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Rolo posted:My mom gave me the complete short story collection of Flannery O’Connor. I’ve never read her before and the internet says positive things but I wouldn’t put it past her to slip conservative boomer stuff onto my bookshelf. She also likes some really good things so I’m wondering which this is. O'Connor is brilliant and a big thumbs up. She is a deeply religious writer but her writing is fundamentally Catholic and thus in deep conflict with most modern evangelical boomer "Christianity."
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Dec 28, 2021 00:27
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Xanderkish posted:So I recently found out, to my shock, that the Unabomber's manifesto, Industrial Society and its Future, is apparently something that non-fringe people read and discuss 
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Dec 28, 2021 00:46
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I would tell you to read Pentti Linkola instead but I think he's only been published in English by (fellow) weird nazis
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Dec 28, 2021 01:56
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I think my general preference is not reading people who advocate the violent collapse of modern civilization. I read this just because I wanted to figure out what the fuss was about. One thing that stood out to me was how a lot of people/sources seem to pick and choose what points they think are "interesting" from the manifesto. People on the right focus on the parts on the erosion of freedoms, while people on the left focus on the environmental stuff. No one I've read seems to mention the part where Kaczynski expresses concern that a cure for diabetes might weaken the gene pool. Mostly, it's just a typical extremist manifesto. Bad parts of modern life pose apocalyptic threats and only violence can stop it. People participating in modern life are either dehumanized as part of "the system" or are sheeple being manipulated and don't know what they really want/need. Plus the internal contradiction of "this powerful minority of people are enforcing their preferred vision of society on people against their will, so let's form our own powerful minority of people to enforce our preferred vision of society on people against their will." I can't help but feel like there's some kind of "edginess" appeal to this manifesto that keeps a certain segment of law-abiding society talking about it. Like "Oooh, I read the Unabomber's manifesto and he made some good points". It's not the only thing, because he's obviously good at tapping into people's anxieties about modern life. But pretty much everything he says can be found in other sources, just not with the "wow" factor of the author loving bombing people.
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Dec 28, 2021 02:54
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i dont think its people being edgy so much as it is being the unabomber gives you pretty good brand recognition. its not like most people are weighing up all the anarchoprimitivist texts and choosing based on strength of argument, or how cool itd be to say youve read it (tho im sure some people do), theyre picking up ted kaczynski and not john zerzan or whoever because no one knows or has ever known who the gently caress john zerzan is. youre far more likely to find industrial society and its future, and then it by necessity ends up having way more cultural impact and being more worthy of study because of it, doesnt really reflect on the quality of the scholarship or the writing in general, tho i hope if i ever get mkultrad i remain as relatively lucid as kaczynski.
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Dec 28, 2021 04:17
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also most people dont like their jobs, youd probably get people saying codreanu had good points if for my legionaries had bits about never having to go through hr training again
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Dec 28, 2021 04:24
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CestMoi posted:i dont think its people being edgy so much as it is being the unabomber gives you pretty good brand recognition. its not like most people are weighing up all the anarchoprimitivist texts and choosing based on strength of argument, or how cool itd be to say youve read it (tho im sure some people do), theyre picking up ted kaczynski and not john zerzan or whoever because no one knows or has ever known who the gently caress john zerzan is. youre far more likely to find industrial society and its future, and then it by necessity ends up having way more cultural impact and being more worthy of study because of it, doesnt really reflect on the quality of the scholarship or the writing in general, tho i hope if i ever get mkultrad i remain as relatively lucid as kaczynski. I think you're right about the brand recognition part (disconcertingly, Kaczynski says as much in the manifesto). You'd probably have more people checking out your soundcloud if you hold a hair salon hostage. I do think the transgressive part still plays a role, but God knows a great way to get your message out is to kill a bunch of people, unfortunately. It helps that Kaczynski is the closest thing to a "safe" terrorist I can think of in terms of feeling the least weird reading their literature. Kaczynski's kind of a terrorist for everyone: he talks poo poo about a lot of things that a lot of people don't like (such as, as you point out, how their job sucks), but he's not, like, railing against the Polish or Catholics or anything that would really raise people's mental defenses. I feel like he's the closest thing to a politically correct terrorist that I can think of without making my brain hurt. Which might explain why people on the right and left sometimes express sympathies for some of his ideas, either shortly before or shortly after saying "WHILE I DON'T CONDONE HIS METHODS-"
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Dec 28, 2021 05:13
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Xanderkish posted:So I recently found out, to my shock, that the Unabomber's manifesto, Industrial Society and its Future, is apparently something that non-fringe people read and discuss. For the nutjobs, the bible comes first; this is a close second. And, they take "Uncle Ted's" word as gospel.
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Dec 28, 2021 05:23
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i wish teddy k was as cool as his reputation makes him out to be..it's funny how he wasn't allowed to represent himself at his trial because both the defence and the prosecution were too freaked out by the prospect of taking his views seriously though
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Dec 28, 2021 09:17
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alienation is a hell of a drug in conclusion, bomb oil refineries now before it's too late (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 28, 2021 15:27
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SniperWoreConverse posted:alienation is a hell of a drug Looks like its too late...FOR YOU I read the manifesto when it was first published because I was right into the Unibomber drama and it seemed like illogical disconnected rantings of a crazed mind to me then and I'm sticking with it
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Dec 28, 2021 18:26
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With what I know now about social media and the completely unavoidable climate Armageddon, Ted was the sane one.
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Dec 28, 2021 18:29
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Take the plunge! Okay! posted:With what I know now about social media and the completely unavoidable climate Armageddon, Ted was the sane one. Smart... for a stemlord!
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Dec 28, 2021 18:30
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Bilirubin posted:I read the manifesto when it was first published because I was right into the Unibomber drama and it seemed like illogical disconnected rantings of a crazed mind to me then and I'm sticking with it There's enough of a throughline for me to think that there's an underlying logic--he basically says that things most people think are bad are even worse, and things people are worried about are definitely going to happen and lead to dystopia, pretty typical extremist stuff--but it's definitely disconnected. In between talking about the coming technological dystopia, he'll go off on rants about how much leftists suck and they're only leftists because they think they're failures. I'm near the end now and he's repeating a lot of his points. In addition to other things, the Unabomber could have used an editor. Also sometimes he's just factually wrong, and not in the way where he's talking about how at some indeterminate point in the future genetic engineering will happen in the way he says, but in saying things like "The Industrial solution was supposed to eliminate poverty, but it didn't!" When, you know, extreme poverty has in fact decreased pretty substantially, which was apparent even in 1995, and so on. Thankfully, he offers a perfectly attainable solution: the total synchronized collapse of all industrial civilization, across every nation simultaneously. Don't take any political office, because then you're part of the system, but just gently caress poo poo up in some vague unspecified way that probably involves a lot of murder so that everyone decides "drat, this sucks, let's go back to making GBS threads in the woods again". I'd point out this seems unfeasible, but then again he got caught because he insisted on getting published in the Washington Post, and his brother recognized his handwriting, so I think it's fair to say he was pretty incompetent at revolutionary conspiracy.
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Dec 28, 2021 19:32
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I didn't read the Umamibomber's manifesto because he's American and as a real person I can't care about any American's views on anything  Like Malcom X's views are the same as Lowtax's views as far as I'm concerned.(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Dec 28, 2021 19:34
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Hell, same.
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Dec 29, 2021 01:38
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I don’t think anyone was holding out for the 40 year old Finnish man on the nerd forum being a thoughtful reader of racial politics anyways.
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Dec 29, 2021 05:15
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Xanderkish posted:There's enough of a throughline for me to think that there's an underlying logic--he basically says that things most people think are bad are even worse, and things people are worried about are definitely going to happen and lead to dystopia, pretty typical extremist stuff--but it's definitely disconnected. In between talking about the coming technological dystopia, he'll go off on rants about how much leftists suck and they're only leftists because they think they're failures. I'm near the end now and he's repeating a lot of his points. In addition to other things, the Unabomber could have used an editor. goonproject: edit the Unibomber Manifesto into a coherent thesis
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Dec 29, 2021 05:47
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I'll also point out that the cover of the kindle version of the manifesto I bought is...less than tasteful. The description is similarly, "uhhh" Panthera Classics posted:On September 19th, 1995, the New York Times printed an essay by a known terrorist in a desperate attempt to stop his string of civilian bombings. Truly, who could deny the genius wisdom of such statements as Unabomber posted:The moral code of our society is so demanding that no one can think, feel and act in a completely moral way. For example, we are not supposed to hate anyone, yet almost everyone hates somebody at some time or other, whether he admits it to himself or not. Really Makes You Think about giving yourself a lobotomy
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Dec 29, 2021 06:19
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welp that's what happens when you get rowdy in the library
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Dec 29, 2021 16:02
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I'm trying to find a copy of King Coal, and the situation is super hosed up. All I can find is those procedurally generated public domain books where the cover is a public domain picture and I'm sure half the pages will be upside down or something
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Jan 8, 2022 05:33
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Gripweed posted:I'm trying to find a copy of King Coal, and the situation is super hosed up. All I can find is those procedurally generated public domain books where the cover is a public domain picture and I'm sure half the pages will be upside down or something You can set published date ranges on Abebooks. https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Se...h=2000&yrl=1800 Some of those are still (likely) crap editions, but the first result claims to be the Bantam Classics edition, and there are some old hardcovers available farther down. Ornamented Death fucked around with this message at 06:19 on Jan 8, 2022 |
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Jan 8, 2022 06:16
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Ornamented Death posted:You can set published date ranges on Abebooks. I don't like to buy used books online
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Jan 8, 2022 22:43
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Gripweed posted:I don't like to buy used books online Then get it at Project Gutenberg? The situation isn't super hosed, there are copies available from a variety of sources, you just seem to have some weird prejudices against those sources.
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Jan 9, 2022 02:57
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Ornamented Death posted:Then get it at Project Gutenberg? I want to buy a physical copy in good condition. Project gutenberg has the text of books but doesn't provide physical copies. Buying used books online is dicey because you can't examine the condition yourself. And the new copies are the print-on-demand public domain books that often have typos or formatting issues. None of that is weird prejudice. That is all facts about books. Upton Sinclair is one of the most famous writers in American literature, so I expected all of his novels to still be in print from a reputable publisher. I was surprised and disappointed to discover that is not the case. There is no reason for you to be upset
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Jan 9, 2022 05:18
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Honestly, I do feel like finding a decent copy of anything public domain is starting to get hard because none of the online retailers are cracking down on lovely transfers of Project Gutenberg TXT files with no quality control.
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Jan 9, 2022 05:34
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Rand Brittain posted:Honestly, I do feel like finding a decent copy of anything public domain is starting to get hard because none of the online retailers are cracking down on lovely transfers of Project Gutenberg TXT files with no quality control. Archive.org is generally the best resource these days. e.g., https://archive.org/details/kingcoalanovel00brangoog
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Jan 9, 2022 05:46
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Gripweed posted:I want to buy a physical copy in good condition. Project gutenberg has the text of books but doesn't provide physical copies. Buying used books online is dicey because you can't examine the condition yourself. And the new copies are the print-on-demand public domain books that often have typos or formatting issues. Buying used books online is not that dicey. The seller lists what condition it is in. If you only buy in Very Good condition or better, you should be perfectly fine.
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Jan 9, 2022 17:09
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Bandiet posted:Buying used books online is not that dicey. The seller lists what condition it is in. If you only buy in Very Good condition or better, you should be perfectly fine. Sure they say it's in good condition and it looks fine in the photos. But then you get it in hand and it turns out it has that thing some old paperbacks get where the cover feels like it's about to tear off at the seam every time you open it. No thank you.
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Jan 9, 2022 17:28
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Gripweed posted:Sure they say it's in good condition and it looks fine in the photos. But then you get it in hand and it turns out it has that thing some old paperbacks get where the cover feels like it's about to tear off at the seam every time you open it. No thank you. Then only buy ones that say "like new" and return them if they're falling apart
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Jan 9, 2022 18:32
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Bandiet posted:Buying used books online is not that dicey. The seller lists what condition it is in. If you only buy in Very Good condition or better, you should be perfectly fine. Almost every shop here lists everything that isn't absolutely pristine as K3 ("good") or lower just so they get less complaints (which, of course, is the sensible thing to do if you sell on-line a lot). So you might get like a 95/100 or a 50/100, you never know! And then there's the one or two sellers who are on my black list because they actually have detailed descriptions of condition but they only technically don't lie in said descriptions. I order from them anyway because they have books that would cost 100€+ elsewhere except they're never even in stock like why the gently caress are the second and third part of the first-edition Dune translations so loving hard to find?!?!?. (It's because no-one bought them after reading the first part lmao lol XD.)
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Jan 9, 2022 18:38
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Ras Het posted:Then only buy ones that say "like new" and return them if they're falling apart I would rather only buy new books online and used books only in real life and avoid the whole situation. All of this is aside from the fact that Upton Sinclair is one of America's most famous writers so it is surprising and disappointing that his novels aren't in print from a reputable publisher
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Jan 9, 2022 18:49
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Maybe they're not in print because there's too many pristine copies in circulation
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Jan 9, 2022 19:06
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I wonder how much the price of King Coal scam editions (and other editions) has gone up since goons started Googling for copies. e: Was reading a piece in an issue Tähtivaeltaja on the 1987 World Con in Birmingham and apparently there was an old guy just sitting there signing things as Robert E. Howard, and no-one knew who he was. Maybe it was Robert E. Howard. Also Iain Banks got apprehended by the filth because he happened to be scaling the hotel wall while a robbery took place. This is book-related because at least one of them 3D Megadoodoo fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Jan 9, 2022 |
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Jan 9, 2022 19:13
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Wasn't that also the Worldcon with heavy interference from Scientology? Edit: Yep, there we go. Sham bam bamina! fucked around with this message at 23:43 on Jan 9, 2022 |
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Jan 9, 2022 23:36
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i've never ordered a second hand book online and had it be in particular bad condition. seems like something you don't actually need to to worry about
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Jan 10, 2022 04:58
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Sham bam bamina! posted:Wasn't that also the Worldcon with heavy interference from Scientology? There was a line like "and the pesky Hubbardists were everywhere just because they financed it". (And the American attendees got mad at petty things like three times and were all 200 kg. Just quoting.)
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Jan 10, 2022 05:03
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So Encanto is what happens when Disney hires Lin-Manuel Miranda to adapt 100 Years of Solitude, isn't it
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Jan 16, 2022 16:08
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3D Megadoodoo posted:I wonder how much the price of King Coal scam editions (and other editions) has gone up since goons started Googling for copies. That'd be a hell of thing, since the real Howard died in 1936.
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Jan 17, 2022 17:08
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Davros1 posted:That'd be a hell of thing, since the real Howard died in 1936. Donald Trump was POTUS and will be again. There's no such thing as impossibility.
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Jan 17, 2022 18:37
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