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ReindeerF posted:I'm not sure where this goes, but he's a Right Wing Media figure: Blackbird Fly fucked around with this message at 05:34 on Aug 25, 2013 |
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Aug 25, 2013 05:32
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So how long until we hear that the money shouldn't be paid back and the students should just have to live with the debt because it's their own loving fault for paying for it in the first place?
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Aug 25, 2013 06:05
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Trump would be so much more effective if he taught people how NOT to run businesses. I mean, how do you bankrupt multiple casinos???
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Aug 25, 2013 07:26
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sleepingbuddha posted:After spending two hours on the phone with Comcast support yesterday to fix a problem that was their fault, I find this hard to believe. And it looks like AJA is only on their upper tier cable sub, so I don't get it. There is progressive radio? I thought it was like 90% conservative. The good stuff's all on podcasts. Try The Majority Report, it's super half-assed but has a giant audience, and he has a lot of big-name guests. If progressive radio sucks, it's because it's a shadow of the rightwing alternative and no one listens to it. Podcasts, man.
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Aug 25, 2013 08:41
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ToxicSlurpee posted:So how long until we hear that the money shouldn't be paid back and the students should just have to live with the debt because it's their own loving fault for paying for it in the first place? Normally I'd agree but I'm honestly fascinated that there are people in the year 2013 who actually think Trump is a guy you can give money to.
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Aug 25, 2013 11:30
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Blackbird Fly posted:Trump in general is a fraud that sees his businesses bankrupt left and right. Although considering the dumb, get-all-you-can-before-it-blows mentality of Wall Street and businesses, he's a perfect business role model. I didn't even know the full history when I first got the story, I just needed to google long enough to find the press releases from the founding and, sure enough, some dude came to Trump with his vision of starting another online scam operation. Whatever the PR papering over, this consultant wunderkind clearly went to Trump and said, "Check this out, we can sell your name to a bunch of desperate people, offer them basically a shitload of Carlton Sheets, Rich Dad/Poor Dad seminars and then continue bilking them as long as the Princess is in another castle." http://enews.tufts.edu/stories/443/2005/07/14/TheRealApprentice A clever repackaging of the get rich quick seminar industry with celebrity panache. The nice part is that it took 8 years and a shitload of complaints for anyone to do anything. Donald Trump truly is a conservative hero.
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Aug 25, 2013 16:50
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ReindeerF posted:I'm not sure where this goes, but he's a Right Wing Media figure: How loving stupid do you have to be to actually believe this was going to work and make you rich? Donald Trump is a horrible businessperson and his wealth is a complete accident at best, and due to the poaching of morons in exactly this fashion at worst. I really have no sympathy at all for anyone who fell for this, they clearly shouldn't be allowed to have enough money to waste it on this anyway. The only reason I want this lawsuit to win is because trump is even less deserving than they are.
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Aug 25, 2013 16:57
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Warchicken posted:How loving stupid do you have to be to actually believe this was going to work and make you rich? Donald Trump is a horrible businessperson and his wealth is a complete accident at best, and due to the poaching of morons in exactly this fashion at worst. I really have no sympathy at all for anyone who fell for this, they clearly shouldn't be allowed to have enough money to waste it on this anyway. Trump is rich because his father was rich. Once you get up to that level you can stay up there no matter how terrible at business you are.
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Aug 25, 2013 19:00
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Warchicken posted:How loving stupid do you have to be to actually believe this was going to work and make you rich? Donald Trump is a horrible businessperson and his wealth is a complete accident at best, and due to the poaching of morons in exactly this fashion at worst. I really have no sympathy at all for anyone who fell for this, they clearly shouldn't be allowed to have enough money to waste it on this anyway. A lot of those people probably didn't have that money to waste. My guess is this is all or mostly student loan money. Let's not shirk our sympathy just because people are morons. Everyone's a moron sometimes, and the more moronic someone is the more help they probably need.
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Aug 25, 2013 19:08
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These seminars are actually quite effective at roping in the unwary or the desperate, the rich dad/poor dad one was particularly disgusting.
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Aug 25, 2013 19:11
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ToxicSlurpee posted:So how long until we hear that the money shouldn't be paid back and the students should just have to live with the debt because it's their own loving fault for paying for it in the first place? This is how conservatives feel about all debt of any kind, especially student debt.
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Aug 25, 2013 19:15
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BONGHITZ posted:These seminars are actually quite effective at roping in the unwary or the desperate, the rich dad/poor dad one was particularly disgusting. What exactly is that? My high-school econ teacher was trying to shill that at us, and I just kinda ignored him because, well, he had a rich dad and he's a libertarian pseudo-economist at best.
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Aug 25, 2013 19:42
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Because people with no hope want hope. It's surprisingly elementary, as patronizing as it may sound.
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Aug 25, 2013 19:46
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PrinceRandom posted:What exactly is that? My high-school econ teacher was trying to shill that at us, and I just kinda ignored him because, well, he had a rich dad and he's a libertarian pseudo-economist at best. My GF is in a college economics test and they had a multiple choice test where the correct answer to "welfare helps it's citizens to" was "become dependent on the government and not be motivated to work" I'm starting to see why so many people believe this nonsense.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:14
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socialsecurity posted:My GF is in a college economics test and they had a multiple choice test where the correct answer to "welfare helps it's citizens to" was "become dependent on the government and not be motivated to work" I'm starting to see why so many people believe this nonsense. What college is that? Bob Jones University?
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Aug 25, 2013 20:16
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FlamingLiberal posted:I was not pleased with Stephanie Miller the other week for basically going after Glenn Greenwald and claiming that the White House would have made the same concessions on NSA spying normally, but Snowden messed that up. One of her co-hosts really disagreed with her at least. I used to listen to Stephanie Miller just for a morning-zoo style liberal morning show, but I can't take her bullshit anymore. She's a constant apologist for Obama, and she has absolutely no reason to be one. I suspect that her constant cheerleading for the NSA has something to do with her giant Carbonite endorsement contract. God knows what they do with your data when they get it, but I doubt they want you to find out. The credibility of the rest is tarnished by their Cash for Gold bullshit. Look, I know you have to make money somehow, but there has to be advertisers out there who aren't notoriously shady. On a side note, I don't know if Ari Rabin-Havt is a good writer. For all I know, he might be. What he isn't is a good radio personality. 90% of his show is dead air because he has to have a pregnant pause after every sentence. You know, to let it really sink in. And I'm actually stunned every time I see a picture of him, because he sounds 18 or 19 years old at best. People call in to troll the poo poo out of him all the time, and he always takes the bait. I haven't listened to the Jason Ellis show in months, but talk radio hosts could really stand to include a gently caress You/Hang up button for their calls. Even the hosts on Sirius Patriot can't stand listening to half of their callers try to be funny or poignant.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:21
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socialsecurity posted:My GF is in a college economics test and they had a multiple choice test where the correct answer to "welfare helps it's citizens to" was "become dependent on the government and not be motivated to work" I'm starting to see why so many people believe this nonsense. Nice Davis posted:What college is that? Bob Jones University? Yeah seriously, if the words 'Bible' or 'Liberty' aren't somewhere in the title that will probably be really dissapointing.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:29
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OMG JC a Bomb! posted:I used to listen to Stephanie Miller just for a morning-zoo style liberal morning show, but I can't take her bullshit anymore. She's a constant apologist for Obama, and she has absolutely no reason to be one. I suspect that her constant cheerleading for the NSA has something to do with her giant Carbonite endorsement contract. God knows what they do with your data when they get it, but I doubt they want you to find out. The credibility of the rest is tarnished by their Cash for Gold bullshit. Look, I know you have to make money somehow, but there has to be advertisers out there who aren't notoriously shady. Usually sales are not the disc jockey's job in radio. They generally have a separate office for that and the sales people usually are hell bent on getting as much money as they can so they can keep running. With something like Stephanie Miller's show, I'm sure it costs a lot of money to just keep it running. Generally, the DJ has no say in who they promote.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:41
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Blackbird Fly posted:Trump in general is a fraud that sees his businesses bankrupt left and right. Although considering the dumb, get-all-you-can-before-it-blows mentality of Wall Street and businesses, he's a perfect business role model. That reminds me of the time that I said to my mother that we should make schools cheaper and better by taxing the rich to provide the revenue. She went on to say something like:  "How dare you diss people like Trump! He worked Very, VEry VERy HARD for his money and yet you want to take it away from him! Maybe you should listen to HIM rather than whatever LIEBERAL crap you're listening to young man!" I wasn't able to provide a decent defense for that statement because admittedly I didn't know enough about Trump to think of one (despite calling myself a socialist  ), but she'll probably would've excused him out of anything this forum can cook up anyway.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:44
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Mercury_Storm posted:Yeah seriously, if the words 'Bible' or 'Liberty' aren't somewhere in the title that will probably be really dissapointing. Local community college here in Raleigh NC, her reading for the class is like a list of Libertarian propaganda, it's just a standard first level econ course that most majors have to take.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:49
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Mercury_Storm posted:Yeah seriously, if the words 'Bible' or 'Liberty' aren't somewhere in the title that will probably be really dissapointing. You guys are forgetting how conservative economics tends to be. Hell, half the people in economics think Keynesian economics is crazy because government can't stimulate the economy and such, and they still get taken seriously. I depends a lot on the geographic location of where you go. Its kind of depressing really.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:52
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One time I was listening to Sirius Left or some similar station and the host of the show spent about 2 minutes on either side of the commercials just trashing the poo poo out of everything that would be advertised, especially the cash for gold stuff. I don't remember who it was, but I was surprised he got away with it.
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Aug 25, 2013 20:53
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Nice Davis posted:What college is that? Bob Jones University? You wish, this is every Econ 101 class in the country. The one I took a while back had like a bunch of questions and examples like that, IIRC we had like 5 problems on a test that were calculating when a person would want to go on welfare rather than work. I think it had to do opportunity costs but gently caress if I remember.
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Aug 25, 2013 21:11
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quote:Phil Mickelson said the high taxes that he has to pay on his winnings do not give him the incentive to work harder. gently caress this guy. Tax him 100%. He doesn't work. He plays loving golf.
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Aug 25, 2013 21:20
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The guy is at the top of his chosen profession, exactly how much harder would he have to work?
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Aug 25, 2013 21:25
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After taxes he only made like $50,000 an hour that week. The heart bleeds.
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Aug 25, 2013 21:29
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... Are taxes supposed to make you want to work harder? I don't think that's why we have them.
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Aug 25, 2013 21:29
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Really gently caress this guy, eat the rich the string up the remains.
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Aug 25, 2013 21:30
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Modern Day Hercules posted:One time I was listening to Sirius Left or some similar station and the host of the show spent about 2 minutes on either side of the commercials just trashing the poo poo out of everything that would be advertised, especially the cash for gold stuff. I don't remember who it was, but I was surprised he got away with it. This is awesome and if I came across this during my morning/afternoon commute I'd tune in the following day. Raskolnikov38 posted:You wish, this is every Econ 101 class in the country. The one I took a while back had like a bunch of questions and examples like that, IIRC we had like 5 problems on a test that were calculating when a person would want to go on welfare rather than work. I think it had to do opportunity costs but gently caress if I remember. I disagree. I went to a Big 10 university and I had several intro/intermediate econ classes where the professors flat out told us that poo poo doesn't work like the book says it works because real life is complicated and people are irrational as hell.
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Aug 25, 2013 21:32
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Raskolnikov38 posted:You wish, this is every Econ 101 class in the country. The one I took a while back had like a bunch of questions and examples like that, IIRC we had like 5 problems on a test that were calculating when a person would want to go on welfare rather than work. I think it had to do opportunity costs but gently caress if I remember. The only things I remember from the intro economics course I took at a flagship state university are what the prisoner's dilemma is and that the minimum wage is a distortion of the free market and should be abolished. Edit: also big 10
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Aug 25, 2013 21:33
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Not to mention he lives in loving San Diego. It's not like he can't move to an area with lower taxes if it was really that important to him. He needs to travel for his 'job' either way. Oh, that's right, the places with really low taxes generally suck because they can't afford to pay for decent city services. e: regarding Phil Mickelson
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Aug 25, 2013 21:34
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A GIANT PARSNIP posted:This is awesome and if I came across this during my morning/afternoon commute I'd tune in the following day. That was my Big 10 intro econ experience too  
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Aug 25, 2013 21:35
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A GIANT PARSNIP posted:I disagree. I went to a Big 10 university and I had several intro/intermediate econ classes where the professors flat out told us that poo poo doesn't work like the book says it works because real life is complicated and people are irrational as hell. Right then, so you had actually competent professors. Despite that, you still had absolutely poo poo literature the ideas of which these professors were trying to shield you from. Now imagine if you only had those books, which are used in a Big 10 university course on the subject so they must be good right? Or maybe you have professors but they're not very good, or total poo poo, or buy into the books. These completely rear end-backwards ideas on the economics of the minimum wage, marginal income taxes, corporate taxes, unions and so on and so on don't just magically perpetuate themselves you know. They're pervasive as all gently caress and for good reason. Economics is a very ideological subject. I make this claim often and sometimes I get someone who very deep into some subfield of economics somewhere getting or having a PhD or whatever and be all like "we're all about statistics and facts and we don't think any of those ridiculous econ101 things are true and so economics is totally a science". Yeah ok cool however that's a tiny minority of the people who even studied economics, let alone people who studied other subjects and had to take some econ101 type courses. There's a hell of a lot of people, and when it's election time, their rear end-backwards and deliberately misinformed views on economics are going to trump you every time. The fact that your Big 10 university with competent professors was still using these books *that your professors then told you to ignore because of how wrong they are* should be an indication of just how deep this poo poo goes. Orange Devil fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Aug 25, 2013 |
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Aug 25, 2013 21:37
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Nice Davis posted:That was my Big 10 intro econ experience too I liked my CC econ teacher because he didn't seem like he gave a gently caress about politics, he just liked the math. Whenever my conservative-as-poo poo classmates would try to start a political discussion, he shut them down pretty quickly.
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Aug 25, 2013 22:07
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Orange Devil posted:Right then, so you had actually competent professors. Despite that, you still had absolutely poo poo literature the ideas of which these professors were trying to shield you from. Now imagine if you only had those books, which are used in a Big 10 university course on the subject so they must be good right? Or maybe you have professors but they're not very good, or total poo poo, or buy into the books. Yeah the books we had weren't like that. The government taxation section pretty explicitly said that taxing a company's profits will never change if that company should do something or not. Basically the simple book model said "if you make any money by doing something you should do it", so if you were gonna make $6 before tax and the government takes 1/3 of that then you're gonna make $4 so you should still do your thing. We never had anything anywhere close to "welfare makes (black) people lazy" in a college textbook - that poo poo is crazy, but when taken in the context of this country I guess it's not very surprising. EDIT: I remember a section in my intermediate micro class that bashed rent controls and rent subsidies for distorting the market. But the textbook's solution was for a government interested in lowering rent prices to build their own housing units and rent those out at lower than market rates, because this would both help the people renting from them as well as lower the rental rates for the population at large due to decreased demand. A GIANT PARSNIP fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Aug 25, 2013 |
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Aug 25, 2013 22:11
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My econ 101 course was pretty decent with the "poo poo doesn't work like this" stuff. After all, my econ departmen had a course on marx which treated himvery well. It was over simple, however. I'm not sure you should be allowed to take only econ 101. You should have to take a few more courses.
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Aug 25, 2013 22:43
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Dr.Zeppelin posted:The only things I remember from the intro economics course I took at a flagship state university are what the prisoner's dilemma is and that the minimum wage is a distortion of the free market and should be abolished. The prisoner's dilemma is also bullshit from outdated and debunked Cold War game theory poo poo - turns out people are more altruistic in real life than as imagined from the point of view of a hallucinating paranoid schizophrenic. The minimum wage stuff is also just libertarian anti-poor pap. I feel sad that this is what passes for economics higher education in the US in some classes. This is like 'a computer programming class in 2013 that teaches how to use the punch cards on ENIAC' levels of bad. Spacedad fucked around with this message at 22:55 on Aug 25, 2013 |
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Aug 25, 2013 22:51
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I start my freshman year of college next week and now I'm kind of concerned that I took an econ 101 class, I just picked it because it fit in with the rest of my schedule. Hopefully it isn't a complete shithole. I remember being in my high school econ class and meeting the first (and so far only) person I've ever met in real life that unironically supported Rick Santorum. The teacher was also the football coach so you can take a few guesses as to how qualified he was to teach a bunch of impressionable high school kids economics.
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Aug 25, 2013 23:04
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NO LISTEN TO ME posted:I start my freshman year of college next week and now I'm kind of concerned that I took an econ 101 class, I just picked it because it fit in with the rest of my schedule. Honestly, just try to think critically about the assumptions that underpin what you're learning because they're some big caveats that make understanding easier but application virtually useless. My econ 101 professor talked endlessly about the economics of professional soccer.
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Aug 25, 2013 23:11
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Nice Davis posted:That was my Big 10 intro econ experience too Echoing this, luckily I managed to drop it the first week and my adviser got me some sort of waiver for it. This left me without an econ class but, I don't think it hurt to much. The rest of my major was doing research and wouldn't you know half the stuff on that syllabus was bullshit when I looked at the supporting science/journal articles. Azuth0667 fucked around with this message at 23:15 on Aug 25, 2013 |
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Aug 25, 2013 23:12
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