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You lost the silicon lottery and your chip is almost at the limit of qualifying for the stock clocks?
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Jun 26, 2018 12:55
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No -.150 is a common limit when undervolting that generation CPU. Dude is way off on a -.9 undervolt being possible. Also I love it but deadfire uses way more power than it has any right to. Just turn off all graphics options and even turn down the frame rate from 60 if that isn't enough. Hopefully they can optimize things at some point.
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Jun 26, 2018 14:04
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CFox posted:No -.150 is a common limit when undervolting that generation CPU. Dude is way off on a -.9 undervolt being possible. Ok I'm glad to know that this limit is correct. Maybe the other poster meant -.09? And I completely agree on Deadfire. I blame the Unity engine. Going low on all the settings the laptop still overheats. I think it's the GPU that causes too much heat and coupled to the Xeon's own heat there's just not enough cooling. Since I don't really need the Xeon to play I'd rather undervolt that. Somebody in the Deadfire thread said it fixed it that way. I'll give it a go soon.
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Jun 26, 2018 14:13
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Furism posted:Ok I'm glad to know that this limit is correct. Maybe the other poster meant -.09? You can also try turning off the intel turbo boost, it won't really effect the performance in this game at least. If you check out point 2.4 here: http://www.geeks3d.com/20170213/how-to-disable-intel-turbo-boost-technology-on-a-notebook/#_22 you'll find a .reg file you can run to add the option to turn it off and on in power management. I've been using it for awhile and it works just fine.
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Jun 26, 2018 15:04
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CFox posted:You can also try turning off the intel turbo boost, it won't really effect the performance in this game at least. If you check out point 2.4 here: http://www.geeks3d.com/20170213/how-to-disable-intel-turbo-boost-technology-on-a-notebook/#_22 you'll find a .reg file you can run to add the option to turn it off and on in power management. I've been using it for awhile and it works just fine. Sweet! Totally did that. Thanks again.
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Jun 26, 2018 15:24
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Furism posted:So interestingly enough if I undervolt by more than .150 I get a Blue Screen of Death (which is really uncommon on Windows 10). I tried many settings (starting from .1 to .2 and then do .150, .175, .135, etc.. basically a binary search) and .150 is the limit. If I go beyond that the GUI just freezes and then the PC either reboots straight away or gives me a BSoD. i might've been using the wrong unit. I undervolt by 90mv. that might be .09 for you.
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Jun 26, 2018 20:06
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Yeah that's 0.09V; 0.9V is more than some chips use total these days. Considering that power use will generally be proportional to the square of voltage, reducing the ~1V a mobile CPU uses by 15% should make a noticeable difference.
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Jun 26, 2018 21:23
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Condiv posted:i might've been using the wrong unit. I undervolt by 90mv. that might be .09 for you. Believe it or not 90 mv is .09 volts for everyone.
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Jun 26, 2018 21:30
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LRADIKAL posted:Believe it or not 90 mv is .09 volts for everyone. he didn't give units so clearly he meant decivolts 
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Jun 26, 2018 21:35
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Well, couldn't swap my 8086K for a Threadripper. Guess submitting immediately after the page updated wasn't fast enough, and now I'm still on team blue
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Jun 26, 2018 22:51
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Endymion FRS MK1 posted:Well, couldn't swap my 8086K for a Threadripper. Guess submitting immediately after the page updated wasn't fast enough, and now I'm still on team blue You can still join team $$$.
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Jun 27, 2018 14:37
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I accidentally bought a 8700k.. without thinking about the cooler. I just have a 30 bux Xigmatec 120mm heatpipe direct cooler. I assume this will not do at all for this new chip. Halp.
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Jun 27, 2018 20:52
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redeyes posted:I accidentally bought a 8700k.. without thinking about the cooler. I just have a 30 bux Xigmatec 120mm heatpipe direct cooler. I assume this will not do at all for this new chip. Halp. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835146059
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Jun 27, 2018 21:05
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redeyes posted:I accidentally bought a 8700k.. without thinking about the cooler. I just have a 30 bux Xigmatec 120mm heatpipe direct cooler. I assume this will not do at all for this new chip. Halp. If you're gonna overclock: Noctua NH-D15, BeQuiet Dark Rock Pro 4, Cryorig R1 Ultimate If not: Cryorig H7 or something, whatever works closed loop liquid coolers are a waste of money
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Jun 27, 2018 21:11
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All in one coolers are sucky? Reasons? Man those coolers are spendy. Is there a bargain option? I kind of blew my budget getting 32GB of RAM ;_; [edit] Oh that Cryorig is cheap. Perfect, thanks.
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Jun 27, 2018 21:22
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The Cryorig H5 Ultimate is probably a better fit for the 8700K, and not *that* much more expensive than the H7. Yes, the H5 is better than the H7. Cryorig really needs to work on their product naming.
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Jun 27, 2018 21:24
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BIG HEADLINE posted:The Cryorig H5 Ultimate is probably a better fit for the 8700K, and not *that* much more expensive than the H7. I was just looking at the numbering scheme and going wtf. I wouldn't mind overclocking at all. Think the H5 can handle it? Internets say about 170w expected AVX maxed out at like 4.9Ghz all cores. According to their docs, it can handle 180w TDP.
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Jun 27, 2018 21:26
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redeyes posted:I was just looking at the numbering scheme and going wtf. I wouldn't mind overclocking at all. Think the H5 can handle it? Internets say about 170w expected AVX maxed out at like 4.9Ghz all cores. According to their docs, it can handle 180w TDP. Yeah, 170W is about right for a max AVX load at those settings - that's about what mine draws according to the software measurements. If you're not delidded though, any conventional cooler is going to have a hard time handling 170W heat load, but that's more because of poor heat transfer out of the die than the performance of the heatsink. That being said, max AVX loads aren't realistic and the heaviest loads you'll see in real applications will probably land somewhere around 120-140W. If you are going to overclock though and aren't delidded then you're probably going to be limited by thermals and you'll want the biggest cooler you can get. Unless you're prepared to throw out at least $150 or so, the all-in-one liquid coolers aren't meaningfully better than the highest end air coolers (which are around $80-90), so they're not really worth spending money on. They tend to be louder than air cooling too unless you buy better fans for them.
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Jun 27, 2018 21:44
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Crap, I totally forgot about delidding which I am not doing. I'll probably go for that Cryorig H5. Price is right and I don't like water cooling.
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Jun 27, 2018 21:48
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sincx fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Mar 23, 2021 |
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Jun 27, 2018 21:49
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sincx posted:AIO coolers have the distinct advantages of directly dumping heat outside the case, and also places minimal pressure on sockets. Minimum pressure on the socket, sure, that's a legitimate advantage. On most midtower cases though, you have a front fan blowing cold air directly into the CPU cooler, which in turn is blowing hot air directly at the exhaust fan at the back (on most cases we're talking a few centimeters between heatsink and exhaust fan), so it's not like you're circulating that much hot air in there. I guess there's a bit of radiation going on, but that's really not much to worry about. Plus, you get airflow over your VRM's for free, which is legitimately a thing you have to worry about with 6- and 8-cores on a lot of midrange motherboards. On a small form factor build though I'll concede the point, because it's usually far easier to find space for a 240mm radiator than for a gigantic dual tower aircooler. TheFluff fucked around with this message at 22:03 on Jun 27, 2018 |
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Jun 27, 2018 22:00
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have you considered that AIOs also look cool and u can say to ur bros "its water cooled"
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Jun 27, 2018 22:06
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I don't have any bros. ;_; Is there a cheap and good AIO that can be recommended?
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Jun 27, 2018 22:07
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no, buy a decent aircooler unless you move your PC around every day
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Jun 27, 2018 22:13
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redeyes posted:I don't have any bros. ;_; The ones that are cheaper than top end air coolers also perform worse than top end air coolers. You'll want at least a 240mm one to get any kind of improvement over top end air cooling, and decent ones start somewhere around $120, but really, if you're throwing down that kind of money you might as well shoot for the best you can get. The one mewse linked is one of the best options. You'll pay twice as much as you would for an air cooler to lower temps by maybe 5-10 degrees Celsius. A far better use of that money would be to send the CPU to Silicon Lottery for their delidding service, which will cost you $45 and lower temperatures by around 20 degrees Celsius. TheFluff fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Jun 27, 2018 |
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Jun 27, 2018 22:21
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AIOs are great, you’re all crazy.
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Jun 27, 2018 22:29
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The day Noctua makes a AIO is the day I go AIO. That day will (probably) never come so guess I'm stuck with fantastically engineered beautiful air coolers designed in Austria homeland of Hitler and all good things.
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Jun 27, 2018 23:19
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I love my massive yet nigh silent Noctua DH-15S. It’s the bomb.
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Jun 27, 2018 23:22
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redeyes posted:All in one coolers are sucky? The smaller ones are good if you've not got the space for a good air cooler. But if you've got the space, I don't see the point in them at all until you get up to 280mm AIO's. Then they start outperforming air. Friend of mine had a 120mm AIO in a giant huge ATX case. WTF lol. Guess he liked looking at pipes. GRINDCORE MEGGIDO fucked around with this message at 10:29 on Jun 28, 2018 |
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Jun 28, 2018 02:49
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A slim 120mm AIO (+Noctua NF-F12) keeps my 1080 at under 60C at 125% load, under 50C at 65% load. My 140mm keeps my 5820K at under 60C at full AVX load (encoding video or mining). I haven't run OC'd since the last mining boom, didn't want to stress my chip running hard AVX loads OC'd 24/7 but it was about the same back when I first set it up. I'm still running a nominal overclock just because the XMP clocks cause a 1.25x BCLK strap increase, so 3.8 GHz, but I'm only running about 1.15v under AVX load (according to HwInfo). Frankly I think this one depends on the rest of your build. If you have a bare die (GPU), soldered, or delidded+LM'd processor, liquid can help a lot (even an AIO). If you are running with TIM, you already have a huge increase in thermal resistance. The processor is cooking inside its IHS, while the IHS contact surface itself is cool. I was not all that impressed with this same AIO on my 4690K, it was running more like 75C under heavy load, although I may not have had the pump cranked up all the way. On the other hand, my 140mm AIO just sucked air the other night, after 3.5 years. Was quite disconcerting, all of a sudden it sounded like an air compressor hose was going off inside my rig. I had the hoses up at the top of the rad, which is wrong, but I was too lazy to fix it. I turned it around and so far so good. I'm glad I have another year and a half of warranty. Under no circumstances should you buy one of those refurb AIOs with a 3-12 month warranty. Generally, if an AIO fails under warranty, CM/Corsair/NZXT/etc will replace any components it takes with it. Not advertised, but it's on a case-by-case basis. As long as you didn't physically mangle the hardware, they usually pay out. It's not particularly silent. I haven't bothered to install better fans or whatever, the ones they usually come with are pretty bad, but even still. If nothing else, the pumps are louder than a custom loop. An AIO is really not a pain. On the other hand, a D15 is not really a pain either. Both of them are pretty solid options. Again, I'd think the D15 is probably the better option for TIM'd chips, and an AIO is a reasonable choice with a soldered or LM'd chip. I'm thinking about maybe going for a custom loop next time but there's some maintenance involved. I'd probably go for ZMT but even still, you really should drain and flush it every year or so. Thinking about replacing this AIO and maybe moving my build into a better case when I do. Maybe a Fractal R6 to give myself more room. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Jun 28, 2018 |
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Jun 28, 2018 04:08
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Good point, they own GPUS bigtime. True about the bigger die CPU's, I = wrong to make that blanket statement.
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Jun 28, 2018 04:14
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Again, I think it's about thermal resistance. TIM is garbage and at higher TDP levels you need to throw absurd amounts of cooling at it. You're pushing on a string, you have to lower the IHS temperature by an exponential amount to lower the die temperature by a small amount. AIOs are somewhat better, but not enough to beat the exponential curve involved here. Soldered dies (X99, Ryzen), liquid-metal'd dies, and bare dies (GPUs) fare overwhelmingly better with AIOs than TIM'd Intel CPUs, from my experience and what I've seen. That's my theory at least. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 04:29 on Jun 28, 2018 |
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Jun 28, 2018 04:26
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Is seating your heat sink against the bare die even possible these days? Does someone make shims or something?
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Jun 28, 2018 05:17
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Dadbod Apocalypse posted:Is seating your heat sink against the bare die even possible these days? Does someone make shims or something? Some company makes waterblocks that are designed to replace the IHS and sit against the die. Linus tech tips did a sponsored video about them.
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Jun 28, 2018 05:25
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Dadbod Apocalypse posted:Is seating your heat sink against the bare die even possible these days? Does someone make shims or something? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DJOVdmd7NHQ The caveat with this kit is that not only do you have to delid your CPU...you have to remove and replace the entire retention system from your motherboard. That kit's only for Sky-X, too - not sure if they make one for Kaby/Coffee. BIG HEADLINE fucked around with this message at 05:38 on Jun 28, 2018 |
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Jun 28, 2018 05:26
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Paul MaudDib posted:Soldered dies (X99, Ryzen), liquid-metal'd dies, and bare dies (GPUs) fare overwhelmingly better with AIOs than TIM'd Intel CPUs, from my experience and what I've seen. But on GPUs they have a huge advantage in that stock GPU coolers are limited by volume. And even the larger aftermarket coolers can only attach so much weight to the PCIe slots. The four-slot(!) Raijintek Morpheus (which beats stock air-cooled GPUs by quite a large margin) isn't too far from a 140mm AIO (the gap in temps/noise is partially from slower Noctua fans):   (source) Llamadeus fucked around with this message at 07:11 on Jun 28, 2018 |
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Jun 28, 2018 07:06
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Yeah the equilibrium factor makes a lot of reviews kinda dicey, there aren't that many sources you can trust. All I can say is I definitely run my hardware to equilibrium... I mine and encode for like 12-48h at a time. But I'm just some rear end in a top hat on the internet. An actual half-kilo of copper being attached to a GPU managing to match a 140mm AIO at equilibrium isn't that impressive. I do like the Morpheus as a product, but it can barely keep up with a basic AIO+G10/G12, and it's certainly not equivalent in any sort of volume sense. It's space vs noise, more or less. If you have an AIO with a 2-slot PCIe radiator (say, slim 280mm or 360mm) that would probably out-cool the morpheus. 120/140mm AIO is a lot easier form-factor to accommodate than a long 4-slot card, and it's just as good. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 07:32 on Jun 28, 2018 |
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Jun 28, 2018 07:19
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Here's a decent look at a custom loop vs a high end air cooler. https://youtu.be/vw4HONEkj4s
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Jun 28, 2018 07:23
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An example with a soldered CPU (technically two CPUs): https://www.gamersnexus.net/hwreviews/3119-360-vs-240-for-threadripper-enermax-liqtech-vs-noctua With Noctua's single 140mm tower falling slightly behind a 240mm AIO, assuming you don't want to run 57 dBA fans. Shows why people say you need a 280mm or larger AIO to comfortably outperform top air coolers. And also that the throughput of the heatsink itself is not the limiting factor for most people, with this test showing Noctua's second largest cooler handling ~250W (albeit across more CPU and IHS surface area) when most people only want to cool ~180W or less.
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Jun 28, 2018 07:55
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second AIO’s for gpus, grab the nzxt converter thingy and bolt one on
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Jun 28, 2018 08:37
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