Pathfinder RPG: sqrt(13)th Edition

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Pathfinder RPG: sqrt(13)th Edition

B.B. Rodriguez: Aug 8, 2005; Bender: "I was God once." God: "Yes, I saw. You were doing well until everyone died."

Evil Sagan posted:

Obsidian making games based on a system based on the third edition of Dungeons and Dragons? You can go home again!

E: Should have read the full press release first.

Hey, if they even approach the good stuff that was KOTOR2 with this, I'll be happy. Maybe they'll make me give a poo poo about lovely Golarion.

# ? Aug 13, 2014 20:53

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 22:26

zachol: Feb 13, 2009; Once per turn, you can Tribute 1 WATER monster you control (except this card) to Special Summon 1 WATER monster from your hand. The monster Special Summoned by this effect is destroyed if "Raging Eria" is removed from your side of the field.

Man card games what.
Pillars of Eternity (?) looks neat, the previews are encouraging and Obsidian seems like they'd know to rebalance things properly for a crpg if they ended up making a pf one.
That said Golarion is a pretty meh setting so it's not like I'd be much more excited than with any other Obsidian crpg.

# ? Aug 13, 2014 20:55

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

Golarion is a setting with huge swathes of really cool places (Nex, geb, Alkenstar, the Worldwound) and equally huge swathes of dumb boring areas (What the hell are isger and molthune)

# ? Aug 13, 2014 20:59

LightWarden: Mar 18, 2007; Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

And the MMO is set in one of the most generic possible locations. I know it's ripe for murderhobos to build their own settlements, but still, nothing says "man, you all should check this location out!"

# ? Aug 14, 2014 03:45

FromTheShire: Feb 19, 2005; Panzers on Russian soil, Thunder in the east.
One million men at war,
The Soviet wrath unleashed

Herr Tog posted:

the OP is four years old. what is the best software for making a character now?

I'm a big fan of Yet Another Pathfinder Character Generator, they do a good job keeping up to date with the latest releases and a great job with responding to feature requests and putting out updated versions in my experience. If you're building something oddball you can run into interaction problems but I've always been able to sort it out myself with the custom options or get the guys who update it to address it with a feature request or bug report.

I find having a sheet that auto-calculates everything from saves to attacks to feats allowed by class/deity/alignment makes it way easier to update it when you level and to theory craft, and this way I don't have to try and read my lovely writing either.

# ? Aug 15, 2014 18:09

LightWarden: Mar 18, 2007; Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

The Advanced Class Guide is out. We have apparently learned nothing.

# ? Aug 16, 2014 23:43

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

It's not a bad book overall, there's the good (Fighters flying under their own power, the slayer and the investigator finally burying the rogue, a spell called whip of spiders) and the bad (The arcanist, divine grace as a feat for casters) but it's a decent paizo product.

# ? Aug 16, 2014 23:52

zachol: Feb 13, 2009; Once per turn, you can Tribute 1 WATER monster you control (except this card) to Special Summon 1 WATER monster from your hand. The monster Special Summoned by this effect is destroyed if "Raging Eria" is removed from your side of the field.

I haven't paid that much attention, did the investigator get much interesting/worthwhile? I remember thinking the skill bonuses were super underwhelming.

# ? Aug 16, 2014 23:58

Inverse Icarus: Dec 4, 2003; I run SyncRPG, and produce original, digital content for the Pathfinder RPG, designed from the ground up to be played online.

zachol posted:

I haven't paid that much attention, did the investigator get much interesting/worthwhile? I remember thinking the skill bonuses were super underwhelming.

It still seems to be a class designed to never enter combat to me.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 00:10

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

It's an entire class based on adding 1d6 to a skill check, but there's enough tricks with the investigator talents to make it pretty interesting and probably the best skill monkey in the game. The Mastermind archetype is also the coolest thing ever

# ? Aug 17, 2014 00:11

NachtSieger: Apr 10, 2013

Eox posted:

The Mastermind archetype is also the coolest thing ever

I'll say!

quote:

Mastermind�s Inspiration (Ex): A mastermind can use inspiration on any Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge, or skill checks without spending a use of inspiration. This ability alters inspiration.

I unironically wish this never gets fixed.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 00:24

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

NachtSieger posted:

I'll say!

I unironically wish this never gets fixed.

quote:

Impregnable Mind (Su): At 9th level, a mastermind�s
secrecy, obscurity, and mental conditioning reach
superhuman levels. He becomes immune to any divination
spell, spell-like ability, or effect that allows a saving throw
(though he can still allow a divination effect to affect him
if he wishes). Even divination effects that do not allow
a saving throw have diff iculty piercing a mastermind�s
barriers, as a mastermind can now choose to think in
any language he speaks. Unless the opponent reading a
mastermind�s thoughts speaks all of the mastermind�s
languages, attempts at thought reading automatically
fail. This ability replaces the investigator talent gained
at 9th level.

Is it useful basically ever? Probably not. Is it cool as poo poo? Hell yeah.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 00:48

Capsaicin: Nov 17, 2004; broof roof roof

NachtSieger posted:

I'll say!

I unironically wish this never gets fixed.

I don't even know what this means.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 01:08

Ambi: Dec 30, 2011; Leave it to me

quote:

Mastermind�s Inspiration (Ex): A mastermind can use inspiration on any Diplomacy, Intimidate, Knowledge, or skill checks without spending a use of inspiration. This ability alters inspiration.

Capsaicin posted:

I don't even know what this means.

Instead of allowing Inspiration to be used for free to buff Diplomacy, Intimidate and Knowledge skills, as written it allows for Inspiration to be used for free on all skills, which is probably not what they meant to do. Probably a fourth skill that it applied to that was written out, or a copy-paste error.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 01:15

zachol: Feb 13, 2009; Once per turn, you can Tribute 1 WATER monster you control (except this card) to Special Summon 1 WATER monster from your hand. The monster Special Summoned by this effect is destroyed if "Raging Eria" is removed from your side of the field.

I feel like I want to make some snarky comment regarding skills or the only useful ones anyway but ugh. +1d6, limited uses, just wow. Great.
God I hate 3e-style skills so much. Just the worst nonsense.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 01:17

Libertad!: Oct 30, 2013; You can have the last word, but I'll have the last laugh!

Eox posted:

It's not a bad book overall, there's the good (Fighters flying under their own power, the slayer and the investigator finally burying the rogue, a spell called whip of spiders) and the bad (The arcanist, divine grace as a feat for casters) but it's a decent paizo product.

Fighters able to fly on their own? Tell me more...

# ? Aug 17, 2014 01:41

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

One of the two new fighter archetypes drops armour training for a mutagen and a handful of alchemist discoveries, one of which is wings. It's not much, but it's a nice trick.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 01:42

LightWarden: Mar 18, 2007; Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

The Wings discovery lets you fly for a number of minutes equal to your caster level, but unfortunately that fighter archetype doesn't have a caster level. There's a ton of RAW stuff like that in this book.

ACG posted:

Pummeling Style (Combat, Style)
You collect all your power into a single vicious and debilitating punch.

Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike; base attack bonus +6, brawler's flurry class feature, or flurry of blows class feature.

Benefit: As a full-round action, you can pool all your attack potential into one devastating punch. Make a number of rolls equal to the number of attacks you can make with a full attack or a flurry of blows (your choice) with the normal attack bonus for each attack. For each roll that is a hit, you deal the normal amount of damage, adding it to any damage the attack already has dealt from previous rolls (if any). If any of the attack rolls are critical hits, make one confirmation roll for the entire attack at your highest base attack bonus. If it succeeds, the entire attack is a confirmed critical hit.

Of note is that despite the intent, you don't actually have to make unarmed attacks to use this one (or even melee attacks). So it's already a novelty crit-fishing option, but then...

ACG posted:

Pummeling Charge
Your charge ends with a mighty haymaker.

Prerequisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, Pummeling Style; base attack bonus +12, brawler level 8th or monk level 8th.

Benefit: When using Pummeling Style, you can charge and make a Pummeling Style attack at the end of your charge as part of the charge action.

Normal: Making a Pummeling Style attack is a full-round action.

It's Pounce time!

# ? Aug 17, 2014 02:02

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

LightWarden posted:

The Wings discovery lets you fly for a number of minutes equal to your caster level, but unfortunately that fighter archetype doesn't have a caster level. There's a ton of RAW stuff like that in this book.

Technically, Alchemists don't have a caster level either!

Alchemy Class Feature posted:

In many ways, they behave like spells in potion form, and as such their effects can be dispelled by effects like dispel magic using the alchemist's level as the caster level.

The alchemist uses his level as the caster level to determine any effect based on caster level.

It's a weird distinction.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 02:10

LightWarden: Mar 18, 2007; Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Yeah, but while you can use your fighter level in place of your alchemist level for discoveries, you don't get the pseudocaster level of the alchemy feature. v :v:

v

Anyways, other stuff

ACG posted:

Spirit's Gift
You commune with a spirit of your choice, and it grants your animal companion or familiar a boon.

Prerequisite: Animal companion class feature or familiar class feature.

Benefit: At the start of the day, you can choose to commune with a single shaman spirit. (Although a shaman would need an hour of preparation, this takes you no time.) For the next 24 hours, that shman spirit augments your animal companion or familiar, as its spirit animal ability.

Of note because there are a variety of spirit animal abilities you can hand your animal companion such as permanent blur, DR 5/adamantine, fast healing 1, 5 ft fly speed, water breathing, or fire immunity, and you can mix it up each day as the situation requires. DR 5/adamantine on an animal companion at level 1 means you can tank a hilarious amount of things.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 02:25

Transient People: Dec 22, 2011; "When a man thinketh on anything whatsoever, his next thought after is not altogether so casual as it seems to be. Not every thought to every thought succeeds indifferently."
- Thomas Hobbes, Leviathan

More noticeably, there's a way to get unlimited Alchemist Spell Level 3 potions for ten minutes of your time each. This is about as amazing as it sounds.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 02:32

LightWarden: Mar 18, 2007; Lander county's safe as heaven,
despite all the strife and boilin',
Tin Star,
Oh how she's an icon of the eastern west,
But now the time has come to end our song,
of the Tin Star, the Tin Star!

Inspired Alchemy + Inspiring Cognatogen + rebrewing the latter?

# ? Aug 17, 2014 02:55

Killbot: Jun 19, 2003; You know, you kids really ought to stop getting involved with this stuff.

So someone on the Paizo forums got to listen about Unchained. They're toying with having rogues inflict more conditions with their attacks, a full-BAB monk, and toning down the summoner, among other things. Should be interesting, although I don't know if my game will ever get to take advantage of this stuff. My rogue tends to do pretty well in our combat encounters (so far), so the DM might be a bit reluctant.

As for the Advanced Class Guide, the Slayer was exactly what I needed for my other game. No one wanted to touch a trapfinding class, and I didn't want to play another rogue. Should be fun!

# ? Aug 17, 2014 03:43

Transient People: Dec 22, 2011; "When a man thinketh on anything whatsoever, his next thought after is not altogether so casual as it seems to be. Not every thought to every thought succeeds indifferently."
- Thomas Hobbes, Leviathan

LightWarden posted:

Inspired Alchemy + Inspiring Cognatogen + rebrewing the latter?

I think so, yes. That plus Lesser Restorations = no penalties at all for running around with eternal buffstacks.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 04:05

Slashrat: Jun 6, 2011; YOSPOS

Killbot posted:

So someone on the Paizo forums got to listen about Unchained. They're toying with having rogues inflict more conditions with their attacks, a full-BAB monk, and toning down the summoner, among other things. Should be interesting, although I don't know if my game will ever get to take advantage of this stuff. My rogue tends to do pretty well in our combat encounters (so far), so the DM might be a bit reluctant.

I'm still amazed that Paizo will be able to get away with selling a book full of long overdue errata as a set of optional rules.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 06:20

Inverse Icarus: Dec 4, 2003; I run SyncRPG, and produce original, digital content for the Pathfinder RPG, designed from the ground up to be played online.

Slashrat posted:

I'm still amazed that Paizo will be able to get away with selling a book full of long overdue errata as a set of optional rules.

Which half the people will beg to be allowed to use, and the other half will spurn.

The idea that I could have a full-BAB monk and a GM who says it's not canon/official is even more hilarious than the gauntlet/handwrap bullshit.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 07:01

Slashrat: Jun 6, 2011; YOSPOS

Eox posted:

The Advanced Class Guide just shipped to some subscribers, and there's some weird poo poo going on with Dex to damage.

Following up on this farce, Jason Bulmahn teased a feat that they added to the upcoming Advanced Class Guide Origins book, in an attempt to fix the clusterfuck that is the Slashing Grace feat.

You get one guess for whether it is a well thought-out and complete fix.

So the spirit of it all is obviously that it should be possible, with a feat, to get DEX-to-damage with one weapon that is either light or one-handed and deals slashing or piercing damage. There now exists three such feats in three separate books, and between them they only cover all one-handed slashing weapons (but not light slashing weapons) and the rapier.

I present to you Paizo.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 12:58

DJ Dizzy: Feb 11, 2009; Real men don't use bolters.

Im going to be running a game for a group of new-ish players. Which AP would be best to get them started on? I'm thinking either Skulls and Shackles, Kingmaker or RotRL

# ? Aug 17, 2014 13:04

LongDarkNight: Oct 25, 2010; It's like watching the collapse of Western civilization in fast forward.; Oven Wrangler

Eox posted:

It's not a bad book overall, there's the good (Fighters flying under their own power, the slayer and the investigator finally burying the rogue, a spell called whip of spiders) and the bad (The arcanist, divine grace as a feat for casters) but it's a decent paizo product.

Do mean a feat that gives the Paladin class feature? Please post this travesty.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 13:09

Eox: Jun 20, 2010; by Fluffdaddy

I wish I was kidding posted:

Divine Protection
Your deity protects you against deadly attacks.
Prerequisites: Cha 13, Knowledge (religion) 5 ranks,
ability to cast 2nd-level divine spells; blessings
or mystery class feature.
Benef it: You gain a bonus equal to your Charisma
modif ier on all saving throws. If your Charisma modif ier
is already applied as a bonus on all saving throw (such as
from the divine grace class feature), you instead gain a +1
bonus on all saving throws.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 13:14

Slashrat: Jun 6, 2011; YOSPOS

LongDarkNight posted:

Do mean a feat that gives the Paladin class feature? Please post this travesty.

Paraphrasing a bit here, but the feat is named Divine Protection and has the following requirements:

Cha 13, Knowledge (religion) 5 ranks, ability to cast 2nd-level divine spells; blessings, domain, or mystery class feature

It grants your charisma modifier to all saves.

If you already have the Divine Grace class feature or an identical ability (it must grant CHA to ALL saves), you only get a +1 bonus all saves instead.

e: beaten

# ? Aug 17, 2014 13:17

Andrast: Apr 21, 2010

Giving my caster oracle +7 to all saves with a single feat seems like a pretty good deal.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 13:34

obeyasia: Sep 21, 2004; Grimey Drawer

Is Divine Protection better than maxing out Superstitious for my next Barbarian?

# ? Aug 17, 2014 15:26

Jack the Lad: Jan 20, 2009; Feed the Pubs

Why are feats involved at all? Why don't you just get Dex to damage with certain weapons?

I mean, 5e has this figured out. :psyduck:

# ? Aug 17, 2014 16:34

Calico Noose: Jun 26, 2010

Because people who insist of using crude things like weapons and spurning glorious magic deserve to be punished for their ineptitude... I guess that kind of thing is legitimately how Paizo designers think.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 16:55

Slashrat: Jun 6, 2011; YOSPOS

If they couldn't pad out the content for martials with badly written feats that just barely makes iconic archetypes feel useful, they might have to start giving them stuff like their primary attribute modifier to all saves, and that would encroach on the stuff casters can do and make them feel less special.

It reads like sarcasm, but it is close to if not The literal truth.

Edit:
More :Paizo:

You know what the wizard or arcanist needs to really be able to contribute to the party? The ability to be the party's Face in every conceivable situation...

...using their primary ability modifier...

...and keying it all off a single unrelated skill that they are the undisputed masters of already.

I give you

Orator
Prereq: Skill Focus (Linguistics)

Benefit: you can use your linguistics in place of bluff when telling a lie, Diplomacy when changing an attitude, and Intimidate when forcing cooperation.

Slashrat fucked around with this message at 17:35 on Aug 17, 2014

# ? Aug 17, 2014 17:08

Night10194: Feb 13, 2012; We'll start,
like many good things,
with a bear.

The more I see about Paizo the more I come to think Wizard Privilege is a real thing.

# ? Aug 17, 2014 18:46

Arivia: Mar 17, 2011

The more I read about Paizo the happier I get that they are just making cool things to mess around with while playing elfgames with my friends. It doesn't need to be super balanced, it just has to be fun: and they're delivering that in spades (and in the most socially conscious manner of any of the big publishers for sure.)

# ? Aug 17, 2014 18:48

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Slashrat posted:

Paraphrasing a bit here, but the feat is named Divine Protection and has the following requirements:

Cha 13, Knowledge (religion) 5 ranks, ability to cast 2nd-level divine spells; blessings, domain, or mystery class feature

It grants your charisma modifier to all saves.

If you already have the Divine Grace class feature or an identical ability (it must grant CHA to ALL saves), you only get a +1 bonus all saves instead.

e: beaten

I'm drooling a bit over this. I have a cleric with a +4 charisma modifier in a Rise of the Runelord game [he's also a necromancer, just don't ask] and this would fit very well for him. Too bad he's picking Leadership for his 7th level feat. He needs a cult after all, and you can't just get one of those for free!

# ? Aug 17, 2014 18:51

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 22:26

Baudin: Dec 31, 2009

Baudin posted:

A secondary melee character will have something more like
+5 BAB
+2 stats
+1 weapon bonus
+8
Meaning they'd need 12's to hit (without flanking), and 10's to hit a 20 if flanking. 25 AC would be fairly difficult to hit.

Zurai posted:

I'm going by adventure path metrics here; there's usually at least one +3 weapon by the end of the second/start of the third AP book. I don't think Paizo even remembers that no more than half of a character's WBL is supposed to come from a single category.

Why would a medium-BAB character only have +2 to their primary combat stat? By 7th level a +2 stat item is easily affordable, and anyone who starts out with only a 12 in their primary combat stat is just bad at D&D or not actually planning to contribute to combat. Also, why only a +1 weapon? 8k gold is, again, quite affordable. If the character actually intends to contribute to combat the only number that should really be different is the BAB.

This is a bit of a thread derail but my current character (the necromancer cleric) whom I consider a secondary/tertiary melee character currently has exactly this attack bonus, with the exception that I'm in the process of crafting a magic scythe and currently only have a masterwork weapon. This is mostly due to poor loot drops, a larger than average party, and a focus on non min-max combat for my character. It really can be just this bad.

e: woops I should have added this to my last post :cripes:

# ? Aug 17, 2014 18:57

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