|
ate poo poo on live tv posted:Ranged attacks have no place in civ. Get rid of them and bring back thunderdome combat. you know i bet you could make this work if you made the primary use of spy actions "confuse enemy ranks." normally, defense would be conducted civ 4 style, the most effective unit intercepts an attacker, but you could use confusion on an archer to force it to defend against the next attack, and then run him over with a cavalry unit while the spearman in that same stack just sits around with his thumb up his rear end. but this might be way too much micromanagement, idk. i'd have to see it practice.
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 03:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 08:10 |
|
|
ate poo poo on live tv posted:Ranged attacks have no place in civ. Get rid of them and bring back thunderdome combat. One unit per tile was one of the series' best innovations.  More seriously, though, after thinking about it CBERT's number one best change in my opinion? Sea improvements. Water's actually useful terrain in Rising Tide. Even beyond sea cities, it makes coastal, peninsula, and island cities a whole lot better.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 04:09
|
|
|
tech web and satellite layer were cool
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 04:34
|
|
|
Spies were the only good part of BE. Satellite layer was underdeveloped. Visuals were so bad that you couldn't see deadly poison when you were sitting on it. Tech web forced you to learn and invest too much in a poorly though out game. Everything was unbalanced. Terrible game.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 04:38
|
|
|
The Human Crouton posted:Tech web forced you to learn and invest too much in a poorly though out game. Oh no, you actually have to learn a new system that's filled with filters to help you find what you want! Not that my early game research usually diverges significantly from: Chemistry -> Pioneering -> Ecology -> Genetics -> Engineering -> Physics -> Tier 1 affinity tech -> Planetary Survey (if I have a water city or am likely to soon) -> Biochemistry -> Computers -> Robotics -> Alien Sciences -> Terraforming -> Genetic Design -> Alien Ethics (could do Transgenics, but I love me that Xenodrome) -> Bionics Sprinkle in affinity techs to taste - I'll sometimes pick up Autonomous Systems and Swarm Robotics regardless of affinity just for the wonders. Once I have bionics, build an institute and wait for the quest to get Artificial Evolution for that juicy beaker added to every farm's output. After that, usually pick up Biology -> Vertical Farming for better farms, Organics for biofactories, Fabrication for alloy foundries, and then maybe Mechatronics if I'm going Purity or have enough floatstone to build the Crawler. After that, it's pretty open. If I'm going Supremacy I'll usually pick up Cognition. If I need health (rare) or am going Harmony, pick up Transgenics. If I'm at war, pick up Communication. Otherwise, head up to Bioengineering and Industrial Ecology. The tech web's fine once you get used to it and realize where stuff is. You don't like the game, fair enough, but the only actual downside of the game you pointed out was the game's trouble with balance.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 04:52
|
|
|
You have so many different recipes for poop thanks to the tech web. Eat the poop in whatever order you want!
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 05:01
|
|
|
Tech Web was step 1 of a good idea. They failed to put steps 2 through Infinity in it by actually THINKING IT OUT. It was just "poo poo is spread out haphazardly, later stuff is later" and you research, maybe, 1/2 of it. And no matter what you kinda research 3/4ths of the same stuff every time once you learn what you need/what's good. Oh and they needed the community to remind them to do stuff like color-code icons for readability. Satellites were cool though. Alkydere fucked around with this message at 05:26 on Apr 20, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 05:23
|
|
|
The White Dragon posted:you know i bet you could make this work if you made the primary use of spy actions "confuse enemy ranks." normally, defense would be conducted civ 4 style, the most effective unit intercepts an attacker, but you could use confusion on an archer to force it to defend against the next attack, and then run him over with a cavalry unit while the spearman in that same stack just sits around with his thumb up his rear end. I could see something like giving various units specific powers, kind of like how the cavalry had the flank ability in Civ4. Maybe a skirmishing unit flushes archers out of their entrenchment so they lose their terrain defense for the turn. Or crossbows have a "lure" ability so it cause cavalry to leave the stack/formation. Basically ways that the attacker can get an upper-hand on the defender in a more interesting way then the ranged attack. But yea it would have to be well executed so that it isn't a pain in the rear end.
|
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 06:16
|
|
|
I can see that working, like active abilities that consume the unit's turn. Use Flush or Flank to force the next defender to be a ranged unit, like weakest/strongest/random--the AI would probably be able to use it pretty effectively because it's just crunching the order of attack based on the most probable ideal outcome of every combat. Plus it engages the player a little more--maybe even a lot more!--and you tab between unit groups in a stack to choose whose active to drop, or even just give them all unique hotkeys. Like queueing Build Watermill from a worker, but instead you're queueing Flush rear end in a top hat Archers from a horseman. Nice and easy to use quickly, feels fairly natural to most players, but all the time in the world to think about it because 4X. Distribute exp based on a unit killed after being affected with the active, so your casters don't lag behind on promotions! But also so you can't overgrind like I do  firaxis! im a ronin dev, call me  we'll make civ 7 baller
Fur20 fucked around with this message at 07:00 on Apr 20, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 20, 2018 06:53
|
|
|
Jeez, I am still not used to some RnF things. In one of my MP games for it (admittedly my first), I had to build one of my early cities in a place where it'd get enough snow in range for the big bonus from the South Pole research center wonder if the game got that far, and I built my campus... One hex right of a place that would have allowed me to build it, and that's actually no better. But I forgot about that wonder when I plonked the campus down, so, not an option there. It's admittedly such a late wonder it probably won't get built anyway, but it's just the most recent reminder of how much I need to (re)learn for the expansion. Also, I hate Magnus so much. His starting ability is amazing, but it makes harvesting/chopping without using it feel like a massive waste of resources, but my rapid expansion leaves a lot of cities that need poo poo chopped (and with the builders the ancestral hall gives I could do it right away) where I have to delay it significantly if I want to use Magnus there. I hope the upcoming patch nerfs his rear end, and in the meantime I think I'm going to try to just ignore trying to take advantage of his bullshit in every city so it doesn't bother me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 21, 2018 19:53
|
|
|
I don't know if it's worth anything with your specific geography, but no wonder needs to be built next to its own city's districts. If you can put another campus next to a snow tile in that city's working range, that campus can be used as a prerequisite instead.
|
|
#
?
Apr 22, 2018 00:27
|
|
|
Roland Jones posted:Also, I hate Magnus so much. His starting ability is amazing, but it makes harvesting/chopping without using it feel like a massive waste of resources, but my rapid expansion leaves a lot of cities that need poo poo chopped (and with the builders the ancestral hall gives I could do it right away) where I have to delay it significantly if I want to use Magnus there. I hope the upcoming patch nerfs his rear end, and in the meantime I think I'm going to try to just ignore trying to take advantage of his bullshit in every city so it doesn't bother me. I've gone through the exact same issue myself. First few games I obsessed over maxing out Magnus' ability to my overall detriment by deliberately waiting to chop, even if I had an eligible worker sitting on that tile, for him to be established somewhere. Once I realized I was actually losing out overall because of this, I just let go and adopted the attitude of "hey, if I get to use him, great; but if not, that's okay, too." On that note, what is everyone's (usual) first governor appointment? Lately I'm going with Liang first just to get the extra worker charge. 33% more charges in the ancient and classical eras is too good to pass up, and unlike Magnus there's no handwringing over whether I'm using her effectively enough or not.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 23:07
|
|
|
Why play CivBE when you could play the vastly superior Caveman2Cosmos?  Thunderdomes for years! Literally, I've assaulted cities that had over 100 camel archers in them because reasons (before getting tired of that mod).
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 00:25
|
|
|
TipTow posted:I've gone through the exact same issue myself. First few games I obsessed over maxing out Magnus' ability to my overall detriment by deliberately waiting to chop, even if I had an eligible worker sitting on that tile, for him to be established somewhere. Once I realized I was actually losing out overall because of this, I just let go and adopted the attitude of "hey, if I get to use him, great; but if not, that's okay, too." It depends a bit on the timing of my government plaza but most of the time I'm still starting with Magnus. Even setting aside the brokenness of his chopping bonus, being able to get to his settler discount with State Workforce + Early Empire usually just seems better than any other combination of 2 governor titles.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 00:26
|
|
|
Falcorum posted:Why play CivBE when you could play the vastly superior Caveman2Cosmos? Pff, look at this noob who doesn't have several elite cavalry brought up through the ages with blitz as one of the conditional promotions. (I think with the tenda religion you can get blitz cav units super early).
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 00:36
|
|
|
Haven't listened to this yet, but it should be interesting for Civ fans. He was the lead designer on Civ 2 and Alpha Centaur, to name a few. https://www.idlethumbs.net/designernotes/episodes/brian-reynolds-part-1
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 05:40
|
|
|
Falcorum posted:Why play CivBE when you could play the vastly superior Caveman2Cosmos? for the record C2C (at least for me) is unplayable right now because of input lag, you click a building button and wait half a second until anything happens and C2C has thousands of new buildings and they mod in more each version
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 06:54
|
|
|
TipTow posted:I've gone through the exact same issue myself. First few games I obsessed over maxing out Magnus' ability to my overall detriment by deliberately waiting to chop, even if I had an eligible worker sitting on that tile, for him to be established somewhere. Once I realized I was actually losing out overall because of this, I just let go and adopted the attitude of "hey, if I get to use him, great; but if not, that's okay, too." Magnus with a promotion to get no-pop settlers is the usual currently just due to its strength. If it weren't for his busted first ability, yeah, Liang would probably be first. More builder charges is always nice. Lower investment cost too, and early on losing a pop to make a settler isn't so bad; your cities grow fast then anyway. Roland Jones fucked around with this message at 07:47 on Apr 24, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 07:34
|
|
|
I really hope they don't nerf Magnus' chop ability too bad, I'd rather they just move it, to require two promotions and be on the opposite side of the tree to the pop-free settler policy. It's too good for a first ability, but if they increase the "startup" time on it it'll be less good because you're going to want/need to chop at least some stuff for either the yields or for placing stuff, before you get it. Basically just swap it with Industrialist, which is lackluster, but not worthless as an opening ability. Sprinkle some buffs on the other dudes as well because some of them are seriously situational to the point of near-uselessness. (I have never recruited Victor.)
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 10:22
|
|
|
I never chop because it makes my lands look uglier.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 11:33
|
|
|
John F Bennett posted:I never chop because it makes my lands look uglier. You can chop a forest and then use a worker charge to grow a new forest on the same tile.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 11:46
|
|
|
What about the birds and the squirrels, man
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 11:48
|
|
|
You can chop them too. Somewhat related, on an ongoing PYDT game I have been running with an extremely lovely income, but I recently managed to upgrade my entire army by chopping 2 crabs that were inside my borders but outside the working radius of any city. Being Russia did help to get those borders though.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 12:02
|
|
|
John F Bennett posted:I never chop because it makes my lands look uglier. Yea I barely ever do it. Maybe if builders worked like they did in the old game and I had them around and about but in this it's a super rare thing to me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 12:16
|
|
|
Taear posted:Yea I barely ever do it. Maybe if builders worked like they did in the old game and I had them around and about but in this it's a super rare thing to me. I thought you hate playing Civ? Jokes aside... chopping is what elevates you from an "also ran" to a competitor, at least in a multiplayer game. The early boost it gives you does wonders. (Sometimes literally.) TjyvTompa posted:You can chop a forest and then use a worker charge to grow a new forest on the same tile. Now I want someone to calculate if this makes sense in terms of production. Having Magnus in a city and then chopping > regrowing > chopping > etc... all the while using the bonus production to poo poo out new workers amongst other stuff. It could actually work.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 13:31
|
|
|
You're not just chopping the rice. You're chopping the builders. Why do you think they disappear man
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 13:31
|
|
|
Yes, chopping spits out more than 2/5 of a builder in cogs, so it's worth it in base game. Except that you can't chop second growth woods for cogs, it's in the tooltip. It also lowers the appeal of the tile compared to old growth, incase anybody cared. No idea about R&F tho. I'm just a scrub who 'also runs' in single player, btw. Serephina fucked around with this message at 13:46 on Apr 24, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 13:43
|
|
|
markus_cz posted:I thought you hate playing Civ? I just said Civ6 isn't a very good game and I've played it the least of any of them. Like loads of people have said. I still read the thread to see if anything interesting happens. I'm sure it's WORTH it but it's a lot of effort and against the AI you don't really need to do it!
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 13:51
|
|
|
markus_cz posted:I thought you hate playing Civ? You can't chop a builder planted forest. e - on the subject of planting forests, is there some additional requirements for where they can be placed? I always seem to have a handful of random hexes where it won't let me place them but I can't fathom why, they're just normal tundra/plains or whatever. HappyCamperGL fucked around with this message at 14:14 on Apr 24, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 13:58
|
|
|
HappyCamperGL posted:You can't chop a builder planted forest. I'm pretty sure if there is a resource there, like an artifact or like oil or aluminum you haven't discovered yet, it won't let you plant the forest there.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 14:38
|
|
|
Falcorum posted:Why play CivBE when you could play the vastly superior Caveman2Cosmos?
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 15:10
|
|
|
Although if they added 190 alien subtypes which all give one beaker upon being turned in at your cities it would probably make at least some people come back to it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 15:11
|
|
|
Random BE thought: there's nothing to do with forests but chop them in that game, and marshes are still as useless as always. Beyond Earth managed to make oceans and tundra and snow useful tiles, you'd think there'd be something useful to do with forests or marshes beyond turn them into farms, especially for a Harmony civ. One of many missed opportunities, I think, to make the affinities seriously diverge from each other. Not hard to imagine Purity going out of its way to encourage you to chop down forests, drain marshes, kill aliens, and generally eradicate local biodiversity where Harmony civs spread forests and marshes rich with miasma everywhere. Maybe make Supremacy the guys who really care about the orbital layer, not giving much of a gently caress about the surface as they take over the planet's orbit.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 15:16
|
|
|
Madmarker posted:I'm pretty sure if there is a resource there, like an artifact or like oil or aluminum you haven't discovered yet, it won't let you plant the forest there. Ah, makes sense. Annoying it works differently to other improvements/districts though. I don't care about the oil, I just want to make a national park! It'd be nice they brought back pollution and global warming from previous games.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 15:29
|
|
|
Goa Tse-tung posted:for the record C2C (at least for me) is unplayable right now because of input lag, you click a building button and wait half a second until anything happens This is one of my problems with game changing mods. Even when the mods are good, the developers simply cannot ignore any idea they have. Anything they can possibly think of must be in the mod.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 16:05
|
|
|
I remember playing some of those mods back in the day. One of the first things you can research is The Secret Of Fire. And only then are you able to build a campfire that delivers 0.05 culture or something like that. It was a bit too much.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 16:21
|
|
|
Madmarker posted:I'm pretty sure if there is a resource there, like an artifact or like oil or aluminum you haven't discovered yet, it won't let you plant the forest there. That can't be the only reason, since I've had that issue with tiles even after discovering uranium.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 18:15
|
|
|
John F Bennett posted:I remember playing some of those mods back in the day. One of the first things you can research is The Secret Of Fire. And only then are you able to build a campfire that delivers 0.05 culture or something like that. This is silly. There should be five separate "log" buildings (each requiring access to woodland) and only when you have all of them should you be able to build the "campfire" building.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 19:30
|
|
|
John F Bennett posted:I remember playing some of those mods back in the day. One of the first things you can research is The Secret Of Fire. And only then are you able to build a campfire that delivers 0.05 culture or something like that. The pre-historic era ends with the discovery of sedentary lifestyle.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 19:41
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 08:10 |
|
|
Cythereal posted:Random BE thought: there's nothing to do with forests but chop them in that game, and marshes are still as useless as always. Beyond Earth managed to make oceans and tundra and snow useful tiles, you'd think there'd be something useful to do with forests or marshes beyond turn them into farms, especially for a Harmony civ. Broadly speaking, Harmony should be adapting yourself to the environment, Purity should be adapting the environment to you, and Supremacy should be exploiting whatever is there to its fullest. So Harmony builds buildings in their cities that give bonuses to untouched forest/marsh/whatever tiles, Purity chops them for lump sums and gets regular strength buildings to put on the cleared land, and Supremacy gets slightly better buildings that go on top of the feature? You could take all of those techs in theory but none of the bonuses would be able to stack because they all have different pre-reqs. Also the tech web should've been divided into three parts with all of the affinity techs in the same segment. You could weave through and grab non-conflicting techs if you wanted but you might have to go through some useless affinity techs to get to them. Xeno Cavalry might be in the Harmony area of the web, but it would be close to the border with Supremacy because it's hard to argue that Supremacists wouldn't also domesticate useful animals. Meanwhile it would be far from Purity, who would never do that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 24, 2018 23:25
|
|