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Mercrom posted:If by midgame I could easily and comfortably put my dude in the center of the main base for permanent safekeeping and build everything else with the help of constructor robots, roboports and radars I would. But since the game is built from the ground up as a Minecraft-like, not a Total Annihilation-like, I don't see that happening anytime soon unless an extremely competent modder starts working on it. As soon as you have construction and logistics bots you can do exactly this from the map screen though. Blueprint books consolidate all the blueprints you have on you, and the archive means you can literally delete blueprints you don't need anymore and pull them back from archive if you do for some reason. While I do want to be able to place ghosts of things I don't have on me in the future its easy enough to have 1 of something you don't have in blueprint or ordering it with logistics bots in those edge cases.
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May 9, 2017 19:51
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Yeah I am trying to do it right now that I have a bunch of robot upgrades but I would say I'm past the midgame. I also really hate the blueprint system so I wouldn't call it comfortable. Any tips on how to extend the logistics system to outposts? I'm not building thousands of roboports. Also FARL stopped working so I might just give up.
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May 9, 2017 20:22
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Mercrom posted:If by midgame I could easily and comfortably put my dude in the center of the main base for permanent safekeeping and build everything else with the help of constructor robots, roboports and radars I would. But since the game is built from the ground up as a Minecraft-like, not a Total Annihilation-like, I don't see that happening anytime soon unless an extremely competent modder starts working on it. Beyond mining by hand in the first half hour or so and the fact that you have a tool belt, what makes you think of it as "Minecraft-like"? I've played a fair bit of Minecraft and never really thought of them as much of a comparison. I think there are some "factory" based Minecraft mods, but I haven't played them. I do tend to build everything with the help of constructor robots and roboports, so to me the only difference from what you're talking about here is I'm not in the center of the base for safe-keeping. Although you can in theory do that now if you set up a big enough bot network as you can place blueprints from the map directly. Mercrom posted:Any tips on how to extend the logistics system to outposts? I'm not building thousands of roboports. Why not! They're pretty cheap and quick to build. Alternative is to set up a separate disconnected network, you can mostly automate the building and supply of that with trains and combinators, which seems like too much work at first, but if you have or are going to have several outposts, subsequent ones are a cinch. I don't know if placing blueprints from the map works if you're in a different network though. There was a link in the last few pages to a site someone is working on that lets you automatically generate outpost blueprints for specified ore patches. While it's still a work in progress and not an in-game mod, it does sound like it might be the sort of thing you're talking about. Gravy Jones fucked around with this message at 20:34 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 20:27
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Mercrom posted:Yeah I am trying to do it right now that I have a bunch of robot upgrades but I would say I'm past the midgame. I also really hate the blueprint system so I wouldn't call it comfortable. How did FARL stop working? Did you just clear it of its rail blueprint? As for extending the network to outposts: If you wanna "extend" it you have to put a roboport every two large electric poles so the networks are connected. If instead what you mean is that you want a self assembling outpost: When you get to approximately the point you want to build the outpost, place a roboport and throw some construction bots in it. One of your train cars should prepared with all the supplies you need when you set out, and you just place inseters pulling out of it to passive provider chests (Better still, blueprint the provider chests with stack filter inserters with reasonable item limits and such, so they don't pull out an inordinate amount. Then use your mine blueprint to place mines, your wall and turret blueprint to ring the outpost if you want, your train loading blueprint to setup a station, then tie it all together with belts or splitters to connect the pieces. Blueprinting and efficieny is all about automation and planning, which is what the game tries to make you do but allows you to spend hours doing it if you want. What is it you hate about the blueprint system? Gravy Jones posted:Although you can in theory do that now if you set up a big enough bot network as you can place blueprints from the map directly. Better still, you can shift click anything from the map, not just blueprints. In fact You can just place it from the map if your character is in range, which combined with long reach means you can directly build things outside of view range. The only downside is your character cant remove things from the map, bots have to do that. M_Gargantua fucked around with this message at 20:34 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 20:32
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Isn't the inspiration those Minecraft factory mods? I don't think it's really like Minecraft, I just think the game is built from it, and suffers from that. The toolbelt as an example is not a good interface for building things compared to the interface in any strategy game. It doesn't even have nearly enough room for all the things you can place.
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May 9, 2017 20:43
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M_Gargantua posted:As soon as you have construction and logistics bots you can do exactly this from the map screen though. His bigger point was that the UI sucks, and it does. The only thing it's fairly good at is blasting out a zillion copies of some pre-perfected rubber-stampable section of factory. Don't get me wrong, in this game that's a really, really important thing to get right, so that's a plus. But the process of refining blueprints is poo poo, and the process of actually working with blueprints is poo poo, and its kind of frustrating that construction bots are useless (deconstruction aside) except when you've already got perfect blueprints. Like, just as one initial idea, it would be cool if construction bots and logistics bots (with personal roboport) would function like the long reach mod (in that your clickable range is extended, but the bots do the actual work of moving things for you).
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May 9, 2017 20:46
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awesmoe posted:Like, just as one initial idea, it would be cool if construction bots and logistics bots (with personal roboport) would function like the long reach mod (in that your clickable range is extended, but the bots do the actual work of moving things for you). Yeah, thats what shift clicking does? And what the deconstruction planner does? I agree the UI needs some more polished but having to layout the prototype to blueprint is kinda an important step, because it lets you make sure it works. You can roboconstruct anything you want from afar without a blueprint too, so blueprints do exactly what they're supposed to do, which is let you stamp down copies of working setups.
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May 9, 2017 20:49
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20 slots on the tool belt is enough to have large/medium power poles, belt, splitter, underground belt, chest, fast, long, and stack inserter, pipe, underground pipe, a furnace, miner, assembler, rail, signal, chain signals, station, and both types of circuit network wire. That covers about 95% of what you're going to place in the game unless I forgot something obvious.
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May 9, 2017 20:49
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Something I haven't found a good way to handle is ghosting items not in your possession without a blueprint. It's common when I'm laying something out I don't have a blue print for to run out of belts. When this happens I can place ghosts for construction bots in the network to drop unless I make a 1 belt blueprint which is a bit hokey.
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May 9, 2017 20:54
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I think most of the issue is the UI just not being clear enough with all the features you have access too that aren't spelled out. Like did you know you can bring up the logistics view with L and search through your stockpiles? And that logistics slots and autotrash do that thing where the bots bring you stuff or take away stuff you don't want? The tutorials help with this but those aren't apparent on first glance. Mr. Powers posted:Something I haven't found a good way to handle is ghosting items not in your possession without a blueprint. It's common when I'm laying something out I don't have a blue print for to run out of belts. When this happens I can place ghosts for construction bots in the network to drop unless I make a 1 belt blueprint which is a bit hokey. Yeah this is my biggest gripe. Not being able to place ghosts without 1 item in your inventory. What i've found as a compromise is that if i'm ever planning out a large project I pop the robots into a chest rather then my inventory until its planned, that way they don't start stripping the materials away from me as I ghost place.
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May 9, 2017 20:55
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M_Gargantua posted:Yeah, thats what shift clicking does? mind:possibly blown (although i cant test yet to see how it works)
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May 9, 2017 20:56
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A more robust blueprint editor would be nice. I made a sandbox mode save with infinite everything for blueprinting purposes, but that sort of workaround really shouldn't be necessary.
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May 9, 2017 21:00
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M_Gargantua posted:How did FARL stop working? Did you just clear it of its rail blueprint? M_Gargantua posted:As for extending the network to outposts: If you wanna "extend" it you have to put a roboport every two large electric poles so the networks are connected. If instead what you mean is that you want a self assembling outpost: When you get to approximately the point you want to build the outpost, place a roboport and throw some construction bots in it. One of your train cars should prepared with all the supplies you need when you set out, and you just place inseters pulling out of it to passive provider chests (Better still, blueprint the provider chests with stack filter inserters with reasonable item limits and such, so they don't pull out an inordinate amount. Then use your mine blueprint to place mines, your wall and turret blueprint to ring the outpost if you want, your train loading blueprint to setup a station, then tie it all together with belts or splitters to connect the pieces. M_Gargantua posted:What is it you hate about the blueprint system?
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May 9, 2017 21:01
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Mercrom posted:Isn't the inspiration those Minecraft factory mods? I don't think it's really like Minecraft, I just think the game is built from it, and suffers from that. The toolbelt as an example is not a good interface for building things compared to the interface in any strategy game. It doesn't even have nearly enough room for all the things you can place. I haven't seen the devs reference Minecraft mods, but it's possible. I think they've cited Sim City and Transport Tycoon as their biggest influences. I'm fairly used to the (upgraded) toolbelt and switching stuff in and out on the rare occasions I'm placing something not in it, but... it's one of the few games of it's type I've played for long enough to learn the hotkeys, and know where everything is, so that might be part of it. I'd spend just as long, if not longer, looking for something on a multilevel menu in a city builder. I guess the big difference, which is what you might be talking about, is that inventory/placement is mostly based on items you exist and are in your possession (like Minecraft), rather than selecting from any currently available item and placing it (like most city builders). I think the former is a better fit, which is probably why the game is built that way, but yeah, obviously opinions/tastes vary. Mercrom posted:I want to make inserters load and unload the train depending on what is missing in the logistics chest in the outposts. Not something I'm particularly good at, but I think it tends to be loading the train continuously at the base station, but limiting the amounts through circuits/or setting slots in the cargo wagon. And then sending it round to all the outposts and using logistics to unload how much you need at each outpost before it returns home. With a bit of setup it can be fully automated. In theory you can string red or green wire all the way from the outpost to your base and load the train based on the readings from it, but that's probably more trouble than it's worth when most of the stuff you're delivering is relatively cheap to produce so you can just keep the train topped up. I've done this a few times for solar farms, but it's also used a lot for walls and outposts. There's an unloading example here: https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-140 Gravy Jones fucked around with this message at 21:16 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 21:06
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Mercrom posted:I want to make inserters load and unload the train depending on what is missing in the logistics chest in the outposts. Open the inserter and select "connect to logistics network" and tell it to limit to run if for example "Repair Packs < 100" and it won't pull repair packs out of a train if there is already 100 in the network at the outpost. If you want the home station to only load exactly what your outposts need thats a little more complicated. Once GotLag updates FLAN its easy, but right now you'd have to have FARL place signal wires on the power poles leading to your outposts, then send back the outposts inventory count. If you do want to do this, at each outpost run a wire from a roboport (set to output logistics contents) to an arithmetic combinator, which is set to "Each + 0, output Each", this separates the networks so theres no signals leaking backwards. Now do the math at the outpost, using deciders/arithmetic/constant combinators to output on the wire leading back to your main base whats needed, and then load that amount in the train. Mercrom posted:Just about everything. You can only box select to create blueprints. If you use a blueprint from the blueprint manager it gets copied, even if you have 5 identical copies in your inventory. If you are organizing your blueprint library and a research completes the blueprint on your cursor goes in your inventory. If you want to edit a blueprint by adding a single thing in your library you have to place it, place the thing, create a new blueprint with box select, remove the unwanted things you selected , name it, delete the old copy from your inventory, delete the old copy from your library, and copy the new copy into your library. Shift clicking a blueprint in your inventory will clear it, so there shouldn't be an old copy in your inventory, and you can copy blueprints into your library directly from the inventory. Why pull one from the manager if you already have a copy in your inventory? You can turn off the research screen popping up automatically. You can ghost place a blueprint and ghost add to it and save it, you don't need to wait for it to be constructed.
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May 9, 2017 21:16
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M_Gargantua posted:Open the inserter and select "connect to logistics network" and tell it to limit to run if for example "Repair Packs < 100" and it won't pull repair packs out of a train if there is already 100 in the network at the outpost. Yeah this sounds like a good solution. I might add another station on the outpost that only activates if there are things missing, and run a single train to supply all outposts with buildings and ammo. What the train loads shouldn't need to be dependant on what individual outposts are missing, but how do I manage the contents of the cargo wagons? Edit: Does this mean I have to use a separate inserter for every type of item to unload? Mercrom fucked around with this message at 21:35 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 21:32
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M_Gargantua posted:I think most of the issue is the UI just not being clear enough with all the features you have access too that aren't spelled out. I guess I'm the only person on the planet who, every time there's a major update, bothers to look at the keybinds to see if there's new stuff. I also habitually look at the keybinds when I start playing a new game for the first time. Mostly since I rebind a lot of them to fit my personal playstyle.
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May 9, 2017 21:34
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Mercrom posted:Yeah this sounds like a good solution. I might add another station on the outpost that only activates if there are things missing, and run a single train to supply all outposts with buildings and ammo. What the train loads shouldn't need to be dependant on what individual outposts are missing, but how do I manage the contents of the cargo wagons? You can filter the contents of cargo wagons the same way you do your hotbar. Normal keybinding is middle mouse button, just Middle click on an item slot to either lock the item type occupying it or if it's empty select it's filter. Using separate (stack) filter inserters for each item is the easiest. Each set to one type of item and the limit for that type. You can use a single inserter whose filter is set and cycled by combinator logic but that takes more effort to setup than its worth.
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May 9, 2017 21:46
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Mercrom posted:Yeah this sounds like a good solution. I might add another station on the outpost that only activates if there are things missing, and run a single train to supply all outposts with buildings and ammo. What the train loads shouldn't need to be dependant on what individual outposts are missing, but how do I manage the contents of the cargo wagons? You only need a single inserter to unload if you set up a combinator. Short tutorial (for walls, but same principle). Also has loading towards the end of the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HVc-ALMWYq4 Gravy Jones fucked around with this message at 21:51 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 21:46
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Wow thanks. I didn't know about the middle click and that video is really helpful. Now I just need to fix FARL and then I can automate almost everything.
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May 9, 2017 21:54
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Mr. Powers posted:Something I haven't found a good way to handle is ghosting items not in your possession without a blueprint. It's common when I'm laying something out I don't have a blue print for to run out of belts. When this happens I can place ghosts for construction bots in the network to drop unless I make a 1 belt blueprint which is a bit hokey. with 0.15.x couldn't you use the radar view and the eyedropper (or whatever it's called when you press q with an empty cursor to copy the item under it)? Or does it work only if you have that item in your inventory?
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May 9, 2017 21:57
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Mercrom posted:I can automate almost everything. 
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May 9, 2017 21:59
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Collateral Damage posted:factorio.txt Factorio made a 10.5 hour plane flight I recently took feel like teleportation
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May 9, 2017 21:59
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So I've sat around the center of the map building a factory, that still requires me to run around and resupply certain things, but I now have a mostly smooth science pack 1 and 2 supply line. Mean while there's some biter camps on the map but they've done nothing, I found a desert, but for right now everything I need is in one place and at least one material has actually gone mostly obsolete (stone), so there's no real need to explore. But I'm suspicious because there's a lot of millitary science to research. Will I need to worry about the biters attacking at some point? (not on peaceful) Are there things I'll need to explore and conquer biter camps for?
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May 9, 2017 22:19
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Biters will attack you, yes. They're attracted to pollution. It stinks and they don't like it.
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May 9, 2017 22:27
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Will the biters attack? Yes. Pollution will trigger them attacking. You can see your pollution cloud (in all its optimized rendering glory) on the map view. Will you need to take out biter bases for anything? Yes. Space. You used to need alien artifacts from them for purple science and fusion reactors, but that's gone now. So now you just need to kill them to make room for your new iron processing site. You'll also want to clear the area near your pollution cloud.
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May 9, 2017 22:27
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Also don't tear down your stone mines just yet, you will need that stuff later to pave the earth
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May 9, 2017 22:29
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What are some good low-hanging-fruit things to stick modules in? Modules have historically been too fiddly or expensive to bother with much for me, beyond sticking some productivity modules in certain assemblers because free stuff sounds good, but I just unlocked effect transmission in my new game and maybe this is a good time to be a little more clever about it. Scoss fucked around with this message at 23:03 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 22:42
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Start with copper and iron plates and move up from there. Eventually you'll have modules in everything.
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May 9, 2017 22:57
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Prod 3's in everything, with effect transmitting speed 3's, pave the world with iron and copper. As a side note; has anyone ever calculated how long it would take to launch a rocket by hand? By that I mean, assuming infinite storage capacity, and the ability to hand-craft whatever you need (oil), how long would it take to hand-mine all required iron/copper needed for the research to the rocket and all 100 rocket parts themselves? VVVV Even if you aren't launching more than one rocket, four Prod3's pay for themselves over a single rocket; that's 400 fewer fuel/low density/control units
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May 9, 2017 23:05
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If you're planning on launching more than one rocket, you can't do better than 4 Prod3 modules in the rocket silo.
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May 9, 2017 23:06
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Mercrom posted:Just about everything. You can only box select to create blueprints When you're previewing a blueprint before saving, right-click to remove the selected object from the blueprint, left-click to add it back. Edit: whoa, Mode 7 Factorio: https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comments/6a8mz6/i_recreated_the_perspective_suggestion_from/ GotLag fucked around with this message at 23:21 on May 9, 2017 |
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May 9, 2017 23:12
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Scoss posted:What are some good low-hanging-fruit things to stick modules in?
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May 10, 2017 00:08
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seravid posted:Start with copper and iron plates and move up from there. Eventually you'll have modules in everything. Productivity modules save you a % of the input, and per module are best placed on things with a lot of net inputs. Labs are the canonical example (and of course the rocket silo), but also a step earlier such as engines and red circuits and processing units. A single productivity module in a lab can be literally 100 times more impactful than a productivity module in your smelter. For efficiency modules, they're best first placed in high power/polluting things that are always on (mining drills, smelters) For speed modules, they're best first placed wherever you currently have a bottleneck (perhaps your module construction) As far as which module to start with, put productivity in your labs. The net impact of productivity modules in your labs is both a dramatic reduction in pollution/power consumption (the lab uses a bit more, but all the inputs to it have to work way less), as well as a general increase in research speed unless you have an over-abundance of science packs, in which case you should just build more labs.
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May 10, 2017 00:44
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M_Gargantua posted:Thats only enough roboports to support unloading about one wagon at a time? Its actively worse than belts? That was my station immediately after I finished building it, while I was still running only about 500 bots. More roboports were added. This was my station in the next game, after I'ver abandoned the save and moved on to .15. 
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May 10, 2017 02:14
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So, has it always been that you can rightclick to open the Deconstruction planner and filter what gets deconstructed, or is that just me coming to the party late?
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May 10, 2017 03:59
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That's new with .15. It's really nice.
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May 10, 2017 03:59
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Scoss posted:What are some good low-hanging-fruit things to stick modules in? Skip straight to level two modules. Put them in your most resource expensive things first, rocket parts, blue circuits, red circuits, downward. Productivity modules are the best for their price. Once you have enough circuit production to support it make hundreds of productivity 3s and as they're made stuff them in your production chain from the top down. Beacons with speed modules offset the slowdown productivity creates, speed 3s they even go faster even after the slowdown.
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May 10, 2017 04:29
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I dont understand fluid mechanics, and I dont care, except as they relate to nuclear power production People give ratios of offshore pumps to heat exchangers to turbines. Great. Does each of those offshore pumps have to be attached to its own separate fluid pipeline? or can i have one pipe feeding all my heat exchangers, with 5 offshore pumps hooked up to it?
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May 10, 2017 04:35
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DelphiAegis posted:So, has it always been that you can rightclick to open the Deconstruction planner and filter what gets deconstructed, or is that just me coming to the party late? Onean posted:That's new with .15. It's really nice. Hooooooooooooooly poo poo.
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May 10, 2017 04:40
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