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StrixNebulosa posted:I've somehow completely missed books by this guy, I'll have a look at his bibliography, thanks! He's a member of the Michael Faber "society pretends he doesn't write genre because he writes purty" crew. Never Let Me Go is a really, really good SF story.
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Mar 1, 2021 23:29
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freebooter posted:"Lockdowns don't work" is usually a bit of a giveaway about somebody's general opinion on COVID. Lockdowns working, as variously defined, implemented, observed, and enforced in America across different jurisdictions and timeframes, is very much an open question and denying that or being unaware of it shows that COVID isn't really what you care about. Butcher's quote seems fine. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 1, 2021 23:30
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that quote is not "fine" it was 9 months ago and he does the standard right wing thing of "states that stayed open are fine" that led to literally hundreds of thousands of people dying in the following 9 months also: Drone Jett posted:Lockdowns working, as variously defined, implemented, observed, and enforced in America across different jurisdictions and timeframes, is very much an open question and denying that or being unaware of it shows that COVID isn't really what you care about are you loving kidding me lol
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Mar 1, 2021 23:36
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Why aren't you perma'd yet race science guy
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Mar 1, 2021 23:37
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multijoe posted:Why aren't you perma'd yet race science guy lol i clicked the rap sheet after i typed a reply and realized i'm an absolute idiot for even responding
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Mar 1, 2021 23:39
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a foolish pianist posted:Kazuo Ishiguro's The Buried Giant has a couple of different errands that different characters are on. Also, it's just a joy to read, same as his other novels. I really liked Never Let Me Go and Remains of the Day (books and movies, the only two my library had at the time), I'll have to check out the rest of his novels. He's got a new one coming out this month, Klara and the Sun. Horn of Ruin is by Tim Akers. I honestly don't remember much of it now, its about a paladin avenging her dead god, and the marketing called it steampunk. Not knight related (so far) but I started reading Cradle after grabbing the first chunk of books free last fall thanks to a tip in this thread. It's a pretty fun quick read right now. The base idea isn't a new one (and I'm currently reading/playing Fate/Stay Night which covers similar themes) but he moves very fast and I can forgive the MC's plot armor with the fun the writer has with everything. I didn't know I wanted Green Lanterns in my shonen animes (wuxia? cultivation?) and now I want to seek out N.K. Jemisin's Far Sector comics. <- Happens early on and is a stretch to compare them but that's what came to mind and has me excited to see more of in the series.
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Mar 1, 2021 23:41
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StrixNebulosa posted:Oh, cool! I was looking him up and found this cool story in his wikipedia; some good series, his ancient greece & jon shannow ones were the ones that i remember most fondly.
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Mar 2, 2021 00:30
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buffalo all day posted:He's a member of the Michael Faber "society pretends he doesn't write genre because he writes purty" crew. Never Let Me Go is a really, really good SF story. Never Let Me Go rocks though I'll sheepishly admit that I was in my late teens when I read it and the allegory sailed right over my head. "Why doesn't she go into hiding! She's a free person, she has access to money," etc. Not SFF, but The Remains of the Day is probably one of the best books I've ever read, and (on multiple levels) the best use of an unreliable narrator I've read.
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Mar 2, 2021 00:56
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freebooter posted:Never Let Me Go rocks though I'll sheepishly admit that I was in my late teens when I read it and the allegory sailed right over my head. "Why doesn't she go into hiding! She's a free person, she has access to money," etc.
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Mar 2, 2021 01:19
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David Mitchell's another one accepted into the "Oh he's not really writing genre" crew, even though all his books, no matter how 'literary' they seem, have a secret war between immortals and psychic vampires going on in the background and it rules.
cptn_dr fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Mar 2, 2021 |
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Mar 2, 2021 01:22
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David Mitchell remains one of my favourite authors and I think Cloud Atlas is still my favourite book, but I wish he would actually either a) write another book entirely about Marinus/the Horologists, or b) write something completely fresh and stop having background cameos from all his other books.
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Mar 2, 2021 01:54
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I'm definitely not anti-lockdown, in fact I think it probably would have been good to have had another one a month or two ago when cases were starting to peak, but everything about this pandemic will continue to be studied and debated for decades. It definitely shouldn't be some third rail of discussion (except for maybe the race science guy). I mean, back when all this started we had very important people saying masks don't help, which I personally thought was bullshit and wore one anyway.
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Mar 2, 2021 02:26
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TOOT BOOT posted:I'm definitely not anti-lockdown, in fact I think it probably would have been good to have had another one a month or two ago when cases were starting to peak, but everything about this pandemic will continue to be studied and debated for decades. It definitely shouldn't be some third rail of discussion (except for maybe the race science guy). I mean, back when all this started we had very important people saying masks don't help, which I personally thought was bullshit and wore one anyway. Sure, but not in this thread except to the extent it relates specifically to authors or books under discussion.
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Mar 2, 2021 02:50
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IMO it's fine to divorce the art from the artist and I can think of any number of writers, musicians, filmmakers and actors who have done lovely things but I still like their work. To each their own of course.
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Mar 2, 2021 03:53
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freebooter posted:IMO it's fine to divorce the art from the artist and I can think of any number of writers, musicians, filmmakers and actors who have done lovely things but I still like their work. To each their own of course. I find this more difficult to do in fiction specifically as words tend to be the most directly influenced by what someone believes. Not to say I can't or won't do it, but there are some authors where I cannot draw the line, Marion Zimmer Bradley. On a happier note, my kindle is locked and loaded now. Will I stop reading webnovels long enough to read the actually good recs from this thread? I don't know, but I've made the barrier to entry as easy as possible!
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Mar 2, 2021 04:05
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StrixNebulosa posted:As I listen to Medieval Death Trip I wonder: are there any modern (well, 1950s-onward) stories that feature knights errant? As in, protagonists who are on an "errand" and uphold a code of values and serve a lord and such. They don't strictly have to be knights, but I'd like it if they did. Hieronymous Alloy posted:Also Gene Wolfe's Wizard/Knight books. Wizard/Knight is incredible, read Wizard/Knight. Or at least, give Wizard/Knight a shot: it's Gene Wolfe, so it has merit, but because it's Gene Wolfe there are like three different stories going on simultaneously and many Very Important Things are alluded to rather than directly stated. I read on on audio and while I enjoyed it immensely, I came away from it knowing that I had missed a lot by not being able to pay really close attention to each carefully-chosen word. Also, content warnings: Book One: The protagonist is a boy from our Earth somewhere around the 1990s, and is definitely A Kid. Early in the book, he is enchanted by a faerie queen and sleeps with her, and is given an adult body with enormous physical strength as a gift afterward. He never regrets it even much later when he's older and wiser, and most of what he does as a knight he does in her name, but, well, enchantment. Book Two: There are giants after the Norse fashion. They are extremely rapey, and while none of that ever happens on-screen, half-giants only happen one way, and that gets referenced a fair bit as a major plot point.
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Mar 2, 2021 09:13
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StrixNebulosa posted:As I listen to Medieval Death Trip I wonder: are there any modern (well, 1950s-onward) stories that feature knights errant? As in, protagonists who are on an "errand" and uphold a code of values and serve a lord and such. They don't strictly have to be knights, but I'd like it if they did. Being pedantic, The Postman by David Brin. Druss isn't the best example of Gemmell as knightly fiction; that's Knights of Dark Renown. Wolf in Shadow is also knightly, although like The Dark Tower the setting is faux-Wild West. It's also much better than The Dark Tower. For my own personal entertainment I'll throw in The Ivanhoe Gambit by Simon Hawke. It's the first in a series of pulp SF novels centred on the premise that in the future "peace in our time" will be achieved by using time travel to fight all wars in the past. The main conceit is that it's set in an alternate universe where various historical novels such as The Scarlet Pimpernel and The Prisoner of Zenda were actually documents of real events. As you may have guessed from the title, the first book sees the protagonists dumped directly into the plot of Ivanhoe.
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Mar 2, 2021 10:32
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pradmer posted:Will Wight's Elder Empire books are all free. He writes it so the trilogies follow the same events for each book but from a different side of the conflict. Have read all of these and they're the most "traditional fantasy" that Wight has published. It's not progression fantasy at all and the world building is really nice. Also it's basically ninjas vs pirates. If you've never given his stuff a try, you should! Edit: it doesn't matter which series you start with though there's a definite general bias to liking the one you started with more than the other. In my opinion,  wins.
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Mar 2, 2021 11:19
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https://twitter.com/alloy_dr/status/1366723717502533634?s=20
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Mar 2, 2021 13:50
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Sure, but not in this thread except to the extent it relates specifically to authors or books under discussion. I agree, and I think at this point there's no doubt about the success of lockdowns, but I do wish people could avoid inflammatory statements in this thread like "Jim Butcher is a COVID denier", and I wish you would clamp down on it at least a bit. At best you could say he's a lockdown denier, and even then I would argue that's uncharitable since it seems to originate from a post 9 MONTHS AGO when I think its fair to say there was very little good data either way on any aspects of COVID, and what there was wasn't exactly easily digestible. All it does is lead the thread down derails. Carrier fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Mar 2, 2021 |
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Mar 2, 2021 14:09
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Carrier posted:I agree, and I think at this point there's no doubt about the success of lockdowns, but I do wish people could avoid inflammatory statements in this thread like "Jim Butcher is a COVID denier", and I wish you would clamp down on it at least a bit. At best you could say he's a lockdown denier, and even then I would argue that's uncharitable since it seems to originate from a post 9 MONTHS AGO when I think its fair to say there was very little good data either way on any aspects of COVID, and what there was wasn't exactly easily digestible. All it does is lead the thread down derails. It's been debated extensively up thread. My personal impression is that Butcher said some stupid poo poo he later recanted but I think there's room for people to have a good-faith belief that either his initial statements aren't something they feel like forgiving, or that his recantation was insufficient, etc. After all this is the forum for discussion of authors and books and I don't want to step on discussion of authors or books. But once it's no longer about an author or a book, yeah, go somewhere else. I realize this creates some weird lines but any other set of lines has worked less well.
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Mar 2, 2021 14:21
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multijoe posted:Why aren't you perma'd yet race science guy Still wondering about this
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Mar 2, 2021 14:48
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Carrier posted:I agree, and I think at this point there's no doubt about the success of lockdowns, but I do wish people could avoid inflammatory statements in this thread like "Jim Butcher is a COVID denier", and I wish you would clamp down on it at least a bit. At best you could say he's a lockdown denier, and even then I would argue that's uncharitable since it seems to originate from a post 9 MONTHS AGO when I think its fair to say there was very little good data either way on any aspects of COVID, and what there was wasn't exactly easily digestible. All it does is lead the thread down derails. As Hieronymous Alloy said, "I think there's room for people to have a good-faith belief that either his initial statements aren't something they feel like forgiving, or that his recantation was insufficient, etc" - this is where I am, and I stated clearly what I think about Butcher, sourced it, retracted the other allegation I couldn't find a source on, and moved on. I don't like Butcher or Dresden but that's a rant that doesn't belong here. If you like reading his works, please continue to do so. Kestral posted:Wizard/Knight is incredible, read Wizard/Knight. Or at least, give Wizard/Knight a shot: it's Gene Wolfe, so it has merit, but because it's Gene Wolfe there are like three different stories going on simultaneously and many Very Important Things are alluded to rather than directly stated. I read on on audio and while I enjoyed it immensely, I came away from it knowing that I had missed a lot by not being able to pay really close attention to each carefully-chosen word. Gene Wolfe is honestly kind of intimidating to read because of how... literary he is. Which is weird to say because I'll happily read literary things and authors like E R Eddison even though I don't have nearly enough of a degree to tackle them. But I have to keep trying with Wolfe, because his works are so influential and interesting. Also, thank you so much for the content warnings, I think I can handle that but it's better to go in prepared. Jedit posted:Being pedantic, The Postman by David Brin. I'm not into Brin, but ooh, Ivanhoe Gambit sounds interesting and I'll put Knights of Dark Renown and Wolf in Shadow on the list, assuming I like Druss. Thanks!
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Mar 2, 2021 14:59
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https://ebookclub.tor.com/quote:This Month’s Tor.com Ebook Club Selection is... Free ebook, get your free ebook here!
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Mar 2, 2021 15:03
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ugh stop putting tamsyn muir blurbs on books, it doesn't work on me, blurbs don't work on me even if they're really cool authors
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Mar 2, 2021 15:08
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and especially don't combine them with queer orc ladies, that's just unfair
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Mar 2, 2021 15:09
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StrixNebulosa posted:As I listen to Medieval Death Trip I wonder: are there any modern (well, 1950s-onward) stories that feature knights errant? As in, protagonists who are on an "errand" and uphold a code of values and serve a lord and such. They don't strictly have to be knights, but I'd like it if they did. They're not modern, and to be honest they're barely fantasy, but I'll grab the chance to promote Leslie Barringer's underappreciated Neustrian Cycle books, Gerfalcon, Joris of the Rock, and Shy Leopardess. They're really fine medieval adventures, and if you like The Worm Ouroboros and that sort of thing, I'd suggest checking them out.
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Mar 2, 2021 15:27
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https://twitter.com/ArkadyMartine/status/1366753586625998855Selachian posted:They're not modern, and to be honest they're barely fantasy, but I'll grab the chance to promote Leslie Barringer's underappreciated Neustrian Cycle books, Gerfalcon, Joris of the Rock, and Shy Leopardess. They're really fine medieval adventures, and if you like The Worm Ouroboros and that sort of thing, I'd suggest checking them out. Oh man, I don't think I've ever heard of these? Thank you!
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Mar 2, 2021 16:11
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I enjoy the titles of this series (I don't care what you tell me, I constantly judge a book by it's cover). I really should get around to reading A Memory Called Empire.
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Mar 2, 2021 16:42
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The Gay Bean posted:Seems like the jury is mostly split on Red Rising. I’m quickly running out of things to read, so I’ll give it a read and at worst I’ll hate it in a fun way or cut my losses early. I'm 2 books in and enjoying it. Just because no one mentioned it, I'll also point out that there's a lot of references to Roman and Greek history/mythology, because like a lot of unimaginative dickhead empires the 'Golds' model themselves quite clearly on those cultures, right down to their names. Not sure if that influences your decision at all but I quite enjoyed that aspect.
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Mar 2, 2021 16:52
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I've started it and I'm enjoying it pretty well so far!
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Mar 2, 2021 17:09
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StrixNebulosa posted:As I listen to Medieval Death Trip I wonder: are there any modern (well, 1950s-onward) stories that feature knights errant? As in, protagonists who are on an "errand" and uphold a code of values and serve a lord and such. They don't strictly have to be knights, but I'd like it if they did. You could try The Reckless Oaths We Made. It's about a man on the autism spectrum who lives as a knight errant and the woman who loves (exploits?) him. It's one of those books that's not genre, but totally is genre.
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Mar 2, 2021 19:41
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freebooter posted:Never Let Me Go rocks though I'll sheepishly admit that I was in my late teens when I read it and the allegory sailed right over my head. "Why doesn't she go into hiding! She's a free person, she has access to money," etc. I remember reading an interesting review (which I'm having trouble finding via Google) of the book that discusses the divided audience response to that aspect of the book. Basically, a lot of SF fans hate it for precisely that reason, and it's hard to imagine someone who isn't an MWoSF writing it that way. But the review argued that this wasn't necessarily a bad thing, just a difference in taste.
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Mar 2, 2021 21:24
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crazyvanman posted:I'm 2 books in and enjoying it. Just because no one mentioned it, I'll also point out that there's a lot of references to Roman and Greek history/mythology, because like a lot of unimaginative dickhead empires the 'Golds' model themselves quite clearly on those cultures, right down to their names. Not sure if that influences your decision at all but I quite enjoyed that aspect. I've read them all, i liked the crumbling roman empire in space schtick a lot. The books are YA level romance tacked onto space opera broad politics merged with 40k Battles type excessive violence (and pauldrons). I would never call them good but they are a good read. Struck down with pneumonia last year they were one of the series i reread.
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Mar 2, 2021 21:25
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Silver2195 posted:I remember reading an interesting review (which I'm having trouble finding via Google) of the book that discusses the divided audience response to that aspect of the book. Basically, a lot of SF fans hate it for precisely that reason, and it's hard to imagine someone who isn't an MWoSF writing it that way. But the review argued that this wasn't necessarily a bad thing, just a difference in taste. I mean...I found the exploration of our understanding of our own limitations and how it's shaped by the society we grow up in to be an incredibly meaningful and heartfelt part of the book! Not everyone who is enslaved dies fighting for their freedom !
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Mar 2, 2021 22:05
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Silver2195 posted:I remember reading an interesting review (which I'm having trouble finding via Google) of the book that discusses the divided audience response to that aspect of the book. Basically, a lot of SF fans hate it for precisely that reason, and it's hard to imagine someone who isn't an MWoSF writing it that way. But the review argued that this wasn't necessarily a bad thing, just a difference in taste. I can 100% see why mainstream SFF readers would react to it that way, for basically the same reason I reacted to it as a teenager: most SFF teaches us that we have agency, that we matter, that we can change the world and choose our own destiny. Obviously sheltered privileged middle class teenagers feel the same way. And I suppose teenage me also thought that if I found myself in an unjust situation I'd at least vehemently react to it and fight back against it. I read some other review shortly afterwards that made me "get" it a bit better, talking about how of course nobody would willingly choose to be a live organ donor but does anyone really willingly choose to be a corporate drone or a minimum wage fast food worker or a suicide bomber? I also think it matches very, very well against The Remains of the Day because it's the same theme but different aspects of it. Never Let Me Go is about the cages society locks us into, The Remains of the Day is about the cages we lock ourselves into. edit - found this on Goodreads too, the film's director responding to the question of "why don't they run away?" quote:Maybe it’s a failing of the film that the question comes up as often as it does – I don’t know freebooter fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Mar 2, 2021 |
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Mar 2, 2021 22:37
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quote:You could have had the obligatory scene where someone tries to run away, but I wouldn't want to see that film. Or, rather, I've seen that film... Yeah, if you want that story, you've Michael Marshall Smith's Spares (which is also a good SF novel!) or that early 2000s action film The Island.
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Mar 2, 2021 22:51
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Silver2195 posted:I remember reading an interesting review (which I'm having trouble finding via Google) of the book that discusses the divided audience response to that aspect of the book. Basically, a lot of SF fans hate it for precisely that reason, and it's hard to imagine someone who isn't an MWoSF writing it that way. But the review argued that this wasn't necessarily a bad thing, just a difference in taste. After reading Never Let Me Go, I read a similar book that was more explicitely sf called A Calculated Life, and it tried to do exactly that, having the character in a similar situation trying to run away and failing, and it kinda sucked. Its 1984-ish ending was far less interesting than it might have been if that character had done literally anything else but try to escape. Those books have already been written. What hasn’t been written enough is exploring what you can do in a dystopia when running away isn’t an option. It’s a far more interesting question when we’re already stuck in a lovely system that feels too big to dismantle
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Mar 2, 2021 22:55
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Borne by Jeff VanderMeer - $2.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01M98T0J7/ The Broken Sword by Poul Anderson - $1.99 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00PI181JI/
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Mar 3, 2021 00:07
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pradmer posted:
I really enjoyed this
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