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Jimong5 posted:14-50 is the best choice because the cost to install would be similar but if you have capacity issues a 14-30 is perfectly fine for residential use. A 30A charger can deliver 5.7kw an hour which should be good for 20-30 miles of range. I'm having a hard time imagining a residential use case that would need much more than that. This is from a while back, but most current models are limited what you can get out of a 40A circuit. The only exceptions I can think of right now are teslas that aren't the model 3 SR/SR+, the e-tron, and the porsche taycan. A 30A circuit is still more than enough for the most part. Higher amps could let you hit lower rates if you have get off-hours pricing, but you should be able to fill up overnight either way.
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Jul 15, 2020 09:20
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I wonder if Nissan will cascade the liquid cooled battery down to the Leaf, or simply replace the Leaf with a new model. Nothing terribly surprising about the Ariya, but they are way behind the competition now, which have all moved past the Leaf. Not selling this until late 2021 will mean it’s dropping into a more crowded market with brands that offer more cachet than Nissan. It will be interesting if they can make the jump from the current “we’ll finance just about anyone” model to their new vision of actually being profitable.
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Jul 15, 2020 11:49
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Finger Prince posted:The before picture looks just as generic, just "concept render smoothed". For every person that bemoans the bland generic design of many new EVs, there's a reason for it, and it's every person who crowed about "why does a hybrid/EV have to look like a goddamn alien space ship from the future, just make it look like a normal car. The before pic also looks like a hot hatch and the real production vehicle is a goddamned SUV. Which was my point
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Jul 15, 2020 12:58
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:I wonder if Nissan will cascade the liquid cooled battery down to the Leaf, or simply replace the Leaf with a new model. Nothing terribly surprising about the Ariya, but they are way behind the competition now, which have all moved past the Leaf. Not selling this until late 2021 will mean it’s dropping into a more crowded market with brands that offer more cachet than Nissan. It will be interesting if they can make the jump from the current “we’ll finance just about anyone” model to their new vision of actually being profitable. I don't think 21 is actually going to be all that crowded. Late 21 means the following nominally planned launches for North America, which I've sorted (subjectively) by how likely I think they are to occur: Definitely: Mach E ID.4, and maybe some other VAG MEB stuff like Q4E, but it won't be that different so I'm lumping it all together. Polestar2 XC40 Recharge Probably: F-150E Hummer MB EQA Maybe: Cybertruk Rivian Truck BMW iNEXT MX-30 What else? I get maybe six approximate competitors (Mach E, ID.4, EQA, iNEXT, MX-30, XC40), with a couple more if you split out the MEB family. Mach E and Polestar2 are more expensive than Ariya's price point, the others are speculative, so I think the real competitors are probably ID.4, XC40, and EQA (if Daimler gets the EQA out in 2021). edit: I forgot a few things - XC40 Recharge, MX-30, Polestar2 KYOON GRIFFEY JR fucked around with this message at 13:59 on Jul 15, 2020 |
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Jul 15, 2020 13:42
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big crush on Chad OMG posted:I wonder if Nissan will cascade the liquid cooled battery down to the Leaf, or simply replace the Leaf with a new model. Nothing terribly surprising about the Ariya, but they are way behind the competition now, which have all moved past the Leaf. Not selling this until late 2021 will mean it’s dropping into a more crowded market with brands that offer more cachet than Nissan. It will be interesting if they can make the jump from the current “we’ll finance just about anyone” model to their new vision of actually being profitable. 4WD and 90 kWh at sub Model 3 prices = hotcakes in Norway at least, late 2021 notwithstanding.
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Jul 15, 2020 13:42
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Ola posted:Maybe a dual thing like the e-tron, with Type 2 only on the passenger side and CCS on driver's side, as local market dictates. The pics from here at least show ports on both sides. Ah yes, the mythical 4th colour option: beige  I kid, I kid. (I have a secret crush on a beige Prius prime. I think they call it titanium.... beige)
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Jul 15, 2020 14:11
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Finger Prince posted:Ah yes, the mythical 4th colour option: beige That looks more like copper metallic to me, but then again I am wearing light beige trousers in an office environment right now, so I am not the most radical color person. Your generic reds and blues also belong in just about any car's colour swatch of course.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:23
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Don't slander the best thing about the Nissan. Ok it's metallic beige but still in a world of black, white and silver, copper is an awesome color. Remember the original copper Hayabusa.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:28
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The e-tron actually has a decent color palette for a modern car but of the 11 colors offered, seven are monochrome. 
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Jul 15, 2020 14:32
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Ola posted:4WD and 90 kWh at sub Model 3 prices = hotcakes in Norway at least, late 2021 notwithstanding.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:33
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I’d love it for Ohio to give a poo poo about electric at all. I keep looking at the Kona and thinking that’d be great but last time I went to the dealer for a car checkup they were like “EVs? Lmao no one wants those”. They didn’t even have the plug in hybrids variants around. It’s loving bullshit.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:35
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Yuns posted:Don't slander the best thing about the Nissan. Ok it's metallic beige but still in a world of black, white and silver, copper is an awesome color. Remember the original copper Hayabusa. Haha, yeah I know, personally I think it looks really sharp in that colour! It speaks volumes about the current blandness of the automotive paint world we live in that a burnished beige is an eye-catching option. When I merged on the highway yesterday evening, I counted 11 white cars in my immediate vicinity. There's an extremely vibrant blue Corolla hatch that heads down the highway in the opposite direction to me every morning and it brightens my morning every time I see it.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:38
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I'm glad to hear that Nissan finally decided to make the Ariya use the CCS standards in NA and EU.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:46
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:I don't think 21 is actually going to be all that crowded. Late 21 means the following nominally planned launches for North America, which I've sorted (subjectively) by how likely I think they are to occur: GM has a Bolt refresh and the Bolt crossover scheduled for 2021. There's also the Cadillac Lyriq as a maybe.
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Jul 15, 2020 14:59
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There are a couple of Smart cars driving around in Fairfax County. I see them regularly at the free level 2 chargers in the area. Here's one at the free chargers in front of Falls Church City Hall in January: 
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Jul 15, 2020 15:09
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Jimong5 posted:GM has a Bolt refresh and the Bolt crossover scheduled for 2021. There's also the Cadillac Lyriq as a maybe. That Bolt refresh is very mild and will not suddenly make that car popular, and I'm not sold on the EUV - it is a taller slightly longer Bolt, same architecture. I don't think that's what's preventing the Bolt from selling. They both will exist in 2021 though, for sure.
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Jul 15, 2020 15:15
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Late to the power supply chat, but for the low low price of "contact us for a quote", you could get a Hobart/ITW GSE 2400 GPU that takes ~230V AC in and spits out 3 phase 115/200V AC at 30 or 45kVA, if you don't mind 400hz.
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Jul 15, 2020 15:46
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So the British press release on Nissan's new CUV said the big battery option will support up to 22kW AC three phase. This is consistent with what Tesla offers on their big battery models (the S and X), and will fill it from empty to full in ~4 hours. It also points out that if nations or states want to support mass EV adoption they need to regulate for three phase availability in residential zoning. Makes me wonder what onboard charging would look like on Rivian's proposed 200kWH model.
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Jul 15, 2020 15:50
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There are some parts of Norway where every house has three phase 400V to the fuse box. The older the neighborhood, the less likely I suppose.
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Jul 15, 2020 16:07
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RZA Encryption posted:You adapt to it surprisingly quickly. I imagine it's quite similar to riding a motorcycle with a high-strung engine - I'm able to use engine braking to handle a huge amount of my braking needs, as long as it's not a quick stop. Electric car subsidies have rendered Renaults free in Germany
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Jul 15, 2020 16:18
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My Energica Ego's regenerative braking in the 'high' setting is more than twice as effective as my Model 3's 'normal' regen setting. It's nuts.
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Jul 15, 2020 16:21
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Also late to the power supply chat: Unless you drive a lot, and/or live in a very cold area, you will most likely never need more than 4-5 kilowatts of charging at home. That's 20A at 240V. No 3-phase needed. Also re: 400Hz converters - keep those loving things away from me, we had an electrical fire onboard ship (navy frigate) from the 400 Hz system once that put a bunch of people (including me  ) in the infirmary. gently caress that poo poo.Ola posted:There are some parts of Norway where every house has three phase 400V to the fuse box. The older the neighborhood, the less likely I suppose. Most older houses have 40-63A 3-phase 230V IT. Newer construction has 40-63A 3-phase 400V TN. 63A 230V IT = 25 kW, 63A 400V TN = 43 kW. 230V IT is a pain in the dick for faster (>7.4 kW) home EV charging unless you have a Model 3/Y or get a 230V IT -> 400V TN transformer (they cost about $2500 and are a bitch and a half to move around due to the weight).
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Jul 15, 2020 16:28
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:That Bolt refresh is very mild and will not suddenly make that car popular, and I'm not sold on the EUV - it is a taller slightly longer Bolt, same architecture. I don't think that's what's preventing the Bolt from selling. They both will exist in 2021 though, for sure. The bolt's shape throws people off because it looks like a car but it's actually the size of most compact SUVs on the market. For example here's a Bolt superimposed with a Trax and a Soul:   Adding 3 inches to it and making it look less like a hatchback brings it close to a similar size to the Equinox, RAV 4, and CRV and probably a better fit for the American market when it presents itself as crossover vs small hatch.
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Jul 15, 2020 17:05
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Are any other people in this thread parents of kids old enough to be heavily involved in extracurriculars including travel sports? If so how do you deal with recharging and planning? As a parent of kids who compete year round in sports (ski racing, swimming, lacrosse, etc.) as well as participate in other extracurriculars like state orchestra etc., pre-COVID I was on the road pretty much constantly on weekends. This includes both long out of state trips to compete as well as just being on the road chauffering them locally from lesson to lesson. Even without long trips, 8 hours on the road in a day including sitting at Starbucks waiting for them is not abnormal.
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Jul 15, 2020 17:08
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Has anyone made the big crush on CHAdeMO joke yet? Also thanks whoever linked the tiny electric pickup on Alibaba in the last thread, I'm obsessed and have spent hours comparing them. I want 1 of every type.
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Jul 15, 2020 17:29
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:I’d love it for Ohio to give a poo poo about electric at all. I keep looking at the Kona and thinking that’d be great but last time I went to the dealer for a car checkup they were like “EVs? Lmao no one wants those”. They didn’t even have the plug in hybrids variants around. It’s loving bullshit. This is where I’m at. I’m considering a PHEV but they only stock them in CARB states worth a drat. There’s no Ioniqs and three Prius Primes in all of Arizona, all base trim.
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Jul 15, 2020 17:30
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Wibla posted:Also late to the power supply chat: Unless you drive a lot, and/or live in a very cold area, you will most likely never need more than 4-5 kilowatts of charging at home. That's 20A at 240V. No 3-phase needed. Also every time you change voltage, or run power though a phase converter, you sacrifice some efficiency. That's ok for running a welder or 3 phase equipment occasionally in your residential shop. Seems counter-productive for an EV. pun pundit posted:So the British press release on Nissan's new CUV said the big battery option will support up to 22kW AC three phase. This is consistent with what Tesla offers on their big battery models (the S and X), and will fill it from empty to full in ~4 hours. It also points out that if nations or states want to support mass EV adoption they need to regulate for three phase availability in residential zoning. That's real easy for Nissan to say. Even assuming a magic wand could be waved and upgraded distribution lines installed quickly, the realities of power generation and transmission make at-home fast charging on a global scale ridiculously inefficient (and counterproductive if anyone wants to move away from coal and natural gas). At-home energy storage that can slow charge all the time (or at off-peak times) and then fast charge your EV on demand is a much more realistic proposal.
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Jul 15, 2020 17:31
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PirateDentist posted:This is where I’m at. I’m considering a PHEV but they only stock them in CARB states worth a drat. There’s no Ioniqs and three Prius Primes in all of Arizona, all base trim. You could go CARMAX route and have it shipped to your closest one. Adds some cost but I did it for my last car and had a good experience
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Jul 15, 2020 17:49
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:I’d love it for Ohio to give a poo poo about electric at all. I keep looking at the Kona and thinking that’d be great but last time I went to the dealer for a car checkup they were like “EVs? Lmao no one wants those”. They didn’t even have the plug in hybrids variants around. It’s loving bullshit. It's super weird because there are plenty of EVs. Columbus is full of Teslas, I see them plus Bolts and Leafs all over central Ohio. Plus tons of Volts.
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Jul 15, 2020 19:17
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angryrobots posted:Also every time you change voltage, or run power though a phase converter, you sacrifice some efficiency. That's ok for running a welder or 3 phase equipment occasionally in your residential shop. Seems counter-productive for an EV. Especially when newer EV's have multiple charger modules and connect them up depending on the source voltage/phase count. angryrobots posted:That's real easy for Nissan to say. Even assuming a magic wand could be waved and upgraded distribution lines installed quickly, the realities of power generation and transmission make at-home fast charging on a global scale ridiculously inefficient (and counterproductive if anyone wants to move away from coal and natural gas). Nissan can gently caress right off. At-home energy storage used for fast DC EV charging is equally unrealistic at this point, because of the costs involved.
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Jul 15, 2020 20:47
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Being able to output that power will probably be less important than switching off the input. We've discussed it before and I've seen it mentioned in tech articles, where power companies give lower rates to big refrigeration systems for instance in return for being able to switch them off by remote command - obviously within safe parameters to whatever is being refrigerated. You can store power like this as well, by freezing the warehouse deeper when the power is cheap and letting it that into the upper range of the temperature tolerance when power is more scarce. You could for instance get a cheaper plan if the power company was allowed to switch off your charging for a maximum of two hours say every day. You put your car on the charger and don't worry, the power company handles the morning spike by switching off load as required. You walk out to a car that has enough range anyway, because you've obviously set this switching to match your requirements. There is huge amounts of potential in this type of energy management, which is so much simpler than giant flywheels or pumped hydro, and so much cheaper than vast banks of batteries. It's a wet dream for certain nation states with active hacking teams of course.
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Jul 15, 2020 21:03
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I'm looking at buying a PHEV/EV in the near future but I have no idea where to start with comparing them. I also have no idea what to check in a used EV. Anyone got some links or wikis where I can read up on what's currently available so I can come back and ask more useful questions?
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Jul 15, 2020 21:03
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ReaperUnreal posted:I'm looking at buying a PHEV/EV in the near future but I have no idea where to start with comparing them. I also have no idea what to check in a used EV. Anyone got some links or wikis where I can read up on what's currently available so I can come back and ask more useful questions? Here's a wiki link to what's currently available but I'm not sure how helpful it will be. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_electric_cars_currently_available A useful think to check on Gen 1 Nissan Leafs is the battery health indicator next to the charge level. I think youtube will be your friend. Where are you located, what's your approx budget and range reqs? Then you can get some brand suggestions and you can look up the cars on youtube. People can't help themselves from reviewing and vlogging about every minute aspect of EV ownership.
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Jul 15, 2020 21:09
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Ola posted:Here's a wiki link to what's currently available but I'm not sure how helpful it will be. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_electric_cars_currently_available A useful think to check on Gen 1 Nissan Leafs is the battery health indicator next to the charge level. Thanks for the link and tip. I'm in Canada, near Toronto. Budget is 30-40k, range is bimodal. I'm either driving 30-40km or 500km along major highways. I'm definitely fine watching a bunch of youtube vids, got plenty of time.
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Jul 15, 2020 21:30
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ReaperUnreal posted:Thanks for the link and tip. I'm in Canada, near Toronto. Budget is 30-40k, range is bimodal. I'm either driving 30-40km or 500km along major highways. I'm definitely fine watching a bunch of youtube vids, got plenty of time. I haven't seen these so no idea if it's worth sitting through a few episodes but it looks like they should contain some info on fast charging coverage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX-hcFd0OLk On that budget, I think you can aim for Kia e-Niro, Hyundai Kona or Ioniq (the new one) EVs, used. Search them up and see if the reviews look good. Here's one to start you off: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1Xbj5RS0Yk The Kona and e-Niro can do 500 km with one charging stop in ideal conditions, more likely two in total. This site lets you plan charging trips so you can get a feel for charger availability and charging times. It says you'll need a single 45 minute charging stop to go from Toronto to Montreal in a Hyundai Kona 64 kWh: https://abetterrouteplanner.com/?plan_uuid=3c9932ea-c404-4b92-8bd4-70f6cf67ee1a
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Jul 15, 2020 21:55
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The soul ev is available in canada too right? I think the niro/kona are a little over the top end of 40k in canada, and I've heard the availability is also somewhat questionable. The soul is closer to 40k and you might be able to get a dealer to let you get one for 40k. I haven't heard of someone getting >5k off a niro other than on previous model years or some weird dealer that just really wants to get rid of them, so you may have to see what dealers are selling 2019 niros/konas and 2020 souls for right now
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Jul 15, 2020 22:07
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Yah I see a lot of Soul EVs around in BC.
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Jul 15, 2020 22:09
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if you are only doing 500km rarely, you can buy a much less expensive EV and rent a car for your long journeys, assuming they are planned.
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Jul 15, 2020 22:09
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After about a nine month wait I finally got my electric Ioniq last week so now I'm proudly representing team electric. It is a sea of buttons - I'm upgrading 22 years of car in one go and there are entirely standard things like cruise control I've never had before left alone anything related to being an EV. I'm loving how quiet it is.
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Jul 15, 2020 22:24
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:if you are only doing 500km rarely, you can buy a much less expensive EV and rent a car for your long journeys, assuming they are planned. If you can charge fully at the other end and it takes 45 minutes of charging each way, you'll spend less time on charging than picking up and delivering back the rental, plus the money.
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Jul 15, 2020 22:33
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