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Gyshall posted:commander.jpg God, every time I see this picture it physically pains me.
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May 22, 2014 20:23
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Commander is a bad format. If you like and have fun with Commander it's because you're a reasonably chill person. You and your play group would be having as much or more fun just playing standard, block, cube, whatever, hell there are some incredibly fun board games these days. Just say no to Commander.
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May 22, 2014 20:27
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Stinky Pit posted:Commander is a bad format. I think what we've all learned is that instead of spending the money on a EDH Deck, everyone should just build a cube and play free, fun magic forever.
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May 22, 2014 20:30
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There are some distinctive features of Commander (large decks, singleton, theming your deck around a single character) that some people enjoy when they can play it without getting stomped by combos. 
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May 22, 2014 20:33
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Once Conspiracy is out and about, I can't wait to build a multiplayer Conspiracy cube for funsies. 
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May 22, 2014 20:34
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Man people get weird about formats. I'd play literally everything if I had the cards. I'm not into legacy for vintage only due to cost. Just don't play with lovely people. I love commander as a space to build theme decks, this is my goblins deck, this is my saprolings deck, this is my artifact dudes deck.
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May 22, 2014 20:36
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jassi007 posted:Man people get weird about formats. I'd play literally everything if I had the cards. I'm not into legacy for vintage only due to cost. Just don't play with lovely people. I love commander as a space to build theme decks, this is my goblins deck, this is my saprolings deck, this is my artifact dudes deck. Bbbbbuuuuut people are having FUN WRONG!
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May 22, 2014 20:41
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The "don't play with lovely people" thing doesn't work when you play magic with your friends and you all agree to not like a format. Sometimes it has nothing to do with the people and more to do with the format!!! Edh is fun, sometimes I get a craving, but it has issues with turns taking forever, some players losing earlier than others, and combos that prevent other people from playing. It's also tough when you have to sort of shape your deck to the meta so that you don't get destroyed by other decks. example: i play mimeoplasm and I can either make it entirely not fun for other people to play against me or I have to turn it into the full board wipe deck that my meta requires or somebody else wins. I find that in edh, there are so many feelbads that after a game, when talking with my friends, we always find that at least one person did not enjoy themselves, and this person changes game to game. That's something that is more inherent in edh. Also, I think somebody should definitely make an edh thread.
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May 22, 2014 20:42
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jassi007 posted:I love commander as a space to build theme decks, this is my goblins deck, this is my saprolings deck, this is my artifact dudes deck. Thing is, you can make a Goblins, or a Saprolings deck in any format. Difference is that if you show up to block, or standard with a Saproling deck and get stomped no one is going to pay attention to you when you complain about losing to a tuned deck. When people say they like Commander because they can build X or Y type of deck in it, they really mean "I like Commander because I can build decks, and then have vague and silly grounds to berate others when they turn out to not be too great"
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May 22, 2014 20:44
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Stinky Pit posted:Thing is, you can make a Goblins, or a Saprolings deck in any format. Difference is that if you show up to block, or standard with a Saproling deck and get stomped no one is going to pay attention to you when you complain about losing to a tuned deck. Here's the thing the grounds for literally any complaint are "they don't play it like I play it." It's dumb. It's dumb all the way around.
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May 22, 2014 20:49
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Madmarker posted:Bbbbbuuuuut people are having FUN WRONG! The issue is when one person having fun their way causes three other people to not have fun at all, which is distressingly common in EDH.
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May 22, 2014 20:49
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uggy posted:The "don't play with lovely people" thing doesn't work when you play magic with your friends and you all agree to not like a format. Sometimes it has nothing to do with the people and more to do with the format!!! Your post is about your personal experience, and none of it is inherent to the format. My group plays EDH, we don't take forever to take turns, we generally do not have someone go out super early, and we generally don't play combo, and none of the decks are specifically combo focused. It isn't hard to shape decks to the meta, that is exactly what my group does and it works out great. We all play decks that none overpower the format and we have a good time. What would the point be to bring a deck to our casual Saturday at one of our houses to just combo everyone out and insta-win? Nobody has a good time if we're done playing in 30 minutes, at least not in our group. Drink a beer, eat some snacks and play some cards man.
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May 22, 2014 20:49
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Stinky Pit posted:Thing is, you can make a Goblins, or a Saprolings deck in any format. Difference is that if you show up to block, or standard with a Saproling deck and get stomped no one is going to pay attention to you when you complain about losing to a tuned deck. I generally like to build tighter 60 card decks in formats like standard. I feel that a nice casual EDH group is exactly the place to play a deck like that. That is how my playgroup works out. Yours may not.
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May 22, 2014 20:51
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Commander is fun but it's nothing on the excellent 5-Color format that was big like 5-6 years ago (at least in WI and PA!!) - now THAT was the end-all be-all of Magic. IMO the issue with Commander is that it's a multiplayer format where people are reluctant to attack each other and it's also a format where you start with 40 life. Both of these things make aggro basically not work so the format is all control and goofball combo.
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May 22, 2014 20:51
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Okay, we've established that some of us like EDH and some of us don't. Can we find something more interesting to talk about?
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May 22, 2014 20:55
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^^^^^ Stop talking about magic in the magic thread!!!jassi007 posted:Your post is about your personal experience, and none of it is inherent to the format. My group plays EDH, we don't take forever to take turns, we generally do not have someone go out super early, and we generally don't play combo, and none of the decks are specifically combo focused. It isn't hard to shape decks to the meta, that is exactly what my group does and it works out great. We all play decks that none overpower the format and we have a good time. What would the point be to bring a deck to our casual Saturday at one of our houses to just combo everyone out and insta-win? Nobody has a good time if we're done playing in 30 minutes, at least not in our group. Drink a beer, eat some snacks and play some cards man. I know it's a personal experience. I'm not going to admonish you for having fun playing edh the way your group does, that sounds like it works for you! But saying that some formats don't push different things is completely wrong. There's a reason a format like standard doesn't push competitive combo as much as something like vintage or legacy. Those are formats that shape how decks work and edh is a format that shapes how decks work!
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May 22, 2014 20:57
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Lottery of Babylon posted:The issue is when one person having fun their way causes three other people to not have fun at all, which is distressingly common in EDH. I am well aware of the issues with EDH. It is not my first choice in formats, I like durdly control decks and aggro-control decks, which really don't have a place in the Timmy/Johnny "BIG GUYS AND COMBOS" format that EDH is. I have outlined what I think it does well, and what I think its major problems are. What my "Bbbuuuut...." comment was is a sarcastic way to agree with Jassi's post, which I had quoted. Look, some people really enjoy EDH....... for me its just ok. Its got its fair share of downsides. But, as has been said by quite a few people its not a competitive format. Play the type of deck you want, and if people dislike it, try changing it up. DO something sillier, less competitive, less optimized. If thats not your thing, great, than don't play EDH, it fails on multiple levels as a competitive format. EDH is a game you play to have something to talk about while having a drink with friends. Its beer and pretzels magic.
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May 22, 2014 20:58
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ALL MAGIC IS BEER AND PRETZELS MAGIC This whole "man edh is super casual everybody should loving chill" thing is silly
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May 22, 2014 20:59
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uggy posted:ALL MAGIC IS BEER AND PRETZELS MAGIC No its not, the Magic you play at a GP or even at most game stores is not "Beer and Pretzels" magic. Yes EDH can be played in a more competitive environment, but it is not a good format for it, the French 1v1 variant is much better balanced for that sort of play, and is actually quite a bit of fun. Standard, Modern, Legacy, and Limited, are, in my opinion, far superior formats because they can be played both casually and competitively with great success, but EDH is much better for multiplayer play. uggy posted:Edh is fun, sometimes I get a craving, but it has issues with turns taking forever, some players losing earlier than others, and combos that prevent other people from playing. It's also tough when you have to sort of shape your deck to the meta so that you don't get destroyed by other decks. I agree with your assessment of the problems of EDH, but its that variance that attracts a lot of players to it. Madmarker fucked around with this message at 21:05 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 21:03
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jassi007 posted:I generally like to build tighter 60 card decks in formats like standard. I feel that a nice casual EDH group is exactly the place to play a deck like that. That is how my playgroup works out. Yours may not. So just play random casual poo poo like has been done for the past 20 years. Once it becomes a "Format" though it has universal rules and you can't bitch and moan when someone follows those rules, but not the ones you've made up. If someone invited you to play a game of Modern, and suddenly you play cranial plating and they are all "Ughh, dude, our playgroup doesn't really use that card because of reasons" you'd think they were loving retarded but that happens all the drat time in EDH land. Madmarker posted:Play the type of deck you want, and if people dislike it, try changing it up. DO something sillier, less competitive, less optimized. In no other format of the game are you expected to stop doing things that you enjoy because others don't like it. Its stupid. Lots of people don't like control in standard or combo in modern, or a million other things but always the onus is on people to be reasonable adults and accept it only in EDH are people allowed to demand others stop doing things they enjoy because they don't like it. Ciprian Maricon fucked around with this message at 21:09 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 21:04
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Madmarker posted:No its not, the Magic you play at a GP or even at most game stores is not "Beer and Pretzels" magic. We're very clearly talking about playing magic with our friends, not at gps. I play standard and modern against my friends and we drink beer and eat goldfish
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May 22, 2014 21:05
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Madmarker posted:No its not, the Magic you play at a GP or even at most game stores is not "Beer and Pretzels" magic. This this this. This is exactly how I feel. EDH i'm sure is an awful experience when people are being competitive. When people are more lax and treating it like board game night, it is excellent. We don't play cut throat Ticket to Ride, or Cards Against Humanity, and we don't play cut throat EDH either.
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May 22, 2014 21:05
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Let's all look at how pretty the new Rout art is. (igor kieryluk)
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May 22, 2014 21:07
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JAMOOOL posted:Commander is fun but it's nothing on the excellent 5-Color format that was big like 5-6 years ago (at least in WI and PA!!) - now THAT was the end-all be-all of Magic. IMO the issue with Commander is that it's a multiplayer format where people are reluctant to attack each other and it's also a format where you start with 40 life. Both of these things make aggro basically not work so the format is all control and goofball combo. Counterpoint I play Omnath and I win because I will play fatties and then hit you in the face while you're jacking around with whatever bullshit.
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May 22, 2014 21:08
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Elesh Norn is just showing off. She doesn't even need to cast rout, those dudes all definitely have at most 2 toughness to begin with 
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May 22, 2014 21:10
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Literally The Worst posted:Counterpoint I play Omnath and I win because I will play fatties and then hit you in the face while you're jacking around with whatever bullshit. man why don't you relax and drink a beer? maybe eat some pretzels
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May 22, 2014 21:10
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I wanted to play Commander until I learned Derevi is banned. How on earth do I play bird tribal and not have it suck now? 
Count Bleck fucked around with this message at 21:13 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 21:11
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Count Bleck posted:I wanted to play Commander until I learned Derevi is banned. Derevi's only on the French banlist, which is unofficial and more oriented towards 1v1 commander iirc.
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May 22, 2014 21:15
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Count Bleck posted:I wanted to play Commander until I learned Derevi is banned. Derevi's only banned in Duel Commander aka the French banlist, which I've never seen people play in real life in ~8 stores in two states. e:^^^ in before this gets posted 4 more times at least
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May 22, 2014 21:16
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Ableist Kinkshamer posted:Derevi's only on the French banlist, which is unofficial and more oriented towards 1v1 commander iirc. Okay good. Guess I'll continue to get more birds.
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May 22, 2014 21:17
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Count Bleck posted:Okay good. Besides, worst case scenario you can use Kangee, Aerie Keeper http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Kangee,%20Aerie%20Keeper edit-Kangee is also a Bird Wizard
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May 22, 2014 21:18
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Madmarker posted:Besides, worst case scenario you can use Kangee, Aerie Keeper I still can't believe how badKangee is. 2UW for a 2/2 legendary Flier? Already worse than Wind Drake. But wait! For the low low sum of 5UW you can get a 3/3 flier! That makes other 1/1's into 2/2's! Symmetrically! Edit: Oh wait, he's been errata'd! For just 5UW, you STILL get a 2/2 that only conditionally buffs other creatures! Shrecknet fucked around with this message at 21:23 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 21:21
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a dozen swans posted:Let's all look at how pretty the new Rout art is. Mostly because there is nowhere near enough depiction of phyrexians killing phyrexians given how cool that element of the lore is.
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May 22, 2014 21:21
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Everblight posted:I still can't believe how badKangee is. 2UW for a 2/2 legendary Flier? Already worse than Wind Drake. But wait! For the low low sum of 5UW you can get a 3/3 flier! That makes other 1/1's into 2/2's! Symmetrically! That's the thing, he isn't that bad........for the time he was printed. Creatures sucked in old magic, they got better.
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May 22, 2014 21:22
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My issue with EDH really boils down to Magic not just being a game I want to play with more than two sides. It just doesn't click for me like that. 2HG, Emperor I'm just fine with, but even back in 1995 I just didn't like those free for all bashes and it hasn't changed. One of the reasons being that Jyhad / V:TES was out and we played it too, and it unsurprisingly made for a better multiplayer game. I'd like playing a highlander format for 1v1 without Commander shenanigans, sadly German highlander has quieted down a lot back here after EDH / Commander became more popular.
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May 22, 2014 21:23
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Count Bleck posted:Okay good. Ironically, also not banned due to its use in a bird deck... quote:However, a closer analysis revealed that Derevi combines with many cards to create an enormous advantage very quickly. Combined with Hokori, Dust Drinker, you can lock your opponent while not suffering the effects yourself. Combined with Bloom Tender, you can create 6 mana on turn three, for exampling letting you cast Frost Titan and completely lock your opponent out of the game. Combined with Birthing Pod you can tutor multiple creatures into play every turn, crushing the opponent under value. And these are only a few examples. So, in other words, go nuts with birds but leave the Frost Titan and the Dust Drinker at home.
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May 22, 2014 21:24
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Everblight posted:I still can't believe how badKangee is. 2UW for a 2/2 legendary Flier? Already worse than Wind Drake. But wait! For the low low sum of 5UW you can get a 3/3 flier! That makes other 1/1's into 2/2's! Symmetrically! If you're in a casual group, run Fate Transfer to take advantage of the two other cards in the game with feather counters (Soulcatcher's Aerie, Aven Mimeomancer). Kangee is still awful though. e: of course neither of those actually needs fate transfer to buff your birds, but if you want to move the counters from the aerie to kangee for some reason you could. a dozen swans fucked around with this message at 21:38 on May 22, 2014 |
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May 22, 2014 21:27
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Everblight posted:I still can't believe how badKangee is. 2UW for a 2/2 legendary Flier? Already worse than Wind Drake. But wait! For the low low sum of 5UW you can get a 3/3 flier! That makes other 1/1's into 2/2's! Symmetrically! It's worse than that, she doesn't even buff herself. Honestly though, it can be alright if you build your deck around it. If you have tons of things that efficiently produce bird tokens, you can kill people out of nowhere. To be fair though, the craziest things I've done with that deck didn't even involve Kangee, like mirrorweaving Aven Brigadier after it and my 10 bird tokens went unblocked.
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May 22, 2014 21:28
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Madmarker posted:Is this list perfect? No, but it bans the cards that are egregiously overpowered in an eternal format. Yes Zur seems weird, but a there are some powerful enchantments out there like Eldrazi Conscription, that can just end a game, and being in the command zone makes these cards powerful. It's Zur's ability to run niche counter-cards without hampering the deck's overall performance while being able to slap out Nevermore to tell any commanders that cannot consistently come out before he does to gently caress off forever. The guy performs extremely consistently in a high-variance format - and that happens to be locking a player out while an old man beats them to death slowly. He's got Esper Control behind him to make it worse. Ableist Kinkshamer posted:Derevi's only on the French banlist, which is unofficial and more oriented towards 1v1 commander iirc. I played Derevi before she got banned. What Bant didn't need was a commander who could value-grind anything into the earth and never cost more than 4 mana. Sometimes she phoned her friend Hokori, Dust Drinker and made sure that you never had more than 1 mana ever again. Other times, she got a bunch of other on-damage effects like Vedalken Heretic and kept making things happen until the card disadvantage got to you.
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May 22, 2014 21:30
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| # ? Jun 7, 2024 07:16 |
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whydirt posted:This reminds me that I need to put together a Type IV Stack for multiplayer pickup games.
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May 22, 2014 21:43
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