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OpenlyEvilJello posted:6 August 1943 Shigure was the fourth IJN destroyer in that Tokyo Express run and also took a torpedo that went straight through the rudder... but didn't explode. Combination of repeating the same tactic over and over again, combined with massively increasing amounts of radar - and experience with it - on US ships was extremely deadly. Also, currently reading through Japanese Destroyer Captain and Hara's comments about the mission planning for that run, as well as the battle itself, are fascinating. The whole book is fascinating and I'd wholly recommend it to everyone, but Vella Gulf is the topic of the day.
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Aug 7, 2017 04:41
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 19:36 |
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Got to give the Allies credit. They.. Sailed up a task force to the guns of two superbattleships, managed to get survivors past them and land on Rabaul. Well, a few survivors mind.. You should be hiring them.
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Aug 7, 2017 05:19
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Leperflesh posted:They're listed there, but you don't have to build them in your industry, assign them to divisions, load them onto ships, etc. right? It just adds them to units as appropriate, takes them out during combat, and then you get more when your unit is in supply? Yes, you do not have to ship individual guns towards extant units to reinforce them. A unit has to: * be in Rest mode * have minimal Disruption and Fatigue * have supplies in excess of twice its demand before it will start accepting replacements. The Allies get a set number of "devices" flowing into their pools per turn, at varying rates and dates - this can sometimes create situations where certain devices cannot be replenished anymore because they're no longer being "produced" by the game. For the Japanese, every device has a certain "build cost" and "manpower cost". Build points are generically produced by industry, while manpower points are generically produced by cities. The game analyzes total demand of devices across your entire force, and builds whatever it thinks you need, taking the amount of build points available into account. The device then goes into the device pools, and then any units can accept replacements, draws them from the pool.
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Aug 7, 2017 06:42
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Leperflesh posted:They're listed there, but you don't have to build them in your industry, assign them to divisions, load them onto ships, etc. right? It just adds them to units as appropriate, takes them out during combat, and then you get more when your unit is in supply? Sorry, I took your post to mean they weren't individually tracked, which they are, but not to the extend of tracking the manufacturing process along with it. My bad.
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Aug 7, 2017 07:27
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OK so, the Japanese forces in Noumea if they are running low on guns will need to rest and have double supply in order to replenish. That's pretty tough I bet, keeping them in great supply must be difficult. I would love to see how many guns they really have, like if that last bombardment attack really represents all they've got, that's terrible and I'd have to agree with Grey that they're not going to win. Jobbo_Fett posted:Sorry, I took your post to mean they weren't individually tracked, which they are, but not to the extend of tracking the manufacturing process along with it. My bad. Nah that's OK, I'm hardly an expert on this game; but I have seen other LPers utilize bombardment far, far more than Grey, and to great affect. I've long suspected the lack of visible progress in the combat reports is the issue.
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Aug 7, 2017 22:31
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Leperflesh posted:OK so, the Japanese forces in Noumea if they are running low on guns will need to rest and have double supply in order to replenish. That's pretty tough I bet, keeping them in great supply must be difficult. Could be, but could also be Grey not properly using all his available assets!
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Aug 7, 2017 23:08
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Jobbo_Fett posted:I think we should keep flooding infantry units onto a small worthless island in hopes of gaining absolutely nothing.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:12
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Noumea is a valuable asset worth lots of points, and once he holds it it'll be similarly hard for the allies to take it back.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:18
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Reuben Sandwich posted:Is that how it really is in the game? I was under the impression it was valuable that planes from Noumea would raid the shipping lanes just south of the island. Considering what's available in the near area, I don't personally believe that Noumea is worth sending so many units to attack a well defended area. Let them send in supplies and men while you bomb/sink them for months. Let the lack of supplies starve your opponent out, rather than losing 1,000 AV in an attack that gains absolutely nothing AND opens you up to a potentially strong counter-attack.
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Aug 7, 2017 23:29
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Considering what's available in the near area, I don't personally believe that Noumea is worth sending so many units to attack a well defended area. Let them send in supplies and men while you bomb/sink them for months. Let the lack of supplies starve your opponent out, rather than losing 1,000 AV in an attack that gains absolutely nothing AND opens you up to a potentially strong counter-attack. I think you're on the money. There are few hexes in this game outside of Japan's starting territory that are inherently valuable for reasons other than their point value, oil and industry. That's not to say that some hexes can't be developed into larger, more effective bases than others, but a must-have hex in one game may not even be a factor in another, depending on how the game progresses. It's not the base itself that is valuable, but where it is in the context of the game that matters. I've played games where Rangoon was the key to Burma, and others where the Japanese just bypassed it to land on the Indian Coast. I've played games where the Aleutians were totally ignored, and others where control of Adak in the Aleutians was fiercely contested due to it's use as a stepping stone to the Kuriles. Putting too much focus on a single hex because of historical significance and not its game significance is rarely the best way to prosecute the war in WitP:AE. Noumea, while strategically significant, can easily be isolated by taking the dot hexes in the eastern part of the Loyalty Islands. Having a fighter and bomber presence there can completely cut off the rest of New Caledonia. Too many times players get tunnel vision on certain hexes, wasting men and material trying to take a hex that can be bypassed and isolated instead.
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Aug 8, 2017 01:41
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   Our patrol ships chase off the invasion force.  On their way out, they hit one of our subs.  We send out the big boys, and they bring down a ship.   We bring down another Liberator!  Its a two for one day!  The Kido Butai slams into another invasion force at Luganville.  We find another force and bring them down as well. I've missed this!  I love murdertime. It makes thing interesting!   We lose a lot of planes, but we get a few hits in!  He he he!
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Aug 8, 2017 04:14
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blueshifting posted:I think you're on the money. There are few hexes in this game outside of Japan's starting territory that are inherently valuable for reasons other than their point value, oil and industry. Theses words are far too wise to have any place in this forum.
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Aug 8, 2017 04:29
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If you lot carry on being mean I'm going to start the Groggyest The Sims LP - then you will all be sorry!
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Aug 8, 2017 09:34
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Only if theres a mod where your sim plays War in the Pacific Day by Day. While looking after a baby. And posting an update about it. And the game always comes first.
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Aug 8, 2017 09:49
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Grey Hunter posted:If you lot carry on being mean I'm going to start the Groggyest The Sims LP - then you will all be sorry! Not for nothing, but there is a VASSAL module for The Campaign for North Africa
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Aug 8, 2017 10:14
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gradenko_2000 posted:Not for nothing, but there is a VASSAL module for The Campaign for North Africa Has anyone ever finished it? How long would a lets play take for it?
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Aug 8, 2017 11:44
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You could farm it out to people. Give everyone a zone and see how it fails.
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Aug 8, 2017 15:22
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Grey Hunter posted:If you lot carry on being mean I'm going to start the Groggyest The Sims LP - then you will all be sorry! Oh. Oh man. Grey, you are just making me want to be mean now
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Aug 8, 2017 15:24
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Comstar posted:Has anyone ever finished it? How long would a lets play take for it? let's just say you'd have to have a designated successor for if you pass away during the game
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Aug 8, 2017 15:26
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You won reverse midway by using battleships to destroy carriers. No-one has a right to question your
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Aug 8, 2017 15:28
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Comstar posted:Has anyone ever finished it? How long would a lets play take for it? I only ever found a single attempt to "actual play" it, and the players discovered a big gaping hole in close-air-support strikes being really powerful which I assume was never previously discovered because who would playtest the loving thing. goatface posted:You could farm it out to people. Give everyone a zone and see how it fails. I've long thought of doing a cooperative game of WITP, but there are just way too many cross-theater and multi-disciplinary aspects that muddle any lines you might want to establish between any two players, as compared to, say, the co-op games of Decisive Battles that seem to work well enough. Like, I'm imagining you'd need a fairly active Slack channel for people to discuss the game on an on-going basis, maybe even have a communal message board where you post all your orders and then an "Adjutant" plots them all. And the UI isn't going to help, either.
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Aug 8, 2017 15:35
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gradenko_2000 posted:The Campaign for North Africa Oh my God!!!! It is listed to be play 1200 hours, with 10 players! I've never seen such an atrociously poorly thought out game. ... ... Grey, is there any chance to LP this game day by day?
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Aug 8, 2017 17:06
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bunnyofdoom posted:Oh. Oh man. Grey, you are just making me want to be mean now
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Aug 8, 2017 17:49
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gradenko_2000 posted:I've long thought of doing a cooperative game of WITP, but there are just way too many cross-theater and multi-disciplinary aspects that muddle any lines you might want to establish between any two players, as compared to, say, the co-op games of Decisive Battles that seem to work well enough. Coordination won't be that big of a challenge! Judging by every other collaborative goon grog LP, one side will get demoralized after Pearl Harbour is not successful enough/too successful and everyone will quit after a week. So whatever you come up with only needs to run for a week, two at most.
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Aug 8, 2017 17:54
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bunnyofdoom posted:Oh. Oh man. Grey, you are just making me want to be mean now Legacy challenge. Start as a hobo. 10 generations to forge a dynasty.
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Aug 8, 2017 18:53
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Grey Hunter posted:Legacy challenge. Start as a hobo. 10 generations to forge a dynasty. What constitutes as a dynasty?
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Aug 8, 2017 19:19
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How many AP/APAs do the Allies have? You've sunk quite a few by now.
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Aug 8, 2017 19:25
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Grey Hunter posted:Legacy challenge. Start as a hobo. 10 generations to forge a dynasty. I would 100% follow this religiously. Pee pee doo doo you are bad at WitP. Is that mean enough yet?
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Aug 8, 2017 20:23
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Cantorsdust posted:How many AP/APAs do the Allies have? You've sunk quite a few by now. Not an effectively infinite amount like AKs, but enough that it's gonna be hard to make a real dent.
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Aug 8, 2017 20:29
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APAs are much rarer though, if more likely to see combat. He might have done some damage there.
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Aug 8, 2017 20:30
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Lord Koth posted:Also, currently reading through Japanese Destroyer Captain and Hara's comments about the mission planning for that run, as well as the battle itself, are fascinating. The whole book is fascinating and I'd wholly recommend it to everyone, but Vella Gulf is the topic of the day. But can we all agree that the humble-bragging in that book gets annoying really fast?
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Aug 8, 2017 22:20
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I feel like if you survived the duration of the war as a Japanese naval captain, you're allowed to brag, humbly or not
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Aug 9, 2017 00:15
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The Allies get over 100 APA-class ships.
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Aug 9, 2017 00:28
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Grey has kept my lucky ship and the Kido Butai alive well into 1943. *bows respectfully*
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Aug 9, 2017 00:31
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Jobbo_Fett posted:The Allies get over 100 APA-class ships. Allies get a KAJILLION_VALUE of SHIP_TYPE_ANY.
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Aug 9, 2017 01:07
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Jesenjin posted:Oh my God!!!! To also be fair to the game, there's this paragraph at the end of the Sequence of Play. (I poo poo you not; despite how obsessive the game is it does have a sense of self-awareness.) Campaign for North Africa posted:VI. END OF GAME-TURN
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Aug 9, 2017 03:29
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  We continue to mop up the latest Allied folly.  The ships rain death upon our foes.  We've not seen these before. Shame there are two less now.  We start evicting the troops in Rabaul.  Talking about follys.  Carrier! Its the Essex. We leave her burning.  Here comes the retaliation.  The Ryujo takes a hit and reports a ammunition explosion. I think we come out on top here.  We bring down a Liberator.  Two more ships are hit, I'd rather these have hit the Essex.  A bit like that.  We got some hits in, but took a hit ourselves. We took them out in the air though, 2-1 air kills is good!  We confirm five kills.  Okay, she should make it.
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Aug 9, 2017 04:21
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Hot drat this game is heating up faster than a junkie's spoon
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Aug 9, 2017 04:29
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Whew. Taking out Essex would be another excellent success, but I'm honestly not sure how well it looks as a trade for a Japanese CVL. Sending 2,600 men, 100 aircraft and probably $100 million in ship and equipment to the bottom is another tremendous blow.
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Aug 9, 2017 04:31
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Were those American planes already in the air? I don't know how they conducted flight ops after 10 bomb hits. Also was the group just the CV and a CLAA?
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Aug 9, 2017 04:41
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