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This drat conversation about led bulbs in garage openers just happened in the AI tools thread and I thought I was going crazy and lost my post.
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Dec 22, 2021 03:49
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My MyQ opener I put in this summer said LED bulbs would interfere with the signal, so I just put in a couple of CFLs that I had laying around, since I've got 10 or 20 of them that still work, and it seems a shame to throw out working CFL bulbs to replace with LED, especially since the biggest problem with them is their disposal.
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Dec 22, 2021 17:16
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Does anyone know a lot about whole home water filter systems? My wife and I had our water tested here at our house (city water) and the guy did the tests in front of us and it came back very high in chlorine and also fairly hard (6 grains per gallon). I don't have any reason to think the test was bullshit and we do taste a difference in our water and water from a portable filter we got (which he also tested in front of us and came out clear), plus my wife has a lot of dry/itchy skin issues that got a lot worse when we moved here. So anyway, I do think getting a whole house system would be a good idea for us, but I'm just wondering about price and quality and that sort of thing. I don't mind paying on the high end for a system that will actually last a super long time since I'm youngish and this is a long term investment, like the big thing with this company is they push Westinghouse filters and that they have a lifetime manufacturer's warranty but I think the price they quoted me (~$6200 for installing a carbon tank and the water softening system) seems pretty high. I'm in the process of getting other quotes but anyway I just wanted to check if this is like an insane price even for a high end system or if a really good long lasting one should be more like $3-4k installed. From what I can tell the average one seems to be like $1500-2500 installed for both a carbon filter and softener but I'm not sure how long those typically last, what the maintenance costs are, etc. Here's part of the gigantic e-mail the dude sent me if anyone wants to look at it and see what exactly they are proposing to install, point out parts that are bullshit or true, that sort of thing. I really don't know a ton about it so I'm very open to advice or resources. Thanks! Also, for context, neither of us care enough to install the reverse osmosis system so that's not really something I'm considering. I would also simply just prefer to have the fluoride since I do get cavities and such. quote:You have 2.0 ppm chlorine in your water which is what should be in a swimming pool. This high level causes your colors to fade in your laundry, damages the valves and seals in your plumbing fixtures (toilets, faucets, etc.) and appliances (ice maker, dishwasher, clothes washer, etc.), dries out your skin and hair and negatively affects the taste of all food and beverages you mix with or make with water. You also absorb chlorine through your skin during a shower or bath and inhale it as well. It is worth noting that chlorine also ruins water softener resin. Every system should include a carbon tank prior to the refiner/softener to prevent damage to the ion exchange resin. Stefan Prodan fucked around with this message at 20:43 on Dec 22, 2021 |
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Dec 22, 2021 20:40
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I beleive that is technically racketeering.
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Dec 22, 2021 20:57
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I would just have my plain old plumber ( company) install the units I wanted. Pretty sure almost all these systems are the same rebranded manufacturers.
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Dec 22, 2021 20:59
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Separate from OP’s concern… I don’t have a weird cohort and I’ve seen multiple people I know distrust city water supplies. I don’t know what source they’re getting their crappy info from, it’s like a Q level conspiracy around municipal water, and they buy bottled water instead. If your water is hard fine, or if you’re on well water yeah I get it, but man so many people distrust municipal chlorinated or fluoridated water with no evidence. Crazy sauce. Really good for a cottage industry of filtration that does very little.
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Dec 22, 2021 21:32
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Inner Light posted:Separate from OP’s concern… I don’t have a weird cohort and I’ve seen multiple people I know distrust city water supplies. I don’t know what source they’re getting their crappy info from, it’s like a Q level conspiracy around municipal water, and they buy bottled water instead. If your water is hard fine, or if you’re on well water yeah I get it, but man so many people distrust municipal chlorinated or fluoridated water with no evidence. Crazy sauce. Really good for a cottage industry of filtration that does very little. Hard disagree. Long Island is 1# (or #2 I don’t remember) in the entire country for breast cancer rates. No one knew why for a long time, but over the last couple years it’s been started to be linked to tap water. https://www.nyit.edu/box/features/qa_what_you_may_not_know_about_long_islands_drinking_water https://www.wshu.org/news/2019-05-30/report-long-island-has-most-contaminated-drinking-water-in-new-york https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2019/10/16/1-4-dioxane-long-island-water/ https://abc7ny.com/water-contamination-nassau-county-help-contaminated/5352036/ Also see flint. I don’t think this is all places. I happily drink tap water in NYC. But on Long Island when I go I never ever drink it.
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Dec 22, 2021 22:28
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Don’t drink the water from the tap here since they used PFAS fire retardant foam at the near by Air Force base and oh boy is that stuff a poo poo show. My gut doesn’t need to be non stick.
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Dec 22, 2021 22:35
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Pilfered Pallbearers posted:Hard disagree. Really really depends on the area. Also, some places have water that just has a taste you don't like. But Flint water with lead in it is pretty different from nimby water concerns
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Dec 22, 2021 22:56
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 Gross She said I could probably keep it closer to $250k if we were going to "keep all existing cabinetry"
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Dec 22, 2021 23:27
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BigPaddy posted:Don’t drink the water from the tap here since they used PFAS fire retardant foam at the near by Air Force base and oh boy is that stuff a poo poo show. My gut doesn’t need to be non stick. Yeah, I grew up near a Naval Air base that poisoned the groundwater with PFAS for decades. Thankfully my parents bought a water cooler and had water delivered when I was a kid. Military bases are exempt from a lot of environmental and reporting rules, so if you’re anywhere near one you have no idea what they could be doing to your aquifer.
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Dec 22, 2021 23:30
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Lol. Also if it wasn't clear earlier I don't think you should take any recommendations on solutions from someone administrating the test. They have no incentive to tell you you're fine. You need an independent third party who makes their money on the test and analysis. Then hire a plumber to install something if you need it.
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Dec 22, 2021 23:31
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I mean I can get a separate one but I watched the dude test both our tap water and the filtered water and saw the tap water which also kind of smells like chlorine already turn yellow in the test while the filter one didn't when he did the same test, as well as the fact that my wife has like bad/dry skin that started when we moved here. I guess he could have done some sleight of hand or something but our filtered water in the big filter we have both smells and tastes noticeably different than our tap water. As far as the hardness, I can visually see mineral deposits on our faucets upstairs because they have the sort of waterfall type spigot, idk what to call it but it has like an exposed horizontal part that's getting mineral deposits on it. I'd be willing to get it tested again but I dunno like I got it tested to begin with because I thought we had water issues in sort of exactly the way that the test came out so I don't think the test itself is the scam. I also have a hard time finding an independent place that even will come out and test, they all seem to be through filter companies. Although I could see if my town has some sort of thing you can do. I did find another company that was quoting like $4500 to install a similar whole house system so I'll keep asking around.
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Dec 22, 2021 23:43
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Water where I'm moving to, there's a plant that makes the adhesive to stick Teflon to metal pans (everything about Teflon is bad) that dumped a bunch of the stuff in the river where all the local communities pull their water supply from Last time they tested for this chemical according to the state website was July 2020 and the reading was not 0 We'll be installing a reverse osmosis system in the kitchen and two main bathrooms where we brush our teeth to start, since they're about $500 each and it's a rental
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Dec 22, 2021 23:50
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StormDrain posted:Lol. Also yeah, if you call the city they will usually offer to test your water for chlorine and calcium levels for free, I forget what exactly City water also probably is required by law to post all sorts of levels of contaminants in the water on at least a quarterly basis, should be on their website
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Dec 22, 2021 23:57
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I have a pipe in the concrete floor in my garage; I am assuming it's a drain pipe and I think I need a dehumidifier for a separate issue, it would be convenient if it was a drain as I could easily drain the dehumidifier out there... Can you rent little snake cameras or something to confirm this is actually just a drain pipe? Or how would one otherwise go about this?
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Dec 22, 2021 23:59
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Stefan Prodan posted:I mean I can get a separate one but I watched the dude test both our tap water and the filtered water and saw the tap water which also kind of smells like chlorine already turn yellow in the test while the filter one didn't when he did the same test, as well as the fact that my wife has like bad/dry skin that started when we moved here. I guess he could have done some sleight of hand or something but our filtered water in the big filter we have both smells and tastes noticeably different than our tap water. Did you move from another climate or a similar one? A lot of people move to where I've lived in Montana and Colorado and are surprised at the dry atmosphere and what it does to their skin. I'm not saying your water is safe. It's poor procedure to test for free and sell you something based on the result. It's not necessarily a parlor trick of swapping glasses, it can just be a very sensitive test that works on tap and not on filtered water. The problem is the incentive, the tester gets nothing if you don't buy a water filter. We live in a capitalist society. You make a good mark because you already think you have a problem. I also posit that a lack of local testing means either there isn't a recognized problem in your area or you're under served. Perhaps there is a mail in test you can do.
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Dec 23, 2021 00:03
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Stefan Prodan posted:Does anyone know a lot about whole home water filter systems? I'll start by saying I'm a wastewater and water treatment engineer. Get water quality testing done by someone who isn't trying to sell you anything. Not that I think this guy has done the tests wrong, but I think what he's selling you is overkill. Free chlorine at at 2ppm is definitely high, and will have taste and odour issues, as well as potential skin irritation. Typically you want this number right around 0.5 ppm at the point of residential supply (where it comes into your house). Is it as much of an issue as he's going on about? Definitely not. This reading will also probably vary with the seasons somewhat, likely dropping in the summer and increasing in the winter. How close do you live to the water distribution infrastructure? The closer you are, the higher the level of chlorine you'll see, as chlorine in water will degrade over time and they need to ensure 0.5ppm at the furthest point in the distribution network. Chlorine can cause dry and itchy skin, hardness can as well. Hardness at 6 grains really isn't all that hard. My water is at 17 grains, but I'm on well water  . Do you notice significant buildup on faucets, sinks, toilet tanks, etc? Do you find you need to use a lot of soap to get things clean? Does it bother you? If yes, you could put in a softener system. You will need a carbon tank prior to the softener system because chlorine does wreck the softener media.I don't have a clue why he's recommending an RO system for your taps / fridge / drinking water. There are no issues drinking appropriately chlorinated water, and RO will remove a lot of good minerals from the water. The membranes in residential systems are fairly loose for this reason - you don't actually want to remove all of that from the water, drinking ultrapure (think removal of >99% of this stuff) water will kill you because the water will actually leach these minerals out of your body, which also needs them. In addition, you're on residential water supply, there shouldn't be anything left in the water that would harm you. Only you can decide if you prefer the taste of it vs the cost and ongoing maintenance of the RO system. A water softener will add salts to the water (this is how it displaces the hard water causing constituants) and an RO will then remove these salts - which is literally only a taste concern. If it were me I'd probably throw a carbon filter at it to knock down the chlorine levels and see if that addressed the issues I had with it, and step up to a softener if it doesn't. I wouldn't bother with the RO system at all.
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Dec 23, 2021 00:24
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StormDrain posted:Did you move from another climate or a similar one? A lot of people move to where I've lived in Montana and Colorado and are surprised at the dry atmosphere and what it does to their skin. Nope we moved 20 miles from our old place. Anyway I agree with you in general, I can look for some place else to test our water but I really do think we have a pretty obvious water issue. We live in a state capital so I'm sure there's someone here that does it, it's probably just flooded on google from the water treatment selling people. edit: Thanks for the good reply above! I do agree that there's no point in getting the RO and we both kinda thought that wasn't really necessary at all. We do have trouble getting clothes to feel like they ever got fully rinsed off and I have deposits on the fixtures and such, yeah, I just never really thought about it before, or like I didn't connect why our clothes would still feel like they had soap on them out of the dryer. They recently built a pump station about a mile from us and I suspect maybe we are getting our water closer to the source than we were when we moved here because of that? I'm not sure. I don't know enough about water treatment to know if a pump station is a place where water is treated. If that isn't one then I don't know how far we are from the source but my suburb isn't that big so I don't think we're like super far from it. Well, I found an annual water report on the town's web site that had our running annual average of chlorine at 2.34 so apparently we aren't even high for the area, our town just loving loves chlorine Stefan Prodan fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Dec 23, 2021 |
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Dec 23, 2021 00:25
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I don’t know anything about your water, but my uncle is a water softener salesman and hoo boy is it ever a Wild West of predatory sales. It’s all pushy sales tactics- first the Neutral Scientific FACTS*, then the Greatest Newest Technology, then the A Good Husband/Father/Whatever Would Buy This For His FAMILY, then The Buddy-Buddy Cuttin’ You a Special Deal! *Facts not guaranteed
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Dec 23, 2021 00:31
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Hutla posted:I don’t know anything about your water, but my uncle is a water softener salesman and hoo boy is it ever a Wild West of predatory sales. It’s all pushy sales tactics- first the Neutral Scientific FACTS*, then the Greatest Newest Technology, then the A Good Husband/Father/Whatever Would Buy This For His FAMILY, then The Buddy-Buddy Cuttin’ You a Special Deal! Yeah that's what it seems like to be honest, I just want to get a good system with someone who will like go ahead and schedule the maintenance and make sure it's all running well every year or half year or something because I know that if it's up to me I will forget, but those companies seem to be the ones that are really into pushing the type of stuff you're talking about
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Dec 23, 2021 00:34
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Stefan Prodan posted:Yeah that's what it seems like to be honest, I just want to get a good system with someone who will like go ahead and schedule the maintenance and make sure it's all running well every year or half year or something because I know that if it's up to me I will forget, but those companies seem to be the ones that are really into pushing the type of stuff you're talking about I asked two plumbers in a row if I could get on a maintenance contract for our tankless water heater. Both said the equivalent of "lol what?" This seems like free money, they mail me a bill for $200 or whatever, they come out and swap the inline filter, flush the coils, and leave. It's nuts.
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Dec 23, 2021 00:43
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We installed a tankless earlier this year. The first annual maintenance is free, after that it’s something like $120/yr. I laughed, looked up the procedure on YouTube provided by the manufacturer, and had an electric pump and necessary hoses ordered that day. You just run vinegar through it with a bucket once it is in bypass. There’s no way in hell I’m paying someone $120 to do something that takes $3 in materials and less than half an hour of my time.
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Dec 23, 2021 00:57
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Anyway I found another guy selling this system which is like the carbon filter and the softener in one, this with installation was like $4500 so that's less but still a decent bit more than ordering another system off the internet and just paying a plumber a few hours labor. I e-mailed two local plumbers instead of like water filtering companies and just waiting to hear back what they can do. I am not handy at all and will not be DIY-ing it, that's great for anyone who can but I hate putting stuff together. https://www.haguewater.com/water-softeners/watermax/ There are a bunch of bad reviews for specific Hague dealers but when I looked at just people talking about the product itself they seemed to be fine with it and my actual local dealer has very high reviews on all the review sites (although some could be fake I guess)
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Dec 23, 2021 01:25
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Stefan Prodan posted:Nope we moved 20 miles from our old place. If you do end up wanting RO and you're even remotely handy (seriously, you're disconnecting and reconnecting a couple hoses... hardest part is getting the spigot attached to the sink), you can get a good quality system for $320. (and that needs a $30 filter every year, and membranes "as needed"... not $120/yr) I just put one of those in for my parents last weekend, only took an hour or two. Hardest part was finding may dad's drill because I forgot mine. They had been somewhat alarmed after watching https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9W74aeuqsiU - and they had been buying cases of water to drink for years because they didn't like the taste of the tap water. I get it that plumbers aren't cheap, but that's a crazy price (and makes me suspicious of their other prices too)
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Dec 23, 2021 02:16
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TrueChaos posted:
This is crap FYI. There are no "minerals" present in a municipal water supply that you miss in a balanced diet. Drink all the distilled or RO water you want.
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Dec 23, 2021 02:23
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NomNomNom posted:This is crap FYI. There are no "minerals" present in a municipal water supply that you miss in a balanced diet. Drink all the distilled or RO water you want. My dude, I literally do this for a living and carry a professional engineering license & personal liability for the systems I design and stamp. I specifically indicated ultrapure water - which is past what a typical residential RO system will produce. Some of the systems with tighter membranes actually include a re-mineralization filter post RO for literally the reasons listed above. The danger isn't that you won't be getting enough of the minerals from your diet - it's that if the water you drink does not contain any impurities (salts, sugars, minerals, etc. - all of which are present in your municipal tap water, as dissolved solids) it will leach those impurities from your saliva, cells, blood, etc. Will this kill you right away? No, unless you drink a lot of it at once. But you absolutely don't want to be drinking ultrapure water on the regular. There's a reason the WHO specifies minimums and maximums for all of these items. Take a read: https://www.who.int/water_sanitation_health/dwq/nutrientschap12.pdf I was certainly being hyperbolic saying it will kill you - a glass of it on a normal day certainly won't. But, a few litres in a short timespan (think hour or two) after serious physical exercise certainly could, and there are long term health effects of drinking ultrapure water.
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Dec 23, 2021 03:45
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I was also advised to not use ultra pure water in the hot tub for similar reasons, it will leech minerals out of the tub shell.
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Dec 23, 2021 03:46
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I have a 5 stage RO/DI filter I use to make water for my reef tank, and it tastes absolutely terrible at 0 tds
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Dec 23, 2021 03:53
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Enos Cabell posted:I have a 5 stage RO/DI filter I use to make water for my reef tank, and it tastes absolutely terrible at 0 tds I'm curious - is this so you can easily control exactly what goes into the water that goes into the tank?
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Dec 23, 2021 04:00
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TrueChaos posted:I'm curious - is this so you can easily control exactly what goes into the water that goes into the tank? Yeah, coral require pretty specific amounts of different minerals and the easiest way to get there is starting with completely pure water and adding what you need via salt mix.
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Dec 23, 2021 04:13
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TrueChaos posted:My dude, I literally do this for a living and carry a professional engineering license & personal liability for the systems I design and stamp. Oh snap
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Dec 23, 2021 04:29
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Enos Cabell posted:Yeah, coral require pretty specific amounts of different minerals and the easiest way to get there is starting with completely pure water and adding what you need via salt mix. That's neat!
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Dec 23, 2021 05:31
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In Denver I was quoted $4000 for a water filter and water softener. That included running a pipe from my water supply to the water heater/ac/furnace area where the filter would be, and back. About 30 feet or so.
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Dec 23, 2021 08:42
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I'd say you should also make sure that you run whatever they suggest they're going to install for you by the NSF water filter certification database. If the things you want are not listed on there I wouldn't bother/trust it. Here's the P-550. It doesn't actually list that system as having been certified for taste/odor reduction or chlorine reduction, which I think is odd for a RO system - but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Also, RO systems will waste like 4 gallons of water for every gallon you ultimately produce.
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Dec 23, 2021 09:15
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El Mero Mero posted:
Between quadrupling my water consumption for $10 extra dollars a month, or damning my wife and children to breast cancer 
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Dec 23, 2021 09:35
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TrueChaos posted:My dude, I literally do this for a living and carry a professional engineering license & personal liability for the systems I design and stamp. I specifically indicated ultrapure water - which is past what a typical residential RO system will produce. Some of the systems with tighter membranes actually include a re-mineralization filter post RO for literally the reasons listed above. I'm also an engineer (unrelated field) so I decided to find some references for my assertion. The Water Quality Association (industry group of purified water people, probably incentivized to say it's safe): Consumption of Low TDS Water I found the WHO report that you were likely referencing: Health Risks from Drinking Demineralised Water I'm suss of some of the studies, like morbidity of infants in the USSR. It also talks about chugging water post-exercise, and admits that regular tap water might kill you too if you do that. . I also found a statement from the EPA saying that they viewed consumption of RO water safe, and saying that "leaching minerals from the body" is not accepted fact. They kind have to say that, since I wonder what Navy sailors and astronauts drink. If you took exception to me saying you could chug distilled water, alright fine that's hyperbolic and you're weird if you like the taste. Home RO systems are fine and safe as a primary drinking source. In short, water is a land of contrasts. NomNomNom fucked around with this message at 14:00 on Dec 23, 2021 |
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Dec 23, 2021 13:46
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Water is fine, it is that dihydrogen monoxide you have to be careful with.
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Dec 23, 2021 14:06
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BigPaddy posted:Water is fine, Source your quotes or get out
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Dec 23, 2021 14:52
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So what brand softener and or whole house filter will be cheap and effective? I have pretty good tap water but soft water is better for my flowing locks.
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Dec 23, 2021 14:57
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