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pidan posted:My PHUO is that horror movies are better when the monster gets explained. I want to learn that the monster haunting the house is the ghost of a lady who is sad because her child died in a fire or something. I also want to know where that alien came from and why it hungers for human blood so much. Yeah, horror needs rules, some sort of framework. I totally check out when the movie makes clear the evil force or monster can do anything the script calls for and is basically just god / Q what ever loving with people. Give me some general rules. The monster can only come out at night, the ghost is contained to the house and can only fool your senses, the demon only has power over people feeling strong negative emotions. But when the force of horror has no real motive, no framework for what it can or can't do, and nothing the humans do can help them it becomes totally disinteresting. Also why is the ghost trying to kill everyone, why is it a dick? "Well ghosts are evil and scary" isn't good enough.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:32
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pidan posted:My PHUO is that horror movies are better when the monster gets explained. I want to learn that the monster haunting the house is the ghost of a lady who is sad because her child died in a fire or something. I also want to know where that alien came from and why it hungers for human blood so much. I think I'd agree. I like horror movies with a realistic backstory, not just the lazy "this piranha/shark/crab/spider/whatever was exposed to radiation and got friggin huge" kind, or "a ghost is just here i guess, who cares". And yes, I hate the demon stuff because they get built up to be these world-ending threats but end up just shaking some pots around and slamming doors until they get spooked enough to call in the people that can kill it. Just kill them from the start, get it over with.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:34
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My fave horror movie was the 1999 House on Haunted Hill remake. For much of the same reasons, they explain the ghosts/The Darkness monster, and the mechanics of it, for lack of a better term, were genuinely interesting. Hoo boy did that movie not get good reviews.
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Aug 18, 2017 17:39
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Das Boo posted:I like looking at anime intros because that's typically where half the show's budget is. When Japanese animation actually has money behind it, they really go all out on fluid, dynamic movement and angles that Western animation won't touch unless it's like, The Thief and the Cobbler, where trippy animation's the whole point. Studios Madhouse and 4°C are particularly good when they severely distort models to emphasize motion. I dislike anime in general (because it is bad) but I agree re: intros.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:07
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I like the idea of humans getting caught in the path of forces they don't understand, sometimes it's better for a horror movie to not offer exposition in the same vein as Crichton's Sphere
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Aug 18, 2017 18:32
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You ghost hating types should watch Eden Lake and Martyrs.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:34
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EvenWorseOpinions posted:I like the idea of humans getting caught in the path of forces they don't understand, sometimes it's better for a horror movie to not offer exposition in the same vein as Crichton's Sphere There is a fine line between explaining and overexplaining. The perfect horror movie gives the thing a motive but still leaves room for your imagination to wonder about "what if" scenarios. Like in "It" (book, movie, whatever) for example - it is clear how you beat it, but there is a lot of room left to wonder what is "it" and why is it there. So I guess I prefer something in the middle - tell us enough to understand the thing but leave some mystery.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:50
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EvenWorseOpinions posted:I like the idea of humans getting caught in the path of forces they don't understand, sometimes it's better for a horror movie to not offer exposition in the same vein as Crichton's Sphere I think it's all contextual. Sometimes it's better to get the lowdown, especially if it's something that Man Hath Wrought and other times it's better if you don't get an explanation and the horror can from the powerlessness and insignificance in the face of it. Similarly I agree that the monster needs to have a coherent set of internally consistent rules but I don't necessarily think those all need to be revealed to the audience, at least not explicitly so.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:50
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Or perhaps the scariest monster isn't a demon or a mysterious "thing", but rather a gang of teenage criminals, or a Christian cult into torturing women.
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Aug 18, 2017 18:56
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yeah I eat rear end posted:There is a fine line between explaining and overexplaining. The perfect horror movie gives the thing a motive but still leaves room for your imagination to wonder about "what if" scenarios. Like in "It" (book, movie, whatever) for example - it is clear how you beat it, but there is a lot of room left to wonder what is "it" and why is it there. It Follows is the perfect mix of this. There are rules to play by but the entity has no origin story and is mysterious enough that the whole movie maintains a dreamlike quality.
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Aug 18, 2017 19:02
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I thought 1408 did this well too. You never know exactly what the deal is, whether it's a ghost a demon or the room itself is just evil, or why it does what it does, but you understand what it does and it's very clear what the room's immediate objective is.
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Aug 18, 2017 19:04
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The main thing is consistency. It can remain mysterious and alien as long as there's some sort of thematic consistency; it needs to have some kind of internal logic even if it's not really revealed what the deal is. You don't want it to be obvious that it's just acting according to the arbitrary whims of the plot.
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Aug 18, 2017 19:25
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fruit on the bottom posted:I thought 1408 did this well too. You never know exactly what the deal is, whether it's a ghost a demon or the room itself is just evil, or why it does what it does, but you understand what it does and it's very clear what the room's immediate objective is. I will always express my love for 1408 whenever I can. It's not perfect, but for what it is which is basically a solo-actor movie, it's extremely good. The multiple endings is annoying but I mean, it's a stephen king adaptation, you know going in you're going to get a poo poo ending. But yes, what the room is is one of the more interesting parts of it.
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Aug 18, 2017 19:29
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yeah I eat rear end posted:I think I'd agree. I like horror movies with a realistic backstory, not just the lazy "this piranha/shark/crab/spider/whatever was exposed to radiation and got friggin huge" kind, or "a ghost is just here i guess, who cares". Which reminds me of one of my PHUOs: Lovecraft had some interesting ideas but was a poo poo writer.
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Aug 18, 2017 19:34
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Guy Goodbody posted:How can you look at this and not think it's a liartown parody? OH haha that is just the cutest thing lol 
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Aug 18, 2017 19:39
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Sunswipe posted:Which reminds me of one of my PHUOs: Lovecraft had some interesting ideas but was a poo poo writer. That's an extremely common opinion. If you mention you enjoy one of his stories be prepared to get told about how racist he was and how bad he was at writing. I've read his entire work and listened to/read a lot of commentary on the stories, the dude, and his beliefs, and in my experience both the Cthulhu mythos superfans and the "he was total poo poo" crowd are not super familiar with his entire body of work. (He was racist and his prose is too purple tho it's truee)
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Aug 18, 2017 19:56
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Whats your favourite? Me, The Festival or The Colour Out of Space. The nethermost caverns...are not for the fathoming of eyes that see; for their marvels are strange and terrific. Cursed the ground where dead thoughts live new and oddly bodied, and evil the mind that is held by no head. Wisely did Ibn Schacabao say, that happy is the tomb where no wizard hath lain, and happy the town at night whose wizards are all ashes. For it is of old rumour that the soul of the devil-bought hastes not from his charnel clay, but fats and instructs the very worm that gnaws; till out of corruption horrid life springs, and the dull scavengers of earth wax crafty to vex it and swell monstrous to plague it. Great holes secretly are digged where earth's pores ought to suffice, and things have learnt to walk that ought to crawl.
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Aug 18, 2017 19:58
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Guy Goodbody posted:My PHUO is kinda tangential to that; horror movie monsters need rules. Defined abilities, goals, a way to defeat it. Straight White Shark posted:The main thing is consistency. It can remain mysterious and alien as long as there's some sort of thematic consistency; it needs to have some kind of internal logic even if it's not really revealed what the deal is. You don't want it to be obvious that it's just acting according to the arbitrary whims of the plot. Edgar Allen Ho posted:That's an extremely common opinion. If you mention you enjoy one of his stories be prepared to get told about how racist he was and how bad he was at writing.
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Aug 18, 2017 20:09
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My only caveat would be that, if for some reason the rules change, that is something that needs to be pretty explicitly laid out and the reasons need to make sense. I don't have a good example at hand for that. I guess if your monster can suddenly attack during the day, you need to clearly lay out why it can when it couldn't before.
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Aug 18, 2017 20:35
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One of the things I appreciate about Alien is that it doesn't need to gently caress with exposition at all. No one needs to ask what the xenomorph's motivations are because it's pretty obviously 'eat, poo poo, reproduce' Of course then people had to go and retcon some grand space opera into it doverhog posted:Whats your favourite? Me, The Festival or The Colour Out of Space. The Music of Erich Zann
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Aug 18, 2017 21:08
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doverhog posted:Whats your favourite? Me, The Festival or The Colour Out of Space. Dagon.
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Aug 18, 2017 21:22
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Tiggum posted:
True, there's no real reason to read anything but the greatest hits unless you're a superfan. The Temple, The Outsider, The Festival, The Picture in the House, At the Mountains of Madness. ATMOM is especially cute for two reasons, one is how the protagonist comes around to the clearly sentient Elder Things and goes "They, too, were men." Nice change from his older stuff. Secondly the bizarre cliche where four of the dudes on the expedition have not only read the necronomicon but are intimately familiar with it. It makes sense when his protagonist is some folklorist or something but in this case it's a geologist, a biologist, an engineer, and a geology grad student. Also I love Dream Quest of unknown Kadath, it's just so loving nonsensical and absurd it left an impression on me, and it's a very high fantasy take on some weird Lovecraftian poo poo instead of the usual horror. Especially the cat city on the moon and the part where he translates between cats and "the fluttering sounds" of the zoogs. Just imagine this mustachio'd Boston socialite intermittently meowing, screeching, hissing, and chirping while surrounded by fuzzy animals.
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Aug 18, 2017 21:40
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Speaking of horror movies, my PHUO is that Cabin in the Woods was a bad movie. The deconstruction of the theme seemed like low hanging fruit and the plot twist was ridiculous and way over the top. And just for the record, I usually like Whedon's stuff. I think Tucker and Dale vs Evil or Get Out are similar but better movies.
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Aug 18, 2017 21:49
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At the Mountains of Madness is overly long IMO, the shorter stuff is better. It's true it gets repetitive. Read his stuff in various collections at first, much of it translated in Finnish, and then bought the omnibus (1500~ pages). Couldn't get through it. Nice to have around thought to revisit stuff, or read a story sometimes. Cabin in the Woods was ok at best.
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Aug 18, 2017 21:51
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Tiggum posted:Some of his ideas are pretty good, but he clearly didn't have that many of them and he milked them for more than they were worth. More like he milked them for less than they were worth
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Aug 18, 2017 22:07
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The movie adaptation of beyond the veil of sleep was a train wreck and should be watched by anyone who hates themselves
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Aug 19, 2017 03:06
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I'll be sure to check it out
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Aug 19, 2017 03:29
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Don't
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Aug 19, 2017 04:42
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I think every person is somewhere on the autisim spectrum.
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Aug 19, 2017 04:54
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Guy Goodbody posted:My PHUO is kinda tangential to that; horror movie monsters need rules. Defined abilities, goals, a way to defeat it. I understand where your coming from but I've only ever been scared by the invisible undefined monsters and whenever it's given limits or definition it stops scaring me, which is a bummer since so few horror movies make paranormal activity style monsters. That's my unpopular opinion, there should be more movies like Paranormal Activity 1 where less is more.
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Aug 19, 2017 05:49
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We Know Catheters posted:I think every person is somewhere on the autisim spectrum. I mean 0 autism is on the spectrum so yah? Also pointing this out probably makes me at least a 5.
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Aug 19, 2017 08:30
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For me there is no such thing as over-explaining a monster, and I think that's the unpopular opinion. If my ghost story ends with the biography of the ghost in question, an essay on the metaphysics of ghosts, and an explanation of what this specific ghost was trying to accomplish, I'm fine with that. It doesn't all need to be explicit, because in many cases the protagonists won't know either. But in principle, I should get the impression that there is an explanation for what is going on, even if it's not explicit. I think Stranger Things did this well, where we don't really know what the monster is and what it's rules are, but the way it interacts with the human world seems well defined. On the other hand, that series where the dead people come back to life in some French town doesn't explain anything, and it's unsatisfying. The Stephen King novels are a different example, because he does always explain stuff at the end, but most of the time the explanation is kind of ridiculous. On the other hand, the Lovecraft maggot people story mentioned above does it right: there's a strange premise, a growing sense of unease, and finally a reveal that explains exactly what is going on, but that is terrifying in itself. I like Lovecraft, though it is irritating how certain kinds of people, including all non-white and especially mixed-race people, are presented as almost as inherently creepy as the monsters themselves. Even the most enthusiastic racists wouldn't write it like that today. Except for inbred redneck town and mayyybe black swamp town, those still show up in contemporary fiction. pidan has a new favorite as of 08:35 on Aug 19, 2017 |
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Aug 19, 2017 08:32
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I'm not actually sure how unpopular this opinion is, but capacitive buttons are straight up the worst commonplace invention I have seen in my life time and the fact that stupid manufacturers actually still put them on things in a sad attempt to look high tech is annoying as gently caress.
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Aug 19, 2017 09:53
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veni veni veni posted:I'm not actually sure how unpopular this opinion is, but capacitive buttons are straight up the worst commonplace invention I have seen in my life time and the fact that stupid manufacturers actually still put them on things in a sad attempt to look high tech is annoying as gently caress. I miss actual, mechanical buttons on things. I miss the feedback they gave, now that everything is moving toward touchscreens.
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Aug 19, 2017 11:12
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Gyro Zeppeli posted:I miss actual, mechanical buttons on things. I miss the feedback they gave, now that everything is moving toward touchscreens. Same. I wish I could get a phone that has buttons and the same functionality that my phone has now (without being a blackberry). Flip phones need to make a comeback.
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Aug 19, 2017 11:29
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I think that people should activate their turn signals before they start slowing down for a turn.
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Aug 19, 2017 12:59
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doverhog posted:Whats your favourite? Me, The Festival or The Colour Out of Space. The Shadow out of Time is a great little scifi story, but an abominable horror story. The "shocking reveal" of the scroll at the end is completely weightless because it's literally explained to you in intricate detail at the start, but dismissed as the rantings of a mad man. The opening of Call of Cthulhu is pretty boss, and as pure Lovecraft as you get: quote:The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far. The sciences, each straining in its own direction, have hitherto harmed us little; but some day the piecing together of dissociated knowledge will open up such terrifying vistas of reality, and of our frightful position therein, that we shall either go mad from the revelation or flee from the deadly light into the peace and safety of a new dark age.
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Aug 19, 2017 15:45
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Any politician who has a cult of personality crop up around them deserves to be torn down.
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Aug 19, 2017 15:47
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I have no idea what the functional difference between capacitive buttons and whatever normal touchscreen is actually called is. Also, my possible PHUO among lovecraft readers is that I think he repented a lot of his lovely racial views later in life. He never became anything you'd call progressive but you can read the changes in his writing and some of his correspondents correlate the idea that he rethought things. You can also definitely, definitely from his stories read how he went from a clueless self-identified monarchist in the '20s to being a socialist in the '30s. Which (also possible PHUO), is pretty normal and reasonable. Lovecraft was a weirdo but he wasn't half the shut-in he's portrayed as. He married a jewish woman and moved to NYC (and for sure the stories from his NYC period are often "FOREIGNS AND BLACKS AND STRANGERS, OH MY", but after his return to Providence he starts traveling a lot and seems to rethink his views. This is also a period where he puts on weight and generally stops being so much of a goony goon. Lovecraft's travelogues are honestly probably his objectively best writing, although still you can see how weird he is because he spends far more time describing history and architecture than anything about people or things to do. I think his description of Québec is his single longest piece. Edgar Allen Ho has a new favorite as of 15:59 on Aug 19, 2017 |
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Aug 19, 2017 15:48
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Agent355 posted:I mean 0 autism is on the spectrum so yah? I went through this exact thought process but then refrained from posting it for that reason.
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