: - In the book, the overlords are completely incapable of seeing the overmind, due to their lack of psychic abilities. That's why they ask Roderick to describe what he sees on earth, in its final moment (and also when he is on their home planet, but they cut that part). They can't use a camera for that, since it's not able to pick up psychic stuff. - The overlords are much more alien in the book. They are described as more intelligent, being able to have multiple, totally different trains of thoughts at the same time in their heads. They are not exactly someone you would want to spend a lot of time with, as a human. - The overmind is not god. It's an alien intelligence that sees a lot if danger in humanity and preemptively wants to pacify us, before we can spread in the universe and pollute it with our aggression and cruelty. We are being conquered and destroyed against our will. The overlords come to us just as we are about to launch the first people into space, on the high of the space race. The book has this awesome passage about two German rocket scientists, working for the Americans and the Russians, trying to outrun each other to the first manned space mission, just as the overlords arrive: Then Reinhold Hoffmann knew, as did Konrad Schneider at this same moment, that he had lost his race. And he knew that he had lost it, not by the few weeks or months that he had feared, but by millennia. The huge and silent shadows driving across the stars, more miles above his head than he dared to guess, were as far beyond his little Columbus as it surpassed the log canoes of paleolithic man. - Joining the overmind is supposed to be a mixed deal and while the overlords envy us, they are also a little bit glad that they get to keep existing as distinct beings with their own culture and individuality.
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Dec 18, 2015 02:58
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I totally loved it and I haven't read the book. The only thing I didn't like was how long Ricky took to get the gently caress over his old love. He had DECADES with the new one, say I love you and kick it already, drat. I would have wanted to stay on the Overlord's home world just to check out the zoos!! Also, I feel that anything beyond our "knowing" could be considered god, I have no doubt that it just continues to level up from wherever we're at in our knowing - Overlords were like gods to us, they had a god in the Overmind, there's probably a messload of Ultraoverminds beyond that, and so on. I wouldn't BUY the miniseries like they advertised but I enjoyed the hell out of it on TV!
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Dec 18, 2015 04:37
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I really enjoyed this and I'll probably watch it again, but I could've done with like 60% less Rick and 100% less ghost-Annabelle. I also wasn't totally a fan of the timeline manipulation (shortening the 50 year gap to 15 years). I guess the whole point was to have Rick still be of child-having age when the Overlords revealed themselves...but why? Even if he was 80 he still could've experienced bitterness, isolation, and regret. I expected them to erase or minimize the time dilation in Milo's travels after the reduction in the initial time jump...but nope. I think if I personally was writing the thing I would've had him return a little more proximal to the (completely off stage) "hell on earth" action.
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Dec 18, 2015 23:34
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They spent entirely too much time on all the emotional Rick/Annabel poo poo, way too little time on Milo at the Overlords' home planet. I felt ripped off. I was disappointed, but I was also disappointed in the book anyway. Seriously, it's the destiny of the human race to lose all it's character to become part of some universal hive mind? And it needs the Overlords to prepare the way for it? In the immortal words of James Kirk, "What does God need with a starship?" I'm glad Clarke was embarrassed by it in his later years.
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Dec 18, 2015 23:53
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RandomBlue posted:What's the point of absorbing our race into the overmind when what they're absorbing is do different from normals humans. It's been decades since I read the book, but watching the show, I figure the Overmind doesn't want Us, necessarily, it just wants Fresh Minds. Which the children certainly are. They're alien to us, but they'd also be alien to every other component race of the Overmind. I may be being influenced by my recent reread of Stapledon's The Star Maker, which repeatedly features species coming together psychically as group minds, and various species minds coming together as galactic minds, and galactic minds struggling to come together as a universal mind.
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Dec 19, 2015 00:05
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Cerebral Mayhem posted:Seriously, it's the destiny of the human race to lose all it's character to become part of some universal hive mind? And it needs the Overlords to prepare the way for it? In the immortal words of James Kirk, "What does God need with a starship?" I'm glad Clarke was embarrassed by it in his later years. I've only watched the first part, and haven't read the book, but Karellen/the Overlords come across as more interested in keeping humanity from going interstellar, and all the 'hey look we're helping' stuff is just their way of doing that. I mean, Karellen just happens to drop the dialogue bomb that they showed up because we were close to figuring out FTL, and suddenly people stop caring about science (and presumably space travel)? Yeah, totally a coincidence and not the plan...
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Dec 19, 2015 00:06
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The book is better, it explains a lot of things they glossed over. The Overlords were directed to Earth by the Overmind because it could sense that the Breakthrough was imminent and it needed the Overlords to bring about a nurturing environment and to protect the children from being destroyed by the rest of humanity. In the book the children were rounded up by the Overlords rather than ascending into the sky, and taken to other regions of Earth away from the adults. The reason Overlords look like the devil is some kind of temporal physic loop, the death cry of the human race richocets into the past creating a race memory of the devil.
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Dec 19, 2015 00:26
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