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RenegadeStyle1 posted:I didn't quit specifically because of the episode, it was more just realizing I didn't really like the characters or Negan. Yeah I'm not thinking I'm going to have much fun watching this season as it seems it's the Negan show now.
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Nov 15, 2016 19:44
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RenegadeStyle1 posted:Has anyone else gave up watching? I actually pulled the plug and stopped after episode one. I felt conflicted because there really was a time it was one of my favorite shows on TV, probably up until around the time they got to Alexandria.
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Nov 15, 2016 19:44
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I felt like I was losing interest in the show after the last season, I watched the first three new episodes but I've got the latest one sitting on dvr. "Daryl eats dog food" was so boring that I haven't yet mustered up the courage to watch a 90 minute episode
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Nov 15, 2016 19:51
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See I actually like that episode. It shows just how far these assholes are willing to go to break a person. And Daryl isn't broken. Yet Rick felates Lucile for 90 minutes.
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Nov 15, 2016 19:54
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Dr. Abysmal posted:I felt like I was losing interest in the show after the last season, I watched the first three new episodes but I've got the latest one sitting on dvr. "Daryl eats dog food" was so boring that I haven't yet mustered up the courage to watch a 90 minute episode Do yourself a favour and don't waste your time. If the pacing(see:blandness) of the show keeps up like this, this season will be my last. Unless they completely wrap Negan up and get to the Whisperers, in which case I'll give it another chance. But that's what I said about last season and Negan, and here we are... 
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Nov 15, 2016 19:54
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The problem a lot of people here are having is the fact that the showrunners artificially extend the storyline by making everyone a loving idiot for the sake of having last second episode twists / stingers. They're purposely loving the story up just to create more drama (than there already is). This episode is a prime loving example of them having no concept of "there's a week of downtime and talking about the episode between each episode". Rick (minor comic spoiler) wastes no time letting everyone know that yes, he's playing along, and they absolutely will fight against the Saviors.. Unfortunately they're either dragging that for another week OR there's a genuine change in how the story (or Rick's part in it) will play out because of the one big divergent factor between show and comic: Judith still being alive. If Rick's conversation to Michonne was honest, then poo poo is going in a different, likely shittier, path.
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Nov 15, 2016 19:58
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Missed last episode but caught up by reading the thread (instead of what sounded like an insufferable 90 minutes). May wait until after the next episode to determine if it's worth continuing.
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Nov 15, 2016 20:05
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VendaGoat posted:If this continues, this may be my last season. Negan's been around for what, 5 episodes? He's obviously gonna be around till at least the end of season 7, 11 more episodes. You want him to have been taken care of already? They are doing a new thing, Rick's been proper usurped and the crew are under occupation. Clearly they aren't just gonna run with that for the rest of the show. Rick's gonna get his groove back, either pushed too far himself or convinced by others (Rosita's starting already). They will almost certainly mount some sort of resistance with a big comeback as a season ender. The other communities Negan controls will be up for it too. All you folks talking about boring it is, how the hell did you stick around through the farm, the governor episodes, the beth episodes, the Morgan episode, and the teen/kid drama last season?
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Nov 15, 2016 20:08
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I'm also just naturally wary of mid season 90 minute episodes now after watching a fat guy teach martial arts to Morgan last year
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Nov 15, 2016 20:09
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magpie posted:Negan's been around for what, 5 episodes? He's obviously gonna be around till at least the end of season 7, 11 more episodes. You want him to have been taken care of already? The Farm was a safe space, much like Alexendria. Unlike now, they only had walkers to deal with. You wouldn't leave a safe space with just the dead to worry about. The governor was a slow build up, without a direct opportunity for him to intercede. There was suspense. Morgan Needed to be developed as a character. Beth had Daryl. Teen/kid drama was what, two episodes? This is a season of the same poo poo different day, psychopath shows up and everyone kowtows even though we, the audience, know what Rick and friends are very capable of. See the raid on the governor's place, Terminus, etc. etc. etc. If Neegan is a half season, I will rescind this and have no complaints. If it's a full season and we get another cliffhanger to the next danger. I will contemplate removing this show from my DVR.
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Nov 15, 2016 20:14
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magpie posted:Negan's been around for what, 5 episodes? He's obviously gonna be around till at least the end of season 7, 11 more episodes. You want him to have been taken care of already? So you're enjoying watch the heroes of the show cower for multiple episodes? Even after we've seen things like Carol almost singlehandedly take out other existential threats? Negan isn't scary; a real ruthless predator wouldn't be so loving smug and basically begging to be killed. They would be paranoid and trying to surround themselves with layers of safety. But because Negan is protected by the plot, the writer's can just go hog wild with smarm that doesn't fit the character or world. This world is loving dead; I don't care how many survivor groups you have under your thrall - food and water and supplies and GAS is running out yet this pathetic character doesn't seem the least bit worried that though they may have won a bunch of battles, the war to survive is not going their way. Smugness opposes desperation and I don't buy a character who doesn't have the least shred of desperation 3 years into an apocalypse. Make him insanely ruthless because he is scared of what the world has become; but don't try and sell me this taunting clown. This is poor writing in the same way shows like Criminal Minds create serial killers: by way of "wouldn't it be cool if" and ignoring that these ridiculous characters would have had to interact with and be shaped by the world to get to the point where we see their story. They are artless constructions that get jammed into a world for reasons other than "it makes sense that this person would have evolved this way, in this world." Enderzero fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Nov 15, 2016 |
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Nov 15, 2016 20:30
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RenegadeStyle1 posted:Has anyone else gave up watching? I actually pulled the plug and stopped after episode one. I felt conflicted because there really was a time it was one of my favorite shows on TV, probably up until around the time they got to Alexandria. I'm really close and it has nothing to do with the violence or brutality, it's just become a bad show. Say what you will about Negan but it's just a different rehash of the Governor and his Army storyline. If they ever get to the Whisperers it'll just be a 3rd rehash of Our Group vs. a new powerful group I don't really follow the comic but have they ever explored the cause of the outbreak or any serious attempt to find how to cure or end it or has it just went from Rick's crew vs. New Enemies over and and over?
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Nov 15, 2016 20:33
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VendaGoat posted:
This is pretty much the format of the show though. The circumstances here are different though, all previous threats were handled. Rick already tried to handle this threat at the end of the last season when he thought his crew were untouchable and Negan would be easily dispatched. He failed big time and is feeling hopeless. He'll come around. I think you have mental blocked the ridiculous Beth hospital episodes. Enderzero posted:
This season we had the intense opener, the weird introduction to the Kingdom, the Daryl episode which was more of a Dwight episode, then this Rick's a bitch episode. Next week's probably going to be Maggie and Sasha. We are in early season world building which I agree is slow and depressing as gently caress, but without making each season only 6 episodes long I don't know how it would be possible to keep the intensity/pace up. And to be fair Carol doesn't know what's happened between Negan and Rick, she could still swoop in and flamethrower everyone.
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Nov 15, 2016 20:37
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magpie posted:This is pretty much the format of the show though. The circumstances here are different though, all previous threats were handled. Rick already tried to handle this threat at the end of the last season when he thought his crew were untouchable and Negan would be easily dispatched. He failed big time and is feeling hopeless. He'll come around. I am glad you are enjoying the show. You are more then allowed to. I am allowed to criticize it for it's shortcomings, as are the rest of us doing the same.
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Nov 15, 2016 20:45
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VendaGoat posted:I am glad you are enjoying the show. You are more then allowed to. Thanks, I completely agree with you! It has many faults but so far this season has been more interesting than the previous one, I think cause all the groups are focused on one threat. Though I too feel a bit fatigued from the sameness but I don't watch much else live so I don't really feel like I'm wasting time with it.
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Nov 15, 2016 20:51
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magpie posted:
Fair enough, it's just a bit irritating to throw away how badass they have built these characters to be in service of showing them hitting a new low at the writers' whims. I mean, Rick's wife is dead. His best friend is dead - at this point they should be able to handle losing a few people without this silly I-can't-even-meet-your-gaze-because-i'm-broken characterization. You're right in that at least we don't have to see a half season of just scurred Rick.
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Nov 15, 2016 20:54
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Enderzero posted:Fair enough, it's just a bit irritating to throw away how badass they have built these characters to be in service of showing them hitting a new low at the writers' whims. I mean, Rick's wife is dead. His best friend is dead - at this point they should be able to handle losing a few people without this silly I-can't-even-meet-your-gaze-because-i'm-broken characterization. You're right in that at least we don't have to see a half season of just scurred Rick. I suppose it's the nature of a multi-season show with no end in sight, it's gonna get repetitive or characters will end up doing things out of character.
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Nov 15, 2016 21:02
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magpie posted:I suppose it's the nature of a multi-season show with no end in sight, it's gonna get repetitive or characters will end up doing things out of character. Very true. And the natural impulse to ratchet up tension and stakes as more seasons come out....it's like the drama version of sitcom characters becoming nothing but their most exaggerated traits.
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Nov 15, 2016 21:08
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Enderzero posted:Very true. And the natural impulse to ratchet up tension and stakes as more seasons come out....it's like the drama version of sitcom characters becoming nothing but their most exaggerated traits. For sure, the Glen dumpster ruse from last season had that written all over it.
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Nov 15, 2016 21:12
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Bad news if you hate Negan. He's still around in the comics.
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Nov 15, 2016 21:17
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Bert Roberge posted:Bad news if you hate Negan. He's still around in the comics. I only hate him because the writer's stalled the plot for him. The actor deserves a loving award.
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Nov 15, 2016 21:24
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So does Rosita have a handgun that can accommodate the shell from that hand cannon Negan fired into the window or what
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Nov 15, 2016 23:00
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I know it's TV and they have to keep the storyline dragging, but it's so unrealistic when there's dozens of golden opportunities to plink off Negan with minimal immediate consequences.
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Nov 15, 2016 23:00
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Auron posted:I know it's TV and they have to keep the storyline dragging, but it's so unrealistic when there's dozens of golden opportunities to plink off Negan with minimal immediate consequences. Then what? Plink the 30 odd other armed guys he also brought along then the dozens more of brutal henchmen that will roll through right after? If Rick popped Negan he would have been dropped immediately then everyone else in Alexandria. Glen and Abe felt the immediate consequences of Rick's hubris. The most unrealistic thing is that Rick and co went back to Alexandria. I would have made the decision to leave the State the second the bat first connected with Abe's head.
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Nov 15, 2016 23:18
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ElectricSheep posted:So does Rosita have a handgun that can accommodate the shell from that hand cannon Negan fired into the window or what No.
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Nov 15, 2016 23:56
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magpie posted:Then what? Plink the 30 odd other armed guys he also brought along then the dozens more of brutal henchmen that will roll through right after? If Rick popped Negan he would have been dropped immediately then everyone else in Alexandria. Either your last sentence or go back to Alexandria and prepare to ambush the people coming to loot them. While they have the guns and an RPG, FFS, you have the ability to defend yourself. Now they have nothing. This exact thing has happened before and it ended, every time, with untold amount of bloodshed. But, in this instance, the writers are trying to get us to swallow that the downtrodden are just going to give up. Despite the mounting rage of a few dissidents, discontent with the current leader, Rick.
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Nov 16, 2016 00:01
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She found a gun on a zombie this episode i thought
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Nov 16, 2016 00:02
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Luvcow posted:She found a gun on a zombie this episode i thought Yah, in the narrative of the show it will fit, in the real world those two guns use very different caliber bullets. 
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Nov 16, 2016 00:06
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VendaGoat posted:Either your last sentence or go back to Alexandria and prepare to ambush the people coming to loot them. Yeah that is what the writers are trying to do, Rick is beat. If they did mount a defense it would've been a conscious last stand though. I think Negan's numbers scared the poo poo out of Rick. They could surrounded the place and just starved them out, flood the place with walkers, let them run out of bullets, etc. They survived the prison siege thing because the governor had like only 20 people, most of whom were just villagers. The tank didn't proved that useful or destructive and Daryl single-handedly killed it. From a story point of view it's similar yeah, they've been surrounded before, they've all been miserable hopeless mooks before, they've all questioned Rick's leadership before. This has all happened before and will all happen again. The writers just tweak the story everytime. In this case the tweak is that it's an occupation/resistance situation and they have put Rick at rock bottom; bigger baddie guy, no weapons, no hope so now he has an even deeper hole to get out of. It could be interesting or could be more of the same.
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Nov 16, 2016 00:24
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magpie posted:From a story point of view it's similar yeah, they've been surrounded before, they've all been miserable hopeless mooks before, they've all questioned Rick's leadership before. This has all happened before and will all happen again. The writers just tweak the story everytime. In this case the tweak is that it's an occupation/resistance situation and they have put Rick at rock bottom; bigger baddie guy, no weapons, no hope so now he has an even deeper hole to get out of. It could be interesting or could be more of the same. I don't disagree. It's why I'm not going to rage quit this show. That's childish. I'll give the writers the opportunity to win me back. By the end of the season I could be lauding their creativity. I simply feel, that at this point, they have misrepresented the characters that we have journeyed with for the past six seasons. If that departure leads to a new story arc that can continue the series, in a meaningful way, that entertains and delights the audience, Wonderful! But, this is currently writing yourself into a corner, with no viable means out.
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Nov 16, 2016 00:29
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80s James Hetfield posted:I don't really follow the comic but have they ever explored the cause of the outbreak or any serious attempt to find how to cure or end it or has it just went from Rick's crew vs. New Enemies over and and over? Rick's gonna go Super Saiyan in the next season at least.
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Nov 16, 2016 00:39
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VendaGoat posted:I don't disagree. It's why I'm not going to rage quit this show. That's childish. I'll give the writers the opportunity to win me back. By the end of the season I could be lauding their creativity. I'd be amazed if anyone ever lauded TWD writers' creativity though we all thought Trump and Brexit could never win so it seems this is the year of anything is possible. VendaGoat posted:I simply feel, that at this point, they have misrepresented the characters that we have journeyed with for the past six seasons. If that departure leads to a new story arc that can continue the series, in a meaningful way, that entertains and delights the audience, Wonderful! That's an interesting thought about misrepresenting the characters. At what point is something considered out of character or character growth? You consider Rick submitting to Negan out of character rather than a progression of his character or story?
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Nov 16, 2016 00:41
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Kinda liked this episode, and I generally only hatewatch the show. Is Carl gonna get a drat haircut at some point, or will the hair just keep expanding into infinity?
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Nov 16, 2016 00:44
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I wonder if he's growing it out to cover his eyehole.
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Nov 16, 2016 00:48
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magpie posted:That's an interesting thought about misrepresenting the characters. At what point is something considered out of character or character growth? You consider Rick submitting to Negan out of character rather than a progression of his character or story? Yes. Rick has always done what was necessary for the survival of the group. Regardless of how difficult, regardless of the losses, regardless of the damage.     For him to "Give up" to preserve the survival of the group, is a gross misrepresentation of Rick. Here's another sociopath. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNzgDgdmRK4 Gun to his head, friends in danger, people about to be raped and he straight up bites the throat out of a dude. But a barbed wire wrapped baseball bat, gently caress HOWDY! That just stops him in his tracks. VendaGoat fucked around with this message at 00:58 on Nov 16, 2016 |
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Nov 16, 2016 00:53
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The bat was showy, but it was the giant group of dudes that scared him. They're all gonna die if they fight back. He acted like normal Rick at the time, and so Negan nearly killed him and then almost made him cut off Coral's arm. He's still trying to keep everyone alive.
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Nov 16, 2016 00:57
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Yeah the only explanation beyond dumb story for not nuking negans dudes is they had Darryl. Of course our heros are headshot masters at any distance so even then it shouldn't have been a problem with their insanely superior defense. But then I remember that this show always takes the dumbest road possible so whatever.
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Nov 16, 2016 01:00
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Fitzy Fitz posted:The bat was showy, but it was the giant group of dudes that scared him. They're all gonna die if they fight back. He acted like normal Rick at the time, and so Negan nearly killed him and then almost made him cut off Coral's arm. Regular Rick, would have submitted and then made a plan, to combat them. Like he did with the governor and like he said in the church. "I could have buried some guns. Waited a few years." And then even one of the members of the group questioned his length of time, "YEARS?!" For Rick to have given up, this thoroughly, after losing his wife, his best friend, almost his son and everyone else. No, I can't buy it. Now, if they had had a long stay in Alexandria, enough time to get them, "domesticated". I'd buy it. They were wild animals when they got to Alexandria and they remained wild animals right up to them encountering Negan. For that to change, with the whack of a bat. Sorry, I just can't buy it.
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Nov 16, 2016 01:02
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I think the delivery is what makes it hard to buy. I'm perfectly fine with the idea that Rick had been beaten, but the writing rarely rises to the challenge of making the show's scenarios fully believable. I am very good at suspending my disbelief though.
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Nov 16, 2016 01:06
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VendaGoat posted:Yes. Rick has always done what was necessary for the survival of the group. Regardless of how difficult, regardless of the losses, regardless of the damage. You make a good case. None of those guys were offering Rick and his crew a chance of survival though. Negan is the only one giving him an option, comply or die not just die. And he's not been outnumbered quite like this before. Also Rick went all pacifist farmer for a while and stepped up only when he absolutely needed to. The same will happen here.
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Nov 16, 2016 01:08
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