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White Rock
Jul 14, 2007
Creativity flows in the bored and the angry!

iospace posted:

Ok, so, coffee goons, I request your help.

I'm debating getting a Moka Pot mostly because I want to start making lattes at home without having to go to a coffee shop all the time but not splurge the money for a proper espresso maker.

Could I get some advice on this?

Also, before anyone asks, no, I can not afford a true espresso maker, so the moka pot is the only option here.

I use a used 2 cup Bialetti Express and an old french press which i have removed the plastic case so it's just a glass jar and the press stop. You can then microwave the milk straight in the presser and froth is easily. I found both in my local second hand shop for less than 10$.

My tip for Moka brewing: always stop the process halfway, when the liquid is starting to touch the start of the spout. This will leave a nice espresso like coffee, rich with oils and flavour (Almost a bit too strong if you drink it straight.). The last half of the Moka is usually very bad tasting and foamy. You can always put it back on the stove after pouring a cup if you want to get that last bit of caffeine or just to compare.

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iospace
Jan 19, 2038


Thanks for the responses all. And thanks for the tip to use the glass part of a french press for the milk. I have one already that I use for cold brewing, and the glass portion slides out pretty easy, so I guess that can serve two roles.

Now to decide aeropress or moka pot, and if I go with the latter, what size one to get.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust

Moka Pot is pretty

Scaramouche
Mar 26, 2001

SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

Ultimate Mango posted:

I could use a little advice, since what I am seeing online is a bit counterintuitive. I know the answer may just be 'git gud' but maybe y'all have some wisdom for me.

I got my 270W back from Baratza and it seems to be working, which is better than not working. I think I a, having trouble dialing it in. With the Breville Smart Grinder, I think I was going way too coarse and over dosing to compensate. Now with the 270 I am going much finer and the scale tells me I am dosing 18.5g. I was getting flow pretty fast, but it was tasty. In an effort to slow down the shots, I started going finer, but now the shots have started tasting acidic to me.

Here is where I need help: the Internet tells me that to correct acidic shots I need to go finer and longer, but it seems I got into this pickle by going finer to begin with?

I am to the point where I will need to add a shim to go finer, and I wonder if coarser and higher dose is really what I need to do?

Well there's quite a few variables, I'm assuming the bean has remained constant throughout this? Sometimes acidity can come from slower roasted beans which means that unless you hit a perfect "window" of extraction they'll have that taste. So it'd be good to know which beans are involved, and maybe post a picture of the grind to see if there's fine/distribution problems.

Also is it possible your 'acidic' is 'sour'? There's some speculation here that sour can be from under extraction:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Coffee/comments/2lu5t8/why_is_my_espresso_sour/

dik-dik
Feb 21, 2009

Ultimate Mango posted:

I could use a little advice, since what I am seeing online is a bit counterintuitive. I know the answer may just be 'git gud' but maybe y'all have some wisdom for me.

I got my 270W back from Baratza and it seems to be working, which is better than not working. I think I a, having trouble dialing it in. With the Breville Smart Grinder, I think I was going way too coarse and over dosing to compensate. Now with the 270 I am going much finer and the scale tells me I am dosing 18.5g. I was getting flow pretty fast, but it was tasty. In an effort to slow down the shots, I started going finer, but now the shots have started tasting acidic to me.

Here is where I need help: the Internet tells me that to correct acidic shots I need to go finer and longer, but it seems I got into this pickle by going finer to begin with?

I am to the point where I will need to add a shim to go finer, and I wonder if coarser and higher dose is really what I need to do?

This guide was very helpful for me when I first got my espresso machine and grinder: http://www.home-barista.com/tips/mano-lite-short-guide-to-dialing-in-espresso-sos-and-blends-t13975.html

Ultimate Mango
Jan 18, 2005

Scaramouche posted:

Well there's quite a few variables, I'm assuming the bean has remained constant throughout this? Sometimes acidity can come from slower roasted beans which means that unless you hit a perfect "window" of extraction they'll have that taste. So it'd be good to know which beans are involved, and maybe post a picture of the grind to see if there's fine/distribution problems.

Also is it possible your 'acidic' is 'sour'? There's some speculation here that sour can be from under extraction:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Coffee/comments/2lu5t8/why_is_my_espresso_sour/

dik-dik posted:

This guide was very helpful for me when I first got my espresso machine and grinder: http://www.home-barista.com/tips/mano-lite-short-guide-to-dialing-in-espresso-sos-and-blends-t13975.html

These were very helpful. I added another shim to my grinder on the theory that I'm still not going fine enough. I know that there should be some detectable grain and not just like talcum powder, but maybe i just need to go finer.

I am getting 2oz in 24-28 seconds from 18-19g of coffee, so I'm in the zone there.

I am about to open a bag of light roast Ethiopian that was roasted less than a week ago so I think I'm in for fun getting it dialed in.

Carpet
Apr 2, 2005

Don't press play

Ultimate Mango posted:

So very nice. How do you like the Mignon?

I went with the 270W and now that it's back from repair I like it, but wish I had done the Mignon instead since Baratza has been a pain to deal with. The Breville Smart Grinder was okay as a stopgap but having something that can do espresso fine is going to be a lot of fun.

As for the Rocket, I know people like the Exobar or Profitec, but drat if Rocket isn't a sexy machine.

Haven't really got anything to compare the Mignon to, apart from my Hario hand grinder, but it looks nice and seems to work well I guess?

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!
First visit to a coffee roaster today. It was a super positive visit, the guy was fun and appropriately passionate. He may have talked us into trying cold brewing.

iospace
Jan 19, 2038


wormil posted:

First visit to a coffee roaster today. It was a super positive visit, the guy was fun and appropriately passionate. He may have talked us into trying cold brewing.

Do it. It's awesome

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust

Cold brew? Not awesome. Less flavor and a waste of beans. The roaster was trolling you or something.

Clark Nova
Jul 18, 2004

I like cold brew, but yeah, it's a good way to use up meh or older beans, not nice fresh expensive ones

TheDarkFlame
May 4, 2013

You tell me I didn't build that?

I'll have you know I worked my fingers to the bone to get where I am today.
On the topic of older beans, I told my mother I bought myself a coffee grinder and she gave me some Tesco coffee beans she bought a while ago thinking they were ground coffee.

Turns out she bought them more than a while ago. The label on the back says Best Before End: SEP/14

Frankston
Jul 27, 2010


TheDarkFlame posted:

On the topic of older beans, I told my mother I bought myself a coffee grinder and she gave me some Tesco coffee beans she bought a while ago thinking they were ground coffee.

Turns out she bought them more than a while ago. The label on the back says Best Before End: SEP/14

Cold brew, obviously

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!
Follow up, I don't like the beans I bought from the roaster. They bloom big which I read is a sign of freshness but they are medium roast and the coffee tastes like something you would get at a diner or donut shop. When he asked what I like, I said, dark roast, fruity, low acid. What I got is a medium roast that tastes like Maxwell House. It is low acid. Is it appropriate to take them back and ask for something else?

GoodluckJonathan
Oct 31, 2003

If they are only one day off roast they might be super gassy depending on his roasting style. Give them 3-5 days and see if they taste better.

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!
My wife is less picky, I'll give them to her. I'll try a different roaster, preferably one with coffee samples I can taste before buying.

obi_ant
Apr 8, 2005

Howdy.

I recently purchased a Kitchen Aid cold brew coffee maker [url=https://www.kitchenaid.com/shop/-[KCM4212SX]-6011596/KCM4212SX/]here[/url]. I was wondering what is a good ratio in terms of grounded coffee beans (oz) to water ratio. Also, does it matter what type of beans I use? I typically use pretty "high" quality beans with my french press / areo pres; but I've heard that it doesn't matter much for cold brew?

TheDarkFlame
May 4, 2013

You tell me I didn't build that?

I'll have you know I worked my fingers to the bone to get where I am today.
Seems like a neat gadget, an all-included kind of design that means you don't have to drain the coffee from the grounds, decant it into a second container and then pour it to serve. I've seen a lot of people here mention that cold brew can be done with relatively cheap, low-end beans and still get a decent drink out of it. If you like cold brew, that is. I guess that with higher quality beans you lose a lot of the flavour that makes them high quality, so it's better to go for something cheap and basic.

Website does list some specs:

Specifications posted:

DIMENSIONS & WEIGHT
Weight 6
Depth 8
Height 6.9
Width 7

No units, it just weighs 6.

Scaramouche
Mar 26, 2001

SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

Yeah cold brew is not where you generally go for subtle flavours (which usually require heat/pressure to bring out) so you can put just about any old bean in there. Quality makes a difference of course, but not nearly as much as heat brewing.

a mysterious cloak
Apr 5, 2003

Leave me alone, dad, I'm with my friends!


I'm so desperately tired that I'm... I'm drinking...

It's from a Keurig, okay? It's absolutely awful and I am ashamed.

There Bias Two
Jan 13, 2009
I'm not a good person

a mysterious cloak posted:

I'm so desperately tired that I'm... I'm drinking...

It's from a Keurig, okay? It's absolutely awful and I am ashamed.

Why not just drink some mud out of a ditch on the side of the road? It's much more palatable.

Scaramouche
Mar 26, 2001

SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

When I'm that low I just bung ground coffee, jeez have some standards man

road potato
Dec 19, 2005
Starting to seriously look into getting a home-roasting setup. I was wondering about noise of various roasters. Watching videos online its impossible to really gauge how loud they are coming through computer speakers. I'm in an apartment, and not living alone, so I'm trying to be conscientious of how much noise my new hobby is going to make.

I was looking at lots of the roasters - Huky, Hot Top, Gene Cafe, Behmoor, a whole bunch. What do you use and how much noise does it actually make? Compared to, say, a normal standard vacuum?

mulls
Jul 30, 2013

I use the heat gun dog bowl. It's fairly loud but I do it outside anyway because of the chaf.

geetee
Feb 2, 2004

>;[
Behmor isn't loud but it gets smokey and the chaff is a pain. I do it in the garage. Can't imagine doing it inside without a heavy duty exhaust.

rockcity
Jan 16, 2004
I would not want to roast inside an apartment. The smell is pretty strong and it definitely lingers. The Behmor is relatively quiet though. I have no qualms doing it on my back patio even at night and my neighbors are close. The beans rolling in the drum make more noise than the machine really.

Scaramouche
Mar 26, 2001

SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

Yeah they noisy and smokey. You can install a venting system like we have in ours to eliminate smoke and flying chaff but that's hardly a usual lease approved reno.

Ultimate Mango
Jan 18, 2005

Got a bottomless portafilter to help me learn to distribute and tamp better. It came with a triple basket, which I love the idea of, but I can't figure out how much coffee to use. I was doing maybe 20g doubles. Does that mean 30g triples with 60g espresso out of it?

Jean-Paul Shartre
Jan 16, 2015

this sentence no verb


Ultimate Mango posted:

Got a bottomless portafilter to help me learn to distribute and tamp better. It came with a triple basket, which I love the idea of, but I can't figure out how much coffee to use. I was doing maybe 20g doubles. Does that mean 30g triples with 60g espresso out of it?

What's your specific setup? Assuming it's a 58mm basket, I wouldn't imagine even a "triple" reaching 30g of grounds, and a 60g result is super long for an espresso. Without knowing more I'd say fidget around with 23g grounds and aim for a ~35-40g shot, but that's for a "standard" third-wave style shot, if you prefer longer shots then you'd know that.

Ultimate Mango
Jan 18, 2005

JohnCompany posted:

What's your specific setup? Assuming it's a 58mm basket, I wouldn't imagine even a "triple" reaching 30g of grounds, and a 60g result is super long for an espresso. Without knowing more I'd say fidget around with 23g grounds and aim for a ~35-40g shot, but that's for a "standard" third-wave style shot, if you prefer longer shots then you'd know that.

This was helpful. I have a Rocket Mozzafiato and a Sette Grinder. I got the rocket bottomless and it came with a redonckulously large basket. I compounded my own problem by trying it out with these light roast Ethiopian beans that I didn't get dialed in ever. Next bag is something I am more familiar with.

Even at 25-27 grams when I tamp the puck is well below the ridge in the basket, which is why I think I've been under dosing. When I do 25ish in and 50ish out it can be pretty tasty indeed. I found that in that configuration tamp pressure makes a huge difference. Too light a tamp and it flows in 2-3 seconds but too firm and it takes 10-15 to start moving, all at the same grind setting.

Should I just use the double basket with the bottomless? I really like the idea of a larger shot, it just seems like I need either a really coarse grind or a huge dose to get it filled to the ridge, if that matters?

Scaramouche
Mar 26, 2001

SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

It's kind of up to you, but I've always found zeroing in a double basket to be easier than anything bigger, it just feels like the additional mass starts to throw off the variables that changed in a linear fashion with smaller amounts, now change in a non-linear fashion with larger amounts. I know it's possible though, so you'll probably nail it eventually.

Verisimilidude
Dec 20, 2006

Strike quick and hurry at him,
not caring to hit or miss.
So that you dishonor him before the judges



I can only afford normal rear end coffee (Folgers) and I use a French press. I've noticed that my brew always comes out on the bitter side (currently going 20g coffee, 300g water). How can I make this taste less lovely without changing brands/method. How do y'all brew normal rear end coffee in your French press. TIA

There Bias Two
Jan 13, 2009
I'm not a good person

Verisimilidude posted:

I can only afford normal rear end coffee (Folgers) and I use a French press. I've noticed that my brew always comes out on the bitter side (currently going 20g coffee, 300g water). How can I make this taste less lovely without changing brands/method. How do y'all brew normal rear end coffee in your French press. TIA

Try reducing the amount of rear end in your coffee.

rockcity
Jan 16, 2004

Verisimilidude posted:

I can only afford normal rear end coffee (Folgers) and I use a French press. I've noticed that my brew always comes out on the bitter side (currently going 20g coffee, 300g water). How can I make this taste less lovely without changing brands/method. How do y'all brew normal rear end coffee in your French press. TIA

Ignoring the obvious, for the love of god stop using that answer, Folgers is pre-ground for a drip machine, not a french press. The grounds are too fine and you are over extracting your coffee. You can try to shorten the brew time, but honestly a more appropriate grind size is what you need. You just can't find that in any packaged, pre-ground coffee though. You'd have to buy whole beans and have them ground for you to the correct grind size.

dik-dik
Feb 21, 2009

...are you trolling?

Jean-Paul Shartre
Jan 16, 2015

this sentence no verb


Ultimate Mango posted:

Even at 25-27 grams when I tamp the puck is well below the ridge in the basket, which is why I think I've been under dosing. When I do 25ish in and 50ish out it can be pretty tasty indeed. I found that in that configuration tamp pressure makes a huge difference. Too light a tamp and it flows in 2-3 seconds but too firm and it takes 10-15 to start moving, all at the same grind setting.

If you're getting good shots at 25-ish g then keep pulling with 25-ish g, find a formula that works rather than following what weights I use for a different setup (23g was typical on the speedster we had at my last cafe), yeah. I've never really seen people using the ridge as a significant indicator, so I wouldn't worry if you're above or below it, but if others have they can say so.

One piece of advice I would say is don't intentionally mess with your tamping. Personally I tamp pretty firmly, but the important thing is I tamp the same way every time. I can adjust weight, grind, extraction time around a consistent tamp pretty easily, and I can control all those other variables as they are clearly quantifiable (whether on a scale, grinder, etc.). Once you start trying to tamp differently from one shot to the next, you now have a changing variable in your extraction that you can't control or quantify as precisely and that's just going to lead to inconsistent shots.

kim jong-illin
May 2, 2011
If you're having trouble achieving consistent tamping then you could consider getting a VST precision basket and Barista Hustle's tamper. The tamper is designed specifically for the VST baskets and makes it super easy to get a consistent tamp every time. The quality of my shots jumped massively after I made the switch from the stock double basket to a 20g VST basket with the Barista Hassle tamper.

I'd even argue that, no matter how good someone's technique is, they'll benefit from a VST precision basket thanks to the specific design of the holes, which eliminates a source of inconsistency.

kim jong-illin fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Jun 1, 2017

bizwank
Oct 4, 2002

Verisimilidude posted:

I can only afford normal rear end coffee (Folgers) and I use a French press. I've noticed that my brew always comes out on the bitter side (currently going 20g coffee, 300g water). How can I make this taste less lovely without changing brands/method. How do y'all brew normal rear end coffee in your French press. TIA
Normally I avoid declaring anything "real" coffee/espresso or the "best" machine/prep method because hey, different strokes for different folks. That said, there's no way you can make Folgers taste not lovely except maybe making it really, really strong in a percolator then dumping a bunch of irish cream in it. If you live near anything even remotely resembling civilization you can find better coffee, and you should, if you want something that you can put in a french press and not have it coming out tasting like rear end. Literally anything that you can buy whole-bean and grind fresh at the grocery store will work better and give you at least a fighting chance at making a palatable beverage.

JohnCompany posted:

Once you start trying to tamp differently from one shot to the next, you now have a changing variable in your extraction that you can't control or quantify as precisely and that's just going to lead to inconsistent shots.
Thirding this.

Dr Cheeto
Mar 2, 2013
Wretched Harp
What's the next logical step from a whirly-pop roaster? I don't have a lot of counter space so stovetop options are a plus.

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Ultimate Mango
Jan 18, 2005

JohnCompany posted:

If you're getting good shots at 25-ish g then keep pulling with 25-ish g, find a formula that works rather than following what weights I use for a different setup (23g was typical on the speedster we had at my last cafe), yeah. I've never really seen people using the ridge as a significant indicator, so I wouldn't worry if you're above or below it, but if others have they can say so.

One piece of advice I would say is don't intentionally mess with your tamping. Personally I tamp pretty firmly, but the important thing is I tamp the same way every time. I can adjust weight, grind, extraction time around a consistent tamp pretty easily, and I can control all those other variables as they are clearly quantifiable (whether on a scale, grinder, etc.). Once you start trying to tamp differently from one shot to the next, you now have a changing variable in your extraction that you can't control or quantify as precisely and that's just going to lead to inconsistent shots.

This is super solid advice, thank you.

I switched beans, and had to grind them finer and I find also have to tamp a little harder. But that sounds like a mistake so maybe an even finer grind is the answer.

I got the brewista scale and that does help in terms of overall amount and time, and the bottomless portafilter shows me how much I still suck. I don't get sprayers or anything but it often comes out of a few spots and at different rates.

At least I'm having cool moments. Like being able to really pull different flavors from different beans. This Guatemalan with dark chocolate and graham cracker that you got a bit of off the Breville Smart Grinder was taken to a whole new level of dark chocolate and graham with the Sette and bottomless portafilter. But it took several horrible shots first to get a good one.

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