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The ending of BtS is remarkable is just how many things it fucks up. Pacing, Story Telling, Characters, motivation, resolving the entire plot off screen. It fucks up basically everything.
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Oct 15, 2020 19:36
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One thing that annoys me about the continuity between BtS and LiS is that the whole working for and dating Frank makes sense, but getting doey-eyed for Jefferson the way she does in the letter you find addressed to Chloe just really doesn't. The only way I could see it working is if the letter was actually written by Jefferson who wasn't aware of their previous relationship?
WhiskeyWhiskers fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 19:37
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In BtS episode 3 I was doing the whole "rooting around Mr. Amber's office and destroying evidence" thing thinking, "I played this before, but I've forgotten how Chloe doesn't get caught." And then Chloe's male friend comes out of nowhere and turns out to be a stalker or something and then she calls 911 and breaks a window and then I'm like "wells poo poo, I guess she's for sure getting in trouble now" but then it's just never addressed and in the end montage (the one where she lies to Rachel) we just see her hanging out with Rachel's family like they're all the best of friends. Like, I get that Rachel's dad would have incentive to keep it secret since Chloe was basically just executing the same deal he'd already made, but maybe we should see that conversation? Or at least a text?
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Oct 15, 2020 19:41
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General Dog posted:I guess one problem I had with Rachel and Chloe's relationship is that Rachel is a pretty chaotic presence in Chloe's life. She walks in, immediately (indirectly) gets her expelled, and sweeps her up in family drama and the local drug trade- friendship with Rachel is costly, and Chloe is someone who already can't afford to give too much more of herself. In a way, it's an interesting role reversal for Chloe from LiS, but it also makes their relationship a bit hard to root for. Rachel Amber is this girl who has everything, is beloved by all, and can be all things to all people, but also (mostly unwittingly) becomes this parasitic influence in the life of Chloe, whose life has already been knocked off its axis. That's not an inherently bad story, but the idea that Rachel is kind of a bad friend for Chloe ultimately goes unexamined. Its not like the story hinges on on Rachel and Chloe's relationship being perfect; in fact the original game outright states that Rachel did a lot of bullshit that Chloe had no idea about. The stuff with Frank and her romantic interest in Jefferson being the most egregious. Its also pretty obvious that Chloe was very less aware of what rachel was up to once she was expelled from Blackwell. It actually makes a ton of sense for their relationship to be portrayed as unhealthy and somewhat parasitic, which is what I think BtS does better than anything else. Its not all supposed to be good. General Dog posted:In BtS episode 3 I was doing the whole "rooting around Mr. Amber's office and destroying evidence" thing thinking, "I played this before, but I've forgotten how Chloe doesn't get caught." And then Chloe's male friend comes out of nowhere and turns out to be a stalker or something and then she calls 911 and breaks a window and then I'm like "wells poo poo, I guess she's for sure getting in trouble now" but then it's just never addressed and in the end montage (the one where she lies to Rachel) we just see her hanging out with Rachel's family like they're all the best of friends. None of the poo poo regarding Rachel's dad and his position as a corrupt DA makes any sense. Elliot makes less way less sense. I love the idea that he just takes the fall for breaking into the DAs office and destroying evidence in an active and ongoing drug investigation and never even mentions Chloe was there. Also the lead suspect in that drug investigation goes missing and no one questions it. Paul Zuvella fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 19:41
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Paul Zuvella posted:Its not like the story hinges on on Rachel and Chloe's relationship being perfect; in fact the original game outright states that Rachel did a lot of bullshit that Chloe had no idea about. The stuff with Frank and her romantic interest in Jefferson being the most egregious. Its also pretty obvious that Chloe was very less aware of what rachel was up to once she was expelled from Blackwell. It actually makes a ton of sense for their relationship to be portrayed as unhealthy and somewhat parasitic, which is what I think BtS does better than anything else. Its not all supposed to be good. That's fair, and I do get that it's not an accident that negative aspects of the relationship are portrayed; I guess my main criticism is that the game never feels like it gets around to making its point. The first two episodes largely foreground Chloe dealing with her grief, while Rachel Amber is just one of the things she has going on at the moment, which is fine. But then you get to the third episode and Rachel's family drama kind of ends up taking up all the air in the room, and you largely just have this girl moping in bed and sending Chloe out on ridiculous missions. Then after that we're assured they were the best of friends in the following years and it just leaves a bit of a bad taste in your mouth.
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Oct 15, 2020 19:52
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General Dog posted:That's fair, and I do get that it's not an accident that negative aspects of the relationship are portrayed; I guess my main criticism is that the game never feels like it gets around to making its point. The first two episodes largely foreground Chloe dealing with her grief, while Rachel Amber is just one of the things she has going on at the moment, which is fine. But then you get to the third episode and Rachel's family drama kind of ends up taking up all the air in the room, and you largely just have this girl moping in bed and sending Chloe out on ridiculous missions. Then after that we're assured they were the best of friends in the following years and it just leaves a bit of a bad taste in your mouth. A lot of this is just because a lot of the game is aimless and rushed. We don't have an actual plot until the very last seconds of episode 1 and then the game has to shove literally the entire plot of the game into like 4 1/2 hours of game. The issue is that the game still takes its sweet rear end time in episode 2 as well, and really they just shove the entire plot into episode 3.... which as I stated before it fails horribly at. If you think of BtS as just an excuse to hang out in Arcadia Bay and learn more about these characters you really like then it makes it a lot better. And you can kind of do that in episodes 1 and 2. The problem is they also wanted the plot to have stakes and drama and they just didnt make the time for any of that because they shoved 4 hours of Concerts and D&D games and Shakespeare plays and Chloe Dad Drama and Eliot for some reason into a 8-9 hour plot. Paul Zuvella fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 20:05
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Yeah it’s telling that the best parts are when you are just kind of farting around. The mood of Arcadia Bay is still right, which is why it’s still worth playing.
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Oct 15, 2020 20:12
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If only they'd realised the game was about being a disaster lesbian. Literally no one asked for plot.
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Oct 15, 2020 20:33
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I'm sure this was discussed exhaustively when episodes were being released, but the end of episode 1 definitely teases a link between Rachel Amber and the storm, doesn't it? But that's confusing, because the deer in LiS, which seems to be a neutral or benevolent entity, is also definitely Rachel Amber. General Dog fucked around with this message at 21:39 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 20:38
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yeah
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Oct 15, 2020 21:24
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General Dog posted:I'm sure this was discussed exhaustively when episodes were being released, but the end of episode 1 definitely teases a link between Rachel Amber and the storm, doesn't it? People read into it in different amounts. Some folks were like "Rachel has wind powers!" and others (mainly me) where like "wtf no what are you talking about".
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Oct 15, 2020 21:45
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Paul Zuvella posted:People read into it in different amounts. Some folks were like "Rachel has wind powers!" and others (mainly me) where like "wtf no what are you talking about". To be fair, we get the explicit visual cue of the wind lines emanating from behind her as she screams in rage and fans the flames of a fire that will serve as the backdrop of the two subsequent episodes, until the fire is spontaneously, maybe supernaturally extinguished (offscreen) near the end of the last episode. Obviously you could argue that the wind imagery and the tie between Rachel and the fire is just metaphorical, but this is a series where the metaphor is almost always made literal; where people have real superpowers and spirit animals are visible to the naked eye.
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Oct 15, 2020 21:53
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Paul Zuvella posted:People read into it in different amounts. Some folks were like "Rachel has wind powers!" and others (mainly me) where like "wtf no what are you talking about". It’s mostly based on circumstantial stuff (such as her scream in episode one appearing to stir the wind up and how the massive forest fire conveniently extinguished itself not long after she was brought to the hospital in the finale). But whether or not any of that was the developer’s intention I have no clue. My personal opinion is that if Rachel did have some sort of power, it was likely just an unconscious thing she had no awareness of. As seen in Seasons 1 and 2, random superpowers brought on by emotional trauma are a thing in this particular universe after all. Larryb fucked around with this message at 22:00 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 21:56
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I remember from my first playthrough of LiS I was expecting a reveal that Rachel Amber also had time travel powers, just because of how well-liked she was by everyone and how she seemed to manage to be all things to all people. That aside, I can't imagine the wind imagery in the first episode is accidental, especially given the setting next to the cliffs/lighthouse, but whether it was a dropped plot point or always just meant to be a tease or a red herring, who knows. Clearly we're not given enough information to build any sort of coherent theory. General Dog fucked around with this message at 22:03 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 22:01
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Not sure if there’s a dedicated thread for this or not but has anyone tried Twin Mirror yet (It apparently came out on the 1st)? If so, is it any good?
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Dec 2, 2020 18:26
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Larryb posted:Not sure if there’s a dedicated thread for this or not but has anyone tried Twin Mirror yet (It apparently came out on the 1st)? If so, is it any good? I'd been keeping my eye out for it, but it's getting pretty bad reviews.
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Dec 2, 2020 18:32
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Ah too bad, Tell Me Why was enough like a Life is Strange game to finally get me to buy an Xbox but I wasn’t sure about Twin Mirror (it sort of looks like DontNod’s answer to Heavy Rain which isn’t really a good thing).
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Dec 2, 2020 18:45
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I'm beginning to think that DONTNOD is just telltale 2.0, in that they are never going to live up to the live up to their one hit and slowly die
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Dec 2, 2020 19:25
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Paul Zuvella posted:I'm beginning to think that DONTNOD is just telltale 2.0, in that they are never going to live up to the live up to their one hit and slowly die Eh I liked LiS 2 and Tell Me Why for the most part but yeah, so far they seem to have a lot more misses than hits. They kind of caught lightning in a bottle with the original Life is Strange (though even that has its detractors) and haven’t really been able to replicate that success as much since then. Larryb fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Dec 2, 2020 |
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Dec 2, 2020 19:34
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Yeah, Life Is Strange (and Before the Storm, to a lesser extent) is kind of a miracle in terms of establishing and maintaining a mood that sticks with you. The weirdness of Arcadia Bay and its inhabitants (both intentional and unintentional) and the pervading sense of melancholy and nostalgia really manage to paper over a myriad of story/gameplay shortcomings. I haven't played Tell Me Why, but one aspect where LiS 2 really took a step back was the score/soundtrack. Music really defined LiS and BtS, but I really don't remember any memorable musical moments in LiS 2.
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Dec 2, 2020 19:56
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If anyone was curious apparently all you need to do to get the Alyson ending in Tell Me Why is (spoilered just in case there’s anyone that still feels like playing the game) Don’t tell Eddy that Alyson killed Mary-Ann and stick to Tyler’s version of events when you get the final choice Also, DontNod recently put out this article explaining the two endings a bit (spoilers of course): https://www.tellmewhygame.com/endings-explained/
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Dec 10, 2020 03:55
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Larryb posted:If anyone was curious apparently all you need to do to get the Alyson ending in Tell Me Why is (spoilered just in case there’s anyone that still feels like playing the game) Don’t tell Eddy that Alyson killed Mary-Ann and stick to Tyler’s version of events when you get the final choice How did you like the game?
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Dec 10, 2020 04:03
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General Dog posted:How did you like the game? It’s basically a pseudo Life Is Strange title with a lot of the same tropes (including unexplained powers, dorky main characters, optional gay relationships, optional collectables and a part where you illegally search through someone’s files). Your mileage may vary but I thought it was ok for the most part if not a little too safe in some areas (particularly how they dealt with the transgender protagonist). It’s also Xbox/PC exclusive if that’s an issue for you but I think it’s worth checking out until if/when we ever get another proper LiS game. Also off the subject, anybody tried Twin Mirror yet? I know it’s been getting some poor reviews but I was just curious if there was anything at least somewhat worthwhile about it. Larryb fucked around with this message at 04:24 on Dec 10, 2020 |
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Dec 10, 2020 04:10
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Sorry, I was actually thinking of Twin Mirror when I asked you that. Wouldn’t mind checking out Tell Me Why if it ever makes it to PlayStation.
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Dec 10, 2020 04:15
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General Dog posted:Sorry, I was actually thinking of Twin Mirror when I asked you that. Wouldn’t mind checking out Tell Me Why if it ever makes it to PlayStation. Still haven’t tried Twin Mirror, that’s why I asked. As for Tell Me Why, Microsoft themselves had a hand in its development so unfortunately a port is likely never going to happen in this case.
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Dec 10, 2020 04:20
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watching the first hour or so of Twin Mirror and holy poo poo this game has literally nothing going for it. No charm, main character has no charisma, bland mystery, boring setting, a gameplay gimmick they do nothing with. I'm kind of shocked they released this, to be honest. Like, I have my problems with LiS2, but at least you could tell they were trying for something there. I have no idea what they were trying to do with this. Normal, boring alan wake?
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Dec 10, 2020 20:25
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Flesnolk fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Dec 31, 2020 |
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Dec 31, 2020 13:47
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The... mushroom thing??
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Dec 31, 2020 13:53
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Flesnolk fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Dec 31, 2020 |
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Dec 31, 2020 14:07
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Macaluso posted:The... mushroom thing?? The dog they killed off at the start of Episode 2. And based on reviews and footage I’ve seen I gather the general consensus is that Twin Mirror kind of sucks right?
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Dec 31, 2020 14:07
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Ah I forgot about the dog, that whole thing didn't work for me emotionally because I didn't want the dog with us in the first place. We are on the run from the cops, for the murder of a cop, I was not upset to lose a not-trained-not-to-bark puppy. I didn't like how the game forced that on you
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Dec 31, 2020 14:37
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It just reinforced the false choice crap that people gave TellTale games poo poo for. Take the dog? Well we can't work that into the story the whole time, dog dies.
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Dec 31, 2020 18:03
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Sakurazuka posted:It just reinforced the false choice crap that people gave TellTale games poo poo for. Take the dog? Well we can't work that into the story the whole time, dog dies. That said, killing the dog might have been a last minute decision though (there was some concept art of Mushroom at the Reynolds’ house and playing with Chris).
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Dec 31, 2020 18:08
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I guarantee that they sat down after they finished episode 1, realized that they were complete morons for having you take on a dog in the first place and just figured out a way to kill it as soon as they could.Sakurazuka posted:It just reinforced the false choice crap that people gave TellTale games poo poo for. Take the dog? Well we can't work that into the story the whole time, dog dies. Its not even a false choice, because its not a choice. You always end up with the dog and it always dies, the same way too. Larryb posted:The dog they killed off at the start of Episode 2. literally no one cares about it at all, so yeah its safe to say it sucks Paul Zuvella fucked around with this message at 19:29 on Dec 31, 2020 |
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Dec 31, 2020 19:26
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Only positive word I've heard spoken about Twin Mirror is that it contains a fully-functional Pac-Man you can play.
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Dec 31, 2020 20:22
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That sucks to think about. I really liked LiS 1, would probably try a hypothetical 3, and didn't want to think of Dontnod as a one hit wonder  (Vampyr was decent fun but I got it for free thanks to PS Plus so that might be part of it)
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Jan 1, 2021 01:35
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Flesnolk posted:That sucks to think about. I really liked LiS 1, would probably try a hypothetical 3, and didn't want to think of Dontnod as a one hit wonder I liked LiS 2 despite its faults and thought Tell Me Why was ok at least (though the latter is Xbox/PC exclusive and since Microsoft was involved in the game’s development is likely gonna stay that way). But yeah, they’ve never really managed to catch lightning in a bottle quite the way they did with the original Life is Strange.
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Jan 1, 2021 01:41
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I mean I really liked LIS2, just some things like the dog were a bit mishandled I'm also a bit weird in that I liked Before The Storm the most
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Jan 1, 2021 01:45
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Macaluso posted:I mean I really liked LIS2, just some things like the dog were a bit mishandled Oh, I liked that too honestly and wouldn’t mind seeing Deck Nine take another crack at the franchise one day.
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Jan 1, 2021 01:49
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I think part of the problem they might have is they have to either dance around the final choice of season 1 or invalidate roughly half the people who've ever played the game. Or effectively create two different games in one, which sounds impracical.
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Jan 1, 2021 02:31
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