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FISHMANPET posted:I may have built myself into a corner with my rail stations: Have you ever played OpenTTD? Signals are not too dissimilar (though factorio lacks pre-signals or pbses - though this isn't as big a deal because trains here can only work based on clock schedules and not "full load" orders). Anywho, the point is signals determine the "direction" of a given line (I.e. inbound vs outbound for double track networks) depending on which side of the track they're on - effectively making the that track one-way. You CAN make a track both signaled and two-way by putting signals on opposite sides of the exact same rail tile. You know you've done it right because a colour outline will pop up during placing, bounding both signals as a 2-way signal. This is not intuitive nor obvious but I think that's how it works. I have crossing two-way lines like that that seem to work without issue. Mrs. Wynand fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Jun 5, 2014 |
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Jun 5, 2014 22:19
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That was it, I needed to place signals opposite each other on the same track. With 8 signals I'm able to do it.
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Jun 5, 2014 22:24
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Any reason to not spend 10 seconds rerouting the belts so that the iron is copper and the copper is iron, then re-lay the track so they don't cross?
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Jun 5, 2014 23:22
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Platystemon posted:Interesting idea. The difference between a direct connection is that the loads on either side get priority for generation on their side, right? There are five power priorities in the game: primary-output, secondary-output, primary-input, secondary-input, and terciary [sic]. Solar is primary-output, steam engines are secondary-output, lasers are primary-input, everything else is secondary-input, and accumulators are terciary. If there is excess output (primary and secondary) in a network, terciary items will be given energy. If there is not enough, terciary is drawn from. Let's take a very arbitrary example (and for the sake of illustration pretend that power demand is steady instead of spiky). Say your main power network has two boilers for 1.02 MW which works fine to power your stuff (draw 900 kW) most of the time but when biters come your two lasers (2 firing for 1.2MW total) causes a problem. In peacetime, the extra 120 kW will go to your let's-call-it-3 accumulators until they're charged; they each get 40 kW and sluggishly charge from empty (0 J) to full (5 MJ) over 125 seconds. Biters come. Your lasers need 1.2 MW, and your steam plus your accumulators (300 kW each) can provide 1.62 MW. Lasers, being primary, take all they can, leaving 420 kW for your base,which slows to about half speed. After 16.7 seconds, the accumulators are drained and the available power supply drops to 1.02 MW, leaving the lasers firing at 85% speed and your factory completely blacked out. Now say your "emergency" coal setup consists of one steam engine (potential power 510 kW) powering a miner and some inserters (say, 100kW load). Most of the time the steam engine will be running at ~20% capacity. If you add an accumulator, it will fill (at 300kW) and your steam engine will be running at 80% for a while (16.7 seconds); then the accumulator will stop drawing power and the steam engine will drop back to 20%. Now, couple the "emergency" accumulator (but not its network, as mentioned) to your main network. Cue the biters. As long as they have stored power, the accumulators can supply 300 kW each, so the three main accumulators plus the one coupled accumulator provide up to 1.2 MW of power. Your lasers plus your factory draw 900kW+1.2MW = 2.1 MW. Minus steam, the remaining 1.08 MW is being asked of your accumulators, and the load is divided equally, each supplying 252 kW. Your factory continues at full speed until the main 3 accumulators are drained after (5 MJ / 252 kW = 19.8 seconds). The coupled accumulator on the other hand has been getting recharged the whole time by your "emergency" steam engine which saw its accumulator needing 252 kW, and it easily handles the load. Once the main 3 accumulators are dead, the coupled accumulator reaches its maximum discharge rate of 300 kW. The steam engine handles its 100 kW + 300 kW demand handily, just as if it were charging the accumulator normally, but your main network now has a total power supply of 1.02 kW + 300kW = 1.32MW, and so your lasers keep firing at full speed and your factory slows to a crawl at 120kW remainder supply attempting to meet 900kW demand (13% speed). Adding a second coupled accumulator would let everything run at full speed for longer (because each accumulators would each be handling 20% of the extra load instead of 25%) and allow for the emergency engine's full spare 410 kW to run into the main network (leaving the factory running at about 25%). Note that no matter what, the coal miner and inserters and whatever else is on the emergency network keep running at full speed, because the coupled accumulators have the lowest priority on that network; this guarantee is basically the reason you'd set things up like this. Terciary priority is either input or output (per network), never both, so accumulators on a network will not drain to charge other accumulators. Placing independent accumulators on the emergency side is pointless; they will never help a coupled network. In my base, I have my laser turret defense perimeter on its own network, powered by only solar and accumulators. It's coupled (via rather many accumulators) to a network that consists of a ton of steam engines. Under idle conditions, the solar handles the passive power drain of the turrets handily and keeps the accumulators charged. At nighttime or when lasers fire when it needs extra power, the network draws (coupled accumulators / total accumulators) from the steam dynamo. Mainly I did this because I could; it's not really necessary, but it's fun to think about it.
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Jun 5, 2014 23:46
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Are you guys moving your steam power as you exhaust coal reserves? I have always had more trouble with the inserters for the boilers running out of power than not having enough buffer built up on both sides of my eventually absurdly long coal belts.
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Jun 6, 2014 02:21
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Kytrarewn posted:exhaust coal reserves?  Personally, I've never even had to move a miner, let alone migrate to a new source of coal. Although, I'm only running ~15 engines, with boilers to keep up. My bigger problem is running out of real estate for new engines.
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Jun 6, 2014 02:51
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I have a bitch of a time fitting 10 steam engines in series, so what I've been doing is making a 2x5 grid linking them with a single pipe, and feeding the requisite 14 boilers down one end.
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Jun 6, 2014 03:11
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I quickly move away from coal and start using solid fuel directly from the chemical plants for my boilers. That seems to work much better.
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Jun 6, 2014 14:58
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Back To 99 posted:I quickly move away from coal and start using solid fuel directly from the chemical plants for my boilers. That seems to work much better. It is more efficient however you need a shitload of oil to actually fuel your base with just solid fuel while also making plastic, explosives, batteries and all the other oil products. Usage starts low but once you are cranking out advanced circuits, electric engines, and processors it eats quite a bit. Nuclearmonkee fucked around with this message at 15:19 on Jun 6, 2014 |
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Jun 6, 2014 15:16
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So, I setup a self-powered firebase away from my main location, out where I had not explored. after it started polluting, it is now surrounded by red... not ideal. And my western front has critters in visual range that are...dense. There isn't even pollution reaching the western side. Though the stuff near the firebase is practically fueled by pollution. So I setup a half a gigajoule of capacitors and 20 steam engines... and 100 laser towers with triple thick walls. Hopefully they hold while its running and I'm at work. Otherwise this will be starship troopers and that outpost on planet P. And there will be no rescue 
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Jun 6, 2014 17:49
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Why the hell do I always end up with a bottleneck on gears, its the stupidest thing but it seems it always happens 
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Jun 6, 2014 18:54
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Platystemon posted:No, it’s just that Factorio’s fluid mechanics are weird and steam engines don’t care what fluid you pump into them as long as it’s hot. Wait wait wait, so I can actually run my boilers on hot sulfuric acid? Sweet. Morning posted:Why the hell do I always end up with a bottleneck on gears, its the stupidest thing but it seems it always happens I usually just put in an assembler to make them on the spot that feeds directly into the end product assembler. Way easier. Gears really are a pain in the rear end to handle any other way.
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Jun 6, 2014 19:02
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0.10.0 is Out! Not as many large changes as other major version changes, but a few neat additions. For now you can only get it by using the in-game patcher. -------------------------------------------------- Version: 0.10.0 Date: 6.6. 2014 Features: - Environment sounds. Active machines close to the player create a small factory orchestra. - Proper volume settings for master volume / effects volume / etc. - Map generation string - stores seed and settings for sharing map conditions. - Clipboard copy & paste (useful for map generation string, updater username, updater password). - Station names can be changed in the train stop gui. - Burner inserter will use item with fuel value for itself when it has empty inventory. - Logistic and Construction robots slowdown to 20% of regular speed when out of energy (instead of dying). - Flying text indication for items collected while placing a building (for instance a rotated transport belt). - Cargo wagon can have filters in the inventory. - Blueprints copy circuit network connections. - Updater can now detect some problems caused by firewalls. Graphics: - Dust effects when building is placed. - Added new doodads for dead desert (dead trees, dead trunks, stones, grey grass, etc.) - Different inserter hand drawing logic (now including hand shadows). - New icons (circuits, steel, copper plate, inserters, etc.) - Puff of smoke when locomotive stops. - New steam engine graphics. - New radar graphics. Gui: - Proper research unit tooltip in the laboratory gui. - Save game gui tweaks (Enter key in text field saves game, text field starts with focus) - Scenario message dialog resizes when the image is too big. - Whole language name in locale dropdown. - Slots with filter have a blue background (both in quickbar and in cargo wagon). - Highlighted item in inventory (when hovering over corresponding recipe) is blinking. - More polished loading screen. Sound: - Working sounds for most of the machines (inserters, assemblers, furnaces, steam engines, labs, etc.). - Sound effects for car and trains. Changes: - Disabled loading of saves before 0.6.0 version (You can use 0.6.4 to load any old saves and re-save them). - Miners in blueprint are ignored when no resource present, instead of blocking the whole blueprint. - Changed stack sizes of items to be 10 based, so it fits the inserter/requester count values. - Smoother car acceleration and braking. - Changed walls/pipes/pipes to ground/boilers/pumps collision boxes logic. It is possible to walk between diagonal (not connected) walls now, but when connected, there is no space inbetween. - Backer names are used for Locomotives, Roboports and Radadars. Optimisations: - Parallelised map generation, the hiccups when new part of map is generated should be smaller or non-existent. - Reduced the saving time (autosave included). - One very long path search will not block path finder for others. This should fix a bug with stuck biters. Bugfixes: - Fixed that inserters had switched the closed/open hand pictures. - Load game dialog scrolls to the selected item (that can be off screen). - When there are more items than 4 in the entity info (i.e. smart inserter filters), the first 4 are shown. - Limited (and sorted) the amount of items in the finished game gui. - Fixed crash when using fish capsule in the god mode. - Prevent negative overflow when mining resources. - Unused pipe connections (in chemical plant, assembler) are passive (they don't connect with other pipes). - Fixed crash: "Can't insert to this EnergySource" - Fixed unloadable save with train in station with no stations left in schedule. - Fixed that radars could explore the same chunk when their progress ended in the same moment. - Solved that items on ground in the way of electric poles were lost when building by dragging. - Fixed bug with hovering in the map editor over assembler gui output. - Game won't crash when the modlist.json is corrupted. - Fixed bug when effect from beacon was applied twice after load. - Fixed crash when previewing a technology with "give-item" modifier. - Inserter's logistic condition is copied when building inserter from blueprints. - Fix of the window hanging out of the screen at start. - Fixed the crash when a blueprint is moved to the quickbar with filter for blueprint selected. - Fixed the inserter not working properly when loading a train wagon on junction. - Fixed crash in the beta level 4 when player dies. - Fixed typo in beta level 4 when explaining oil industry. - Fixed wrong connection of newly built train wagon to train in some cases. - Fixed that some of the capsules couldn't be fired repeatedly by holding the button. - Fixed that player wasn't notified about items collected from belts when rebuilding them with different direction. - Fixed crash when loading save where entity with electric energy source has been removed because same mods are not installed. - Fixed problems with unicode characters in the path when updating. - Game doesn't crash when no scenario is selected in custom scenarios screen. - Corrupted saves don't crash the game to desktop, just give an error message. Scripting: - API to take game screenshots. - Simple API to write to disk (makefile, removepath). - Added trailer mod (data/trailer), that contains map and logic for new Factorio trailer. - Added set/get/clear filter methods to access inserter filters - Added set/get/clear requestslot to access requester chest requests. - Added set/get/clear methods for circuit conditions. - Changed the game.disableminimap to read/write value of player.minimapenabled. - Added lua interfaces to force to get/set modifiers - Expanded connetneighbour-method - Removed the crash when die/destroy is called on the dying entity in the onentitydied hook. -------------------------------------------------- Version: 0.9.9 Date: 15.4. 2014 Bugfixes: - Fixed that turrets ordered to be deconstructed couldn't be destroyed. - Fixed crash when locomotive/cargo wagons were attemted to be built as ghosts. Scripting: - Fixed the wrong positioning of the top custom gui flow. --------------------------------------------------
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Jun 6, 2014 20:26
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0.10.0 is an experimental release, so you'll have to enable that option in the "Other" options menu if you want it, otherwise sounds like a week or two for 0.10.0 to be "stable."
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Jun 6, 2014 20:31
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quote:- Logistic and Construction robots slowdown to 20% of regular speed when out of energy (instead of dying). Truly the greatest of changes. Burner inserters fueling themselves is also pretty cool for gimmick factories, though I have to admit that I’ll miss shenanigans like this: 
Platystemon fucked around with this message at 20:52 on Jun 6, 2014 |
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Jun 6, 2014 20:48
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That burner inserter change is interesting, in the context of the discussion we were having about coal lines earlier. Put one or two burner inserters on your boilers just to keep things going if there's a power spike that screws up your other inserters.
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Jun 6, 2014 20:49
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Ugh, when can I use robots to put modules into things. Inserting 150 effectivity modules into a new mining area is just the wooorst.
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Jun 6, 2014 20:56
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FISHMANPET posted:Ugh, when can I use robots to put modules into things. Inserting 150 effectivity modules into a new mining area is just the wooorst. That’s what, 11 megawatts?  e: You know that if you have the modules in your hand you can ctrl‐click to insert them, right?
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Jun 6, 2014 21:01
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FISHMANPET posted:Ugh, when can I use robots to put modules into things. Inserting 150 effectivity modules into a new mining area is just the wooorst. I'm convinced setting richness to 350,000 is the best way to play. It is just too much of a pain in the dick to setup a complex operation to just have to tear it down. And running 10 miles of track to bring resources to the fabrication center is...ugh, horrid. Granted, I am going to do just that now that I've built up my infrastructure, but jesus, I cannot imagine doing that initially. I have over 100 hours (probably only 1/3 to 2/5 of that actually playing) and I am generating and using about 160k iron plates an hour. an hour. That is....insane.
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Jun 6, 2014 21:02
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Did not know about ctrl+click to load (been using it to unload though), holy poo poo that is amazing, and makes this basically fine. Now a splitter quesiton. If I have two inputs into a splitter, and two outputs, will it balance both inputs onto the outputs? or do I need a splitter to join the two belts, a single length of belt, and then another splitter to split them up again?
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Jun 6, 2014 21:11
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FISHMANPET posted:0.10.0 is an experimental release, so you'll have to enable that option in the "Other" options menu if you want it, otherwise sounds like a week or two for 0.10.0 to be "stable." It looks nice, but there are issues including the naming of some items in a code-like state, and the "ghost build" tool is currently broken in the experimental release. There could be more issues but that's all I saw in 10 minutes which convinced me to go back to the old version until the stable release. edit: FISHMANPET posted:Did not know about ctrl+click to load (been using it to unload though), holy poo poo that is amazing, and makes this basically fine. bitcoin bastard posted:
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Jun 6, 2014 21:21
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Alright, here's a screenshot, since I suck at describing. I've got my coal mine, and it comes into two belts, but they're usually not equal, and I want to balance them to load the chests that will load the train. Both bottom belts will have the same resource, but at different rates, will this work to balance them so they're the same rate on each top belt?
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Jun 6, 2014 21:30
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FISHMANPET posted:Alright, here's a screenshot, since I suck at describing. I've got my coal mine, and it comes into two belts, but they're usually not equal, and I want to balance them to load the chests that will load the train. Yes, it should
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Jun 6, 2014 21:48
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FISHMANPET posted:Both bottom belts will have the same resource, but at different rates, will this work to balance them so they're the same rate on each top belt?
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Jun 6, 2014 21:49
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quote:- Burner inserter will use item with fuel value for itself when it has empty inventory. quote:- Logistic and Construction robots slowdown to 20% of regular speed when out of energy (instead of dying). quote:- Puff of smoke when locomotive stops. 
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Jun 6, 2014 22:05
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I want to start a new game but I want to keep the map I was using. Is there any way to reset a map?
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Jun 6, 2014 22:20
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FISHMANPET posted:Alright, here's a screenshot, since I suck at describing. I've got my coal mine, and it comes into two belts, but they're usually not equal, and I want to balance them to load the chests that will load the train. I linked you the resource you need to find your answer. You can balance belts with a splitter if you read the thread
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Jun 6, 2014 22:22
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Ulsoro posted:- Station names can be changed in the train stop gui. This will make everything so much easier
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Jun 6, 2014 22:37
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When will we get smart splitters? When?
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Jun 6, 2014 22:55
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Weird issue after downloading the experimental update. While loading sprites it gets an error trying to find some .wav file, and crashes, every time, making it impossible to launch. I don't know if there is a way to roll-back the game at this point, which sucks, but I wanted to start a new map anyway, so downloaded the packed version of 0.9.8 to play in until the stable release comes out. Just a warning for people who have yet to download the release. By the way, is it possible to transfer maps between installs, so I don't have to abandon my current map when the stable version comes out?
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Jun 6, 2014 23:06
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Spaseman posted:I want to start a new game but I want to keep the map I was using. Is there any way to reset a map? Die and choose Restart Level.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:18
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Shintaro posted:Die and choose Restart Level. Or just press Esc and choose Restart. edit: actually this will give you a new map, nvm.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:24
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quote:Changed stack sizes of items to be 10 based, so it fits the inserter/requester count values.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:36
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Instead of a slider, a number input would be nice. But then again, it doesn't really matter toooo much.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:39
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It's annoying because a logistics robot will always carry a full load. So if you have 97 iron plates, and you've request 100, a bot will bring you 4, bringing you to 101, making your iron plates take up 2 slots instead of 1. I'd rather request 96 iron plates, or just not have the bots always bring a full load.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:47
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FISHMANPET posted:Alright, here's a screenshot, since I suck at describing. I've got my coal mine, and it comes into two belts, but they're usually not equal, and I want to balance them to load the chests that will load the train. It will balance total throughput but not the sides of the belt. (If both output belts are blocked on one side, both input belts will also be blocked on that side.) Add in the following on each input belt before the splitter you have shown to balance the sides of the belt:  E: Rephrasing. goatsestretchgoals fucked around with this message at 23:56 on Jun 6, 2014 |
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Jun 6, 2014 23:52
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They need a discard item box. Like how Starbound or Terraria does it.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:54
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Phobophilia posted:They need a discard item box. Like how Starbound or Terraria does it. Haven't tried yet but supposedly you can put stuff in a wooden chest then blow it up. But yeah it would be nice to be able to just highlight an item and hit the delete key or drag it to a trash can icon. E: \/ \/ \/ Yeah, a deconstructor would be great, put in 2 of an item, get back the components for 1 of them maybe? goatsestretchgoals fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Jun 6, 2014 |
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Jun 6, 2014 23:57
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I think a recycling or disassembling machine would be more in the theme of things
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Jun 6, 2014 23:57
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bitcoin bastard posted:Haven't tried yet but supposedly you can put stuff in a wooden chest then blow it up. But yeah it would be nice to be able to just highlight an item and hit the delete key or drag it to a trash can icon. You can do that but that involves waiting for the wooden chest to finish crafting and ugh.
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Jun 6, 2014 23:59
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