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Why are all the men so irresponsible? All that needs to be done is a mandatory neutering program, they can hand you your balls on the wedding night 
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Sep 8, 2021 21:24
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SlipkPIe posted:Used to drop off lunch to my GF at the time who worked at a clinic and the protestors would always yell "don't kill me daddy" to me and the sandwich I was carrying I'm super jealous of this prime opportunity to hail satan in the wild
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Sep 8, 2021 21:29
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When I was in college, I was walking to class and ran into a huge pro-life rally in the campus' central square. There were speakers, signs, giant posters of aborted fetuses, everything. I only saw one counter-protestor, some guy waving a sign that said "BRING BACK THE MCRIB". I spoke to him and said I didn't appreciate what he was implying about the composition of the McRib, and he laughed.Worf posted:I've been kind of trying to figure out why the term for that process is still called abortion. It seems designed to be inherently shaming. Is there honestly another word that people use for that because I would rather use that one It just means "end". Some people call it "terminating" a pregnancy, means the same thing. The problem is, there's no noun that means "to end something" that doesn't sound sinister. Imagine being a young woman in desperate need of a "termination" or "ending". William Bear fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Sep 8, 2021 |
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Sep 8, 2021 21:32
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I've been kind of trying to figure out why the term for that process is still called abortion. It seems designed to be inherently shaming. Is there honestly another word that people use for that because I would rather use that one E: lol people that don't suck / approve of human rights I mean
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Sep 8, 2021 21:36
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Worf posted:I've been kind of trying to figure out why the term for that process is still called abortion. It seems designed to be inherently shaming. Is there honestly another word that people use for that because I would rather use that one pre-emptive salvation
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Sep 8, 2021 21:37
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Worf posted:I've been kind of trying to figure out why the term for that process is still called abortion. It seems designed to be inherently shaming. Is there honestly another word that people use for that because I would rather use that one "termination of a pregnancy" not that that sounds much better
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Sep 8, 2021 21:37
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I recommend something like "reducing the load on taxpayer funded social programs" to get some right wingers on board
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Sep 8, 2021 21:39
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Denatalisation
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Sep 8, 2021 21:39
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The Bloop posted:"termination of a pregnancy" Tbh no  I always try to use the words for things that don't make people feel extra bad if I can. I legit could not recall hearing a more medical term for the process ever
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Sep 8, 2021 21:39
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Colonel Cancer posted:Denatalisation Lol at me trying to pronounce this in conversation
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Sep 8, 2021 21:40
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Worf posted:Tbh no A quick search of some medical journals shows me they simply use the word abortion. One paper used the phrase, "interruption of pregnancy" which makes me imagine someone politely taking the fetus off their hands.
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Sep 8, 2021 21:42
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Ok how about "kidproofing your uterus" then
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Sep 8, 2021 21:43
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My wife worked at an abortion clinic for about 10 years She knew the regular protesters by name That is my abortion story ty
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Sep 8, 2021 21:43
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Colonel Cancer posted:Ok how about "kidproofing your uterus" then meatspace babygate
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Sep 8, 2021 21:44
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I literally cannot conceive of why people are against abortion. It is a completely alien and inconceivable concept because it is never, ever consistent. It always seems like Calvinball because if you drill down into their reasoning they retreat to something else, and if you drill down on that they retreat to something else again. It's complete nonsense and they know it.
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Sep 8, 2021 21:44
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I think it comes down to viewing 50% of the populations bodies as some sort of a valuable resource to be controlled as opposed to autonomous individuals
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Sep 8, 2021 21:45
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Colonel Cancer posted:I think it comes down to viewing 50% of the populations bodies as some sort of a valuable resource to be controlled as opposed to autonomous individuals This is really what it boils down to honestly I've unfortunately had a lot of occasion to spend time with various dregs of society. Men genuinely have a problem seeing women as humans. I have explained very basic emotional concepts that apply to all people regardless of any gender, and men were flabbergasted that even though they knew it applied to them, it would also apply to The women in their lives. You see it in like every aspect of people's lives. Even if you just watch the way that a man does not value a woman's time or is surprised when she might have like a full schedule of career obligations or extracurricular things she might do for fun or fulfillment. But you can take those same people and ask them to walk you through their day and it was like busy as hell and I'm like yeah so was her's man It's literally that they don't comprehend them as human beings. They basically view women as an extension of their sexual need to reproduce kind of like a fleshlight I suppose Worf fucked around with this message at 21:53 on Sep 8, 2021 |
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Sep 8, 2021 21:50
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People will say that it's about "killing a(n unborn) human" and some really do believe that. Nowadays, at least politically, it's about which team/tribe you are on more than anything. One tribe certainly likes shaming and controlling women more than the other, though.
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Sep 8, 2021 21:56
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Lol what a hilarious thread
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Sep 8, 2021 21:58
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Poohs Packin posted:Lol what a hilarious thread It's not all pig balls around here. Some threads are informative. If you don't like it, move on.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:00
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I used to have to drive to a further away McDonalds because the one down the street from my house was by a clinic and those loving protesters with their gross signs would ruin my appetite.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:05
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I think if someone ever comes up with a reliable male birth control pill that comes with even half the side effects of the female ones, the world will blow up in a hilarious fashion
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Sep 8, 2021 22:06
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Colonel Cancer posted:I think it comes down to viewing 50% of the populations bodies as some sort of a valuable resource to be controlled as opposed to autonomous individuals Yeah but they're not even consistent about that (thank god). They have zero thoughts or ideas about how to stop women from getting back alley abortions, the majority of them just stare blankly if you even bring up the concept of non-legal abortions.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:07
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Colonel Cancer posted:I think if someone ever comes up with a reliable male birth control pill that comes with even half the side effects of the female ones, the world will blow up in a hilarious fashion IIRC they came up with one that had similar side-effects and it was deemed unacceptably unsafe
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Sep 8, 2021 22:08
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Poohs Packin posted:Lol what a hilarious thread Some people just don't "get" abortions.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:14
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I knocked up two girls in my 20s that ended up getting abortions and in both cases I paid for it cuz imo it's such a significantly greater pain for them from both a logistics and emotional standpoint that going halfsies seemed unreasonable. In both cases they were fine with it and didn't seem to stick around with them emotionally but neither of them were the types that were in religious families or life conditions where they were especially conditioned to suffer great quantities of self loathing over it. Anyway I was really bad about safe sex when I was younger lol.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:16
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Is the male pill something you can get even? I haven't looked into it much since honestly risk of pregnancy is probably 0 with most of the types of sex I have (I work from home)
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Sep 8, 2021 22:16
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Worf posted:Is the male pill something you can get even? I haven't looked into it much since honestly risk of pregnancy is probably 0 with most of the types of sex I have no and let me tell you that spermicidal jelly is bullshit too. I eat it on my toast every morning and it doesn't do poo poo
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Sep 8, 2021 22:19
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lol jfc
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Sep 8, 2021 22:20
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Who What Now posted:I literally cannot conceive of why people are against abortion. It is a completely alien and inconceivable concept because it is never, ever consistent. It always seems like Calvinball because if you drill down into their reasoning they retreat to something else, and if you drill down on that they retreat to something else again. It's complete nonsense and they know it. I think the arguments against late abortion are strong. While a several-month old fetus doesn't have all of the classical attributes of personhood, it does have consciousness (or something resembling it), particularly a response to stimulus, including pain. Therefore, it seems reasonable to argue that a mature fetus has a right to life. Whether this right overrides its mother's rights is a different matter, of course, though it's interesting to see that Peter Singer held, on utilitarian grounds, that a person has a moral obligation to attach themselves to the violinist (fetus analogue) in Judith Jarvis Thompson's famous pro-choice thought experiment. Arguments against the termination of a several-week old embryo (or even a brand new zygote) are trickier. Generally, I've seen pro-life philosophers argue either in terms of virtue ethics (abortion harms the development of good human character) or capacity argument (while not a person, an embryo has the essence or capacity to develop into one). The latter seems stronger, I think, but there are philosophical problems with whether there is any essential continuity between an embryo and the grown human it may eventually develop into.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:21
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There was a highlights magazine in the one PP and I read the whole thing
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Sep 8, 2021 22:23
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Every "pro-life philosopher" I've ever encountered was part of the catholic church, a baby murdering child raping abortion of an organization.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:23
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one of my friends had a phantom pregnancy about a year ago and had to get a D&C because her body thought she was pregnant even though there was nothing in there. It was really upsetting for her because she and her husband were trying to get pregnant at the time and were really excited. She'd had a miscarriage once before (when she was much younger, before they were married and when she was still smoking, etc) so she wasn't sure how fertile she was gonna be able to be. it was a really horrible thing she had to go through, having a real D&C procedure for a non-baby who didn't exist, even though she wanted it. A few months after the procedure she did successfully get pregnant and their daughter is a month old this week and very cute though so it all worked out ok 
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Sep 8, 2021 22:24
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Lets move away from explicit pro-choice / anti-abortion argument discussion itt please Discussing experiences related to the topic and protesters and such is fine but we aren't going to do a philosophy here and Answer the Question
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Sep 8, 2021 22:26
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William Bear posted:I think the arguments against late abortion are strong. While a several-month old fetus doesn't have all of the classical attributes of personhood, it does have consciousness (or something resembling it), particularly a response to stimulus, including pain. Therefore, it seems reasonable to argue that a mature fetus has a right to life. Whether this right overrides its mother's rights is a different matter, of course, though it's interesting to see that Peter Singer held, on utilitarian grounds, that a person has a moral obligation to attach themselves to the violinist (fetus analogue) in Judith Jarvis Thompson's famous pro-choice thought experiment. No woman, none, is waking up in the 8th month of her pregnancy and saying "Aw, gently caress, I completely forgot to have an abortion! Haha, silly me, better hop on down to PP to blender this baby!" It simply does not happen. The only reason any woman has a late-term abortion is because it is medically necessary. Late-term abortion arguments are a disingenuous way to sneak in bans for abortions of all kind. They are not logically consistent with anti-abortionist arguments. I'm not saying you're any of these things, I'm just explaining how this sort of argument is an outright lie on the part of anti-abortionists. William Bear posted:
If anti-abortionists actually believed the latter then they would be arguing to ban Invitro Fertilization because IVF requires harvesting and fertilizing multiple eggs, keeping only the couple most viable, and then destroying the rest. Every single IVF treatment would be a massacre under this logic but not a single one of them protests outside of a fertility clinic. E: Sorry Bloop, I'll drop it Who What Now fucked around with this message at 22:36 on Sep 8, 2021 |
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Sep 8, 2021 22:27
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I knew people who used Dr. Kermit Gosnell's illegal and unsanitary late-term abortion clinic in West Philadelphia. His operation is what you get when you deny women access to medical care and you'll see popping up all across Texas. It was something like $2600 to go to another state to get it done or around $300 to do it at his clinic and he did some seriously dangerous poo poo like let barely-trained people perform procedures. https://whyy.org/articles/kermit-gosnells-west-philly-house-of-horrors-could-be-bought-by-anti-abortion-group/ Also, you can drive THOSE people crazy by telling them that Frank Sinatra's mom was basically able to pay for his early music career by doing back alley abortions.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:27
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Understood.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:28
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NC Wyeth Death Cult posted:Also, you can drive THOSE people crazy by telling them that Frank Sinatra's mom was basically able to pay for his early music career by doing back alley abortions. Hell yeah, another abortion success story
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Sep 8, 2021 22:29
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Let me tell you if you have a pregnancy in Utah that has a whole bunch of genetic abnormalities that mean you are going to lose the pregnancy at some point, better hope you don't have State health care. Happened to my family so not only are we reeling from very bad news, but now are looking at paying thousands out of pocket to end the pregnancy before it basically ends itself or results in a stillborn child or lots of other "not compatible with life" conditions that the fiance and I had agreed would never be something we would endure a potential life to. We also have "morality panels" for a lack of better words here when you want to end a pregnancy for medical reasons so we were getting weeks and weeks of delays so what could have been one of the simple take some pills procedure ended up turning into a surgical one and just created tons and tons of stress. Pretty much the reason we never tried for another child after that, might have still if we hadn't had all that extra stress and weeks and weeks of worrying forced on us. In the end though when we did go to get the abortion done the faetus didn't have a heart beat anymore so suddenly it was a covered procedure again and like a 100 dollar copay. gently caress Red States in America basically.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:35
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William Bear posted:I think the arguments against late abortion are strong. While a several-month old fetus doesn't have all of the classical attributes of personhood, it does have consciousness (or something resembling it), particularly a response to stimulus, including pain. Therefore, it seems reasonable to argue that a mature fetus has a right to life. Trying to pin the right to life to some measurable, scientific test about cognition, pain, or response to stimuli is a very slippery slope. At the very least, it needs to be accompanied by the assumption of a human "soul" or some other unmeasurable significance to explain why the same test isn't used for animals that we slaughter in the billions each year that would rank higher than a human embryo in the same tests. I'm not arguing it's wrong to elevate human life necessarily, but once you do, the merit of a scientifically measurable test falls away and all that's left is trying to define an arbitrary point in the development that a fetus becomes a human.
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Sep 8, 2021 22:37
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