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The only Command and Conquer I ever played was...well.. ...Command and Conquer 64, which is an atrocious attempt to remake this game on a 16 MB cartridge.Watching this is an interesting experience for me.
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Nov 28, 2018 05:15
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I know playing at a high resolution makes things more convenient because you can see the whole map, but I'm just not used to C&C sprites looking as tiny as they do here and it's really weirding me out. I'm not necessarily saying you should play at 640x480 or anything like that (I probably would, but I'm also a moron), just making an observation. Also, Frank Klepacki is a loving legend and the music in this game is perfect. edit: Patter Song posted:The only Command and Conquer I ever played was...well.. DMorbid fucked around with this message at 05:20 on Nov 28, 2018 |
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Nov 28, 2018 05:17
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Winner winner chicken dinner They also have the most amazing sounding guns on planet earth.... and literally explode when they die
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Nov 28, 2018 05:17
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Doc M posted:Also, Frank Klepacki is a loving legend and the music in this game is perfect.
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Nov 28, 2018 05:43
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One thing I remember about C&C is that the unit data was literally stored in a .txt file that you could open up and change pretty easily. Was much easier to beat the game when all the minigunners were bumped up to maximum damage.
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Nov 28, 2018 06:25
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sullat posted:One thing I remember about C&C is that the unit data was literally stored in a .txt file that you could open up and change pretty easily. Was much easier to beat the game when all the minigunners were bumped up to maximum damage. 
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Nov 28, 2018 06:29
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EclecticTastes posted:The soundtrack is one of the strongest points in favor of C&C being the best drat RTS series ever. Frank Klepacki is a goddamn musical genius, and he managed to top himself with each successive game he worked on, until he reached absolute perfection with RA2 and just maintained that quality for the remainder.   Name: Frank Klepacki Aliases: The Big F, K-Note, Father Sound Affiliation: Frank works for no one but himself Occupation: Legend Voiced/Played by: Unknown Who is Frank Klepacki? Very little evidence, other than his musical entries in the game, supports the theory that Mr. Klepacki, if that is his real name, has ever existed on planet Earth. Rumours have made the rounds on the internet that he is simply a Tommy Tallarico expy, or an even wilder theory that the music was created during a darker period of time in Koji Kondo's life. [VIDEO REDACTED] A young Frank Klepacki on [REDACTED], or simply a hoax video? Whatever the case may be, he is credited for Original Soundtrack for Command and Conquer (Tiberian Dawn). More to follow at a later date...
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Nov 28, 2018 06:42
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Patter Song posted:The only Command and Conquer I ever played was...well.. I too had C&C1 on N64, and yeah, it was definitely an experience, double so when I eventually played the PC original and saw the FMVs actually, well, move and whatnot. And the far superior music quality goes without saying.
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Nov 28, 2018 06:43
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Edit: Whoops sorry.
NewMars fucked around with this message at 06:54 on Nov 28, 2018 |
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Nov 28, 2018 06:44
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Lets try not to spoil any weird/crazy things that may or may not come up ya?
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Nov 28, 2018 06:52
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Lets try not to spoil any weird/crazy things that may or may not come up ya? Oh, sorry, I wasn't sure if a skirmish map that I thought was in this one, but it turns out is in RA, was a spoiler.
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Nov 28, 2018 06:55
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My first C&C was RA2, so eagerly awaiting you getting there and actually getting through the campaign, which younger me was never too interested in. Younger me was too busy building defensive structures around the edge of the map to kill an easy AI, or building up a far too large force of top level units to smash the garbage that said AIs would construct.
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Nov 28, 2018 07:08
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Jobbo_Fett posted:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bccxgkgdvEo
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Nov 28, 2018 09:42
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Oh god. That first medium tank is a monster I'll never forget, I think the first time I played this mission it came out of nowhere and ran everybody over in one swoop. It needs to be emphasised how close this was to happening during the video, those things move slightly faster than bazooka guys run iirc and the AI is good at tracking clumps of infantry.
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Nov 28, 2018 13:46
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Patter Song posted:The only Command and Conquer I ever played was...well.. I mean... They tried, that's all I can say. There's only so much even Looking Glass Studios can do for the game on a controller and system like that. It deserves some credit for swapping the buildings out with 3D models, but the game runs super slowly compared to the PC version, and that's actually a good thing, because the controls are not fun. The build menu was your standard console menu (you swapped between build and cursor mode by pressing the shoulder button, I think), but the cursor interface remained for commanding units, and trying to do cursor stuff with the N64 controller was not ideal (yes, lasso selection was there, and yes it's as bad as you think). It also included a few bonus missions accessible from the main menu, and these bonus missions are accessible now on the PC as well. I didn't really have anything more than a vague idea of what I was missing either, since I had only managed to get the demo for the Mac before I got the N64 version and my parents decided that was good enough. The music and cutscenes are obviously much better on the PC version. Honestly, the N64 briefings had some effort put into them, but replacing the FMVs with powerpoints doesn't give you a great impression if you've played both versions. It was good enough for me as a kid, I suppose, but having the benefit of hindsight and comparison now, it's really, really not great.
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Nov 28, 2018 13:50
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Crazy Achmed posted:Oh god. That first medium tank is a monster I'll never forget, I think the first time I played this mission it came out of nowhere and ran everybody over in one swoop. It needs to be emphasised how close this was to happening during the video, those things move slightly faster than bazooka guys run iirc and the AI is good at tracking clumps of infantry. I ragequit a few times when I was a kid after watching my glorious army get turned into a red paste. If only I'd known about the "X" shortcut  (Hitting X with infantry selected forces them to scatter in random directions)
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Nov 28, 2018 14:14
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UED Special Ops posted:Yeah, I remember way back in the day having a Technician just run around in the fog of war like that. Controlling a unit you can't even see was "fun" for all the 15 seconds it lived out there. Pretty sure they also have weird random delays between shots or some sort of invisible ammo counter that takes a while to refill, as I remember that sometimes telling them to attack does nothing/cause them to just run around instead.
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Nov 28, 2018 22:50
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Asehujiko posted:The technician's handgun holds 10 shots and after that it needs to be reloaded. If they kill an enemy unit with their last shot, they won't reload until the next time they try to attack. Why this one unit and nothing else has this mechanic is never explained. 90's RTS people! Likely most units in some early version were intended to have some variant of that mechanic, but probably it got scrapped during dev, and then no one thought to remove it from the Mechanic because they were so irrelevant.
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Nov 28, 2018 23:12
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Patter Song posted:The only Command and Conquer I ever played was...well.. That was how I got into the series too, actually. Think we rented it once, liked it and bought it, then from there we moved on to the rest of the series on PC as it came out for a while. The fun thing is that I remember getting most of the games after Red Alert right around when they came out, so we must have gotten the N64 version like right as it became available, because Tiberian Sun was out just three months afterwards. The N64 did have a really good startup sequence going for it, though. Neat way to replicate the original's installer, and a Commando blowing up the N64 logo never stops being funny.
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Nov 28, 2018 23:15
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PurpleXVI posted:Likely most units in some early version were intended to have some variant of that mechanic, but probably it got scrapped during dev, and then no one thought to remove it from the Mechanic because they were so irrelevant. It might be that they deliberately left in the otherwise-cut mechanic for the completely irrelevant unit as a sort of tribute or reminder of the work that went in. Were it not for the Technician, we'd have never even known that reloading had crossed the devs' minds when they were developing C&C.
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Nov 28, 2018 23:25
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Reloading sounds like an interesting mechanic that probably just turned into what we got in terms of the various attack speeds of different units. Now sprite animations to demonstrate said mechanic? That would've been loving dope but a) not easy to see given the size of infantry units and b) a whole lot of extra animation work that doesn't really add anything to the gameplay
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Nov 29, 2018 00:56
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Chalk me down as another guy whose first exposure to this series was the N64 version. Which I was absolutely terrible at. Really looking forward to when you reach Red Alert, which I have opinions regarding.
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Nov 29, 2018 02:20
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Jobbo_Fett posted:I ragequit a few times when I was a kid after watching my glorious army get turned into a red paste. It's such an important keybind in these games.
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Nov 29, 2018 03:21
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Yep, I never knew about the X key for quite some time - was it even in the manual? Off the top of my head there's also a "force move" command that seems designed to let you order a tank to squish rather than fire on infantry, and a "guard" command that gives you something akin to an actual attack-move (tell your army to guard one tank/buggy, then drive that around and everyone will have a decent autoattack rather than standing around watching their mates standing six feet away get blown up by a grenadier)
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Nov 29, 2018 11:20
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I know it'd be only for my convevience, but would you mind labeling the videos' urls with titles? Like so: NOD Mission 4. It'd be easier to know what you're linking to, and even though there are add-ons to certain browsers that allow one to see the title of video, I don't think Firefox has one.
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Nov 29, 2018 14:15
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Szurumbur posted:I know it'd be only for my convevience, but would you mind labeling the videos' urls with titles? Like so: NOD Mission 4. It'd be easier to know what you're linking to, and even though there are add-ons to certain browsers that allow one to see the title of video, I don't think Firefox has one. I just embed the videos in the post. I assumed most everyone would browse like that, but yeah I'll go through the previous posts and add a titled link under each video.
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Nov 29, 2018 14:18
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Crazy Achmed posted:Yep, I never knew about the X key for quite some time - was it even in the manual? Off the top of my head there's also a "force move" command that seems designed to let you order a tank to squish rather than fire on infantry, and a "guard" command that gives you something akin to an actual attack-move (tell your army to guard one tank/buggy, then drive that around and everyone will have a decent autoattack rather than standing around watching their mates standing six feet away get blown up by a grenadier) Yes, the manual does! Its at the back of the book, but before all the unit/building blurbs, and the tutorials. Here's a direct copy-paste of the manual. quote:Advanced Game Controls Interesting to note that a lot of these controls would become essentials to RTS pro-gaming. Also that "Control Groups" as we know them were called "Teams".
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Nov 29, 2018 14:23
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Jobbo_Fett posted:I just embed the videos in the post. I assumed most everyone would browse like that, but yeah I'll go through the previous posts and add a titled link under each video. Great, thank you very much:)
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Nov 29, 2018 14:47
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NOD Mission 05 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_yWCeivBfU NOD Mission 05  MAURITANIA Population: 2,059,000 Expendability: 50% Capital: Nouakchott Government: Islamic Republic Govt Corruptability: 48% Net Worth: $1 Billion Point of Conflict: Tidjikdja Military Strength: Laughable Military Resistance: 24%  After a nice informational video on Tiberium, what it is and how it spreads, we are made aware that the eye of Kane is on us now, moreso than ever before. Strange, however, that Seth wouldn't be Kane's personal commander, or that we should worry about failing Seth, and not Kane. Location: Tidjikdja, Mauritania Objective: Deploy SAMs to defend your base, then eliminate GDI presence on the map. Briefing: Our brothers within GDI tell us of A-10 strike jets scheduled to be deployed here soon. Our suppliers have delivered new Surface to Air Missiles to aid you. Use the SAMs to defend your base, then seek out their base and destroy it. Author's note: Seriously, what's Seth's deal?   LIGHT TANK ARMOR: MEDIUM COST: 600 SECONDS TO PRODUCE: 40 RANGE: MEDIUM WEAPON: 75MM APDS This highly-mobile tread vehicle, delivers maximum weaponry and personnel destruction with minimum weight, maintenance and weaponry. Faster than any other tank on the battlefield, these units can reach a target quickly. Used in conjunction with aerial assaults, these units are very effective. Author's notes: What aerial assaults?!  FLAMETHROWER INFANTRY ARMOR: NONE COST: 200 SECONDS TO PRODUCE: 13 RANGE: SHORT WEAPON: FLAMETHROWER Effective for maximum close-range destruction. Produces fire which burns more slowly than normal, allowing more effective elimination of humans and armament. Be careful when using these troops in groups—if one unit gets in front of another, chances are that the unit in front will catch some of the damage from the back unit. Spread them out. Author's notes: The slow burning fire stuff is just fluff, but you should honestly be careful with multiple flamethrowers. No joke, anything over 1 is dangerous to all sides.  SANDBAG BARRIER ARMOR: LIGHT COST: 50 SECONDS TO PRODUCE: 3 POWER USAGE: NONE PURPOSE: BASE DEFENSE Used to deter the enemy from advancing. Sandbags provide limited cover and may slow units down. Only explosive weapons such as grenades, missiles, and shells can damage Sandbags. Author's notes: Not sure what the "provide limited cover" is supposed to be exactly, although I haven't checked the rules on it. The 2nd part is true, and annoyingly so at times.  SAM SITE ARMOR: HEAVY/LIGHT COST: 750 SECONDS TO PRODUCE: 50 POWER USAGE: 20 PURPOSE: DEFENSIVE ANTI-AIRBORNE UNIT Fires surface-to-air missiles at airborne GDI units. When the it is recessed in the ground, it is difficult to harm. However, when the launcher is exposed, it will damage more easily. Position these around your base in a triangular layout. This gives you the best chances of destroying aerial threats before they can cause serious damage to your base. Author's notes: Due to the limits on distance (you need to build adjacent), you either need to build out or accept that their range will be poor, especially against A-10 strikes.  AIRSTRIP ARMOR: HEAVY COST: 2000 SECONDS TO PRODUCE: 133 POWER USAGE: 30 PURPOSE: WEAPONS RECEIVING AREA Nod buys all its units. The Airfield allows cargo planes to land and deliver equipment. It is functionally equivalent to the GDI Weapons Factory. However, you do not instantly get the unit when it is complete—it must be flown in, so plan accordingly. Building multiple Airfields will increase the ordering speed, and will enable you to have two units delivered at a time. Author's notes: I don't think I ever bothered building a second one, mostly due to money concerns. Sorry guys, would've had this out sooner but holy crap the encoding just would NOT register my commentary track for some godawful reason. Jobbo_Fett fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Nov 30, 2018 |
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Nov 30, 2018 04:49
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Ahh C&C1 A-10 warthog strikes, the bane of NOD missions at times. Speaking of those, are you going to talk about how the AI them works or can that be talked about in the thread? Also, noticed that the note on flamethrowers is the same as sandbags.
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Nov 30, 2018 05:41
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UED Special Ops posted:Ahh C&C1 A-10 warthog strikes, the bane of NOD missions at times. Speaking of those, are you going to talk about how the AI them works or can that be talked about in the thread? Also, noticed that the note on flamethrowers is the same as sandbags. Whoops, fixed the sandbag note. The A-10 Strike always feels random or like.. closest enemy to the comms center? I def won't say no to some more knowledge kn how the AI uses them
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Nov 30, 2018 05:56
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OK, to the best of my knowledge, the AI sweeps from the upper left to right very top of the map looking for either buildings or units once the A-10 strike is ready. If it detects nothing, it shifts down a map square and repeats, hence why the A-10 fried that lone almost dead infantry scout midway through the video that was up near its base. This can be exploited by either having a sacrificial unit or building in the upper left most part of your base area/map. Under AI control the A-10 actually can follow whatever unit it has locked on to, hence why several light tanks were destroyed by the final A-10 strike of the mission, the locked-on tank was moving and the A-10 followed and dropped its napalm towards the unit, hitting a lot more ground then it would normally vs a stationary unit.
UED Special Ops fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Nov 30, 2018 |
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Nov 30, 2018 06:11
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I'm surprised that the A-10s in this game are just used for putting down napalm. It seems potent enough but you'd think they'd instead be using their actual ridiculous gun with the same mechanical effect? So far as C&C itself goes I have no experience with this beyond fragments. I watched someone play one match on a later game, I'm familiar with a certain performance, and somehow my patrol with the Boy Scouts had a modified version of the NOD logo as their badge.
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Nov 30, 2018 06:39
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Hey, one of my favourite early Klepacki tracks! I still to this day get Mechanical Man randomly stuck in my head sometimes.
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Nov 30, 2018 06:53
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Totally forgot about Mechanical Man. Far catchier than it has any right to be. Jobbo Fett posted:Author's note: Seriously, what's Seth's deal? Once again I interpreted this differently. There's IMO a clearer view of his arrogance, which is basically the only reason I know of to throw in the 'while I was at a top-level briefing with Kane' line. I really started to see him as a smarmy, slippery weasel at this point. I didn't find the rest of what he said to be nearly as odd though. As Kane's right-hand man, he wouldn't be the personal commander; I don't see either one of them as field commanders. It always struck me as more the idea that the personal commander would be Kane's most trusted man in the field, directing his most capable troops - like Napoleon's Old Guard or the Sacred Band of ancient Carthage - on missions vital enough to commit them to which Kane would naturally directly oversee himself. Seth, from this POV, would be the administrative person Kane hands off most less-important matters to, and he probably has others to delegate further on down the chain of command. I can imagine a NOD Leadership Council or whatever of sorts, where they would go over the key happenings in each operational theatre, and Kane 'suggesting' that the player-commander be given the Lagos AirBase Assault task. The reason Seth might say 'do not fail me' is that he's stuck his neck out in mentioning the player. Knowing what we know about Seth, I'm sure it wasn't for our benefit, but to further his own ambitions and stature and probably brag about the fact that Seth 'discovered' us. Having done so, and established the player as his protégé/golden boy/whathaveyou, Seth would have egg on his face and his judgement called into question if we fail. I also think it reveals that, to Seth, his personal ambition trumps the furthering of Nod's goals. Or maybe I just put way too much thought into this. Also, I notice that it doesn't particularly concern you to be low on power. I thought this made buildings run less efficiently - i.e., not build units as fast, etc. I know it does so in later games, or in the original here does it not affect much other than knocking the communications building off-line? I never had the engineer issue - so long as I was building a bunch of tanks to defeat the enemy base anyway, I would pretty much just smash the whole thing with them and not bother with the capturing part. . Strategic Sage fucked around with this message at 08:21 on Nov 30, 2018 |
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Nov 30, 2018 08:16
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Still irrationally annoyed you're not selling the second refinery to get that second harvester cheap. But hey, Kane sort of knows we exist!!!
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Nov 30, 2018 11:14
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Thotimx posted:Totally forgot about Mechanical Man. Far catchier than it has any right to be. I could be wrong on this but I think Mechanical Man is an expansion song and, due to the nature of the patches and such, they are in the normal song rotation. As for Seth, he's clearly doing what he can to further his own goals, or at the very least impress Kane (whoever he is). The way he addresses us makes me think he doesn't actually like the commander, and that we're just being used. I swesr in a trial run being at low power slowed production time and ill make a tiny video demoing it if I can replicate it again.
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Nov 30, 2018 12:44
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90s Cringe Rock posted:Still irrationally annoyed you're not selling the second refinery to get that second harvester cheap. I find it more efficient to keep several refineries in this game 
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Nov 30, 2018 12:45
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I like how the briefing map has us attacking Mauretania and then the briefing video has us...not doing that.
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Nov 30, 2018 13:07
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Jobbo_Fett posted:I find it more efficient to keep several refineries in this game As long as you're serving the Brotherhood, though, it's all good.
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Nov 30, 2018 13:14
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