Early FPS Megathread: the kids need to learn about TekWar sooner or later

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Retro Games > Early FPS Megathread: the kids need to learn about TekWar sooner or later

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Artelier: Jan 23, 2015

Speaking of Unreal Tournament, wasn't there a new Unreal in some sort of beta on Epic? What happened to it? I feel like I heard about it years ago and then it disappeared.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 11:28

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# ? May 29, 2024 15:42

kirbysuperstar: Nov 11, 2012; Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.

Artelier posted:

Speaking of Unreal Tournament, wasn't there a new Unreal in some sort of beta on Epic? What happened to it? I feel like I heard about it years ago and then it disappeared.

It and Paragon died to fuel the Fortnite machine

# ? Sep 1, 2021 11:31

Doctor Dogballs: Apr 1, 2007; driving the fuck truck from hand land to pound town without stopping at suction station

Barudak posted:

Given the Doom re-releases sold pretty well even on console I have a suspicion the Quake one will have done just fine.

yeah they got 2 copies of each - both games for Switch AND ps4 - out of me netting them a whopping $9 total. (some of the best $9 you could spend)

# ? Sep 1, 2021 12:58

Rupert Buttermilk: Apr 15, 2007; 🚣RowboatMan: ❄️Freezing time🕰️ is an old P.I. 🥧trick...

The Kins posted:

There's some form of CTF in one of the expansions already, but it's not exposed to the menus (yet?) because Quake 1 Teamplay is kinda weird and based on your pants color, so there'd need to be some consideration to sorting teams in a sane, modern way.

As for Threewave CTF, Zoid (the original creator) was asking about this on Twitter and an Id guy replied by asking him to DM, so we'll see what happens. I guess it depends on whether or not they need to chase up permissions with anyone else?

I'm still catching up with this thread, but...

The Early FPS Megathread - Teamplay is based on your pants color

# ? Sep 1, 2021 13:09

Turin Turambar: Jun 5, 2011

kirbysuperstar posted:

It and Paragon died to fuel the Fortnite machine

To be fair with them, I suspect their prototype of new UT died really even before that, more like it never properly born because they never gave it full attention. Reason being, they saw the current panorama of gaming, with every drat arena shooter doing bad, from Lawbreakers to Quake Champions to many indie games, and decided they weren't going do any better and it was better to cut their losses.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 13:21

The Kins: Oct 2, 2004

The new UT only ever had a skeleton crew and was mostly relying on community contributors that never showed up. Then that skeleton crew prototyped up a PUBG clone using another Epic game's assets, and...

# ? Sep 1, 2021 13:41

Groovelord Neato: Dec 6, 2014

https://twitter.com/TreyPowell1964/status/1433047524798091269?s=20

# ? Sep 1, 2021 13:47

Hasturtium: May 19, 2020; And that year, for his birthday, he got six pink ping pong balls in a little pink backpack.

The Kins posted:

The new UT only ever had a skeleton crew and was mostly relying on community contributors that never showed up. Then that skeleton crew prototyped up a PUBG clone using another Epic game's assets, and...

Don't forget that the community contributors who did show up got into big fights over nothing substantial and stifled what momentum the project had. There's blame to spread around, sure. But you can't blame Epic for prioritizing a cash machine over something that might have eventually bumbled to completion before falling down in a way very similar to all the other arena shooters in its company. It's just not 1999 any more.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 13:53

Barudak: May 7, 2007

Quake has decided to just not agree with my completion of certain mission packs and give me the achievements but whatever, its fine, I did everything except quake 64 because a) my god my eyes my eyes and b) it has this weird dreamlike quality where everything is slightly off and wrong in the level layout

# ? Sep 1, 2021 15:11

Quantum of Phallus: Dec 27, 2010; Can't post for 9 hours!

quake 64 feels like playing a beta build , it's so weird

# ? Sep 1, 2021 15:12

SCheeseman: Apr 23, 2003

Barudak posted:

it has this weird dreamlike quality where everything is slightly off and wrong in the level layout

That's why I kind of enjoy it. Try running it with the CRT filter off.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 15:13

Solaris 2.0: May 14, 2008

Hasturtium posted:

Don't forget that the community contributors who did show up got into big fights over nothing substantial and stifled what momentum the project had. There's blame to spread around, sure. But you can't blame Epic for prioritizing a cash machine over something that might have eventually bumbled to completion before falling down in a way very similar to all the other arena shooters in its company. It's just not 1999 any more.

Yea

I would be a very happy man if Quake 3 got the Quake 1 remaster treatment though. I would be especially happy if somehow UT got the same and released along side a Quake 3 remaster :getin:

# ? Sep 1, 2021 15:43

Squeezy Farm: Jun 16, 2009

Quake 3 was already "remastered" and still has an active playerbase.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 15:56

Zeether: Aug 26, 2011

Do people still play Q3A or did they all migrate to Quake Live?

# ? Sep 1, 2021 15:57

Quantum of Phallus: Dec 27, 2010; Can't post for 9 hours!

getting rid of the quake live mac client was some heinous poo poo

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:01

Al Cu Ad Solte: Nov 30, 2005; Searching for
a righteous cause

Finished Duke Nukem Zero Hour.

I know it's not saying much since most Duke games aside from 3D are varying degrees of awful, but Zero Hour is definitely the second best next to 3D. It even does some things better. For instance, 3D has my favorite FPS arsenal of all time and ZH kicks its rear end in that department. Each time era you go to has its own weaponry, like the old west having a lever action rifle, Victorian England (where you boss fight Jack the Ripper??) has a lightning bolt cannon and a gatling gun. The pigs are all in top hats lol. You can rescue the babes for health boosts ("Oh, Duke! I knew you'd....come.").

And I know it's silly to look to a Duke game for story, but I do like having a smidge more context for what's going on. ZH's story is a hilariously flimsy excuse to kill poo poo but there's this satisfying connective tissue to everything. And where as Time to Kill and Land of the Babes were just faster paced riffs on the Tomb Raider formula, Zero Hour is through and through a shooter. There's some nice level progression, although not as intuitive or memorable as 3D, there's lots of variety. No real puzzles, just lots of locks and keys (the nature of those locks and keys change tho. Like instead of finding access cards or something, you gotta find a keg of gunpowder to blow open a vault to steal alien plans or some poo poo). The difficulty can be harsh as gently caress, in ways that feel unfair sometimes, but the same can absolutely be said of 3D where Duke feels like he's made out of tissue paper.

Downer is definitely the music. The tracks that play in the present day New York levels kick rear end but everything else is either unmemorable or actually kind of bad.

It's funny too, and definitely has 3D's mix of a strangely grim tone mixed with juvenile humor. There's the aforementioned Jack the Ripper fight (Duke: "The perfect person to rip a new one. :clint:

") or future New York being a snowy, post-apocalyptic shithole with no music and only ambient sounds because everyone is dead. Except Duke sees the half blown up Statue of Liberty and says "drat you! drat you all!"

I really enjoyed it!

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:01

Rupert Buttermilk: Apr 15, 2007; 🚣RowboatMan: ❄️Freezing time🕰️ is an old P.I. 🥧trick...

Al Cu Ad Solte posted:

Finished Duke Nukem Zero Hour.

I know it's not saying much since most Duke games aside from 3D are varying degrees of awful, but Zero Hour is definitely the second best next to 3D. It even does some things better. For instance, 3D has my favorite FPS arsenal of all time and ZH kicks its rear end in that department. Each time era you go to has its own weaponry, like the old west having a lever action rifle, Victorian England (where you boss fight Jack the Ripper??) has a lightning bolt cannon and a gatling gun. The pigs are all in top hats lol. You can rescue the babes for health boosts ("Oh, Duke! I knew you'd....come.").

And I know it's silly to look to a Duke game for story, but I do like having a smidge more context for what's going on. ZH's story is a hilariously flimsy excuse to kill poo poo but there's this satisfying connective tissue to everything. And where as Time to Kill and Land of the Babes were just faster paced riffs on the Tomb Raider formula, Zero Hour is through and through a shooter. There's some nice level progression, although not as intuitive or memorable as 3D, there's lots of variety. No real puzzles, just lots of locks and keys (the nature of those locks and keys change tho. Like instead of finding access cards or something, you gotta find a keg of gunpowder to blow open a vault to steal alien plans or some poo poo). The difficulty can be harsh as gently caress, in ways that feel unfair sometimes, but the same can absolutely be said of 3D where Duke feels like he's made out of tissue paper.

Downer is definitely the music. The tracks that play in the present day New York levels kick rear end but everything else is either unmemorable or actually kind of bad.

It's funny too, and definitely has 3D's mix of a strangely grim tone mixed with juvenile humor. There's the aforementioned Jack the Ripper fight (Duke: "The perfect person to rip a new one. ") or future New York being a snowy, post-apocalyptic shithole with no music and only ambient sounds because everyone is dead. Except Duke sees the half blown up Statue of Liberty and says "drat you! drat you all!"

I really enjoyed it!

I remember loving the hell out of Zero Hour. I barely remember a multiplayer mode, but I think it was fun?

Anyway, yeah, not that Randy would ever do it but with Doom 64 and kinda Quake 64, I'd love a Duke ZH remake/port/remaster.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:04

Barudak: May 7, 2007

Theoretically now, its out of Randibalds hands. If Embracer says "hey, we're making Duke Nukem 4d" he doesn't really get a say

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:24

SeANMcBAY: Jun 28, 2006; Look on the bright side.

Zeether posted:

Do people still play Q3A or did they all migrate to Quake Live?

People definitely still play Q3A. You can find more diverse games there while people on Quake Live only seem to play Clan Arena.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:27

koren: Sep 7, 2003

The server browser in quake live is an absolute turd and did a lot to make finding and playing games as tedious as possible. I remember having to use an external program to set up basic filters like "gamemode x and not full". That and the late-patch introduction of the terrible and redundant heavy machinegun, which all good servers have to mod out via steam workshop mods. A lot of very bad decisions in the dying days of support for that game, but at least it's still alive and they migrated a lot of the functionality over to steam's services.

You'll still get games though - there's open servers, pickups and you have activity in q3 and mods like cpm if you are up for a good time that way.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:34

koren: Sep 7, 2003

Oh and the loadouts system - what was all that about?

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:38

Squeezy Farm: Jun 16, 2009

Finding their footing to properly add all that junk and more to Quake Champions.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:49

The Kins: Oct 2, 2004

Squeezy Farm posted:

Finding their footing to properly add all that junk and more to Quake Champions.

IIRC QC started development as a QL expansion?

# ? Sep 1, 2021 16:59

crondaily: Nov 27, 2006

The Kins posted:

IIRC QC started development as a QL expansion?

Good thing it's still in EA...since 2017.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:04

caleb: Jul 17, 2004; ...rough day at the orifice.

Stockwell posted:

I noticed a lot of people don't seem to like ambient occlusion, any particular reason? I just find that It adds an extra dimension to the lighting, fills in shadows where you'd expect them to be, like in corners or around small objects, etc.

Eric W's tools for compiling Quake maps allows you to bake dirt and bounce lighting so depending on who made the map and their workflow "AO" was sort of already there. Between that and using textures as light sources you can pretty easily light an entire map with one entity.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:08

Feels Villeneuve: Oct 7, 2007; Setter is Better.

man i really like the design of Quake

i always figured it as a game where the key design decision is the lack of an ideal weapon for everything. The SSG isn't particularly good past midrage, rockets are a problem against several enemies (not just shamblers, but fiends where you really need to be careful if you want to rocket them) and in hallways that Quake likes to put you in, Nails use your SNG ammo when the SNG is the game's designated "panic button" gun.

I particularly like how the shambler has two melee animations at significantly different speeds to make sure you can't just do the old "rev dance" thing from Doom 2 where you need to actually be careful about the rhythm where you jump in and trigger their melee.

the result is that you rarely get into that kind of locked-in cruise that you do in Doom. it's a slower game that plays completely differently but isn't bad for it

still am not sure about the nail/SNG thing though. also never really figured out how the lightning gun fit in apart from being a super fun MP weapon

also i'm glad i'm not nuts about the mega respawns lol. did they accidentally screw up a multiplayer flag or something?

Feels Villeneuve fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Sep 1, 2021

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:11

koren: Sep 7, 2003

Yes, the mega respawning is a bug. I really hope they push a fix with for some of the more egregious problems quickly.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:14

Feels Villeneuve: Oct 7, 2007; Setter is Better.

also i can't admire the ogre enough. just a great enemy, down to them being killable at 100% ammo efficiency if you're accurate enough (two rockets!)

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:16

Feels Villeneuve: Oct 7, 2007; Setter is Better.

koren posted:

Yes, the mega respawning is a bug. I really hope they push a fix with for some of the more egregious problems quickly.

Yeah. tbh I'm mostly just having fun with this one because of the gimmick of playing quake on a handheld device, I got source ports for serious quake action lol

The e1m6 light issue is fucky, though.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:27

Hasturtium: May 19, 2020; And that year, for his birthday, he got six pink ping pong balls in a little pink backpack.

I'm kinda dying to see how the unofficial third mission pack, Abyss of Pandemonium, manages in KexQuake. Also Zerstorer. Heck, is there any community single player-focused map pack where the new official port just can't handle it?

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:43

Stockwell: Mar 29, 2005; Ask me about personal watercraft.

Unless you're trying to bounce around walls is the rocket generally preferable to the grenade? Any difference in damage output, or is it like a nailgun/SNG situation. It does feel like the rocket has a larger area of effect for splash damage, unless it's my imagination.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:44

skasion: Feb 13, 2012; Why don't you perform zazen, facing a wall?

Stockwell posted:

Unless you're trying to bounce around walls is the rocket generally preferable to the grenade? Any difference in damage output, or is it like a nailgun/SNG situation. It does feel like the rocket has a larger area of effect for splash damage, unless it's my imagination.

GL shoots faster than RL but the damage should be the same iirc

# ? Sep 1, 2021 17:57

KrunkMcGrunk: Jul 2, 2007; Sometimes I sit and think, and sometimes I just sit.

well gently caress, now the quake remaster will CTD every time i try to launch it.

e: and of course after i post, it boots up just fine.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 18:21

JLaw: Feb 10, 2008; - harmless -

Hasturtium posted:

I'm kinda dying to see how the unofficial third mission pack, Abyss of Pandemonium, manages in KexQuake. Also Zerstorer. Heck, is there any community single player-focused map pack where the new official port just can't handle it?

It doesn't have all of the limits-raising stuff from current source ports. I imagine it can play lots and lots of releases, especially older ones, but e.g. Tears of a False God will crash it.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 18:46

KrunkMcGrunk: Jul 2, 2007; Sometimes I sit and think, and sometimes I just sit.

Stockwell posted:

Unless you're trying to bounce around walls is the rocket generally preferable to the grenade? Any difference in damage output, or is it like a nailgun/SNG situation. It does feel like the rocket has a larger area of effect for splash damage, unless it's my imagination.

Rocket splash feels much larger than grenades'. I usually have the GL out and ready when walking into a new room, where I'm not sure how close I'm going to be to an enemy. Also being able to bounce grenades around corners and stuff is real nice.

If I have space, I'll switch to rockets tho.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 19:01

CV 64 Fan: Oct 13, 2012; It's pretty dope.

Zero Hour was dope. I thought it was way better than Time To Kill And Land.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 19:46

Convex: Aug 19, 2010

Barudak posted:

Theoretically now, its out of Randibalds hands. If Embracer says "hey, we're making Duke Nukem 4d" he doesn't really get a say

Ah yes. The final showdown between Duke Nukem and his ultimate nemesis, the slow and inexorable passage of time.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 20:03

UnknownMercenary: Nov 1, 2011; I LIKE IT
WAY WAY TOO LOUD

The best Duke Nukem game not 3D is Duke Nukem Advance. :colbert:

# ? Sep 1, 2021 20:07

Stockwell: Mar 29, 2005; Ask me about personal watercraft.

I farted around with the values for the minimal HUD to have it more centered, like the standard one, except transparent and without the border and the bottom of the screen getting cut off. I think it's a bit easier to see at a glance. Edit your config file which should be here:

C:\Users\USERNAME\Saved Games\Nightdive Studios\Quake\kexengine.cfg

code:

seta cl_hdhud_face_x "-180"
seta cl_hdhud_face_y "25"
seta cl_hdhud_armor_x "-50"
seta cl_hdhud_armor_y "25"
seta cl_hdhud_ammo_x "80"
seta cl_hdhud_ammo_y "25"
seta cl_hdhud_health_num_x "-150"
seta cl_hdhud_health_num_y "25"
seta cl_hdhud_armor_num_x "-20"
seta cl_hdhud_armor_num_y "25"
seta cl_hdhud_ammo_num_x "110"
seta cl_hdhud_ammo_num_y "25"

edit: you can swap the values for face/health_num & armor/armor_num if you'd prefer it more symmetrical, since it otherwise doesn't show the armor icon/value if you have none.

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Stockwell fucked around with this message at 20:27 on Sep 1, 2021

# ? Sep 1, 2021 20:12

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# ? May 29, 2024 15:42

Carpator Diei: Feb 26, 2011

Feels Villeneuve posted:

also i can't admire the ogre enough. just a great enemy, down to them being killable at 100% ammo efficiency if you're accurate enough (two rockets!)

Interestingly enough, the Copper mod removes that 100% ammo efficiency because the mod author considers it a liability for map design:

lunaran posted:

Ogre ammo drops have been reduced to 1 rocket each (from 2). Vanilla Ogres were 'ammo neutral' in that it took two grenades (or two grenades worth of shotgun or nail damage) to kill them, and two grenades were dropped in return, so each Ogre was effectively a means of converting other ammo into rockets. The level designer could not then give the player a grenade launcher or rocket launcher without making them instantly overpowered thanks to all the rockets they'd saved up, due to what a bread and butter monster the Ogre is. This change improves the mapper's ability to make rockets rare if they choose, without having to so severely limit use of Ogres.

The mod also attempts to give the Thunderbolt more of a distinct role by having the lightning pierce through enemies, dealing diminishing damage to each additional enemy. The Copper changelog is a really interesting read in general for anyone interested in the fine details of retro FPS design.

# ? Sep 1, 2021 20:15

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