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Chrysophylax posted:Just wanted to point out that the real reason for this is that the broken and online regen rate for prismatics is actually much lower compared to regular. This video illustrates this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSRRw0tP7Zw. All the ships have the same shield strength. Doesn't change the rest of your argument tho, it just triggered my You are right, i completly left out that the regen rate is lower to begin with. But its actually a combination of both, slow regen and higher strength. Since offline shields will come online once they regenerated 50% of their total strength, higher strength increases the time-to-online even further. Combined that makes for some serious watching-paint-dry when offlining your shields, which is the reason you must always keep them alive. You can easily test this with shield boosters, btw. While stock 5A prismatics have a time-to-online of 2:27 (according to edshipyard) in my +100% shield strength FDL that time is roughly 5 minutes.
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Sep 6, 2016 11:48
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The thing is it doesn't mean much right now, because missiles exist. Bi-weaves are best when your shields go down a lot, prismatic are best if you're sure you can keep them up. If your shields go down, even if your hull is super tanky, missiles will cripple your externals and you're as good as dead. The only places I can see bi-weaves being better are low power ships that don't expect to ever see combat, or stealth builds. Besides, getting hit stops shield regen, so bi-weaves are just class C shields while you're being shot at.
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Sep 6, 2016 12:12
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Dabir posted:The thing is it doesn't mean much right now, because missiles exist. Bi-weaves are best when your shields go down a lot, prismatic are best if you're sure you can keep them up. If your shields go down, even if your hull is super tanky, missiles will cripple your externals and you're as good as dead. The only places I can see bi-weaves being better are low power ships that don't expect to ever see combat, or stealth builds. Besides, getting hit stops shield regen, so bi-weaves are just class C shields while you're being shot at. We shouldnt forget the price too though. Especially with large ships, it is the tie breaker for most people. Size 8 Bi-weaves are 27 mil, regular A are 162 and prismatics about 244.
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Sep 6, 2016 12:24
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Fights in this game really dont need to be spaced minutes apart if youre in a mid-large ship. Shield cell reloads or faster regen out of combat would go far
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Sep 6, 2016 12:32
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It's not too feasible to get access to prismatics in the first place without a decent pile of money to either build a combat ship or buy printers to ship. E: and besides I thought we were talking about their effectiveness in combat, not how easy it is to get your hands on them. Dabir fucked around with this message at 13:11 on Sep 6, 2016 |
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Sep 6, 2016 13:08
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Dabir posted:It's not too feasible to get access to prismatics in the first place without a decent pile of money to either build a combat ship or buy printers to ship. For pure (single)combat effectiveness is pretty clear that the most expensie toughest shield would be best, and the Bi-weave is practically worthless in comparison. For overall performance though it has its uses, and those start with "being 1/10th the price" and include recharge after being almost depleted imo.
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Sep 6, 2016 13:48
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Schindler's Fist posted:https://eddb.io mang. Do a station search. Put the system you are in into 'Reference System'. Put the module(s) you are looking for into 'Station Sells Modules', and click Find Stations. "Warning: The module presence is not guaranteed." says eddb. That's a great way to build a game. Yeah I know it takes 5 minutes to go to another station, land, go into the hangar, look for the module, see it isn't there and then pick another station and launch, but isn't it IMMERSIVE you can't just ask the wrench jockey working in the outfitting station "Hey do you know where I could find a 4D distributor nearby? Or do you sometimes carry them?". It is fun to try to look up the information you need to play this game because you can see how it has massively changed in the past year and a half. Can you imagine just doing Federation/Imperial missions without having any idea if there's any sort of rank progression (there was no progress bar)?" What a great UI it was to have every module in one giant long list at the outfitter at one point! What was this game like before you could take a module out of your ship and store it somewhere? Oh we don't have that yet. 200 billion star systems with a trillion planets we can land on, but not one has a shed I can put a gun in. If I could build a self storage facility on a barren atmosphere-less planet, I would be a space billionaire!
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Sep 6, 2016 13:58
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CapnBry posted:I'll give it a try. I had been using http://ed-td.space/en/30/Find+Outfitting but it seemed like 75% of the time, the module wouldn't be there when I flew to the station so I just gave up on it. Started using the "Find a high tech system with a largeish population" method and that was pretty hit or miss. They'd have tons of modules but often lacked what I specifically wanted Module storage should come with Guardians. Until then i store my modules on 1 abused anaconda and a few cobras .
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Sep 6, 2016 14:03
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Xeremides posted:26.51%: Transfer should take at least as long as it would take manually. A popular idea in that thread is that it should take one minute per light year. One minute. Per light year.
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Sep 6, 2016 14:21
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Just over 2 weeks to jaques, I don't see the problem!
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Sep 6, 2016 14:28
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Bushiz posted:A popular idea in that thread is that it should take one minute per light year. Someone should jokingly request a light speed restriction. You want to move something into the station on the other side of the system? Sorry that'll take two months. You want to send your ship to Jaque's? Only 20000 years until it arrives! 
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Sep 6, 2016 14:40
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Dabir posted:Besides, getting hit stops shield regen, so bi-weaves are just class C shields while you're being shot at. So given the same amount of incoming damage the bi-weaves last longer, because they are adding back more every second than regular shields do. Granted, if you're taking like 30 damage a second it doesn't mean poo poo because it isn't even going to get you an extra second with a 500 point shield (17.36 vs 17.73s). But if you're taking like 5 damage a second (say 2x 30 damage hits every 12 seconds) there is a significant difference in effective shield strength (131.58s vs 156.25s). Comparing Vulture shields: 5A Shield Generator = 387, 5C Bi-Weave Shields Generator = 315. 2 DPS = 5A lasts 483.8s, bi-weave lasts 1575s 4 DPS = 5A lasts 138.2s, bi-weave 143.2s 5 DPS = 5A lasts 101.8s, bi-weave lasts 98.4s 30 DPS = 5A lasts 13.4s, bi-weave lasts 11.2s So if you can manage to take 4 damage per second or less on this ship, bi-weaves are stronger. If you're getting hammered at 30 DPS continuously you're going to lose shields a full 2.2s (20%) earlier with bi-weave. CapnBry fucked around with this message at 14:57 on Sep 6, 2016 |
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Sep 6, 2016 14:48
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CapnBry posted:I'll give it a try. I had been using http://ed-td.space/en/30/Find+Outfitting but it seemed like 75% of the time, the module wouldn't be there when I flew to the station so I just gave up on it. Started using the "Find a high tech system with a largeish population" method and that was pretty hit or miss. They'd have tons of modules but often lacked what I specifically wanted EDDB usually has a timestamp for the data, I find that anything within the last 24 hours is extremely accurate, while outside of that gets progressively worse. Pro-tip: when looking for mats, you can use eddb's "Bodies" tab to search planets by material composition. For instance, this planet has three of the mats needed for 100% boosts! quote:It is fun to try to look up the information you need to play this game because you can see how it has massively changed in the past year and a half. Can you imagine just doing Federation/Imperial missions without having any idea if there's any sort of rank progression (there was no progress bar)?" What a great UI it was to have every module in one giant long list at the outfitter at one point! What was this game like before you could take a module out of your ship and store it somewhere? Oh we don't have that yet. 200 billion star systems with a trillion planets we can land on, but not one has a shed I can put a gun in. If I could build a self storage facility on a barren atmosphere-less planet, I would be a space billionaire! Honestly, I wish I had done the rank grind back when there was no bar. In those days, donations missions cost <2000cr each and you could max rank for something absurd like 10 or 20 million in donation missions. I got the rank to unlock the Earth permits in less than an hour of station hopping.
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Sep 6, 2016 15:02
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CapnBry posted:I don't think that's true at all (EDIT: Unless you're talking about broken shield?). Shields that are up do regenerate while being shot, shields regenerate continuously. A regular shield regenerates at 1.2/sec versus a bi-weave regenerates at 1.8/sec. The in-game manual claims that shields stop regenerating briefly while being shot.
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Sep 6, 2016 15:04
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I do believe there is a brief pause in shield regeneration (you can notice pretty clearly with the SRV) while you're taking hits, but even so I think the point stands for PVE. With the gaps between being shot at or from boosting between one fight and the next I think you're going to lose and recharge more total shield strength over the course of a moderate stint in a RES or CZ. In other words you're more resilient against being whittled down over time. Depending on the ship, if you can also swing an SCB and heat sinks that gives you your extra reserve for emergencies without sacrificing base regen rate. In fact I'd say bi-weaves are ideal in that situation expressly for the fact that they maximize shield recovery in the periods between taking fire. Engineer mods let you get a pretty tremendous shield boost with just 1 or 2 boosters anyway. After a certain point, additional total shield capacity isn't that helpful in PVE imo.
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Sep 6, 2016 15:30
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Lindsay Lohan posted:look at this bs! kilometers away from the station and i get a delivery mission update asking me to deliver the goods in 0h and 0m. thanks for nothing? I've gotten that multiple times, mostly as soon as I jump into the destination system. At first I thought I was doing something wrong, like, "Should I really be able to make it to this station and dock, and turn in this mission in less than a minute??" Turns out it's just a bug. Still happens to me about half the time though.
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Sep 6, 2016 15:50
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Hey guys, I'm looking to hook up with goons. I have a couple friends who play elite intermittently, but one barely plays, and he's headed towards exploration. The other LIVES exploration. Load the bong, and stamp his butt all over the cosmos. Doesn't leave much for cooperative play I really can't tell by the PGS thread if I'd be a fit. Right now I'm doing the federation rep grind, in the bubble, in an asp scout (I hate this loving thing), mostly hanging around the space police and picking up bounties. I just got my first rank (recruit), though i have quite a bit more faction with the feds. I'm not interested in pvp yet, mostly just looking to chill with goons whilewe blow up space NPCs. I'd love to have a group to run hazardous res sites. Is there a goon group that fits me here? I mostly want sol access for now. Beyond that, my goals are open. My piloit is Kisra Keris in-game and i'm sort of playing right now. If anyone wants to hit me up. Otherwise I'll check here now and then. I'm just not sure the PGS groups are for me, but maybe they are! I don't know. I'd really rather not have to use much mor than a voice service maybe, as my bandwidth is fairly limited for now.
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Sep 6, 2016 15:56
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Oh yeah I totally forgot you also have to turn it in, so it's really one minute to: Fly about 9km, land, load station services, load the mission board, load the NPC to turn in. The latter two easily take up half a minute on their own, for me.Yolomon Wayne posted:Module storage should come with Guardians. I'd actually like to store some mats too. I've been getting a lot of crap in Wu Guinagi but had to vendor most of it far below the average price in order to continue doing mission with cargo rewards/cargo shipping missions with my crappy ships. I don't even want to look up if they're used for anything good (engineers?) or if they're worth a drat in other places because that would probably be frustrating as hell.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:02
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Wait...materials? Materials don't take up space...or do they? 
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Sep 6, 2016 16:23
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AnimalChin posted:I'm a stupid dumby and can't wrap my head around ship outfitting. I spent ~3 hours yesterday trying to get my Cobra MkIII to be able to jump between Wu Guinagi and HIP 10716 and when I finally got it to work in one jump I could only carry 3t in cargo which makes it pretty pointless. Find yourself a high population high tech system before attempting to upgrade your boat. Not all ship upgrades are available everywhere and you're probably running into that as an issue. Most systems you can map with the intermediate scanner, except for those with really far companions, but at this point if you're looking for the extra cash, just go with the cheaper option for now.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:24
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Do I just have the wrong spaceboat? I just wanted to try and grind out some early game money instead of bounty hunting because I always get 1/2 shotted when I try bounty hunting. I have ~500k credits at the moment.
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hemophilia posted:I'm just not sure the PGS groups are for me, but maybe they are! I don't know. I'd say that you can't lose anything by giving it a go. It seems laid back enough, and it gives enough direction and distraction to break up whatever grind you're doing. I don't contribute much, but even just having the Discord around makes it 'better', IMO.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:27
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Morter posted:Wait...materials? Materials don't take up space...or do they? I meant cargo rewards 
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Sep 6, 2016 16:27
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orcane posted:I meant cargo rewards Pretty sure that's never gonna happen, even if cargo storage is added (and they've said they won't add it) I'm pretty much convinced the reason that engineer commodities are commodities rather than mats is specifically because it makes it a pain in the rear end to hold onto them for long periods of time, preventing you from stockpiling them over long periods of time like you can with mats
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Sep 6, 2016 16:42
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Main Paineframe posted:Pretty sure that's never gonna happen, even if cargo storage is added (and they've said they won't add it) I dont have the newsletters here, but i think they said you will be able to store engineer-related commodities with the corresponding engineers.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:54
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Hav posted:I'd say that you can't lose anything by giving it a go. It seems laid back enough, and it gives enough direction and distraction to break up whatever grind you're doing. My main thing is, are there any groups that would respond to "hey, i'm in the X system of fed space, i'm running a res site, who wants to join in? I do a fair amont of pvp, and maybe one day when i have the cash to afford getting my rear end handed to me I'll invest in pvp ship or two, but for now i just like shooting AI and harvesting bounties.
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Sep 6, 2016 16:56
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hemophilia posted:My main thing is, are there any groups that would respond to "hey, i'm in the X system of fed space, i'm running a res site, who wants to join in? That's absolutely the PGS group. Jump on Discord and bitch about the engineer grind with the rest of us.
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Sep 6, 2016 17:06
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Au Revoir Shosanna posted:That's absolutely the PGS group. Jump on Discord and bitch about the engineer grind with the rest of us. ^ This
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Sep 6, 2016 17:11
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Bushiz posted:A popular idea in that thread is that it should take one minute per light year. That's far slower than I can actually fly it, and I assume I'm still expected to pay for the privilege?!?
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Sep 6, 2016 17:38
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Bushiz posted:A popular idea in that thread is that it should take one minute per light year. They also want a RNG your ship was damaged/destroyed in transit.
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Sep 6, 2016 17:40
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The fact that you can fly from one end of human space to the other in 15 minutes is lost on lots of players.
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Sep 6, 2016 17:40
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tooterfish posted:The fact that you can fly from one end of human space to the other in 15 minutes is lost on lots of players. But it needs to take into account the ship's jump range, FSD charge time and if it needs to stop to refuel!
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Sep 6, 2016 17:58
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tooterfish posted:The fact that you can fly from one end of human space to the other in 15 minutes is lost on lots of players. Where can I get that jump drive?
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Sep 6, 2016 18:06
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Morter posted:Where can I get that jump drive? Modded AspE can get 50+ LY per jump.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:08
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Boogalo posted:But it needs to take into account the ship's jump range, FSD charge time and if it needs to stop to refuel! So in conclusion: the delay for ship transfer should be no more than half an hour, since anyone who isn't brain dead can travel the entirety of human space in that time in practically any ship. Half an hour is a poo poo cooldown, it's long enough to be inconvenient but too short for you to do anything useful while waiting. Therefore, transfers, should be instant.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:18
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In general, if you have 2 medium & 1 large hardpoint, is it better to have 2M lasers & 1L kinetic? Or 2M Kinetic and 1L laser?
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Sep 6, 2016 18:43
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Lasers don't get a damage penalty to bigger shields, kinetics do get a damage penalty to bigger hulls (or maybe just internals?). Either way, you want to maximize kinetic damage on hulls.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:46
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:They also want a RNG your ship was damaged/destroyed in transit.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:52
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tooterfish posted:I did! You could do it in half an hour even in an FDL. That's a ship renowned for two things, its capacity for luxurious murder, and its ability to make people openly weep if they need to travel more than 40 light years. Why even have a delay? Delays aren't fun, it doesn't add anything to the game. If they want some sort of penalty so people aren't using it all the time, have there be a sliding cost scale the farther you want to move a ship to account for the extra special quantum gas it takes to move it Instantly. Actually what they should do is make it an option. Have a delay in there for the people that want THEIR IMMERSION, or you can pay more space bucks for the privilege of instant transfer because it costs teleportation juice but space rich people who actually have a reason to be moving multiple ships around at will won't care about the extra costs anyway. Boom, everyone is happy.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:55
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Why are these people not irate that your modded ship gear isn't lost forever when your ship is destroyed? I mean your insurance company can't duplicate one of a kind mods, it should obviously just give the ship back with the base part unmodded. It's damaging to my immersion! There are poo poo tons of ease of life things that are here.
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Sep 6, 2016 18:58
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Truga posted:Lasers don't get a damage penalty to bigger shields, kinetics do get a damage penalty to bigger hulls (or maybe just internals?). So I'm guessing you mean 2 medium kinetics?
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Sep 6, 2016 18:59
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