Cricket 2012: Cricket has always been a game stuck in the past

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Cricket This poll is closed.
Blackface in crowd	129	55.36%
References to Lord of the Rings	104	44.64%
Total:	233 votes

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glasnost toyboy: May 29, 2009

Burn Down Canberra posted:

I know I've talked about the book nonstop (whitewash to whitewash) but its relevant. After the controversial series against India the Australian cricket side was on a very short chain with cricket Australia.

There was a big push to clean up Australian cricket.

Last summer because everyones job was on the line they were told by cricket Australia to play like nasty dickheads. The Australians of old. Cricket Australia gave them the assurance that they would forgive anything within reason to win back the ashes. The saddest thing is that Australia has improved since then. Be it directly caused by or simple happenstance. The players would have been under instruction to wind up the kiwis

I don't think they were told to play like dickheads (not by CA anyway, perhaps by Boof), they just knew that CA was prepared to weather a bit of bad press and wouldn't hang them out to dry for getting a fine on a misconduct charge. CA had to regain the trust of the players, and get the team moving together in the same direction, letting them act like Australian cricketers and be overtly aggressive towards the opposition (instead of towards each other :v:

) was a concession to that.

It's an excellent book though, I haven't read Ponting's own books but it's nice to see he's honest enough to admit he had no idea what to do when he lost Warne and McGrath.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:12

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# ? Jun 1, 2024 17:14

The Deadly Hume: May 26, 2004; Let's get a little crazy. Let's have some fun.

Airstream Driver posted:

Like it or not aggression and sledging is very effective.

Well, you pick your targets. I remember something Steve Waugh? (who escalated it, pretty much) said they figured out how to give the silent treatment to people who liked a chat, or who would get mad and focused by it, but they would give heaps to anyone who might get rattled by it.

The funny thing to me is that cricket has its own name for trash-talk.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:13

Lionel Richie: Nov 14, 2004

I don't have a problem with sledging as such, it's just that if everyone did it to the extent that Australia do it then the game would be loving unwatchable.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:13

The Deadly Hume: May 26, 2004; Let's get a little crazy. Let's have some fun.

It'd be more bearable if it was of the witty "tickets, please!" kind but most of it is just verbal diarrhoea.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:16

The Deadly Hume: May 26, 2004; Let's get a little crazy. Let's have some fun.

Much like the Nine commentary team, come to think of it. Their sledging "skills", now inflicted upon the viewing public.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:17

Hyperriker: Nov 1, 2008; ur fukt m8

Seams posted:

If that doesn't deserve a send-off nothing does.

Nothing does.

Airstream Driver posted:

Holding's opinion of the tournament: it was shithouse

"Batsman's game" says the bowler! Seriously there were a truly ridiculous number of runs scored this Cup, almost to the point of it being a huge joke. 38 centuries for the tournament? gently caress! I think there were... two? Two double hundreds if I recall? Remember when scoring 200 in a one-dayer was literally impossible?

Watching guys like AB de Villiers find a way to belt the poo poo out of literally every single ball that arrive in their general direction is a true treat, but I reckon it does get old.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:22

The Deadly Hume: May 26, 2004; Let's get a little crazy. Let's have some fun.

I think it just has to do with the way T20 has changed batting attitudes and technique being carried over. Yeah there were a shitload of runs but there were still games where the bowling attack would rip through the opposition. The Eden Park NZ v Australia game was a pretty good example of that.

It's also messing with how the Duckworth-Lewis tables work.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:29

Hyperriker: Nov 1, 2008; ur fukt m8

Yeah it makes sense that T20 has a lot to do with it.

Some of the fast bowling was particularly good to watch though. Actual genuine attacking lines, which is not a T20 staple.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:34

Noxin of Shame: Jul 25, 2005; Our Dan

Mister Chief posted:

CGW story with a bit of the ACC.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nl3pRaN8E8

God I love John Campbell

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:51

Varkk: Apr 17, 2004

The Deadly Hume posted:

Well, you pick your targets. I remember something Steve Waugh? (who escalated it, pretty much) said they figured out how to give the silent treatment to people who liked a chat, or who would get mad and focused by it, but they would give heaps to anyone who might get rattled by it.

The funny thing to me is that cricket has its own name for trash-talk.

I wonder how much that idea went in to the Blackcaps being friendly and welcoming to the Australians. They knew they couldn't out oval office them so went the opposite and caught them off guard.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 10:52

Airstream Driver: May 6, 2009

Varkk posted:

I wonder how much that idea went in to the Blackcaps being friendly and welcoming to the Australians. They knew they couldn't out oval office them so went the opposite and caught them off guard.

Were they actually friendly? I assumed haddin was taking the piss.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:01

Wandle Cax: Dec 15, 2006

Noxin of Shame posted:

God I love John Campbell

Yeah me too. Best guy on TV.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:04

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

The Deadly Hume posted:

I think it just has to do with the way T20 has changed batting attitudes and technique being carried over. Yeah there were a shitload of runs but there were still games where the bowling attack would rip through the opposition. The Eden Park NZ v Australia game was a pretty good example of that.

It's also messing with how the Duckworth-Lewis tables work.

Isn't one of them leaving because they cant be arsed to keep updating it? I know for sure they've basically shrugged their shoulders and said 'How do you account for having someone like AB or McCullum who if they're set, regularly hit 10+ an over for the last 10 overs?' You cant base the entire formula on that, but to not take batsmen like them into account is also harming those teams who lose those overs.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:07

Quasimango: Mar 10, 2011; God damn you.

Haddin has a wierdly shaped face and looks like a 75 year old. In fact, most of the Australian team have old-looking skin, use some sunscreen, fellas.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:27

Drugs: Jul 16, 2010; I don't like people who take drugs. Customs agents, for example - Albert Einstein

Quasimango posted:

Haddin has a wierdly shaped face and looks like a 75 year old. In fact, most of the Australian team have old-looking skin, use some sunscreen, fellas.

constantly screaming abuse uses a lot of muscles in the face

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:29

Dumb Username: Oct 20, 2012

http://www.cricket.com.au/news/bcci-prank-calls-mauka-mauka-campaign-world-cup-semi-final-exit-australia-sydney/2015-03-30

lmao

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:35

Centusin: Aug 5, 2009

Quasimango posted:

Haddin has a wierdly shaped face and looks like a 75 year old. In fact, most of the Australian team have old-looking skin, use some sunscreen, fellas.

Australians are very ugly I agree

# ? Mar 30, 2015 11:36

CAT INTERCEPTOR: Nov 9, 2004; Basically a male Margaret Thatcher

Lionel Richie posted:

I don't have a problem with sledging as such, it's just that if everyone did it to the extent that Australia do it then the game would be loving unwatchable.

So I guess you dont watch cricket then?

FFS sledging has always been part of the game and every single bloody team does it. The incidents in the WC final are being written about by bunch of loving idiots who are basically "Yeah mate, they did write poo poo but they were writing fantastic stories in the nets!" and are frankly weak loving sauce at best.

It's not like sledging is unique to cricket either. Ask about it in any pro sport, what the current Aussie side do is taaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame

# ? Mar 30, 2015 12:06

Airstream Driver: May 6, 2009

Scylo posted:

Australians are very ugly I agree

gently caress you I'm beautiful

# ? Mar 30, 2015 12:09

Lionel Richie: Nov 14, 2004

Cat Terrist posted:

So I guess you dont watch cricket then?

FFS sledging has always been part of the game and every single bloody team does it. The incidents in the WC final are being written about by bunch of loving idiots who are basically "Yeah mate, they did write poo poo but they were writing fantastic stories in the nets!" and are frankly weak loving sauce at best.

It's not like sledging is unique to cricket either. Ask about it in any pro sport, what the current Aussie side do is taaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame

Yeah alright then Australia are no worse than anyone else :thumbsup:

. I haven't got a problem with sledging, we all like to see a riled up fast bowler and batsman going at it (not sexually), but Australia basically count on the better nature of others to not turn it into a shitshow. If someone in the opposition side acted exactly the same as David Warner, to David Warner, how long do you think it would take to kick off big style?

# ? Mar 30, 2015 12:23

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

Lionel Richie posted:

Yeah alright then Australia are no worse than anyone else . I haven't got a problem with sledging, we all like to see a riled up fast bowler and batsman going at it (not sexually), but Australia basically count on the better nature of others to not turn it into a shitshow. If someone in the opposition side acted exactly the same as David Warner, to David Warner, how long do you think it would take to kick off big style?

Then you have the series against India.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 12:38

Burn Down Canberra: Oct 27, 2005; GAME PLANS? We don't need no stinking game plans.

Warner is no worse than James Anderson and they managed to play a series without getting into an on field fight. Sure Anderson threatened to fight Bailey but no actual fists were thrown.

Send offs I think could trigger something one day. Batsmen can be emotional after being dismissed so I'd lean towards not doing it but Warner is mostly OK.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 12:59

glasnost toyboy: May 29, 2009

Lionel Richie posted:

Yeah alright then Australia are no worse than anyone else . I haven't got a problem with sledging, we all like to see a riled up fast bowler and batsman going at it (not sexually), but Australia basically count on the better nature of others to not turn it into a shitshow. If someone in the opposition side acted exactly the same as David Warner, to David Warner, how long do you think it would take to kick off big style?

The only difference between Warner and Jimmy Anderson is that Anderson usually covers his mouth when he's having a crack. Let's not get too precious here.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 13:01

monkeu: Jun 1, 2000; by Reene

The reason all the cry babies get so upset about Australia sledging is because they do it while pretty consistently winning. Under Waugh and then Ponting Australia dominated cricket. They were terrible for a long time after 2007, but now that they're back on top the whinging and whining about them has started all over again.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 13:09

Lionel Richie: Nov 14, 2004

glasnost toyboy posted:

The only difference between Warner and Jimmy Anderson is that Anderson usually covers his mouth when he's having a crack. Let's not get too precious here.

And the borderline racist stuff of course

# ? Mar 30, 2015 13:13

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

Lionel Richie posted:

And the borderline racist stuff of course

And the actual racist stuff.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 13:50

Gough Suppressant: Nov 14, 2008

quote:

In a corner of the glowing image of Australia's World Cup triumph is a blot that no amount of rubbing ever will remove. It is the disposition of the Australians at the dismissals of three New Zealanders during a largely one-sided final. Brad Haddin mocked Martin Guptill by clapping his gloves in Guptill's face after he was bowled by Glenn Maxwell, while Grant Elliott and Daniel Vettori were sent on their respective ways with volleys of words.

It was the sort of ugliness the ICC had promised to crack down on in this tournament. Like footballers who used to run amok in grand finals until the penalties were doubled, Australia's cricketers seemed to take the attitude that in a World Cup final, as long as they won, no punishment � no matter how stringent � could hurt them.

Australian captain Michael Clarke adopted the three wise monkeys defence, saying he saw, heard and said nothing. More generally, he said Australians played with "passion, excitement, adrenalin", as if that explained all. He left out the other usual alibis, "hard but fair", "not crossing the line" and "the Australian way", but it was late. Cocooned in sycophancy, the Australians seem not to grasp nor care how poorly this behaviour sits with the other half of a cricket-following public they repeatedly and ever more deeply divide, even in their finest hours.
Daniel Vettori is dismissed by Mitchell Johnson and sent on his way with a few words.

Daniel Vettori is dismissed by Mitchell Johnson and sent on his way with a few words. Photo: Getty Images

They also do not seem to care or grasp how it rankles with opponents, and how insufferably arrogant it makes them look. Do they really think they are the only country that plays with passion and pride? Do they think they patented the will to win? Do they think they have cornered the market in competitiveness?

No team in the World Cup played with more "passion, excitement, adrenalin" than New Zealand, but the Kiwis explicitly and scrupulously refrained from parlaying that into boorishness. Speaking before their epic semi-final win over South Africa, captain Brendon McCullum said: "Verbals are not part of our game. We're not good enough to focus on that."

In that semi-final, match-winner Grant Elliott went immediately to fallen opponent Dale Steyn to commiserate before rejoicing with teammates. In the final, when Clarke was dismissed moments before the end, four Kiwis put aside their own disappointment to go and shake his hand as he walked off. The contrast with the attitude of the Australians could not have been any sharper. Of course, in the minds of some, the Kiwis were too polite and too deferential, and that made them losers before they began, and the final result was proof of it.

Evidently, Haddin is one. Speaking on minimal sleep on Sydney radio on Monday morning, he said Australia had been discomfited by New Zealand's courtesy when the two played in Auckland earlier in the tournament. "I said in the team meeting, 'I can't stand for this any more, we're going at them as hard as we can', " he said. "It was that uncomfortable. All they were was that nice to us for seven days. I said, 'I'm not playing cricket like this. If we get another crack at these guys in the final I'm letting everything (out)'. "

Just possibly, Haddin was speaking with thick tongue in ruddy cheek. But the mindset was unmistakeable; niceness is a failing. It is un-Australian.

This is not about the everyday rough and tumble of high stakes international sport. No one objects to zest and enthusiasm. Not many object to meaningful stares, back and forth. In the famous duel between Pakistan's Wahab Riaz and Australia's Shane Watson in the Adelaide quarter-final, they were essential to the mise-en-scene. No one objects to banter. When McCullum took strike in the first over of Sunday's final, Haddin asked him if he was going to have a crack that day. "Too right I am," McCullum replied.

What is objectionable is the snark, the cattiness, the hissing, the goads and provocations, the infantilism. What is objectionable is the faux offence taken should an opponent be so impertinent as to reply. What is objectionable is to rub a dismissed batsman's nose in his dismissal, rather than let the wicket speak for itself. For 18 years, Vettori has been a grand competitor at international cricket, and this day was playing his last New Zealand game in any form. He deserved a salute; he got a gobful.

Later, McCullum was even and diplomatic, saying the send-offs were a "micro" issue, and that he did not want to say anything that might diminish Australia's achievement. Australia deserved to bask in the glory of being the best one-day cricket team in the world, he said.

And they are, and they bask on. But there is a difference between best and champion.

This article by greg baum sums up pretty well why I find the australian cricket team and their fans utterly insufferable and will almost always barrack for whoever is playing against them.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 14:19

MacDougall: Apr 21, 2008; Definitely Australian

Gough Suppressant posted:

This article by greg baum sums up pretty well why I find the australian cricket team and their fans utterly insufferable and will almost always barrack for whoever is playing against them.

You're a dick. Most of us were supporting NZ. Stop tarring us with David Warner coloured feathers.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 14:48

Byolante: Mar 23, 2008; by Cyrano4747

Gough Suppressant posted:

This article by greg baum sums up pretty well why I find the australian cricket team and their fans utterly insufferable and will almost always barrack for whoever is playing against them.

You should go hang out with your latte set and look down your nose at those horrible boors and their professional sport. Its only become an issue because Australia got good again and England, India and the bleeding hearts at the Age really need to tell you why its such a horrible crime while handing out a free pass to everyone else.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 15:01

Boonys Cut Shot: Nov 5, 2004; Elite athlete

Gough Suppressant posted:

This article by greg baum sums up pretty well why I find the australian cricket team and their fans utterly insufferable and will almost always barrack for whoever is playing against them.

Oh jeez I expected better from Greg Baum. I can't believe he's written that a day after we won the World Cup final.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 15:12

Hyperriker: Nov 1, 2008; ur fukt m8

Shmoses posted:

Oh jeez I expected better from Greg Baum. I can't believe he's written that a day after we won the World Cup final.

Listening to Warne onfield after the game was enough to turn anyone's mild frustration into full-scale Get hosed

# ? Mar 30, 2015 15:38

Lionel Richie: Nov 14, 2004

Just reading this 2003 article on the Darren Lehmann racism episode, going by some replies in this thread it's striking how much of it seems to still be accurate nowadays http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2003/jan/20/cricket

quote:

Instead it is the Sri Lankans who are rendered villains, oversensitive and unmanly to complain.

quote:

All ills can be cured if everybody just stops whingeing and swallows the (white, male, resolutely middle-class and anti-intellectual) panacea of 'mateship'.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 15:41

snaeksikn: Feb 28, 2010

australians being mean to kiwis isnt racist though. we literally invited the them to be part of the federation at the founding of the country, there's not really any bigger picture historically ingrained bad blood to trigger deep emotional reactions.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 15:57

Airstream Driver: May 6, 2009

Jesus not this poo poo again. I think I'll give this place a miss until the next cricket starts.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:05

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

the world needs David Warners in it to make your guys look like The Bigger Man in comparison.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:05

goatface: Dec 5, 2007; I had a video of that when I was about 6.

I remember it being shit.; Grimey Drawer

serious gaylord posted:

Isn't one of them leaving because they cant be arsed to keep updating it? I know for sure they've basically shrugged their shoulders and said 'How do you account for having someone like AB or McCullum who if they're set, regularly hit 10+ an over for the last 10 overs?' You cant base the entire formula on that, but to not take batsmen like them into account is also harming those teams who lose those overs.

They either need to somehow refit it so it scales depending on the ground (impossible for a match happening at a new or recently modified venue) and the current "game pattern", or replace it with something else entirely. gently caress knows what though.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:38

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

get the ICC to give Nate Silver a call, dude's got a p good system for picking winners

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:40

goatface: Dec 5, 2007; I had a video of that when I was about 6.

I remember it being shit.; Grimey Drawer

Some elaborate formula involving the stats of every player in every team, broken down over-by-over, run through a simulated game a few hundred times to find the average result at this point.

Cricket Manager 2015.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:44

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

The thing would have a blatant English bias since they're already basing their entire game plan around the contents of a laptop

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:49

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# ? Jun 1, 2024 17:14

goatface: Dec 5, 2007; I had a video of that when I was about 6.

I remember it being shit.; Grimey Drawer

They could run it on the weather supercomputers, to ensure that precise wind and air pressure effects are accounted for. A full 3d model of the ground, with crowd figures used to make adjustments based on levels of fan support and morale.

# ? Mar 30, 2015 16:56

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