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Someone show this to Skipper so he can bust it out the next time he faces Yoshi-hashi so he can hit him with 3 different Rainmaker variations
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Jan 12, 2019 17:56
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"Scotty Riggs' eye still showing the aftereffects." I busted a loving gut. It's like if you lost half your arm and then Tenay said "still showing the aftereffects of the arm injury/" So when does Raven actually do something in WCW? The Retro Nitros have talked about him and talked about him and talked about him and he hasn't wrestled yet. I remember he had great matches with DDP after which Page went to main event status and Raven...I can't even remember. Also https://youtu.be/jq99-gRMFuM?t=272 This fucker could have seriously hurt Raven just like the guy who beaned Randy Anderson with a golfball.
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Jan 27, 2019 23:07
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NikkolasKing posted:"Scotty Riggs' eye still showing the aftereffects." Raven starts actually wrestling after the Riggs matches, and he will end up winning the US title in Spring Stampede 1998 and lose it Goldberg immediately afterwards after that I think there's some teaming with Saturn for a bit, and then starts the build to Raven/Saturn for the freedom of the Flock at Fall Brawl 1998 then there's some more teaming with Saturn, the horrible "Raven is a whiny rich guy" angle, and then he leaves in August 1999 after briefly tagging with Vampiro for a few weeks at best the DDP ME push basically happens on the tails of the rich guy angle too
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Jan 27, 2019 23:46
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I remember reading there was some strange commentary rules for the announcers especially in regards to foreign objects in wcw. What was the weird wording they used? Or am I crazy.
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Jan 28, 2019 04:16
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International Objects
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Jan 28, 2019 04:20
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Lol thank you
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Jan 28, 2019 05:55
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Suplex Liberace posted:I remember reading there was some strange commentary rules for the announcers especially in regards to foreign objects in wcw. What was the weird wording they used? Or am I crazy. there was a directive to not use the word "foreign" and use "international" in place on turner networks for a time
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Jan 28, 2019 06:06
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I just heard Dusty Rhodes say "Now maybe Riggs can turn it around, if you're a Riggs fan". A thing that totally existed, Scotty Riggs fans. That said, this Scotty Riggs vs Buff Bagwell strap match isn't as bad as I was expecting! Bagwell mugging for the camera mid match was actually amusing. He has a superbly punchable face.
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Jan 28, 2019 07:44
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Bagwell was a very solid worker with tons of charisma. He just eventually hit a point where he knew he wasn't going anywhere higher than he was after WCW screwed with pushing him for what felt like the 80th time so he stopped giving a poo poo.
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Jan 28, 2019 09:09
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Yeah I've been rather surprised by how decent his '96-'97 stuff has been so far. He's one of those guys who never in a million years should be anywhere near the main event, but can put on a solid entertaining midcard match. Most of my memories of him were things like the Judy Bagwell on a Pole match or other unbearable crap so it's been neat watching him as a pretty decent midcard heel! Watching all these mid to late 90s Nitros and PPVs has been a real treat. Growing up we watched WWF almost exclusively, so while I know the big moments and plot points a lot of the little stuff got lost to history. Dusty laughing at Public Enemy vs Harlem Heat at Uncensored was hilarious.
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Jan 28, 2019 09:22
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It's funny you say that, because in almost any other company Bagwell would have been a megastar. Why that is I'm going to put in spoilers, but you'll understand when you get there if you keep watching (or you might know already). If you don't mind being spoiled on an unbelievable screw-up involving Bagwell and WCW, feel free to read. In April 1998, due to a freak in-ring accident Rick Steiner broke Bagwell's neck. It was possible he'd never walk again, let alone wrestle. Not only did Bagwell recover from this injury, he did so in like 3 months. He returned to an enormous ovation in July, and the angle was set up, Bagwell cut a great babyface promo, and asked Rick to come out, as he knew Rick felt guilty about this whole thing, and he wanted to forgive him face to face. It was a swerve, Bagwell immediately turned heel, and thus WCW managed to ruin what should have been a slam-dunk newly minted young top babyface by taking maybe the greatest comeback story in wrestling history and using it to get one over on the fans.
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Jan 28, 2019 09:43
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Ehhhhhh that feels pretty optimistic to me. He’s better than being the butt of all the jokes about him, but I can’t imagine him being a main event babyface in the WWF or ECW of that era. Maybe they could have got a run out of the sympathy, but I don’t think he’s talented enough to turn it into anything lasting. That said, I enjoyed a few of his matches and I certainly didn’t expect that.
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Jan 28, 2019 10:00
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I'd agree if it was anybody but Buff.
LividLiquid fucked around with this message at 10:08 on Jan 28, 2019 |
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Jan 28, 2019 10:04
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Maybe a main event push for a time after his (hypothetical non-ruined) comeback and then an upper midcard guy after that? That was something I asked about before. WCW failing to make new main event stars is one of its most often cited flaws. But what would your main event roster look like? I know Benoit, Eddie, Jericho and maybe one or two others are the names people jump to immediately and that makes sense given how great they were and their success after WCW. Any others besides the usual suspects? Bagwell is a possibility apparently but not a unanimous one. Raven and Konnan have stated they could have been respectable world champions in WCW if they hadn't been held back.
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Jan 28, 2019 11:11
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La Parka should have been WCW World Champion.
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Jan 28, 2019 11:17
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He should have.
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Jan 28, 2019 11:18
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NikkolasKing posted:Maybe a main event push for a time after his (hypothetical non-ruined) comeback and then an upper midcard guy after that? Konnan, Rey, Vampiro, Kidman, Raven would be on the list as chronic waste of talent From the period where they were trying to desperately make new main event stars but ran out of runway, you've got Storm, Awesome, Wall, some of the Natural Born Thrillers and when the writing was really on the wall, there were Christopher Daniels and AJ Styles
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Jan 28, 2019 13:08
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rare Magic card l00k posted:Bagwell was a very solid worker with tons of charisma. if Buff hit his peak 10 years earlier, he would have been a license to print money both as a heel or a face.
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Jan 28, 2019 16:47
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I don't really care for Bagwell, but in retrospect he made teenage me genuinely mad; i.e. he was very good at his job. As opposed to JJ who just made me want to change the channel to something, anything else.
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Jan 28, 2019 16:53
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exploded mummy posted:Konnan, Rey, Vampiro, Kidman, Raven would be on the list as chronic waste of talent I thought about mentioning Rey in the same breath as Eddie and the others as "one of those guys who became massive stars after WCW" but I just dunno if WCW, even in a hypothetical Better World, would have ever pushed him as a main eventer. Bischoff and those in charge didn't fetishize Big Strong Men quite as much as Vince but do you think anyone in WCW would be willing to put the World Title on Rey at any point? God knows he was always great and super over but that is, bewilderingly, not very important to some bookers.
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Jan 28, 2019 18:27
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NikkolasKing posted:Bischoff and those in charge didn't fetishize Big Strong Men quite as much as Vince 
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Jan 28, 2019 18:33
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There is no way Bischoff would have put the title on Rey. By the time WCW needed to create new stars, Rey was unmasked, and maskless Rey is impossible to take seriously.
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Jan 28, 2019 18:47
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rare Magic card l00k posted:There is no way Bischoff would have put the title on Rey. By the time WCW needed to create new stars, Rey was unmasked, and maskless Rey is impossible to take seriously. WCW needed to make new stars well before Rey was unmasked but he was still never going to do it. WCW may not have been as size crazy as Vince but they were still big into size. Just look at the Natural Born Thrillers, they were pushed because they were big and muscular. They were all green as hell but Bischoff thought O'Haire could be the next big thing because he had the look.
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Jan 28, 2019 18:59
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WCW main event scene was insane to book with the people they had already.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:00
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Styles and Daniels were more or less nobodies when they were in WCW and on top of that Daniels drat near killed himself in the ring. If you look at the roster around September/October of 1999 (just to be pre-concussion Bret) you could make a case for trying to turn the following into a new main event scene: Benoit, Goldberg, DDP, Sting, Booker T, Bret Hart, Scott Steiner. Possibly Kidman, Sean O'Haire and Chuck Palumbo. Mike Awesome would arrive in 2000 and could fit in as well. You'd need to rein in Hogan and Nash a lot though. Flair would also be fine still.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:06
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MassRafTer posted:WCW needed to make new stars well before Rey was unmasked but he was still never going to do it. Looking it up, I forgot the unmasking was in 1999, I thought it was 1998.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:10
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By the time the big egos had stepped aside or left and you could put the title on who you wanted, it was already too late and the company was hosed. I was laughing reading a 1998 Observer where they originally planned to have an eight-person "Night of Champions" bracket-style tournament with all the top guys during Fall Brawl instead of War Games. Then they realized they would require convincing 7 guys to job, knew that would be absolutely impossible, and gave up.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:15
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Why wasn't Ed Leslie the one to shave off Hogan's mustache in WCW? How do you gently caress that up?
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Jan 28, 2019 19:22
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MrBling posted:Styles and Daniels were more or less nobodies when they were in WCW and on top of that Daniels drat near killed himself in the ring. I didn't think it was fair to say Daniels and Styles should have been turned into main eventers, they just were barely in the company for a few months before it folded. On the other hand, they are legitimately 2 of the bigger stars of the 2000s and 2010s and I cant ignore that if you want to list people who WCW missed. 2hich is why they are a separate item. Your timeline is off, Palumbo didnt even wrestle until December 99 (and even then it was a few matches on Saturday Night) and really started in May 2000 (after Awesome) and O'Haire didnt make his debut until June 2000. also we basically came up with the same list short of listing a bunch of dudes who WCW didn't miss on and were disqualified by the question rare Magic card l00k posted:Looking it up, I forgot the unmasking was in 1999, I thought it was 1998. WCW really needed new blood starting in 1998, it was even more apparent in 1999, and it was too late in mid 2000 when over the span of 3 months, their entire ME scene is cut down to the bare bones OJ MIST 2 THE DICK fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Jan 28, 2019 |
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Jan 28, 2019 19:45
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exploded mummy posted:WCW really needed new blood starting in 1998, it was even more apparent in 1999, and it was too late in mid 2000 when over the span of 3 months, their entire ME scene is cut down to the bare bones WCW had new blood in 1998. His name was Goldberg, and to a lesser extent DDP. Then in 1999 they killed DDP and would spend 1999 and 2000 trying to kill Goldberg, only to fail to because Goldberg was that good.
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Jan 28, 2019 19:51
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rare Magic card l00k posted:WCW had new blood in 1998. His name was Goldberg, and to a lesser extent DDP. the problem is that as good as Goldberg is, they needed to wipe everyone in their ME scene from the past 3 years and put an entirely new slate in
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Jan 28, 2019 19:55
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It feels weird that I suggested maybe Buff Bagwell didn’t suck as much as he’s commonly remembered to, and that spun off into rebooking the entire main event scene of late stage WCW. 
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Jan 28, 2019 20:13
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Bischoff offered Jericho more money to stay and not be pushed. I think that's a good summary of WCW.
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Jan 28, 2019 20:49
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Jericho was also one of the smarter folk to turn down joining the nWo repeatedly, he knew that was just the way Hogan and Nash shut you down when you started getting momentum.
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Jan 28, 2019 21:38
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UltimoDragonQuest posted:Bischoff offered Jericho more money to stay and not be pushed. I think that's a good summary of WCW. Worked for Lanny Poffo
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Jan 28, 2019 21:58
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One of my biggest “what ifs” in wrestling is wondering what could have happened if Jericho had bought WCW. He claims he had a coalition of people with money interested, but when Turner yanked the TV contract everyone backed out cause WCW with no TV was worthless. I doubt they ever could have reached the heights they enjoyed in the 90s, but with a guy like Jericho at the helm it’s interesting. I could imagine a world where WCW squeezed out ROH and became the premier “not WWE” option of that era. A new WCW with some of the talent ROH had through the 2000s/early 2010s would pretty much be most of the WWE main event and midcard scene.
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Jan 28, 2019 22:24
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BGrifter posted:One of my biggest “what ifs” in wrestling is wondering what could have happened if Jericho had bought WCW. He claims he had a coalition of people with money interested, but when Turner yanked the TV contract everyone backed out cause WCW with no TV was worthless. Unless Jericho has completely changed his story is all he has said about the subject is at the sale price he wishes he'd bought it. You might be confusing this with Jerry Jarrett who claims he had investors and everything lined up. No one was going to be able to absorb the kind of losses WCW was taking on in 2001. That's why the Fusient deal was mostly smoke and mirrors with only a few million of guaranteed money and why Turner took the WWF deal.
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Jan 28, 2019 23:16
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MassRafTer posted:Unless Jericho has completely changed his story is all he has said about the subject is at the sale price he wishes he'd bought it. You might be confusing this with Jerry Jarrett who claims he had investors and everything lined up. No one was going to be able to absorb the kind of losses WCW was taking on in 2001. That's why the Fusient deal was mostly smoke and mirrors with only a few million of guaranteed money and why Turner took the WWF deal. I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure the whole Jericho wanting to buy it came from either the early episodes of his podcast or one of his first two books. Its been a loooooooooong time though so I might be misremembering.
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Jan 29, 2019 00:42
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BGrifter posted:I could be wrong, but I’m pretty sure the whole Jericho wanting to buy it came from either the early episodes of his podcast or one of his first two books. Its been a loooooooooong time though so I might be misremembering. I think Jericho wished he had bought it at that price for the tape library and such, not to actually run the company.
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Jan 29, 2019 00:44
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Yeah, Jericho made comments about how cheap it was, that he might have brought it if he knew it was going for that little. But I doubt he ever intended to run it. It's always been more of a joke.
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Jan 29, 2019 00:52
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