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You best not get in her way. She'll throw you into a wall if you don't mind your step. She's like real loving good at it.
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Dec 9, 2017 23:54
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Slow burn? lol dumb it down some, this poo poo is modern soap operas. People become interested in what happens to the characters. I feel connected so I'd watch an episode about the punisher prepping to take a poo poo at this point. Some people don't get attached. If you don't get attached, this poo poo has to be boring as hell.
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Dec 10, 2017 00:50
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cosmicjim posted:Slow burn? lol dumb it down some, this poo poo is modern soap operas. People become interested in what happens to the characters. I feel connected so I'd watch an episode about the punisher prepping to take a poo poo at this point. Some people don't get attached. If you don't get attached, this poo poo has to be boring as hell. I think this is probably why Iron Fist is so bad.
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Dec 10, 2017 02:57
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Also TV has fundamentally changed now that they are writing it to be all released at once. They don’t have to obey the writing conventions of the last 50 years because people aren’t sitting down for 20-30 minutes at a time, they are sitting down for 2-4 hours at a time. Your show can burn as slow as you want because everyone is gonna take it at their own pace now. Also people who were bored by the Punisher... smdh I don’t think a word could be less relevant to this show, especially compared to the other MCU shows
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Dec 10, 2017 03:14
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That JJ2 trailer was surprisingly lackluster. I'm still stoked, though.
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Dec 10, 2017 03:21
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Slow burn is supposed to mean you focus less on action but it should still be interesting. Like if you could make being a lawyer or climbing a ladder with binoculars interesting, that'd be a good slow burn. Even better if the interesting part also leads into action, like if you have a good scene of sharpening knives or making battle plans. As such, I believe daredevil and Jessica Jones have lots of good slow burns, but on rare occasion it gets boring. The other shows are all over the place, they have good parts but it's hard to call them good overall. I haven't seen punisher yet but I hope it's good.
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Dec 10, 2017 08:29
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BrianWilly posted:I certainly want a great amount of titillating, gratuitous, gratifying violence in my Punisher shows, but I like the fact that this Netflix Punisher is at least sort of circumspect and restrained about what exactly he does. It's really nice that this version of the character falls more-or-less perfectly in-line with my personal idealized version of the character, as summarized way back when in this thread. Thanks for nailing this down awhile back. Unlike the all heroes with their secret identities, Frank Castle's life has pretty much been declassified and laid bare in the comics. Everybody knows who he is, and why he does the things that he does. The thing is, in the comics the police and generally other heroes think he's a psychopath but the trick is the audience knows he's not a psychopath at all. He absolutely does not harm civilians, he plans all these brutal killings as if it were an operation, and he's a man who had his life and family taken away after giving everything out there. There's a reason why Revenge motivators can make great action characters and movies. That's why we have poo poo like John Wick, Man On Fire, Conan the Barbarian, because there's the part in our brain that craves the whole "You lost everything, now make sure they lose everything". People don't realize that the reason why Punisher MAX and punisher comics is good (and some bad, all depends on the writer) is because you already know who he is, and he has been killing criminals for years now. No origin story, it's just a continuation. Bad guy, mob boss, bad operation, new drugs in the streets, innocents dying, police cannot solve this issue or look the other way, life is miserable, put a stop to it. Heroes do the same thing too, but without killing. That's why they are called heroes, and Punisher is considered a Vigilante, even though EVERYTHING they do is vigilantism. Fargin Icehole fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Dec 10, 2017 |
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Dec 10, 2017 16:08
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Hap & Leonard is the very definition of a "slow burn", and at no point is it ever boring.
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Dec 10, 2017 16:45
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Or the Expanse season 1. Finished Iron Fist and really enjoyed it, and then watched all of the Defenders. The Iron Fist is a god drat moron, but I really enjoyed this show. Mostly because I liked the Hand, and how a show finally got the mysterious Illuminati controlling the world done right. I was completely enthralled in the idea of Kun Lun and having a living weapon guard them. I enjoyed the dysfunctional family, and pretty much every character. The sound track, and shots/colors were amazing. Whoever they had doing the color work for the set design made me have eyegasms. The sound track guy channeled his inner Vangelis pretty good. Defenders was a good build up, but I feel they fumbled the ending entirely like they did with Luke Cage. No one wants to watch 10 minutes of fighting the B team in the dark just after watching 5 minutes of a kickass fight against the A team. Out of all the shows I'd probably rank them: Jessica Jones / Punisher Daredevil S2 Iron Fist Daredevil S1 Defenders Luke Cage Philthy fucked around with this message at 07:07 on Dec 11, 2017 |
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Dec 11, 2017 07:02
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The Meachums plot saved Iron Fist for me. Ward was a really good character.
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Dec 11, 2017 07:49
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sticklefifer posted:The Meachums plot saved Iron Fist for me. Ward was a really good character. Yeah, the way his world kept unraveling was excellent. First Danny came back from the dead. Then Danny exposed the layer of corruption under Rand Enterprises. Then he had a drug overdose. Then he killed his dad. Then his dad came back from the dead. Then he got framed by his dad, arrested and sent to a psychiatric hospital.  It's like the writers always asked themselves "OK, how do we gently caress with Ward in this episode?" and the result was great.
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Dec 11, 2017 08:03
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It's unfair of me to imply that Punisher season 1 is all-out boring, but I still think the season is too long and slow. I am going through DD2 and frankly the campiness of the plot is more my style, and as I mentioned before it's a show that still believes in episodic television and establishing a solid rhythm instead of hours of repetitious brooding followed up by a crescendo. Also, thanks to doing both Punisher 1 and DD2, I get to laugh at Frank's full backstory of the 17 different corrupt government agencies, gangs, and mercenary hitsquads responsible for killing his family. Somehow even the New York district attorney was in on it. Maybe by the end of season 2 he figures out Thanos had a guy there. Poo on the people who thought most of DD2 was bad, though.
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Dec 11, 2017 11:58
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dont even fink about it posted:Poo on the people who thought most of DD2 was bad, though. You've gotta remember that everyone judges things harder than you might. Personally I think Elektra constantly getting near fatally wounded was a negative and so was Matt needing to be told to listen for the ninja's breathing once he couldn't track their weapons anymore. You'd think he'd be better at improvising a way to see on the fly than that.
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Dec 11, 2017 14:44
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I’m still annoyed by all the breathing stuff in Daredevil. I thought he was supposed to have sonar? If he needs things to make noise to “see” them why doesn’t he constantly run into walls? Well anyway Punisher was good and is definitely in the top tier of Marvel Netflix things. It perhaps tries a bit too hard to have its cake and eat it- War is hell but let’s have lots of thrilling action set pieces where Frank slaughters the bad men in graphic detail. It follows the trend of American war movies lamenting the toll doing terrible things takes on their troops, while glossing over their civilian victims. And as a non-American the gun stuff was pretty jarring. Weird to hear someone like Karen Page who we are supposed to see as reasonable and rational spouting crazy pro-gun propaganda, saying that having guns for self defence is justified, positions that only fringe far-right parties advocate in my country. But overall I enjoyed it a lot. Best paced of any of these shows, and good to see the CIA and mercenaries and the US government appropriately treated as villains. And Bernthals performance was great. My tactical realism nitpick is that Micro’s family or some random civilian didn’t recognise Frank despite him being all over the media a few months back in the trial of the century.
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Dec 11, 2017 16:17
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marktheando posted:And as a non-American the gun stuff was pretty jarring. Weird to hear someone like Karen Page who we are supposed to see as reasonable and rational spouting crazy pro-gun propaganda, saying that having guns for self defence is justified, positions that only fringe far-right parties advocate in my country. If you watched DD you'll know she has every reason to think that way.
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Dec 11, 2017 18:09
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BiggerBoat posted:If you watched DD you'll know she has every reason to think that way. I did and I guess it’s understandable that she thinks that after her experience with Wesley and whatever the mysterious thing in her past was. Still feels weird, especially when the show pretty much takes her side on the issue. The only person who argues against her is a strawman politician. Like it’s understandable for Frank to be into guns because he’s a god damned psychopath, Karen is like a normal person. Probably hard for Americans to understand where I’m coming from, seeing all the guns in Walmart and sporting goods shops and on cops belts were definitely my biggest moments of culture shock visiting America. That and the churches and flags absolutely everywhere made the place feel quite alien at times. Where I come from, the most popular opinion on guns is that we should have even stricter gun control and harsher penalties for possession. So it’s strange to see something as mainstream as a Disney Marvel Netflix show argue the opposite.
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Dec 11, 2017 18:37
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The problem is, you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. There are literally as many guns as there are people in America, you're never going to get rid of them and have UK style gun control. So under that mentality, I can understand why some people think it's better to be armed. I personally don't agree with them, but I definitely get where they're coming from. And hell, if I lived in Marvel's universe where aliens can come out of the sky and gently caress my poo poo up, I probably would want to carry a gun too.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:02
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WampaLord posted:There are literally as many guns as there are people in America, you're never going to get rid of them and have UK style gun control. Why not? Obviously there are more weapons in play here than there were in Australia, but their turn-in programs seemed to work well at removing them from circulation.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:09
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JawKnee posted:Why not? Obviously there are more weapons in play here than there were in Australia, but their turn-in programs seemed to work well at removing them from circulation. I mean, I could go on and on about the cultural difference and how "government coming to take your guns" plays right into the fears of a subset of right wingers, but the real answer is that there's no political will behind such a goal. We literally had an elementary school mass shooting and nothing happened. The populace here is fine with gun deaths, or at least fine enough to not want to make waves.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:11
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marktheando posted:I did and I guess it’s understandable that she thinks that after her experience with Wesley and whatever the mysterious thing in her past was. Still feels weird, especially when the show pretty much takes her side on the issue. The only person who argues against her is a strawman politician. You're also forgetting the cop who tried to strangle her to death in like the first episode and the hitman with the knife who showed up in her house, and the thugs hanging around Mrs. Cardenas' apartment. It's not like she's been living a happy life of sunshine and zero conflicts for the entire show or something. When she's first getting introduced, she's covered in blood in front of a freshly dead man.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:17
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Yeah, even just going off her time on the show and ignoring whatever shifty past they've hinted at, Karen being pro gun for self defense makes way more sense than if she were against them.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:21
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esperterra posted:Yeah, even just going off her time on the show and ignoring whatever shifty past they've hinted at, Karen being pro gun for self defense makes way more sense than if she were against them. She may have committed some light homicide.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:26
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They seem to flipflop on her past some like I mentioned a page or so back, it's weird and I wish they would pin it down. She killed someone in a car accident ?? or something which seemed to be the shifty past hinted at, but in season one she implies after shooting Wesley that he isn't the first person she's killed with a bullet so idk
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Dec 11, 2017 19:29
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Yeah, who knows. They're treating her backstory just like the Hand's motivation. If we're lucky, she was just bluffing in the moment so Wesley wouldn't try something.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:31
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On the subject of projectile weapons, I laughed a lot when the ninjas used a bow and arrow against Daredevil rather than a gun. I couldn’t stop thinking about how ridiculous it was. Funny how little things like that can break your suspension of disbelief when super powers and aliens are totally fine.
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Dec 11, 2017 19:58
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RareAcumen posted:You've gotta remember that everyone judges things harder than you might. Personally I think Elektra constantly getting near fatally wounded was a negative and so was Matt needing to be told to listen for the ninja's breathing once he couldn't track their weapons anymore. You'd think he'd be better at improvising a way to see on the fly than that. I liked how Matt, who tracks everything by sound, needs to be told that he can follow the sound of breathing to find people.
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Dec 11, 2017 20:18
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HIJK posted:I liked how Matt, who tracks everything by sound, needs to be told that he can follow the sound of breathing to find people. To be fair, it's literally the blind leading the blind 
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Dec 11, 2017 20:21
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marktheando posted:Probably hard for Americans to understand where I’m coming from... Not at all I understand perfectly. i was just pointing out that it's in character for Karen when you seemed to find it strange. WampaLord posted:We literally had an elementary school mass shooting and nothing happened. That's not true at all. A sickeningly large percentage of our country called it a false flag. Also they postponed the release of Punisher after Vegas which was an incredibly drastic measure that upset several thousand people. BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 21:22 on Dec 11, 2017 |
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Dec 11, 2017 21:18
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WampaLord posted:I mean, I could go on and on about the cultural difference and how "government coming to take your guns" plays right into the fears of a subset of right wingers, but the real answer is that there's no political will behind such a goal. okay, I had thought you were implying this was a practical problem due to the large number of guns that would need to be removed
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Dec 11, 2017 22:31
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marktheando posted:On the subject of projectile weapons, I laughed a lot when the ninjas used a bow and arrow against Daredevil rather than a gun. I couldn’t stop thinking about how ridiculous it was. I mean, it is pretty quiet. I kinda got the impression that they're trying to not draw attention to their hideout, even if they can disappear at a moment's notice. HIJK posted:I liked how Matt, who tracks everything by sound, needs to be told that he can follow the sound of breathing to find people. Yeah, that one threw me off real bad. That was my minigun complaint, since I missed that whole build-up with Frank. I just felt like it should've been a lot more ninjas than were on screen. That's probably why Punisher was so good. You only need to have people who can act and appear to shoot guns well instead of finding dozens of people who're great at martial arts.
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Dec 12, 2017 03:29
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Stick taught him that breathing was a fingerprint, not that you can find people by listening for breathing.....
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Dec 12, 2017 04:42
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Ah...just to be clear, y'all have it backwards. Matt couldn't hear their breathing. He could hear their weapons.
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Dec 12, 2017 04:56
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BrianWilly posted:Ah...just to be clear, y'all have it backwards. Matt couldn't hear their breathing. He could hear their weapons. I also thought it was that he couldn't hear hearts but could hear breaths. Perhaps I'm misremembering. In either case, "ooooh, you mean I need to not listen to the thing but listen to the thing?" was a really odd plot point for a character whose superpower is listening to things.
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Dec 12, 2017 05:16
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BrianWilly posted:Ah...just to be clear, y'all have it backwards. Matt couldn't hear their breathing. He could hear their weapons. It's been a while since I've seen it but it just struck me as stupid as even ordinary people can still hear others breathing which means Matt should hear it as well since his senses are supposed to be SUPER CHAAAARGED. It's also strange to have the undead breathing when they don't have heartbeats to circulate oxygen with. So my primary complaints are 1) Breathing is pretty obvious and should be obvious to Matt since it's a sound and his world primarily consists of sound 2) Undead zombies with no heartbeats should not need to breathe and it's a dumb inconsistency that was obviously fabricated on the spot to give Stick a Teachable Moment to Matt 3) Too many people try to handwave these complaints by going "iT's JuSt LiKe ThE cOmICs" or "wHo CaReS cOmIcS aRe AlWaYs DuMb" which totally misses the point: that it's dumb stupid inconsistent storytelling and it was created by people who should know better.
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Dec 12, 2017 05:58
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marktheando posted:If he needs things to make noise to “see” them why doesn’t he constantly run into walls?
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Dec 12, 2017 09:37
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Yeah, there's people that can sense objects without making clicking noises at them, and can "see" them even better by clicking at them.
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Dec 12, 2017 13:48
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HIJK posted:It's been a while since I've seen it but it just struck me as stupid as even ordinary people can still hear others breathing which means Matt should hear it as well since his senses are supposed to be SUPER CHAAAARGED. It's also strange to have the undead breathing when they don't have heartbeats to circulate oxygen with. I think the progression was [normal people] movement [ninjas] heartbeat [zombie ninjas] weapons [zombie ninjas] breathing??? But I wouldn't be shocked if I forgot a step or something along the line.
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Dec 12, 2017 14:11
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Breathing and heartbeat are evolutionary involuntary actions. Being a zombie doesn’t mean your body will stop doing something just because it doesn’t need that function. Nerds overthinking it, But NOT OVERTHINKING IT ENOUGH.
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Dec 12, 2017 14:18
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RareAcumen posted:I think the progression was [normal people] movement [ninjas] heartbeat [zombie ninjas] weapons [zombie ninjas] breathing??? The truth is we're putting more thought into it than the scriptwriters ever did. cosmicjim posted:Breathing and heartbeat are evolutionary involuntary actions. Being a zombie doesn’t mean your body will stop doing something just because it doesn’t need that function. Nerds overthinking it, But NOT OVERTHINKING IT ENOUGH. ahoist by my own petard 
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Dec 12, 2017 14:25
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sticklefifer posted:There are actual blind people who can figure out where things are via echolocation of other sounds. DD has that sense amplified a whole bunch, so things like footsteps or ambient sound are a replacement for sight. It's not that weird. It also contradicts what we have been told on the show about how Matt’s power works- his “world on fire” speech about how he sees the world and Foggy’s comment that he always knows when a woman is hot.
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Dec 12, 2017 14:40
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