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Psychotic Weasel posted:I am very bored at work and a speed run of Factorio came up on my YouTube queue so I decided to watch it. At one point instead of using walls around his mining outposts the guy playing started placing a ring of conveyors pointing away from the defenses, knowing biter AI would prioritize the turrets while ignoring the belts that were pushing them away where as normal walls would also become a target. When's the video from? I remember that used to work but I have a hazy and maybe wrong recollection of them patching out using belts to make biter treadmills.
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Jan 31, 2019 20:20
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Posted the video just above, looks like it was uploaded in Jan 12th. Not sure if we see it in action in the video (I have to keep tabbing back and forth to make it look like I'm still working) I just caught a part of it where he was laying it out. So long as the turrets aren't being overwhelmed by the sheer number of biters I don't see why it wouldn't work. In theory anyway. I'll have to try it when I get home.
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Jan 31, 2019 20:25
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Yeah it still works. Yellow belts won't do as well but can help.
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Jan 31, 2019 20:43
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The best use is when you start to see spitters, since the belts will interrupt their spitting animation if placed at the right spot.
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Jan 31, 2019 20:44
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LLSix posted:When's the video from? I remember that used to work but I have a hazy and maybe wrong recollection of them patching out using belts to make biter treadmills. I think it used to be possible to basically trap biters on belts forever, because they didn't see them as a valid target. Biters attack belts now if they're stuck on the belt for too long, but as long as there's guns killing them they probably won't stick around long enough for that to be an issue.
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Jan 31, 2019 20:50
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just lol if you don't have two trains orbiting each of your outposts on a permanent basis to run over attacking bugs, circuit-controlled to be refueled on an offset schedule for 100% uptime with 256 artillery cars each, that fire while refueling
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Jan 31, 2019 22:06
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Psychotic Weasel posted:I believe this is the one I watched: Thanks 
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Jan 31, 2019 22:29
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Evilreaver posted:just lol if you don't have two trains orbiting each of your outposts on a permanent basis to run over attacking bugs, circuit-controlled to be refueled on an offset schedule for 100% uptime
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Feb 1, 2019 00:57
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I gave it a few days and restarted the game with some different goals derived from your ideas - giving myself plenty of space, automating and scaling up as much as possible at my current tech before moving on, and I'm having a ton of fun. Thanks for the advice guys. Sometimes it pays to come at very open-ended games from a different approach.
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Feb 1, 2019 04:16
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Slowly assembling the pieces needed for a large AngelBob circuit factory for the ones past basic electronic circuits has been fun. I have everything except for gilded copper wire and gold plates added as inputs. Gold smelting requires fancier setups with chlorine at the basic level, then somehow dealing with the sodium build-up (that is likely to be handled by a parallel gold smelting 3 process if I can get past my reluctance to use catalysts). My gas extraction section somehow turned into producing all the liquid plastic, liquid resin and sulphuric acid inputs which I'm particularly pleased with.
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Feb 1, 2019 06:02
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Speaking of Factorio speedruns, the guy who has held the Any% world record for the past while just posted a breakdown of his most recent build, which he used to push the record below 2:30:00 a few days ago. I really recommend it, even if you don't care about playing Factorio super fast you can still pick up useful tips and get good ideas for layouts. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/373003663 Here's the WR run: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hCBP7RXOA8&t=54s
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Feb 1, 2019 07:52
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I realize this is a hard question to answer, but does anyone have any generalized advice or hints for building beacon-based designs? I've never really messed with them before, and I don't want to just look up solutions without understanding why they work. It's really cool that at this stage of the game miniaturization and space efficiency suddenly start to matter, but it also means I have to figure something out I've never cared about before. e: I had a design here but it doesn't actually work yet period.  e2: Okay I sorted out the issues, here's an example of the sort of thing I'm building now: https://pastebin.com/vMFtjJZG 
Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 09:17 on Feb 1, 2019 |
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Feb 1, 2019 08:53
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So when is this 0.17 thing going to happen? Didn't they say January at some point?
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Feb 1, 2019 11:34
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They aimed for January but it obviously didn't pan out. Either the last FFF or the one before they said likely early/mid February.
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Feb 1, 2019 11:38
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I realize this is a hard question to answer, but does anyone have any generalized advice or hints for building beacon-based designs? I've never really messed with them before, and I don't want to just look up solutions without understanding why they work. It's really cool that at this stage of the game miniaturization and space efficiency suddenly start to matter, but it also means I have to figure something out I've never cared about before. More in general tips for building with beacons: 1) Beacons don't need to be right up against machines. You can have them two tiles away on both sides, leaving enough room for a belt on each side. 2) Undergrounds are your friend. Depending on the product you can weave red belt/red undergrounds into your design to move extra lanes of material in the same space. If making a product that outputs more than the input (prodded green chips, in particular) have red belt for input and blue for output. When going to output products that are less in quantity than the input materials (prodded gears, all rocket parts, science) the output can be on red belt. Or even yellow belt, allowing you to have inputs on both red and blue belt. 3) Take advantage of how inserters output. You can have input materials on the inner lane of a belt via sideloading, and output to the outer lane. At the end of the line, use a splitter filter or the underground trick to take off only the output material. 4) Direct insertion can include chests. Instead of having two machines separated by a tile to fit an inserter, put them side by side, and have the output go up and over via two chests (and 2 extra inserters) which are limited to one stack each. This lets you fit more machines in and line them up with the beacons better. For single-file beacons the best you can get is 8 beacons each hitting 8 assemblers (except at the ends of the line, where you'll have a few beacons not hitting maximum assemblers).
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Feb 1, 2019 11:58
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Alkydere posted:They aimed for January but it obviously didn't pan out. Either the last FFF or the one before they said likely early/mid February. The devs pretty much copped to the fact that they left the bulk of the GUI redesigns for the end because they figured it'd be easy, then realized that proper UI/UX design is actually really loving hard and takes considerable effort. So they've slid 0.17 out to February. I'm hoping we'll get a tentative release date when today's FFF's drop.
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Feb 1, 2019 16:12
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I realize this is a hard question to answer, but does anyone have any generalized advice or hints for building beacon-based designs? I've never really messed with them before, and I don't want to just look up solutions without understanding why they work. It's really cool that at this stage of the game miniaturization and space efficiency suddenly start to matter, but it also means I have to figure something out I've never cared about before. It's really hard to get enough throughput on belts with a fully beaconed setup. In fact, the belt throughput is going to be the real limiter rather than the number of beacons you can fit. Switching to a giant cloud of bots will let you produce much more densely. For the posted design you can avoid needing the belts feeding from the middle copper wire assemblers if you scoot a few things around. I'd specify further but you asked for hints so I'll let you work it out yourself if you want. I find it useful to do the math when making designs. For your design I think this is the right Factorio calculator. I've always done it by hand so I might be misreading this but... 1) you should only need 1.1 assemblers to make copper wire to feed your setup, not the 1.5 you are using. You could just add an extra beacon on the ends to allow the ones feeding directly to keep up and remove the rest. 2) with 4 assemblers feeding into the same blue belt you would be generating 714*4= 2856 items per minute which is more than 2400 items/min throughput of the single blue belt you are using for output, so your output is currently bottlenecking your design 3) Surprisingly, you have excess capacity on your input belts, so if you can squeeze a few more beacons in there you'll get more output, maybe stretch or compress your center lane?
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Feb 1, 2019 16:25
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I enjoy belted setups for aesthetic reasons; I'll probably switch to robots some day but for now that's by design. That blueprint produces exactly a full belt of green circuits (which I confirmed in Factorio Planner, although it might be slightly overkill due to rounding issues); I also had to lock the output stack inserters to stacks of 10 to get them to sync up properly. Thanks, though! e: Cutting the copper wire assemblers down to 2 is a great catch, in particular; I'm still used to thinking of things in terms of fixed ratios instead of ratios being something you can manipulate. Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Feb 1, 2019 |
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Feb 1, 2019 18:14
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https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-280 A whole bunch of GUi improvements, and, more excitingly, if a train has a station in its schedule without any wait conditions, it will path through that station but not stop
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Feb 1, 2019 18:58
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Optimizing robot based builds just isn't as fun as belt based ones. A tractable way to do the math is think in terms of production time per module. Ways to make this number go up are: 1.Try to increase the number of beacons that each assembler is touching; and 2.Try to increase the number of assemblers that each beacon is touching. Those two things are at odds with each other, and should be kept in balance. Just as having each assembler hit by one 1 beacon, but that beacon is hitting 12 assemblers is bad, having each beacon touch 1 assembler, with that assembler getting 12 beacons is also bad. Your build has each assembler getting hit by 6 beacons, and each beacon hitting 2.5 assemblers. Try to find ways to make one of those numbers go up without making the other number go down. An entirely separate thing to think about: What's the ratio between wire assemblers and green circuit assemblers? Does that change when modules are involved?
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Feb 1, 2019 19:09
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Also be aware that sometimes things like cable need more than one stack inserter on the inputs and outputs to keep up with how fast it is with beacons.
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Feb 1, 2019 19:34
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Here is a TA miner for Uranium: 5M patch. 13668 Uranium/min out, 12400 Acid/min in. 115MW when its running. Not that there was ever really a need for it to cycle more than once that i've ever noticed, its still fun.
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Feb 1, 2019 21:38
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GotLag posted:https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-280 
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Feb 1, 2019 22:03
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Yeah, that's pretty cool. I can't think of any uses for it off the top of my head. I like load balanced stations and I don't think this helps with them. I guess if you want tighter control over where a train goes?
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Feb 1, 2019 23:14
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Solumin posted:Yeah, that's pretty cool. I can't think of any uses for it off the top of my head. I like load balanced stations and I don't think this helps with them. I guess if you want tighter control over where a train goes? It means I can put multiple pick-up stations on a single route and only have the train slow down if it isn't full yet. Basically irrelevant in my current game where everything has a million modules and productivity upgrades, but still handy! e: you could probably have accomplished this with circuits but 
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Feb 1, 2019 23:25
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But the biggest question is, what sound should Honk! make when that happens? I'm thinking maybe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRc2vx4xTVM
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Feb 2, 2019 00:31
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GotLag posted:But the biggest question is, what sound should Honk! make when that happens? I'm thinking maybe https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXxcwFfovkc
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Feb 2, 2019 01:34
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:It means I can put multiple pick-up stations on a single route and only have the train slow down if it isn't full yet. No, waypoints are specifically stations that have no conditions in the train schedule, not conditions that are completely satisfied.
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Feb 2, 2019 01:59
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Guh, they have the example right there: https://cdn.factorio.com/assets/img/blog/fff-280-train-loop.webm Also known as Evilreaver posted:just lol if you don't have two trains orbiting each of your outposts on a permanent basis to run over attacking bugs, circuit-controlled to be refueled on an offset schedule for 100% uptime
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Feb 2, 2019 02:04
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GotLag posted:https://www.factorio.com/blog/post/fff-280 Loving all the functionality they're adding, but that new UI still looks like something that came straight out of an early 2000's UI designer course. Really hope there's gonna be UI mods to fix some of that terrible design.
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Feb 2, 2019 23:48
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I, for one, miss the java look and feel and am glad to see it still has proponents.
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Feb 3, 2019 00:00
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TigerXtrm posted:Loving all the functionality they're adding, but that new UI still looks like something that came straight out of an early 2000's UI designer course. Really hope there's gonna be UI mods to fix some of that terrible design. What do you want it to look like, Windows XP?
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Feb 3, 2019 04:58
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Any game's UI that doesn't look like Grandma's copy of internet explorer after she neurotically searched out and installed every searchbar/toolbar addon she could find, is a missed opportunity for a good game UI
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Feb 3, 2019 05:13
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e: You know, nevermind, clickable buttons are better. This was a dumb post.
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Feb 3, 2019 05:58
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GotLag posted:What do you want it to look like, Windows XP? It's the massive overuse of bevel and emboss throughout the entire UI that irks me a bit. Too many '3D' elements. Windows, buttons, inventory slots, sliders. Almost everything has that same effect applied to it and it just looks a bit messy, is all I'm saying. I find that very few people agree with me on this, though, and most are simply happy to see any kind of improvement on the UI at all. Maybe it's just a matter of taste, I dunno.
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Feb 3, 2019 11:41
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GotLag posted:But the biggest question is, what sound should Honk! make when that happens? I'm thinking maybe https://youtu.be/x3SxEOvAOEg
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Feb 3, 2019 12:45
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TigerXtrm posted:It's the massive overuse of bevel and emboss throughout the entire UI that irks me a bit. Too many '3D' elements. Windows, buttons, inventory slots, sliders. Almost everything has that same effect applied to it and it just looks a bit messy, is all I'm saying. I find that very few people agree with me on this, though, and most are simply happy to see any kind of improvement on the UI at all. Maybe it's just a matter of taste, I dunno. Hell yes brother let's get the same exact completely flat white expanses of 0218357092138412032 different identical react-driven brand websites. where are the hero images??
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Feb 3, 2019 17:10
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It looks ok but I kind of miss the programmer graphics UI already because it looked like an industrial HMI. Would be neat to see the new UIX with the old UI art. Only half joking.
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Feb 3, 2019 17:18
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zedprime posted:It looks ok but I kind of miss the programmer graphics UI already because it looked like an industrial HMI. Would be neat to see the new UIX with the old UI art. Only half joking.
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Feb 3, 2019 18:47
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I'm just gonna delurk and say that I really dig the new interface. Mostly because it's clear that while it might not be to everyone's taste, a lot of thought has gone into making it more consistent and powerful. I neither love nor hate the beveled look itself, though. Wild swerve: anybody have a favorite mall that's tuned specifically to load a build train pre-logistics network rather than just filling passive provider chests? Finally getting a build train set up well into yellow science during my last game felt really good re: not keeping half a base worth of items in my personal inventory and I wanna try my hand at a railworld in .17 anyway, but most malls seem to either assume I want to hand-pick stuff from chests or research all the way into logistics network, which I'm specifically trying to cut down on using. (Also I'm gonna barrel liquids and power outposts with steam trains in that run simply to be an edgy rebel.)
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Feb 3, 2019 19:52
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