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porfiria posted:Well, I just saw it. Really great first act--the sequence on the landing shuttle is a display of true bravura, but everything after that kinda meanders. I think part of the problem is there's no throughline in the second act--David is very obviously evil, which fine, but there's no play given to, say, trust morphing into suspicion and then confrontation. None of the characters other than Walter give a poo poo about David or what he's been up, which, again, makes sense I guess but is really inert dramatically. I didn't love Prometheus but at least there the characters' motivations and internal lives informed their actions. The whole thing felt weirdly put together--I can't for the life of me remember exactly how the scenes were put together but I feel like there were at least a couple of moments where I thought the tension was about to start ratcheting up...and then we'd cut to a scene of David talking urbanely about something. I pretty much agree with your entire review, but just wanted to add that I thought there were elements of drama, tension and high stakes, but the film went nowhere with them. It seemed like every potentially contentious interaction played out like: Character A: I want to do this dangerous thing with clearly defined rewards, which is actually rational/reasonable given the circumstances . Character B: I think we should do the safe thing. Character A: I'm going to do the dangerous thing. Character B: Okay, I just wanted you to know my opinion. The easiest thing I can think of to contrast Covenant's approach to conflict among the crew is the scene in the original Alien when the landing party brings Kane back to the ship. Ripley refuses to let them in. Ash overrides her lockout. They all start yelling at each other, and Lambert slaps Ripley. It's a highly contentious moment between all of the crew which doesn't really get resolved until they have much bigger problems to deal with.
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Jun 6, 2017 19:34
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I sort of liked it. These folks were just way more professional than the Nostromo or Prometheus crew.
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Jun 6, 2017 20:09
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Sometimes people are panicky idiots who do very very stupid things due to stress and personal failings. Sometimes groups are actually professional and respectful of each other and keep cool under pressure. I find movies tend to depict the first group far more often because it's easy cheap drama, but when the later type is shown in some sort of horror movie and poo poo STILL goes wrong I enjoy that much more. "These people were logical and kept their poo poo together and did all the right things but were still hosed in the end" is generally more scary than "These people only died because they were too stupid to live and if it wasn't for the monster probably would have all managed to get them selves killed through infighting and incompetence on a simple shopping trip together" is often just frustrating to watch.
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Jun 6, 2017 20:27
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Danny McBride's wife played it level-headed like Ripley in Alien, up until the point where that guy's back wound gleeks blood on her face, then poo poo's pretty much hosed from that point on.
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Jun 6, 2017 20:35
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Speak of of Danny, I just started this Vice Principals show. Pretty good.
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Jun 6, 2017 20:41
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Neo Rasa posted:I sort of liked it. These folks were just way more professional than the Nostromo or Prometheus crew. The Nostromo were all level-headed with their only mistake of having Dallas go after the Alien alone in the vents which he quickly backs out of since he had no clue what he's doing because he doesn't know what he's dealing with. No one had seen it full grown until that point except for Parker and Ripley (only briefly). The crew of the Covenant has some of the dumbest characters in the films with the woman who singlehandedly blows up their ship (  ) being the worst. Someone should set that whole scene to music from Loony Toons and it'll work perfectly. Right down to the banana-peel slip on the blood.
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Jun 6, 2017 21:32
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The slip on the blood was actually pretty good, especially the fact that it occurs after Oram's wife had already slipped on it. It's Faris' fault, yes, but I think the reason the events occur isn't as silly as it seems unless you're the type of person to yell at horror movie victims for the circumstances they are in. The whole scene resulting from the panic of someone who had to judge between corporate protocols and her better judgement in the face of something she absolutely is not prepared for is very well done, especially considering that that's how everyone in this film dies. Doing things like trying to please the corporate hierarchy or their mental conflict in how corporate protocol has left them utterly unprepared for what will happen. Oram's decision to leave for the planet and answer the beacon, betraying what he identifies as a persecution of his character based on his faith, something he willfully discards in trying to please the crew and be a leader on the terms of his crew liking him. In the case of Tennessee's wife, the fact she panics is the whole point of the scene. She can't choose between instinct and protocol, she ends up wedged between doing what she thinks is right and what she is "supposed to do" and ends up getting Karine and herself killed. Along with precipitating the destruction of the ship which goes up in flames and parallels the death of the original Captain, Daniels' husband. Compared to Oram sticking his head in the egg being outside of a naturalized reading, Faris' death doesn't really bother me. The crew tries to multitask and succumbs to things they are not prepared for, nor is their corporate protocol going to prepare them for. The whole trust in David comes with the instinct that synthetics obey and serve humans, that that is what they do. David saves their lives, that's a lot of pathos earned and David is able to capitalize on people doing their jobs or people becoming complacent in the face of something they understandably aren't ready for. Corrosion fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Jun 6, 2017 |
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Jun 6, 2017 21:49
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s.i.r.e. posted:The Nostromo were all level-headed with their only mistake of having Dallas go after the Alien alone in the vents which he quickly backs out of since he had no clue what he's doing because he doesn't know what he's dealing with. No one had seen it full grown until that point except for Parker and Ripley (only briefly). At that point, they know it's larger than a snake, has teeth, has enough strength to punch through a human sternum, and can move at lightning speed. Why in the gently caress would you EVER think getting in a vent with something like that is a good idea? Dallas was as smart as the guy who got friendly with the snake lamprey thing in Prometheus, but since Alien came out when you were a young'n you can forgive whatever occular pat down you're giving the movie.
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Jun 6, 2017 23:04
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Maybe if you have a quarantine procedure, you should also screen the new planet for airborne diseases.
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Jun 6, 2017 23:09
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They did - you can hear their onboard computer reciting a long list of boring facts about the atmosphere before the doors open. It wasn't an airborne disease what got 'em.
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Jun 6, 2017 23:13
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Still probably a good idea to wear some kind of filter but I'll forgive a movie for not wanting to stick its entire cast behind masks or helmets for the whole runtime.
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Jun 6, 2017 23:15
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To get all tactical realist, the chance of a disease on an alien planet being communicable to humans on first contact is close to zero. Bacteria and viruses don't just go around infecting whatever they find, they target specific hosts. Occasionally a mutation will allow them to infect a different host, but that doesn't happen the moment a host shows up. That's why something like the bird flu is a threat to humans- a virus which normally targets birds mutated to also infect humans.
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Jun 6, 2017 23:48
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Hodgepodge posted:To get all tactical realist, the chance of a disease on an alien planet being communicable to humans on first contact is close to zero. Bacteria and viruses don't just go around infecting whatever they find, they target specific hosts. Occasionally a mutation will allow them to infect a different host, but that doesn't happen the moment a host shows up. That's why something like the bird flu is a threat to humans- a virus which normally targets birds mutated to also infect humans. B-b-but War of the Worlds! 
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Jun 6, 2017 23:58
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ruddiger posted:Dallas was as smart as the guy who got friendly with the snake lamprey thing in Prometheus, but since Alien came out when you were a young'n you can forgive whatever occular pat down you're giving the movie. Dallas wasn't doing it to impress a date.
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Jun 7, 2017 00:37
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I mean, the ~tactically realistic~ response to hearing human music being broadcasted from an undiscovered earth-like planet that conveniently didn't show up in the scans is to Nope the hell away from it, but nobody wanted to get back in the pods for another seven years when the captain just died.
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Jun 7, 2017 01:19
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CelticPredator posted:The score for Liar Liar is abysmal. I hate that boopy comedy music. It made an amazing comeback for Nightcrawler, though.
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Jun 7, 2017 01:52
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I felt pretty bad for Walter in this movie. He gets punked by David, gets up, and then instantly gets punked again! Edit: Also Walter getting unplugged and collapsing into the weird manufacturing pose is one of the movie's moments of true artistry along with the double blood floor slip.
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Jun 7, 2017 02:09
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Hodgepodge posted:To get all tactical realist, the chance of a disease on an alien planet being communicable to humans on first contact is close to zero. Bacteria and viruses don't just go around infecting whatever they find, they target specific hosts. Occasionally a mutation will allow them to infect a different host, but that doesn't happen the moment a host shows up. That's why something like the bird flu is a threat to humans- a virus which normally targets birds mutated to also infect humans. Yeah, I assume that all the alien life heretofore discovered by spacefaring humanity has actually obeyed the laws of evolutionary biology and thermodynamics and so on such that there's no reason to fear viral infection or parasitism by creatures that'd have no idea what to do with your bloodstream if they managed to wander inside it.
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Jun 7, 2017 02:22
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To be fair as soon as they spot earth trees and earth wheat that would go out the window.
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Jun 7, 2017 02:24
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:It made an amazing comeback for Nightcrawler, though. Oh yeah! I did love that quite a bit.
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Jun 7, 2017 02:29
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Hodgepodge posted:To get all tactical realist, the chance of a disease on an alien planet being communicable to humans on first contact is close to zero. Bacteria and viruses don't just go around infecting whatever they find, they target specific hosts. Occasionally a mutation will allow them to infect a different host, but that doesn't happen the moment a host shows up. That's why something like the bird flu is a threat to humans- a virus which normally targets birds mutated to also infect humans. That's true, but at the same time they are landing in a brand new environment with many unknowns. The thing that bothered me was the moment you feel weird, light headed, pain, et cetera in an environment like this you need to immediately communicate this and take it more seriously than, *stumble* (person standing near by): "You ok?" (Person who is not ok): "Yeah, I'm fine."
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Jun 7, 2017 03:26
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ruddiger posted:At that point, they know it's larger than a snake, has teeth, has enough strength to punch through a human sternum, and can move at lightning speed. Why in the gently caress would you EVER think getting in a vent with something like that is a good idea? They had no other options and had to get rid of it, Dallas didn't go in there looking to examine it or out of curiosity his job is to rid his ship of the monster under the bed. Remember that they're all just truckers that aren't trained, equipped or prepared for the poo poo they have to deal with. Millburn tries to pet the large dick monster like it's a puppy because he wants to but there's absolutely no need to, they're not trapped in the room and they could easily have ran and hid until the rest of the team could pick them up the next day.
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Jun 7, 2017 03:34
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s.i.r.e. posted:The crew of the Covenant has some of the dumbest characters in the films with the woman who singlehandedly blows up their ship ( I have actually said before that you could set the entirety of Prometheus to the Benny Hill Theme, I'm glad I'm not alone in this thinking.
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Jun 7, 2017 03:45
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Taintrunner posted:I have actually said before that you could set the entirety of Prometheus to the Benny Hill Theme, I'm glad I'm not alone in this thinking. You could do this with the original Alien film as well.
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Jun 7, 2017 04:59
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http://youtubedoubler.com/?video1=h...+MASTER%22+Rasa
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Jun 7, 2017 05:24
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I like how "my wife" and "your wife" had to be thrown around every two minutes because audiences can't be hosed to remember.
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Jun 7, 2017 06:23
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I don't get upset by that because I saw too many Sci-Fi Channel originals back in the day so I'm jaded. *two people that have worked together for ten years speak to each other like they do every day* SO MR. ARMSTRONG. EVER SINCE YOU WERE KICKED OUT OF THE FUTURE COPS BECAUSE YOU WERE FRAMED BY THAT OTHER CHARACTER, YOU'VE BEEN WORKING HERE. *five minutes pass* DARE ARMSTRONG?! WOW, IF IT ISN'T THE GUY WHO WAS KICKED OUT OF THE FUTURE COPS!
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Jun 7, 2017 06:44
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I kind of liked Alien Covenant. I dug quite a bit of what it was going for, but it's one of those movies I feel like doesn't quite execute what it's going for well enough if that makes any sense.
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Jun 7, 2017 06:49
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Nail Rat posted:I like how "my wife" and "your wife" had to be thrown around every two minutes because audiences can't be hosed to remember. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6l23JsoTbT4
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Jun 7, 2017 06:55
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RedSpider posted:You could do this with the original Alien film as well. Maybe if the film was twice the speed, but Alien is too slow, though adding a laugh track to key parts would be hilarious.
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Jun 7, 2017 07:17
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lizardman posted:How did I go nearly 20 years without realizing Alien Resurrection was an anti-abortion movie? The whole theme of the movie is about persisting in life even if your existence is a 'mistake' (in a perfect world, Ripley would never have been cloned; the robot Call faces a lot of cognitive dissonance with her programming considering she was recalled by her manufacturer). In a chapel, Call asks Ripley how she can continue living and her reply is "I don't have much of a choice" (she's not pro-choice, har). Aliwn Megathread: Gay Abortions
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Jun 7, 2017 10:27
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This is in response to an earlier post that I read, but can't seem to find now. What could the crew of the Nostromo have done differently/better? The shuttle only has two cryopods I think, and obviously a very limited amount of provisions can be carried on there. They are way the gently caress out there, no place nearby to put in, and apparently no way to communicate with the outside world at all (or if they could, it was so slow as to be useless). I thought the plan of sending someone into the vents was pretty good, even considering what they knew at the time ("The son of a bitch was HUGE!") Like, one of the things I love about the film is that the crew seem to be real people, normal people that are thrust into a situation they are just not prepared for at all. I thought most of what they did, or tried to do, was pretty rational. And there weren't a lot of horror movie-type mistakes, where someone does something really stupid and gets killed for it. At least in my opinion.
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Jun 7, 2017 20:44
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Shoot it with a spear gun and just let it burn it self to death.
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Jun 7, 2017 21:40
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MrMojok posted:What could the crew of the Nostromo have done differently/better? Not stand outside the hatch demanding that Ripley break quarantine, thus allowing Ash to doom the crew with a single press of a button.
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Jun 7, 2017 21:58
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MrMojok posted:This is in response to an earlier post that I read, but can't seem to find now. Other than actually following safety procedures in the first place and not letting kane back on the ship, probably not a lot. The huge refinery complex they were pulling probably had supplies and things as well, could have potentially ditched the nostromo and hid out on the refinery until help arrived? I mean I assume a complex as huge as that had some general living space and emergency supplies and such? It was practically a whole city. Like, look at the size of this thing. It looks like it's got windows and poo poo, so I assume it's crewed when operational.  I've always loved this thing, here's a cool article on the Refinery http://alienexplorations.blogspot.ca/1979/08/bismarck.html Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 22:06 on Jun 7, 2017 |
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Jun 7, 2017 22:00
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Arglebargle III posted:Not stand outside the hatch demanding that Ripley break quarantine, thus allowing Ash to doom the crew with a single press of a button. Obviously they should never have let it in. But Ripley seemed pretty determined not to, and it looks like it wasn't going to happen had Ash not opened the hatch. But I mean, after that. I suppose they could have tried to barricade themselves some small compartment and hope it couldn't get in. Although provisions would have been just as much of an issue that way.
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Jun 7, 2017 22:02
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Baronjutter posted:Other than actually following safety procedures in the first place and not letting kane back on the ship, probably not a lot. The huge refinery complex they were pulling probably had supplies and things as well, could have potentially ditched the nostromo and hid out on the refinery until help arrived? I mean I assume a complex as huge as that had some general living space and emergency supplies and such? It was practically a whole city. If they could wait in the refinery for help, I doubt they'd need to be put into hypersleep for the duration of the journey home. It seems obvious they'd either die of starvation or old age if they didn't have the hypersleep chamber.
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Jun 7, 2017 22:58
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SUNKOS posted:If they could wait in the refinery for help, I doubt they'd need to be put into hypersleep for the duration of the journey home. It seems obvious they'd either die of starvation or old age if they didn't have the hypersleep chamber. Lure the alien into the refinery then gently caress off home?
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Jun 7, 2017 23:01
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Turn off the gravity and then get a shopvac and shoot the alien to death and throw it out the airlock and Hoover up its blood and put that overboard too.
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Jun 8, 2017 01:19
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Baronjutter posted:Lure the alien into the refinery then gently caress off home? What, you mean like douse the fucker?
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Jun 8, 2017 01:28
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