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Roargasm
Oct 21, 2010

Hate to sound sleazy
But tease me
I don't want it if it's that easy
Before you spend three hours troubleshooting WinRM firewall configs and group policy, make sure that the WinRM update is installed on the client computer first :(

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The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


This isn't directly IT related, but is a thing that is pissing me off this week.

Skills that aren't used stagnate quickly.

I had an idea for a personal project, and went to setup a django instance on my shared hosting. 5 years ago, this would have taken me 10 minutes, yesterday, nearly 3 hours. All of my motivation to do any programming last night went straight out the window.

Thanks Ants
May 21, 2004

#essereFerrari


Do not come to me with a question about something you have admitted to knowing nothing about and then argue about the answer I give you just because you didn't want to hear it.

Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013



Thanks Ants posted:

Do not come to me with a question about something you have admitted to knowing nothing about and then argue about the answer I give you just because you didn't want to hear it.

Christ, I hate that. We had that at one point, and THREE separate people gave an identical answer. I was third he approached (he goes to me last because he thinks I'm grumpy) and I knew the other two had told him what's up.

:eng101: You aren't going to get a different answer from me, we've told you what the solution is, so either do it or not.

:byodood: Well... I think...

:eng101: What you "think" doesn't matter. This is the way it is, and this is the only way it will work.

:byodood: OK... thanks...

Two days later a two minute fix still hadn't been done.

:negative:

This is why I'm grumpy.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

Just got yelled at about web browsers.

Owner got some message on some website about IE9 not being supported soon, showed him that he could use Firefox and it was already installed (which he uses for Pandora). He asked why can people use two web browsers, I told him we have some legacy stuff that doesn't work in newer versions of IE, he said that's bullshit and we neeed to choose one. Then he told me the story about a long time ago when his granddaughter was running the computer system here and people were using Microsoft Word and something else he can't remember the name of an he told her to pick one.

At least she chose Word.

MC Fruit Stripe
Nov 26, 2002

around and around we go
If you're given a task, do you

a) ask follow up questions to make sure you understand the request and hammer out some specific details?
or
b) do things immediately, and declare it 'done' as soon as you run out of buttons to click

If you answered A, I'd like to work with you - if you answered B, I probably already do.

e: An example story from about 4 months ago, probably the 'definitive' - we run a product which requires a lot of database prep. Gotta get all the right databases, tables, stored procs and permissions in place. Much of this is automated, but some requires the touch that only a DBA can provide. THIS is installing our product. We asked a DBA to install it - he literally put SQL on a box and was like okay it's done. What even the hell.

Collateral Damage
Jun 13, 2009

Some times other people call me a DBA because I can half-rear end my way around SQL Server, can find the execution plan analyzer button and know the difference between a function and a stored procedure. I wouldn't call myself it though.

I've still seen way too many people who unironically call themselves DBAs with way less knowledge and professional standards. :smith:

Spazz
Nov 17, 2005

Collateral Damage posted:

I've still seen way too many people who unironically call themselves DBAs with way less knowledge and professional standards. :smith:

"We don't write queries, we're DBAs, not programmers."

Actual quote from a client's DBA at a 2b+ revenue company.

Collateral Damage
Jun 13, 2009

Oh, related thing that pisses me off: Developers who write database-centric applications that can't write efficient queries, have a completely retarded table design, or both.

Why are we pegging I/O on the database server every time this job runs? Because it runs a query which effectively does "SELECT * FROM 20_million_rows_and_30_columns_table".
Developer: "Oh we filter the data in the application."

Ynglaur
Oct 9, 2013

The Malta Conference, anyone?

Collateral Damage posted:

Oh, related thing that pisses me off: Developers who write database-centric applications that can't write efficient queries, have a completely retarded table design, or both.

Why are we pegging I/O on the database server every time this job runs? Because it runs a query which effectively does "SELECT * FROM 20_million_rows_and_30_columns_table".
Developer: "Oh we filter the data in the application."

This can be a valid design choice if the database isn't all in memory. Hitting disk is expensive in terms of time, so sometimes its faster to grab an entire table and manipulate your data in RAM. Total application memory used tends to be higher, but memory-time can often be less. This can be especially helpful in virtualized environments, even apart from the performance gains.

As you say, though, this type of design can put a lot of short-term stress on the database.

anthonypants
May 6, 2007

by Nyc_Tattoo
Dinosaur Gum

Ynglaur posted:

This can be a valid design choice if the database isn't all in memory. Hitting disk is expensive in terms of time, so sometimes its faster to grab an entire table and manipulate your data in RAM. Total application memory used tends to be higher, but memory-time can often be less. This can be especially helpful in virtualized environments, even apart from the performance gains.

As you say, though, this type of design can put a lot of short-term stress on the database.
Actually, a query that returns 600,000,000 objects before it's filtered is not a valid design choice.

the littlest prince
Sep 23, 2006


I could see it being a valid choice if your software connects to a database you don't control, on a high latency connection, and caches the data for further use.

dissss
Nov 10, 2007

I'm a terrible forums poster with terrible opinions.

Here's a cat fucking a squid.

Collateral Damage posted:

Oh, related thing that pisses me off: Developers who write database-centric applications that can't write efficient queries, have a completely retarded table design, or both.

Why are we pegging I/O on the database server every time this job runs? Because it runs a query which effectively does "SELECT * FROM 20_million_rows_and_30_columns_table".
Developer: "Oh we filter the data in the application."

That or cursors everywhere.

I get that if you're not a database guy looping and dealing with one row at a time is more intuitive but drat does it kill performance (at least most of the time). It's particularly frustrating when it's a vendor app that you can look at but not touch.

Mogomra
Nov 5, 2005

simply having a wonderful time
Sort of the opposite end of the spectrum.

I particularly love it when management comes to me with a huge gently caress off table that has tens of millions a of rows, no god damned indexes, and just says "make it work" or something equally unhelpful.

Then I'm the dumb idiot because whatever app or report didn't go blindingly fast like they wanted.

MrMoo
Sep 14, 2000

Reuters ships a 6TB DB with daily updates like that. It runs on SQL Server but Microsoft put so many limitations in place that you cannot use materialized views otherwise they will get wiped on each update. The answer is ghetto materialized views with INSERT ... SELECT.

Lord Dudeguy
Sep 17, 2006
[Insert good English here]

Collateral Damage posted:

I've still seen way too many people who unironically call themselves DBAs with way less knowledge and professional standards. :smith:

I can create instances and "performance tune" them in the most hamfisted ways possible, run very simple SELECT queries, and basically copy-pasta anything sent my way from a vendor into SQL Server Management Studio.

Am I a DBA? Absolutely not. But don't let that stop everyone from forwarding calls to me when "The DBA" is requested. :smithicide:

:edit: seriously guys please hire a dba so these vendor-provided 'SELECT *' queries won't keep knocking over the brand new hardware i put together pretty please

Lord Dudeguy fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Aug 2, 2015

EAT THE EGGS RICOLA
May 29, 2008

Bob Morales posted:

Just got yelled at about web browsers.

Owner got some message on some website about IE9 not being supported soon, showed him that he could use Firefox and it was already installed (which he uses for Pandora). He asked why can people use two web browsers, I told him we have some legacy stuff that doesn't work in newer versions of IE, he said that's bullshit and we neeed to choose one. Then he told me the story about a long time ago when his granddaughter was running the computer system here and people were using Microsoft Word and something else he can't remember the name of an he told her to pick one.

At least she chose Word.

At one point, I migrated a giant law firm from WordPerfect to Word. You would not believe how angry every single person there was about it.

Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013



EAT THE EGGS RICOLA posted:

At one point, I migrated a giant law firm from WordPerfect to Word. You would not believe how angry every single person there was about it.

I can believe it. There were a ton of things in WP that were specifically aimed at legal documents. Word is missing some of that baked in, very specific functionality. If it happened without warning I'd be pissed as well.

At least you got some 3rd party tools and/or plugins to replace that functionality, right?

Proteus Jones fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Aug 2, 2015

EAT THE EGGS RICOLA
May 29, 2008

flosofl posted:

I can believe it. There were a ton of things in WP that were specifically aimed at legal documents. Word is missing some of that baked in, very specific functionality. If it happened without warning I'd be pissed as well.

At least you got some 3rd party tools and/or plugins to replace that functionality, right?

Eh, the firm's partners made the decision and they were told very well ahead of time about it. The lawyers/partners were happy, the admin staff had a meltdown.

We absolutely had a bunch tools/plugins that they used to generate letters from templates and stuff, the formatting was already handled for them.

Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013



EAT THE EGGS RICOLA posted:

Eh, the firm's partners made the decision and they were told very well ahead of time about it. The lawyers/partners were happy, the admin staff had a meltdown.

We absolutely had a bunch tools/plugins that they used to generate letters from templates and stuff, the formatting was already handled for them.

Then, "oh well". I'm sure they eventually adapted.

EAT THE EGGS RICOLA
May 29, 2008

flosofl posted:

Then, "oh well". I'm sure they eventually adapted.

People were still whining about section breaks + page numbers forever, but yeah, when the firm's owners are the ones that announce it, then they can just deal with it.

The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


One of my clients is a law firm. Their Word templates are a precious commodity. To the point where when a lawyer left to start his own firm, and copied all of their templates to take with him, they sued him for it.

Dunno-Lars
Apr 7, 2011
:norway:

:iiam:



The Fool posted:

One of my clients is a law firm. Their Word templates are a precious commodity. To the point where when a lawyer left to start his own firm, and copied all of their templates to take with him, they sued him for it.

Please tell me he used their templates for all communication with the firm suing him? :v:

Swink
Apr 18, 2006
Left Side <--- Many Whelps
Law firm checking in.
Maybe the best scenario is when we poach a new lawyer from another firm and they bring a whole bunch of their own special snowflake templates and ask how soon they can be inserted into the document system.

Also when we hire assistants with 50 years experience but have no concept of Word styles or sections or directory structure.

Or just how loving slow the entire firm operates due to a million pieces of red tape.

Maybe it's their ferocious aversion to metrics of any kind, save for billable hours.

IT budget is good though.




Edit - I used to care about how inefficient everything was. Every process from entering new clients into the database to getting approval to actually do any work for them to reviewing a letter that needs to be sent takes 10 people to be involved.

Trying to fix these problems only caused problems for me so now instead of trying to improve their workflows I just ensure that their backwards rear end methods work properly (email all the partners!).

Swink fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Aug 2, 2015

Wizard of the Deep
Sep 25, 2005

Another productive workday
poo poo that pisses me off: New barista in my morning coffee shop, and my coffee is boring again until she perfects the pull.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!

My helpdesk guy is moving (his wife's job is re-locating their HQ) so in about a year he'll be 1 hour away. they were going to move kind of in the middle of each job but not now.

He's super dedicated to the company and close to the owners so they really don't have anything to worry about, at least not for a while.

But now they are trying to hold up my ERP project because they don't want to 'waste a year of training' with him. Ugh.

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009
So I talked to my coworker today about my job offer to stay here with better benefits, and he immediately called the VP who now wants to talk about raising my salary/benefits to get me to move to San Diego this afternoon.

Never negotiated from a position of power before. Feels good man. :getin:

edit* To clarify, I would need at a minimum: 40K extra a year and better benefits to get them to convince me to move.

Japanese Dating Sim
Nov 12, 2003

hehe
Lipstick Apathy
No, the guy who started last week does not get a computer today, because this is the first time I've heard about it. Also he's going to get a shitbox later this week until we get a decent computer in.

ratbert90 posted:

So I talked to my coworker today about my job offer to stay here with better benefits, and he immediately called the VP who now wants to talk about raising my salary/benefits to get me to move to San Diego this afternoon.

Never negotiated from a position of power before. Feels good man. :getin:

edit* To clarify, I would need at a minimum: 40K extra a year and better benefits to get them to convince me to move.

Wrong thread. Kidding - nice job, dude. :yotj:

Super-NintendoUser
Jan 16, 2004

COWABUNGERDER COMPADRES
Soiled Meat

ratbert90 posted:

So I talked to my coworker today about my job offer to stay here with better benefits, and he immediately called the VP who now wants to talk about raising my salary/benefits to get me to move to San Diego this afternoon.

Never negotiated from a position of power before. Feels good man. :getin:

edit* To clarify, I would need at a minimum: 40K extra a year and better benefits to get them to convince me to move.

Oh man, don't take a counter offer. This is a mistake. Something like 90% of people that take a counter offer are gone with in a year. Half of them leave on their own, and the other half are let go. When you take a counter offer, you are basically telling your company you are unhappy, and don't want to be there. They'll give you an offer just to save themselves the hassle of rushing to hire a replacement. You now have a target on your back and will be the first one that comes to their mind when they need to let someone go.

I'm not trying to pee on your Wheeties, but I'd seriously reconsider.

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

SIR FAT JONY IVES posted:

Oh man, don't take a counter offer. This is a mistake. Something like 90% of people that take a counter offer are gone with in a year. Half of them leave on their own, and the other half are let go. When you take a counter offer, you are basically telling your company you are unhappy, and don't want to be there. They'll give you an offer just to save themselves the hassle of rushing to hire a replacement. You now have a target on your back and will be the first one that comes to their mind when they need to let someone go.

I'm not trying to pee on your Wheeties, but I'd seriously reconsider.

Not at all, I am using their counter offer to try and boost my salary a bit with the new company. :)

Super-NintendoUser
Jan 16, 2004

COWABUNGERDER COMPADRES
Soiled Meat

ratbert90 posted:

Not at all, I am using their counter offer to try and boost my salary a bit with the new company. :)

Good. That's a better move, but now you are stuck. You have to leave. If the other offer isn't solid, then staying after you get them make you a counter-offer, even if you don't really have a job to go to is going to put you in a weird situation.

Proud Christian Mom
Dec 20, 2006
READING COMPREHENSION IS HARD

ratbert90 posted:

Not at all, I am using their counter offer to try and boost my salary a bit with the new company. :)

feels good man

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

SIR FAT JONY IVES posted:

Good. That's a better move, but now you are stuck. You have to leave. If the other offer isn't solid, then staying after you get them make you a counter-offer, even if you don't really have a job to go to is going to put you in a weird situation.

The new job is Solid, we just haven't worked out Salary completely yet. They expect to pay me around the same I am making now, which if that's all I get I am happy with. Or should I just say no thanks to the counter offer all together and not try to negotiate with the new place?

*edit* To clarify, even if I was left jobless, I have around 6 months of bills/spending money saved up.

Super-NintendoUser
Jan 16, 2004

COWABUNGERDER COMPADRES
Soiled Meat

ratbert90 posted:

The new job is Solid, we just haven't worked out Salary completely yet. They expect to pay me around the same I am making now, which if that's all I get I am happy with. Or should I just say no thanks to the counter offer all together and not try to negotiate with the new place?

*edit* To clarify, even if I was left jobless, I have around 6 months of bills/spending money saved up.

Here's the situation. Now keep in mind I'm not trying to slag you here, but it's in general good advice.

1) The rule is never accept a counter offer. Never. Just don't. This also includes finding a job you don't want just to get a better salary for leverage.
2) You don't have a new job until there's an offer letter in your hand with numbers on it.


These are the two rules of professional job searching.

Now you are sort of in limbo, you don't have number 2. But you have already let your company know you are leaving. In your old company's mind, you have one foot out the door. So they will counter offer, but you actually don't have any increased leverage.

edit for clarity.

Monty Hall Situation:

1) You take the counter offer (bad)
2) You get a counter offer and reject it. You negotiate with the new company, they don't play ball. (bad)
3) You don't get a counter offer, your old company says "bye!" , you negotiate with the new company, they don't play ball (bad)
4) The new company rejects your negotiations but still gives you job (ok)
5) The new company accepts your negotiations and gives you more money (best)

So the odds are not in your favor, but only you know how the new job process is really going. That said, the bottom line is that since your old job knows you are looking, and are already at the point where you are talking money, you are dead to them. If you don't leave, be ready to be let go with in six months.

Super-NintendoUser fucked around with this message at 19:07 on Aug 3, 2015

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

SIR FAT JONY IVES posted:

Here's the situation. Now keep in mind I'm not trying to slag you here, but it's in general good advice.

1) The rule is never accept a counter offer. Never. Just don't. This also includes finding a job you don't want just to get a better salary for leverage.
2) You don't have a new job until there's an offer letter in your hand with numbers on it.


These are the two rules of professional job searching.

Now you are sort of in limbo, you don't have number 2. But you have already let your company know you are leaving. In your old company's mind, you have one foot out the door. So they will counter offer, but you actually don't have any increased leverage.

edit for clarity.

Yeah, the only saving grace is that my Cousin is the one who offered me the job, and she is the hiring manager at the new place. She is firing a guy today and I am going to be his replacement.
I know it's never a real job until you have papers though. :\

Super-NintendoUser
Jan 16, 2004

COWABUNGERDER COMPADRES
Soiled Meat

ratbert90 posted:

Yeah, the only saving grace is that my Cousin is the one who offered me the job, and she is the hiring manager at the new place. She is firing a guy today and I am going to be his replacement.
I know it's never a real job until you have papers though. :\

Well, nepotism blows all the rules away. :unsmith: until someone with a higher paycheck brings in their cousin/nephew/niece and then you are out on the street.

Heck, even with an offer letter, be wary. A friend of mine had an offer letter, and it was set to start in one month. But in the lead time of giving his two weeks notice, the company said "Whoops, we are closing that division, so no job." His current job said "gtfo traitor" since he was going to a competitor and then he had no job.

FlapYoJacks
Feb 12, 2009

SIR FAT JONY IVES posted:

Well, nepotism blows all the rules away. :unsmith: until someone with a higher paycheck brings in their cousin/nephew/niece and then you are out on the street.

Heck, even with an offer letter, be wary. A friend of mine had an offer letter, and it was set to start in one month. But in the lead time of giving his two weeks notice, the company said "Whoops, we are closing that division, so no job." His current job said "gtfo traitor" since he was going to a competitor and then he had no job.

Yeah, there is that as well. :unsmith: Even if that does happen, I still have 6+ months to find a job, or play Destiny, not sure which.

Dick Trauma
Nov 30, 2007

God damn it, you've got to be kind.
I was quit when I came in here; I'm twice as quit now.

RadicalR
Jan 20, 2008

"Businessmen are the symbol of a free society
---
the symbol of America."

Dick Trauma posted:

I was quit when I came in here; I'm twice as quit now.

Welp, this sounds like a good story. Are you okay?

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The Fool
Oct 16, 2003


Dick Trauma posted:

I was quit when I came in here; I'm twice as quit now.

I thought this was a good job. Anything to do with that crazy assistant you mentioned last week?

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