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Silver2195 posted:
Robin and Monet aren't really fighters. They can fight quite effectively and have some real OP abilities, but they're secondarily fighters. There's lots of casual sexism in One Piece, but Zoro seems to be of the belief that if you're a fighter then gender if fairly irrelevant. This pertains to not only Miss Monday but also Tashigi, around 1/3 of the bounty hunters at Whiskey Peak, Baroque Works agents, and of course Kuina.
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Oct 16, 2015 03:04
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 15:43 |
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You guys realize that Kuina is Tashigi, right? Oda's already experimented with Plot Amnesia with Sabo, so she's next.
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Oct 16, 2015 03:44
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then why is she so bad
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Oct 16, 2015 03:46
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Yeah the whole "female swordsman" thing isn't really a thing with Zoro. I mean, yeah, the comment to Enel is weird but it's a manga and that poo poo is everywhere. It IS however, a part of Tashigi's character that she feels inferior as a female swordswoman and she mostly interacts through Zoro, though I trust Oda is eventually going somewhere with it.
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Oct 16, 2015 03:50
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Amorphous Blob posted:then why is she so bad Because she forgot how to be good?
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Oct 16, 2015 03:52
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Tashigi will casually cut down Mihawk with one swing when she remembers she's Kuina and fights Zoro for real
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Oct 16, 2015 03:59
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yeah why not
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Oct 16, 2015 04:00
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I somehow don't see Zoro owning the gently caress out of Kuina as a good final fight. If it does happen though the sexism chat will, never, ever, loving end
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Oct 16, 2015 04:00
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I remember 4kids changed Kuina's fate from her tripping down the stairs and dying to a bunch of guys just ganging up and beating the poo poo out of her, crippling her for life. Which is kind of an interesting idea, or at least better than some of the other alterations they did.
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Oct 16, 2015 05:31
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Silver2195 posted:The way Alvida's infobox specifically mentions that she's a female pirate makes me wonder whether Oda originally intended pirates to be almost exclusively male. In fact, after Alvida, we don't meet any female pirates until Nami is revealed to be a member of Arlong's crew; Buggy, Kuro, and Don Krieg all have all-male crews as far I remember. As far as this goes even amongst real pirates one of the rules of the pirates code was no females allowed on the ship. mainly for their safety and to prevent pirates fighting each other over her. There however were still both female pirates and female pirate captains. 2 of the most ruthless pirates in our world were female.
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Oct 16, 2015 13:02
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AkumaHokoru posted:As far as this goes even amongst real pirates one of the rules of the pirates code was no females allowed on the ship. mainly for their safety and to prevent pirates fighting each other over her. There however were still both female pirates and female pirate captains. 2 of the most ruthless pirates in our world were female. Those are mostly guidelines.
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Oct 16, 2015 19:32
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AkumaHokoru posted:As far as this goes even amongst real pirates one of the rules of the pirates code was no females allowed on the ship. mainly for their safety and to prevent pirates fighting each other over her. There however were still both female pirates and female pirate captains. 2 of the most ruthless pirates in our world were female. I thought the main reason was superstition about women on ships. It was totally bad luck and an ill omen.
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Oct 16, 2015 19:32
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Gyges posted:I thought the main reason was superstition about women on ships. It was totally bad luck and an ill omen. Superstitions are created to convince people to do things when you don't want to tell them the real reason.
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Oct 16, 2015 19:58
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Gyges posted:I thought the main reason was superstition about women on ships. It was totally bad luck and an ill omen. Probably started after the crew murdered each other to get to them during long voyages.
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Oct 16, 2015 19:58
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not to mention love triangles and what not. being at sea for months looootta room for potential problems.
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Oct 17, 2015 00:59
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Advice posted:You guys realize that Kuina is Tashigi, right? Oda's already experimented with Plot Amnesia with Sabo, so she's next. Hasn't Oda explicitly said that she's not?
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Oct 17, 2015 01:04
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Oda has amnesia too.
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Oct 17, 2015 01:17
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Volume 2 thoughts:
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Oct 17, 2015 02:57
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I dunno, I always felt like Nami was denying to herself of being part of Arlong's crew even if she technically was. Like Oda explicitly has her hate pirates from the start, so he had some idea of her backstory at that point.
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Oct 17, 2015 03:11
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Allarion posted:I dunno, I always felt like Nami was denying to herself of being part of Arlong's crew even if she technically was. Like Oda explicitly has her hate pirates from the start, so he had some idea of her backstory at that point. That makes sense.
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Oct 17, 2015 03:21
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For the devil fruit confusion, maybe since East Blue is such a in comparison peaceful sea of the world it's not too weird for residents to be shocked by Devil Fruit powers. Think about how many Devil Fruit users come from East Blue
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Oct 17, 2015 03:29
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Though to be fair, there was an early period that Nami was planned to be this. 
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Oct 17, 2015 03:40
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Sinners Sandwich posted:For the devil fruit confusion, maybe since East Blue is such a in comparison peaceful sea of the world it's not too weird for residents to be shocked by Devil Fruit powers. Think about how many Devil Fruit users come from East Blue At least four: Luffy, Buggy, Smoker, and Alvida. If you assume Ace and Bartolomeo ate their Devil fruits before entering the Grand Line, then six. The real issue is that newspaper delivery is worldwide. Luffy may not read the papers, but Nami should probably have known about people like Whitebeard and Crocodile. I was also about to mention the book Nami read about Little Garden in, but I looked it up, and apparently the book in question had a reputation for being full of BS, so it makes sense that Nami wouldn't believe what it might have said about Devil Fruits. Edit: Plus Nami works with the Arlong Pirates. Many of them were born in the Grand Line, and several have personally met Devil Fruit users like Boa Hancock. Edit 2: In a similar vein, apparently neither Shanks nor Garp ever explained to Luffy what Haki was. Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Oct 17, 2015 |
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Oct 17, 2015 03:41
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idk its pretty easy to handwave a lot of that stuff away. i dont care as long as its not extremely contradictory.
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Oct 17, 2015 03:45
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anime was right posted:idk its pretty easy to handwave a lot of that stuff away. I suppose that's true, though. Nami and Arlong (or even Nami and Hatchan) weren't exactly best friends, it's possible that Grand Line newspapers didn't become widely available in East Blue until recently, and Luffy isn't the type who'd remember much about Haki even if Garp explained it to him explicitly.
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Oct 17, 2015 04:15
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Allarion posted:Though to be fair, there was an early period that Nami was planned to be this. Potential Mad Max crossover?
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Oct 17, 2015 04:58
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Holy gently caress. I wasn't aware this existed and now I'm super mad this wasn't her final design because it's loving awesome.
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Oct 17, 2015 05:16
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chaos rhames posted:Potential Mad Max crossover?  It's obviously not Oda's, but it's drat close.
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Oct 17, 2015 05:22
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Silver2195 posted:
Garp was too busy throwing Luffy at tigers to explain Haki to him. Not to mention the fact Garp said his fist was full of love. And Shanks probably didn't worry too much about the nitty gritty of being a pirate, Luffy's determination is all that he needed to see to let him go off on his own.
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Oct 17, 2015 05:31
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TriffTshngo posted:Holy gently caress. I wasn't aware this existed and now I'm super mad this wasn't her final design because it's loving awesome. I can see the bigass axe being a problem, it takes up a lot of panel space.
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Oct 17, 2015 05:39
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TriffTshngo posted:Holy gently caress. I wasn't aware this existed and now I'm super mad this wasn't her final design because it's loving awesome. It's a pretty boss design, I don't care how big the ax is. Plus there's a bit of humor to be mined from her having those scars and cyber arm but still having her get girly over dresses, like she'd be a mix of flashy and intimidating.
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Oct 17, 2015 07:13
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It's interesting that Nami ended up with her design instead of that one, even ignoring where she ended up, in even the Buggy arc she was pretty dainty compared to Luffy or Zoro. She takes almost no real damage and has pretty much no physical strength or anything like that and even when Buggy is about to hit her a single time, Luffy blocks it. Especially with how often Oda buckles shonen trends, it feels like an editor stepped in on this one
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Oct 17, 2015 07:27
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Just like how an editor stepped in on Dressrosa and made Rebecca useless Let's not put everything bad about One Piece down to the evil editors
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Oct 17, 2015 07:33
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Pretty sure Oda just doesn't really like having women get beat the gently caress up and probably hit his limit on that with Spandam and Robin.
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Oct 17, 2015 07:46
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I'm not sure how to feel about that proto-Nami. She's pretty unironically 90s, for lack of a better term. Which makes sense, since she was designed in the 90s, but it's not quite Oda's current style. Note that the actual cyborg crew member is a Jim Carrey lookalike powered by cola. On the other hand, I like the implied difference from the way Oda currently tends to handle female characters. Every scarred or otherwise disfigured by violence character in One Piece I can think of is male. For that matter, although it's probably overthinking things, I can't think of any notable feats of lifting (as opposed to striking) strength by female characters either (although even proto-Nami is "cheating" with that cyborg arm). Edit: Oh Snapple! posted:Pretty sure Oda just doesn't really like having women get beat the gently caress up and probably hit his limit on that with Spandam and Robin. He doesn't like attractive women getting beaten up. As recently as the Dressrosa arc, we had Brook slicing up Jora.
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Oct 17, 2015 07:47
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Silver2195 posted:
Ehhhh. It was one panel and basically all we saw were smoke-lines around where the slashes were and then she was out. EDIT:  He pretty blatantly kept the "violence" to a minimum here - hell, the hit is more implied than anything. Oh Snapple! fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Oct 17, 2015 |
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Oct 17, 2015 07:54
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Miss Monday was pretty strong.
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Oct 17, 2015 08:03
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Oh Snapple! posted:Ehhhh. It was one panel and basically all we saw were smoke-lines around where the slashes were and then she was out. The trend is definitely there, though. When we first meet Alvida, she's ugly, and Luffy punches her hard. Then she eats a DF that "coincidentally" makes her beautiful and keeps her from getting physically hit at the same time. Look at the contortions Oda goes through to keep Usopp from actually hitting Perona (or Sugar, who's off-limits for the more understandable reason of looking like a child) with a projectile, and contrast what he does to Miss Merry Christmas. Miss Monday takes a blow to the head from Zoro, while he refuses to seriously fight Tashigi. Female protagonists (which mostly just means Nami) are allowed to attack attractive women, but not very hard, and none of Nami's enemies hit her very hard either. (Nami getting a shallow cut on the shoulder is treated as equivalent to Luffy getting impaled or Zoro getting his chest sliced open.) Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 08:20 on Oct 17, 2015 |
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Oct 17, 2015 08:11
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I mean let's be fair Nami got pretty hosed up by Miss Doublefinger, she was bleeding out and everything. And even though it was self-inflicted, she got a pretty gruesome arm injury during the Arlong arc
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Oct 17, 2015 08:51
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| # ? Jun 6, 2024 15:43 |
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Monet, despite being fine in the end was at one point slashed into a nightmarish mismatched hash of arms and legs and shoggoth piss.
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Oct 17, 2015 09:44
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