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silvergoose posted:If I want to roleplay I'm not playing a board game. Why the hell not? You could easily take out the board in King's Dilemma and replace the sealed envelopes with a campaign book. A game is just a kit for having fun.
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Feb 13, 2020 20:21
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Why the hell not? You could easily take out the board in King's Dilemma and replace the sealed envelopes with a campaign book. A game is just a kit for having fun. Personal preference? I don't find that sort of stuff engaging at all, roleplaying requires buy-in that I honestly don't have a lot of the time. If I'm going to roleplay I'll play fiasco.
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Feb 13, 2020 20:28
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Role Playing and Board Gaming are two different disciplines, granted with some overlap. If you want to role play, a RPG has a better structure for enabling that than a board game will have.
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Feb 13, 2020 20:30
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Shadow225 posted:Role Playing and Board Gaming are two different disciplines, granted with some overlap. If you want to role play, a RPG has a better structure for enabling that than a board game will have. Nah, son. If you're telling me RIFTS is a better structure for role-play than a game of Tales from the Arabian Nights just because one's an RPG and the other's a boardgame, I'm telling you that's shallow analysis.
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Feb 13, 2020 21:22
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I think there is room for overlap in design but I haven’t experienced any that pull it off well yet. I am generally very anti-narrative driven games because they often have terrible writing. Adding a light role playing requirement to that narrative sounds like disaster, but Kings Dilemma looks solid in that it seems the light role playing it tries to induce is mechanically driven by your factions goals, and not by a bunch of fluff narrative that doesn’t add anything to the actual game.
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Feb 13, 2020 21:31
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I mean, I feel like it should be understood that I am speaking generally. I am not going to cherry pick counter examples for two distinct disciplines with broad nd sometimes nebulous definitions.
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Feb 13, 2020 21:32
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Shadow225 posted:Role Playing and Board Gaming are two different disciplines, granted with some overlap. If you want to role play, a RPG has a better structure for enabling that than a board game will have. They're arbitrary placeholder names for a type of methodology, but that's it. RPGs can use decks of cards, board games can have character sheets, etc. Legacy board games have a lot of RPG crossover stuff, as people have noted. Shadow225 posted:I mean, I feel like it should be understood that I am speaking generally. I am not going to cherry pick counter examples for two distinct disciplines with broad nd sometimes nebulous definitions. two "distinct disiplines with broad and nebulous definitions" is you contradicting yourself in the same sentence. Distinct disciplines aren't nebulous and broad.
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Feb 13, 2020 21:35
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Memnaelar posted:Nah, son. If you're telling me RIFTS is a better structure for role-play than a game of Tales from the Arabian Nights just because one's an RPG and the other's a boardgame, I'm telling you that's shallow analysis. Tales is a pretty terribly written choose your own adventure where your choices are really arbitrary because you don't know what consequences there are for any of your choices.
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Feb 13, 2020 21:38
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silvergoose posted:Tales is a pretty terribly written choose your own adventure where your choices are really arbitrary because you don't know what consequences there are for any of your choices. None of that invalidates my thesis. I'm not shilling for Tales' value as a boardgame which, frankly, is pretty limited. I'm stating that saying that RPGs are a better medium for role-playing than boardgames simply because of their genre names is ridiculous, especially given the roots of RPGs. RPGs, like boardgames, have a spectrum for mechanical depth and theme/storytelling. Nothing about Mechwarrior/Battletech's hex maps and charts make it a "better" role-play conduit than, say, Mysterium or The Resistance. That said, yes, you're more likely to role-play in Apocalypse World than when playing a Lacerda. You got me. edit: Generally speaking, the heavier the mechanical depth, the more likely (but not absolute) the focus of the players will be on navigating those mechanics and centering the game around that. There's an entire derail here about how people argued that D&D 4E was "less" role-play-oriented because of its heavier focus on system mechanics, despite the fact that the corebooks for 4E had just as much discussion of theme and setting as any prior edition. All that had really changed was the level of complexity. I've got love for King's Dilemma because it does what a lot of story game RPGs do. It provides just enough mechanical bones to make a "game" out of the storytelling and then focuses its energy on the storytelling and legacy elements in order to encourage its players to role-play. I may not have the time or energy to devote to a weekly 4-hour D&D sesson, but I do have the time for a weekly 1-hour King's Dilemma session and will probably get more role-play out of it than I would with some of my D&D DMs who focus more heavily on combat than role-play. *shrug* Memnaelar fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Feb 13, 2020 |
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Feb 13, 2020 21:52
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:two "distinct disiplines with broad and nebulous definitions" is you contradicting yourself in the same sentence. Distinct disciplines aren't nebulous and broad. Look man I honestly don't want to get pissy with someone on the internet for my word choice in a two sentence reply. If you don't think that there is a difference between the two terms/genres, then we won't find enough common ground to have a substantial discussion upon. FWIW I agreed with the initial post, which I understood to mean 'if you're enjoying it why does it matter if it's a board game or a RPG.'
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Feb 13, 2020 21:57
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Memnaelar posted:I've got love for King's Dilemma because it does what a lot of story game RPGs do. It provides just enough mechanical bones to make a "game" out of the storytelling and then focuses its energy on the storytelling and legacy elements in order to encourage its players to role-play. I may not have the time or energy to devote to a weekly 4-hour D&D sesson, but I do have the time for a weekly 1-hour King's Dilemma session and will probably get more role-play out of it than I would with some of my D&D DMs who focus more heavily on combat than role-play. *shrug* Just enough mechanics to qualify as a game. Oh goodie.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:07
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Mr. Squishy posted:Just enough mechanics to qualify as a game. Oh goodie. Just enough words to qualify as a post. Goodie indeed. Werewolf or Codenames fit that bill just as well. They're not all going to be your cuppa, just like not all internet posters are going to be mine.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:12
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Shadow225 posted:Look man I honestly don't want to get pissy with someone on the internet for my word choice in a two sentence reply. If you don't think that there is a difference between the two terms/genres, then we won't find enough common ground to have a substantial discussion upon. I'm not pissy with you at all and I hope I'm not making you angry. I once thought like you did. I'm just trying to have a conversation but I'm 100% willing to drop it. Thanks for being civil and I agree with your final point.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:15
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Arguing about taxonomy and genre semantics is fine but I find it completely meaningless without examples to reinforce any given point. Role playing in itself is such a nebulous thing and to some that means tactical grids and combat, to others that means talking in character, and I don’t know of any board games that do the latter.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:26
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If you haven't given passionate in character oration as to why the Senators should personally support the war against Cathage have you even played Republic Of Rome?
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Feb 13, 2020 22:45
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:I'm not pissy with you at all and I hope I'm not making you angry. I once thought like you did. I'm just trying to have a conversation but I'm 100% willing to drop it. Thanks for being civil and I agree with your final point. I read your reply and it felt snippy, but could completely be projecting. If that was not your intent, I apologize for misinterpreting it as such and replying in a snippy manner myself. I will try to remember to PM you in the next few days to discuss formally, and we an summarize for the thread if we feel it's interesting enough.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:48
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the big problem is that a huge amount of rpgs don't actually have rules to help you roleplay either. there is fundamentally no mechanical distinction between playing every game of 1830 as Baron Von StuffyPants, Proud Heir of the Stuffypants Fortune and playing every session of D&D as Scarlett Jo, half-elven chaotic good rogue, other than one having a character sheet where you can write down your appearance, alignment, and a set of theoretically contiguous skills.
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Feb 13, 2020 22:54
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Impermanent posted:the big problem is that a huge amount of rpgs don't actually have rules to help you roleplay either. there is fundamentally no mechanical distinction between playing every game of 1830 as Baron Von StuffyPants, Proud Heir of the Stuffypants Fortune and playing every session of D&D as Scarlett Jo, half-elven chaotic good rogue, other than one having a character sheet where you can write down your appearance, alignment, and a set of theoretically contiguous skills. Yes, but the difference is in the non-mechanical elements. A D&D game is moderated by a human, who has discretion to play off the personality and goals of Scarlett Jo even when running a premade adventure. There is nothing in 1830 to bend for Baron von Stuffypants and the best he can hope for is not to be perceived as deliberately throwing the game.
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Feb 13, 2020 23:25
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Just got King's Dilemma in the mail today. Was listening to SUSD, Quinns said "top game of 2019", I paused, and ordered it before the SUSD supply-chain-hug landed. Read the rules during lunch today - it looks loving delightful. Components aren't anything special in their material, but they's a couple small touches that show that thought and care has gone into them. I'm hoping to put a lunch-time crew together for this, because it's straight my jam.
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Feb 13, 2020 23:28
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Im angry about board games too
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Feb 13, 2020 23:31
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Control Volume posted:Im angry about board games too  E: i mean, same
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Feb 13, 2020 23:35
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Feb 13, 2020 23:36
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Impermanent posted:playing every game of 1830 as Baron Von StuffyPants, Proud Heir of the Stuffypants Fortune You joke but this reminded me of this: https://www.reddit.com/r/18XX/comments/buiqcc/18xx_random_playstyle_cards quote:Recently, I watched a bit of Jeff's 18OE solo-marathon on YouTube, and he had a great idea! He gave each "player" a personality, and tries to play each according to that persona. I had to try that out!
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Feb 13, 2020 23:39
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What is the goon consensus on Escape the Dark Castle. Looks really really interesting and it might be right up my groups alley. Anyone played it?
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Feb 14, 2020 00:23
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Bottom Liner posted:talking in character, and I don’t know of any board games that do the latter. Fog Of Love
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Feb 14, 2020 00:24
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Every game of Sheriff of Nottingham I've ever seen has people talking in character. I sort of assumed it was in the rulebook.
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Feb 14, 2020 00:34
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I think I'm just about done with Arkham Horror LCG having played through every cycle up til the present, I'm starting to much better understand some things that I do and don't like in co-op game design. Particularly having had a couple of games of Spirit Island in between, it blows me away how much that game gets right that so many other co-op games, AHLCG included, get wrong. I think the single biggest thing that's killing the fun of AHLCG over time for me is that so much of the 'difficulty' of the game relies on preventing you from doing stuff - limiting your options. The deck building is super fun, and lets you build up really interesting and clever combos of cards that in practice end up falling flat half the time due to encounter cards that lock you out of playing events, or require you to do special investigate actions on the cards (meaning you can't use the active abilities on items), or just overwhelm you with monsters so you end up stuck in place just trying to fight your way clear, or limiting your movement, or killing off your resources and on and on. I love the variety of scenario design, the strongly different character archetypes and deck building but I increasingly feel like it's just bad co-op game design to make the game difficult through restricting what you can do. By contrast, Spirit Island feels amazing in that it goes the exact opposite direction - the longer the game runs, the more options you have and the more powerful you become. None of the game mechanics (unless you're playing with events, and even there very rarely) stop you from doing what you want to do. The difficulty and loss condition is simply separated from your own ability to perform actions. While it maybe fits thematically in AHLCG that you're always struggling to get ahead, I've had far too many games recently where it felt like we spent most of the game battling off an endless procession of metaphorical leeches and irritations to try and get to a point where we could actually do what our decks/characters were designed to do. I feel like the game is so close to working right (even something like monster attack of opportunities resolving after playing cards seems like it would give you more freedom to actually do things, though obviously would affect balance) but so frequently just ends up creating an experience that's just not fun to play through. I dunno. I'm far enough into the Dream Eaters cycle that I'll probably play it through but I'm thinking I'll likely sell my collection after that.
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Feb 14, 2020 00:36
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JoCo is a board game that is also a better roleplaying game than most of the field. It does one thing but it does it incredibly well. Coincidentally, the roleplaying games that embrace a specific area are also much better than games that try to do it all. The latter is best left to acting.
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Feb 14, 2020 00:41
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The Cards Against Humanity 2500-card "Bigger, Blacker Box" is just $15. I'm thinking maybe I can cram all my Dominion cards into one. Has anybody bought that box by any absurd chance? Note that what they have now is not a long box with a single line of cards but a multi-row box that has a better chance of fitting on a shelf.
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Feb 14, 2020 01:53
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Rocko Bonaparte posted:The Cards Against Humanity 2500-card "Bigger, Blacker Box" is just $15. I'm thinking maybe I can cram all my Dominion cards into one. Has anybody bought that box by any absurd chance? Note that what they have now is not a long box with a single line of cards but a multi-row box that has a better chance of fitting on a shelf. If you do this you’re obligated to include “the biggest, blackest dick” card that comes taped to the inside of the box in all your future dominion games.
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Feb 14, 2020 02:05
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ketchup vs catsup posted:If you do this you’re obligated to include “the biggest, blackest dick” card that comes taped to the inside of the box in all your future dominion games. Oh is it just taped inside now? It used to be inside the lining of the lid and you had to extract it with careful exacto-knifing
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Feb 14, 2020 02:37
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So what games are folks playing over the holiday? (US only sorry  ) I'm playing Age of Steam, Acquire, 1862 and Indonesia. I'll let y'all know how it goes.
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Feb 14, 2020 17:03
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Mayveena posted:So what games are folks playing over the holiday? (US only sorry Hope the 62 is less...collusive.
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Feb 14, 2020 17:14
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silvergoose posted:Hope the 62 is less...collusive. Different set of players thankfully.
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Feb 14, 2020 21:07
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If you need more room for your games, IKEA is currently offering a sale on their Kallax shelves. Although shipping might be a concern. As for games, Little Towns is a good light worker placement with much more interactivities compared to other one hour and under worker placements.
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Feb 14, 2020 21:11
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King's Dilemma went up $30 since yesterday, gently caress.
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Feb 14, 2020 21:20
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I have 49, FCM, and 17 slotted between today and tomorrow. Maybe get 30/89 on Monday
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Feb 14, 2020 21:52
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golden bubble posted:As for games, Little Towns is a good light worker placement with much more interactivities compared to other one hour and under worker placements. Little town is mean as gently caress
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Feb 14, 2020 22:06
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SmellOfPetroleum posted:King's Dilemma went up $30 since yesterday, gently caress. If SUSD reviews a game and it looks good to you, buy it immediately or make peace with waiting for reprint.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:08
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Crackbone posted:If SUSD reviews a game and it looks good to you, buy it immediately or make peace with waiting for reprint. Yarp. That's what I did. As soon as I saw that review and compared it to SVWAG, I burned through some Amazon Rewards points and grabbed that sucker. It'd be great if the major e-retailers out there collected some data that showed sales spikes on SUSD review days. I imagine that site doesn't get nearly the marketing dollars it should, despite its obvious influence.
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Feb 14, 2020 22:15
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