Gaz-L posted:

Current GL Tier List based on how DC portrays them:

Hal

John, Jo

Jessica, Guy, Alan














Kyle

No I didn't forget anyone. DC did

Gripweed posted:

I read the current Catwoman series up to the point where the renumber the trades, which I assume is going to be a fairly firm break.

I didn't really like it.

What really struck me when I got to the end was how little it had done to set up Catwoman's supporting cast. There are only two new villains in it. One of them was a crime lord lady who was secretly really ugly, who died. The other was a failed Azrael turned Catholic murderer for hire, who doesn't die. He's fine as a recurring villain but he recurs so loving much and gets so much goddamn page time, way more than such a mid villain deserves. And he doesn't really have any specific connection to Catwoman, he's more just like a floating villain who can now turn up in any book.

And on the ally side, Catwoman befriends a cop, who dies. We get a flashback to the time she trained a group of youths to be thieves, who all died. She trains another group of youths to be thieves, and they all die. She trains a third group of youths to be thieves, and these don't die! But the only one of them with a memorable character design ends up becoming Cheshire's protégé. Six goddamn volumes of Catwoman and at the end the only new ally she has gained ends up being supporting cast for loving Cheshire instead.

I know that not every story needs to add to the mythos, but in Catwoman's case, doesn't it? At least a little bit? You want her to be more than a Batman sidestory, she needs her own stuff. And it's not like the stories we get here are amazing. They're fine. There's even a couple cool heist scenes. But they are very repetitive. You could get one really good standalone Catwoman OGN out of these six volumes of an ongoing.

There was also a very strange focus on showing Catwoman get hurt. Every single fight, she gets cut. Often several times. It's just weird. I've never seen another superhero comic show the lead take so much damage.

You guys were saying that after this she gets powers from a cat god and goes to space, and that makes total sense. I can understand why the writer who took over was like, "well, we gotta do something with Catwoman"

Xelkelvos posted:

There's also the woman who ended up as Yakuza boss that ran around as Catwoman when Selina did her own stint leading a whole organized crime family but then went back to being a Yakuza full time after Selina took the mantle back.

I do forget what all ended up happening with her sister as well as she was also attempted to be established as part of Selina's backstory

Xelkelvos posted:

There's also the woman who ended up as Yakuza boss that ran around as Catwoman when Selina did her own stint leading a whole organized crime family but then went back to being a Yakuza full time after Selina took the mantle back.

I do forget what all ended up happening with her sister as well as she was also attempted to be established as part of Selina's backstory

quote:

Is good vs. evil political? That answer might depend on whether or not you find yourself identifying more with the villains than the heroes. For some - especially in these politically charged times - DC's Wonder Woman title as written by Tom King is a pointedly political book. For writer Tom King, however, it's anything but.

"I don’t see Wonder Woman as a specifically political book, I see it as a superhero book. I may just be an idiot," King says with a laugh to Popverse's Sam Stone. "What is Wonder Woman fighting for? She’s fighting for equality, love, and all the things I was taught as a kid in the ‘80s that were the ideal things and that my mother was taught in the ‘50s and all the things my grandmother, who helped raise me, was taught in the ‘40s. I don’t see it as being political."

King and artist Daniel Sampere's Wonder Woman run, which began in 2023, features Wonder Woman and other Amazons being persecuted and judged by the media, with a new villain called the Sovereign behind it all. King says "too many people are associating" the Sovereign with themselves.

"I’m like 'You’re not the bad guy! Just like you’re not Lex Luthor or the Joker, you are not the Sovereign,'" says King. "There are definitely political undertones to it and there will always be people who are trying to be lovely that we can’t get rid of, that’s the reason why superhero comics work. But, for the most part, I’m still on the side of Stan Lee and Jack Kirby, that superheroes fight bad guys, and this is a bad guy. I don’t see it as more complicated than that."

King says that not all villains he's written shouldn't be worth identifying with - and we're not just talking about his Batman/Elmer Fudd crossover.

"I don’t want to say that Sovereign is completely evil, but I do consider him to be a Joker-level villain," says King. "When I write the Joker, I understand there’s a certain glory in imagining yourself to be a serial killer, like there’s a certain glory in imagining yourself to be the King of America with infinite power. But, at the end of the day, you want that villain to get punched in the face because they deserve it."

King describes Sovereign as representing "the status quo, that system, the power, the man, whatever you want to call that thing that, when you’re born, is the great power that you’ll be fighting with for the rest of time." In essence, it's the legacy forces that prevent things from becoming a better world for everyone.

"When you go out into the world, you find out you’re constantly being restricted by 400 years of history that has nothing to do with you and now it’s defining you," says King. "It’s like, 'I didn’t get a say in any of this!'"

The Last Call posted:

Thoughts?

Open Marriage Night posted:

He's probably getting poo poo from right wingers, and he has to act like it's not about them.

BrianWilly posted:

Sounds like he's reacting to the label of being political in a Twitter-mob pejorative sense, as in "Why are you forcing politics into comics? Why can't you just write comics without politics like they did in the good old days of 1942?" Which is a bit of a shame, because comics being political can be a great thing that ought to be borne with pride.

Though his impression that some readers are projecting themselves onto Sovereign is pretty strange, 'cuz I haven't seen that from...like, anyone anywhere. But maybe the algorithm has corralled him into a corner of Twitter comments that I am thankfully protected from. Mostly.

quote:

"I don’t see Wonder Woman as a specifically political book, I see it as a superhero book. I may just be an idiot," King says with a laugh to Popverse's Sam Stone. "What is Wonder Woman fighting for? She’s fighting for equality, love, and all the things I was taught as a kid in the ‘80s that were the ideal things and that my mother was taught in the ‘50s and all the things my grandmother, who helped raise me, was taught in the ‘40s. I don’t see it as being political."

Xelkelvos posted:

The first arc of Poison Ivy is extremely political and is fantastic and isn't afraid to have its anti hero protagonist literally suggest eating the rich. Even Superman had dipped its toes into being political with the Blue Earth stuff and aliens basically being a proxy for immigrants (again).

At least he's honest about being an idiot as all of the stuff he lists is political. And also sorta unclear as to what sorts of things he, his mother and grandmother were taught. You'd think a spook wouldn't be scared of hate mobbing by right wing internet trolls, but here we are I guess

The Last Call posted:

If you think DC's Wonder Woman is a political book, then you're identifying with the villains waaaaaay too much, says writer Tom King


https://www.thepopverse.com/wonder-woman-political-dc-tom-king-sovereign-book-may-2024

Thoughts?

BrianWilly posted:

I'm not out to defend King's track record on...anything, really...but I also feel like there are some weirdly intense reactions here to what was basically some tepid room temperature comments.

Gaz-L posted:

I mean, he's wrong about it not being political, and while I can see people thinking the literal text of 'one dude with a magic rope is behind all the bad things' ain't great, it's pretty blatant to me that the Sovereign is meant to be read as a metaphor for the worst parts of America, imperialism, misogyny, racism, classism, economic inequality, all wrapped up in the image of one dude because, well, it's a superhero comic and Diana needs someone to punch in the end. Hell, the scene where he mind controls the one soldier into killing himself as an example of the Amazons 'emasculation' feels pretty unsubtle in being about both the military brainwashing young men to ignore their better natures, with a dollop of toxic masculinity on top.

Like, the King run on Wonder Woman has problems, but the basic messaging doesn't strike me as one.

Cartridgeblowers posted:

Outsiders is cool as heck

The Last Call posted:

DC Reveals Zero Hour 30th-Anniversary Special First Look


https://comicbook.com/comics/news/dc-reveals-zero-hour-30th-anniversary-special-first-look-exclusive/

30 years ago, one of the DCU's brightest heroes fell from grace, driven over the edge by his failure to save Coast City and millions of people. In the famed EMERALD TWILIGHT storyline, Hal Jordan became PARALLAX in the wake of Coast City being annihilated. After that, he almost succeeded in refashioning the entire DC timeline and resetting reality to restore his home in the ZERO HOUR event. Luckily, the heroes prevailed and destroyed this villain and timeline for good...or so we thought. Green Lantern Kyle Rayner is about to discover Hal and his vision have survived, and they're willing to do whatever it takes to make sure their world prevails!

Writers Dan Jurgens and Ron Marz return to the world of Zero Hour with an art team comprised of all-star DC talent to celebrate this landmark anniversary. What repercussions will their story today have for
those of tomorrow? Find out in this




30 years. Why did that make me feel so much older upon seeing that number. Anyone else?
The Parallax armor is still one of the best designs.

Codependent Poster posted:

A story where Kyle Rayner is the star? Could it be?

Gripweed posted:

Cartridgeblowers posted:

Outsiders is cool as heck

Xelkelvos posted:

Drummer: "I'm gonna go punch God."
Guy: "God is already dead"
Drummer: "Then I'm gonna punch that gently caress." *Points to the reader*

Open Marriage Night posted:

He’s written some crap books, but the guy stacks Eisners with all the good stuff.

It’s not like he has to water board editorial to get assignments with top artists.

thetoughestbean posted:

Speaking of Eisners, the nominees were just announced.

Funnily enough, Tom King’s Wonder Woman is included in the “Best Continuing Series” category.