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Man I hope someone compiles all the great SMG and Cnut posts in this and other Star Wars threads. I really enjoy their analysis. It would probably make a great video series as well.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:11
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Mantis42 posted:Man I hope someone compiles all the great SMG and Cnut posts in this and other Star Wars threads. I really enjoy their analysis. It would probably make a great video series as well. Too late someone beat you to it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLKnCeeAW48
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Jan 20, 2016 02:15
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So I got home today and fired up the ol' Clone Wars and what should be my fortune cookie intro this time but this: lmao
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Jan 20, 2016 02:24
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Neo Rasa posted:Even after all that he still wants Luke to cold kill Vader because "He's more machine now than man..." Obi-Wan was intent on killing all along, from the moment Yoda gave him the job of facing Vader. He doesn't say anything in reply when Padme asks him whether he's going to kill Anakin. Obi-Wan ignites his laser sword first on Mustafar. Perhaps most tellingly, rather than staying with the mortally-wounded Vader, he picks up Anakin's lightsaber and reports back to Padme, who reminds him that there is (present tense, even though Obi-Wan presumably thinks Vader died) good in Vader before she dies too.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:29
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Harime Nui posted:In his postures and movements Grievous is clearly modeled on Snidely Whiplash. On top of being an affectation though (he tosses it away in a sort of parody of how Jedi prepare for a fight), Grievous is obviously using the cape to hide his mangled body.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:30
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There's some Ralph McQuarrie prints on ebay for like 40 bucks. I really want to buy one or two but I just can't tell if I'm the kind of person to buy Star Wars concept art and frame and hang it on my walls. Is that really something I want to do? Yes, probably. But is it?
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Jan 20, 2016 02:30
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piratepilates posted:There's some Ralph McQuarrie prints on ebay for like 40 bucks. I really want to buy one or two but I just can't tell if I'm the kind of person to buy Star Wars concept art and frame and hang it on my walls. Is that really something I want to do? Yes, probably. But is it? Do it.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:35
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piratepilates posted:There's some Ralph McQuarrie prints on ebay for like 40 bucks. I really want to buy one or two but I just can't tell if I'm the kind of person to buy Star Wars concept art and frame and hang it on my walls. Is that really something I want to do? Yes, probably. But is it? Buy one that tells a story about you, that way when people ask about the picture you talk about that and they'll be like "whoah he's cool".
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Jan 20, 2016 02:40
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Mantis42 posted:Man I hope someone compiles all the great SMG and Cnut posts in this and other Star Wars threads. I really enjoy their analysis. It would probably make a great video series as well. http://www.moviepilot.de/movies/the-prequels-strike-back/trailer/77387 http://prequelsstrikeback.com/ There is a bunch of film academics behind a "Ring Theory" analysis which delves heavily into the intertextual and referential aspects of the PT and reads the six movies as a cohesive cyclic whole. But upon reading some of the arguments by the people behind this project they heavily rely on old-fashioned Campbell's "A Hero's Journey" and Jungian stereotypes (which are obviously inseparable from SW) but without expanding into some of the interesting Christian Existential, Transhumanism and Zizekian analysis found in some of these cool CD posts.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:44
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I support Tezzor. I think he's showing more insight and gumption than any of the PT defenders as evidenced by the overly defensive and pitiful responses he's getting. He's hit a nerve with people because he's largely correct and that scares people. There's nothing wrong with enjoying bad movies. There's nothing wrong with guilty pleasures. But don't act like a buncha punk rear end bitches when people have some legitimate criticisms towards them!
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Jan 20, 2016 02:49
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Right or wrong, Tezzor's inspiring more interesting conversation than this thread has seen in a while.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:57
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PBS Newshour posted:Stop making me defend these bad movies. I always make one prayer to God, a very short one. Here it is: "O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous." God granted it. Yaws posted:There's nothing wrong with enjoying bad movies. There's nothing wrong with guilty pleasures. But don't act like a buncha punk rear end bitches when people have some legitimate criticisms towards them! It would've been cool if he posted any of those criticisms instead of just puking in response to somebody describing the events of the film.
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Jan 20, 2016 02:57
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Yaws posted:I support Tezzor. I think he's showing more insight Let's not forget such insightful quotes such as Tezzor posted:aaaah i'm vomiting from every hole and there's blood in it now
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Jan 20, 2016 02:58
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Phylodox posted:Right or wrong, Tezzor's inspiring more interesting conversation than this thread has seen in a while.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:10
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Sometimes I feel like I should serious post about the themes of faith (or rather hope if you prefer less religiously loaded terminology) present in TFA but then  Anyway, why do people seem to want to read Maz as some sort of ethnic wise woman when she's clearly the "realistic without being jaded or bitter catholic priest"? Is it because she's female? is it because no one ever calls her "father"?
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Jan 20, 2016 03:14
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NecroMonster posted:Sometimes I feel like I should serious post about the themes of faith (or rather hope if you prefer less religiously loaded terminology) present in TFA but then She's played by that famous black actress. Mocapped and everything. Might stem a bit from that.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:18
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NecroMonster posted:Sometimes I feel like I should serious post about the themes of faith (or rather hope if you prefer less religiously loaded terminology) present in TFA but then It's kind of hard to label her as a space-Catholic when she explicitly said she's not a space-Catholic (i.e., Jedi). On the other hand, there's plenty of stories of Christian iconography being transformed with local beliefs into a separate culture all their own (this is especially prevalent in the Caribbean).
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Jan 20, 2016 03:25
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It's just funny I'm watching this movie and Maz shows up and I'm all ready to find out which sort of hackneyed racial stereotype she is and the very nearly first thing out of her mouth is a joke about Chewie being her boyfriend that could have come right out of the mouth of one of the two major Nun stereotypes in fiction.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:28
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NecroMonster posted:Sometimes I feel like I should serious post about the themes of faith (or rather hope if you prefer less religiously loaded terminology) present in TFA but then She's a bit of both. I'd use SMG'S label of "hip street preacher" but without the uncomfortably awkward negative connotations he holds on the concept. She shelters and assists her community, does not demand subservience, is completely nonaggressive, and her display of faith comes in the form of life advice. She's not like, a soothsayer, but "worldly Yoda" mostly fits her.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:31
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Anyway, I really liked Maz, she was pretty loving great I think.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:33
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Also Tezzor was good for this thread because he acted as a lightning rod for the most stuck-up posters, while bouncing from topic to topic to allow the more substantial posters chances to post neat observations. Like a posting Air Freshener slash Bug Zapper.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:35
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piratepilates posted:She's played by that famous black actress. Mocapped and everything. Might stem a bit from that. And the reggae music playing... I found it strange that she was a thousand years old but also still bussing her patrons empty beer (?) glasses. I kinda got the "common worker who drops gems of wisdom" vibe from some of the visuals that is obviously contradicted by her reputation, the fact she has a giant statue of herself, and her subsequent actions. Yeah the film can be said to be a bit more overtly religious. The guy at the beginning is apparently from "the Church of the Force"
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Jan 20, 2016 03:38
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the film is also full of people either losing their faith and desperately looking for something new to cling to, or clinging desperately to something to their own detriment and/or the detriment of others and then there is Kylo's whole deal and then Luke doesn't take the lightsaber back and we are left swirling in confusion around this scene as the film ends will Luke accept the light saber and others faith in him? will the audience once again find faith in these drat star wars?
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Jan 20, 2016 03:46
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ungulateman posted:The Death Tezzor has only one weakness - a shitpost port two metres in diameter. He was the best shitposter in the galaxy, and a cunning...a cunning...uh...poster. quote:I support Tezzor. I think he's showing more insight and gumption than any of the PT defenders as evidenced by the overly defensive and pitiful responses he's getting. He's hit a nerve with people because he's largely correct and that scares people. and he was a good friend
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Jan 20, 2016 03:46
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Maz's big statue was obviously created by her congregation, as thanks to her. SMG said that only 2 ppl in star wars have statues of themselves, The Emperor and Maz, but the Emperor's is torn down by the people because hes an evil dictator, and Maz's is torn down by the space nazis who are busy dragging her customers out of the bar and shooting them.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:47
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Wait what movie has the emperor having a statue?
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Jan 20, 2016 03:48
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piratepilates posted:Wait what movie has the emperor having a statue? ROTJ special edition.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:48
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Yaws posted:I support Tezzor. I think he's showing more insight and gumption than any of the PT defenders as evidenced by the overly defensive and pitiful responses he's getting. He's hit a nerve with people because he's largely correct and that scares people. That may be a comforting thought, but there is nothing frightening in the form of his posts, nor fearfulness evident in the form of the responses. Tezzor has actually taken great pains to promote his 'depth of human feeling', and things of that sort. Emotiveness. The form is what matters, not fantasy. It's a question of truth and accuracy.
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Jan 20, 2016 03:49
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NecroMonster posted:Sometimes I feel like I should serious post about the themes of faith (or rather hope if you prefer less religiously loaded terminology) present in TFA but then That seems a bit off to me, but a good starting point. Let's run with this. You've got Lor San Tekka (Max von Sydow's character, not named on screen, whom Kylo Ren kills early on) as a literal priest early on, part of a Church of the Force. He's your Catholic priest. Maz is more ecumenical about it. Many flags fly over her castle. I think it's significant that the only person who calls the Jedi necessary gets killed for it. Without Jedi to monopolize it or Sith to repress it, people who aren't psychic mutants are developing their own relations to the Force. This is most obvious when you compare the destruction of Alderaan with the destruction of the Hosnian system, where instead of just giving Jedi indigestion, random schmoes can just go outside and be aware that it's happening. There's a Force sound cue when Finn starts doing his individuality thing, as has been mentioned. A pivotal moment for Rey is not, as with Luke, when she uses the Force when the chips are down - that's just an extension of her habit of surviving by any means and using whatever her enemies give her when she gets stranded on a shithole war-world. The climax of the film is when she "just let[s] it in," when she listens to the Force. The Force is speaking to everybody in this movie. Finn and the bar patrons, as we mentioned; but it's also what wakes up R2-D2 when Rey arrives at the Resistance base. Even the dead are starting to speak to the living, and give confusing and frightening visions to people they've never met (most obviously when Obi-Wan calls out Rey's name (apparently, they recorded some new audio from Ewan MacGregor for that, but found they were able to splice something together from old Alec Guinness recordings instead)). So where does that leave Luke, a living saint of the emerging religion of this era? The film suggests he has made a mistake. Specifically, the same mistakes that were made in the last three movies since his prior appearance, or echoes of them. He taught his students the way his own teachers taught him, with the result that one of his pupils ended up turning out like one of Obi-Wan's and Yoda's. This was before his pilgrimage to the first Jedi temple, of course - he did not know his history, so he was doomed to repeat it. I don't mean to belittle his earlier heroism, of course. He was the one who learned in the last Star War how to overcome evil, but he faltered when he faced the secondary step of keeping it from taking root. Guy shouldn't be too hard on himself; we just had a whole trilogy of movies about how easy it is for this sort of thing to happen. So the new generation of heroes, like all new generations, represent an opportunity to do better, an opportunity for things to turn out differently. Finn shows us that spontaneous goodness can't be thwarted or prevented. Ben is trying, struggling and stumbling, to reach the end of the radical path that Anakin was prevented from fulfilling (or at least he sees it that way). And Rey - well, maybe Luke will get it right this time. Then again, that's what Obi-Wan thought about Luke, and that only turned out okay because he did the opposite of what he was told. After his failure, Luke has no interest in being the spiritual leader that the galaxy is yearning for. So you've got hierophants like Lor San Tekka who talk a lot of poo poo about the Divine Right of Princesses, and you've got kindly but grim universalists like Maz for whom there's only unending evil and the necessity of opposing it. But if masters can learn anything from their apprentices, he might yet justify somebody's faith. Bongo Bill fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Jan 20, 2016 |
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Jan 20, 2016 03:55
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Luke did not learn from the prequels, therefore he was doomed to repeat them.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:02
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Bongo Bill posted:(apparently, they recorded some new audio from Ewan MacGregor for that, but found they were able to splice something together from old Alec Guinness recordings instead)). They got Guinness saying 'Afraid' to turn it into Rey, and Ewan MacGregor says "Take your first steps" 
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Jan 20, 2016 04:12
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Frackie Robinson posted:Luke did not learn from the prequels, therefore he was doomed to repeat them. Indeed, this whole star war is being fought because everybody would rather think they didn't happen.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:13
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Bongo Bill posted:Indeed, this whole star war is being fought because everybody would rather think they didn't happen. I'm okay with that on two separate levels.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:27
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The Force Awakens is uniting the tribes. It is still, however, the sequel to Revenge of the Sith.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:36
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I don't subscribe to the idea that Luke fell prey to PT mistakes. It's not like he just walked into a slave hut and picked up a mentally ill kid. His friends' child was having trouble and they looked to him for help; what was he going to do? My guess is that, instead of the theory of Luke turning Ren into Space Cop, he was instead corrupted or secretly taught by Snoke during his time learning under Luke. How else would he be calable of fashioning, as the film notes slash art book calls it, an ancient sith-designed lightsaber? It also sounds more reasonable when considering how Ren deifies Vader; a Ren that was corrupted Anakin style would get tricked once then go along because eh, nothing else to do, pissed off my friends. Ren's deal seems more like an attempt to live up to his family lineage, and when Luke didn't turn him into a righteous hand-chopping cop accepted Snokes' influence.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:36
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Neurolimal posted:I don't subscribe to the idea that Luke fell prey to PT mistakes. It's not like he just walked into a slave hut and picked up a mentally ill kid. His friends' child was having trouble and they looked to him for help; what was he going to do? It sounds like you might be right from how Leia describes it, but one wonders how Snoke had contact with Ben while he was on the planet on which Luke was training the Jedi.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:43
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That one is simple. Luke gathered some people who knew about/of the Jedi ways to help him teach the new generation. Snoke was one of them. But Luke ends up refusing to teach the standard Jedi dogma or propagate Jedi myths and trappings. And Snoke, very unhappy about this, easily sways Ben (also very unhappy about this) and others to his thinking with promises of power, and some, not quite perfect, instructions on how to make a Lightsaber. This would also be why Snoke and Kylo aren't actually calling themselves Sith, they don't want to be Sith, they want to be Jedi, and are simply using the Dark Side as a means to their ends (kill Luke so they can be the Jedi and properly restart the Jedi order). That would also be why Kylo (and Snoke) are so concerned about Kylo failing to "be dark", because they see the Dark Side as the only hope they have for defeating the "misguided" (but powerful!) Luke and restoring the Jedi order.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:55
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If they take a que from the Tales of the Jedi (the awesome Old Republic comics from the 90s, KOTOR before KOTOR) comics then he could communicate with him telepathically or appear like a force ghost via some Sith artifact or some object that's super attuned to the dark side because a badass dead Sith guy used it a lot or a lot of people died around it. So maybe like, Vader's armor is in repose wherever, Ben gets some kind of Sith knowledge through it and takes the helmet with him.
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Jan 20, 2016 04:59
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That's a good possibility as well, and would help to explain why everything is so very weighty and physical and characters drat near always pushing or pulling or shoving each other around, you know, aside from a simple response to the ethereal bodilessness of the prequels, or just the advances in computer technology and techniques the "villian" being immaterial would be a pretty stark contrast to the solidity TFA takes pains to establish in the world and it's people. of course Snoke only being present as a halogram in TFA already sort of does this NecroMonster fucked around with this message at 05:12 on Jan 20, 2016 |
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Jan 20, 2016 05:10
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Neurolimal posted:I don't subscribe to the idea that Luke fell prey to PT mistakes. It's not like he just walked into a slave hut and picked up a mentally ill kid. His friends' child was having trouble and they looked to him for help; what was he going to do? I don't know, when your pupil embraces facism and resolves to murder his famil you usually have failed somewhere along the way.
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